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Gyokeres (6 Viewers)

  • Thread starter Evo1883
  • Start date Nov 5, 2022
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Deleted member 9744

Guest
  • Jun 6, 2023
  • #1,366
ccfc1234 said:
Harry Kane who turns 30 next year and is also out of contact next season doesn't seem to be offered at a knock down price. I realise the negotiating positions are different however I think we should be resolved not to be seen as a soft touch.
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Indeed. It's only relevant if Gyokeres is prepared to waste a year of his career and I would be very surprised if he was.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Jun 6, 2023
  • #1,367
ccfc1234 said:
Harry Kane who turns 30 next year and is also out of contact next season doesn't seem to be offered at a knock down price. I realise the negotiating positions are different however I think we should be resolved not to be seen as a soft touch.
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He could agree terms with them in 6 months time and leave on a free next summer.
 
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Deleted member 9744

Guest
  • Jun 6, 2023
  • #1,368
Sick Boy said:
He could agree terms with them in 6 months time and leave on a free next summer.
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Then he loses a year of playing at the top level and spends a year at a lower salary. Also if he gets injured like O'Hare he misses out on a move completely. Don't see what would be in it for Gyokeres.
 
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Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,369
Nobody has yet to answer me why a manager with money to spend who sees Gyokeres as the answer would wait a year and risk being sacked.

Sure, some clubs won't have money, but he's going to have plenty of suitors.
 
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Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,370
Deleted member 9744 said:
Then he loses a year of playing at the top level and spends a year at a lower salary. Also if he gets injured like O'Hare he misses out on a move completely. Don't see what would be in it for Gyokeres.
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He’s contracted to us and it’s up to us to decide what we sell him for. From his POV, I’m sure he want to make the step up because he’s ready, but with all the teams that are mooted as being interested… we’ve got leverage.

In comparison, because the interest in Hamer is not so obvious, we don’t have the same leverage and the risk of getting a bad deal is riskier.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,371
Deleted member 5849 said:
Nobody has yet to answer me why a manager with money to spend who sees Gyokeres as the answer would wait a year and risk being sacked.

Sure, some clubs won't have money, but he's going to have plenty of suitors.
Click to expand...
And if he was available for free what club wouldn't be interested in him. It would be instant profit as well as a very good prospect.

Can't see anything happening for a couple more weeks at least unless a club sees him as their main target and want to beat everyone else to his signing.
 

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,372
Astute said:
And if he was available for free what club wouldn't be interested in him. It would be instant profit as well as a very good prospect.

Can't see anything happening for a couple more weeks at least unless a club sees him as their main target and want to beat everyone else to his signing.
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Which Sporting Lisbon are trying to do but they don’t have the financial clout. A Prem team will pay £15m for him comfortably.

The Championship is as good test for strikers hoping to make the step up. Toney, Mitrovic and Watkins have all made big impacts in recent seasons.

The only red flag about Gyokeres is the amount of chances he misses. Comfortably at the top of the Championship in this metric, but otherwise is a good buy at £20m.
 

AFCCOVENTRY

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,373
Mucca Mad Boys said:
Which Sporting Lisbon are trying to do but they don’t have the financial clout. A Prem team will pay £15m for him comfortably.

The Championship is as good test for strikers hoping to make the step up. Toney, Mitrovic and Watkins have all made big impacts in recent seasons.

The only red flag about Gyokeres is the amount of chances he misses. Comfortably at the top of the Championship in this metric, but otherwise is a good buy at £20m.
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They don’t have the same clout as a Prem club but they’re about to sell their star player to PSG for €60m, so if they really want him they could push the boat out to get him for £20m.
 
H

HuckerbyDublinWhelan

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,374
Deleted member 5849 said:
Nobody has yet to answer me why a manager with money to spend who sees Gyokeres as the answer would wait a year and risk being sacked.

Sure, some clubs won't have money, but he's going to have plenty of suitors.
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Becuase these days most football clubs operate a director of football model, the players are brought in to fit a system as is a manager. It’s a continuity thing - basically the manager effectively works with what he’s given
 
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Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,375
HuckerbyDublinWhelan said:
Becuase these days most football clubs operate a director of football model, the players are brought in to fit a system as is a manager. It’s a continuity thing - basically the manager effectively works with what he’s given
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You think Dyche would wait? Moyes? The Australian geezer at Spurs? You think a Director of Football would do without a striker for a year?
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,376
Each position higher up the Prem table is worth about 2.2m. Gyokeres could easily be the difference of just 5 points over a season.

Everton were safe in 17th position. If they had 5 more points they would have finished in 13th. It would have been worth nearly an extra 9m. That could be about half the price of Gyokeres.

Or just an extra 2 points would have saved Leicester. That would have been much more.
 
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JimmyHillsbeard

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,377
Deleted member 5849 said:
You think Dyche would wait? Moyes? The Australian geezer at Spurs? You think a Director of Football would do without a striker for a year?
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Up to a point but Dyche’s Everton nearly went down precisely because they failed to strengthen their attack in January.
 
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Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,378
JimmyHillsbeard said:
Up to a point but Dyche’s Everton nearly went down precisely because they failed to strengthen their attack in January.
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That's kind of my point?
 
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Mcbean

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,379
Mucca Mad Boys said:
The only red flag about Gyokeres is the amount of chances he misses. Comfortably at the top of the Championship in this metric, but otherwise is a good buy at £20m.
Click to expand...
I would assume a Prem club would think they have a better midfield to supply Vik more readily with the ball ( however hopefully we can keep Gus)
 

JimmyHillsbeard

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,380
Deleted member 5849 said:
That's kind of my point?
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Kind of… up to..
 
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PVA

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,381
Brentford or West Ham seem like a good fit IMO.

Both desperately need a striker and both play in a way that would suit him.
 
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AFCCOVENTRY

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,382
PVA said:
Brentford or West Ham seem like a good fit IMO.

Both desperately need a striker and both play in a way that would suit him.
Click to expand...

I would think most of the bottom half of the Prem table and the promoted teams would take him on.
 
H

HuckerbyDublinWhelan

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,383
Deleted member 5849 said:
You think Dyche would wait? Moyes? The Australian geezer at Spurs? You think a Director of Football would do without a striker for a year?
Click to expand...
Modern football works like that, they’ll have a list of strikers with an attached value. If they can’t get one for the value they want to pay

Kevin Thelwell is in charge of recruitment at Everton and Scott Munn is in charge at spurs.

the oversee the transfers. The manager will get a list of available players and he may have a say on which ones. The lists will likely say, Gyokeres - summer 2024… we can get Player B now

the DoF oversees the long term strategy. Nowadays with the right strategy the manager is a seamlessly changed position. We’re looking to operate that way with Dean Austin
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,384
If he does go to the PL it’ll be interesting to see how he gets on. He’s got a bit more about him than the other strikers who are too good for the Championship but not quite good enough for the PL.
 
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Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,385
Mcbean said:
I would assume a Prem club would think they have a better midfield to supply Vik more readily with the ball ( however hopefully we can keep Gus)
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Potentially, Gyokeres missed the most clear cut chances this season and last by a significant margin. However, he also had the lowest xG of the top scorers in the league which suggests his chances were ‘harder’.

He’s still developing as a player so there’s no reason he cannot be a solid 10-15 goal a season striker in the Prem (at least).
 
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shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,386
Mucca Mad Boys said:
Which Sporting Lisbon are trying to do but they don’t have the financial clout. A Prem team will pay £15m for him comfortably.

The Championship is as good test for strikers hoping to make the step up. Toney, Mitrovic and Watkins have all made big impacts in recent seasons.

The only red flag about Gyokeres is the amount of chances he misses. Comfortably at the top of the Championship in this metric, but otherwise is a good buy at £20m.
Click to expand...

Haaland missed more chances than anyone in the PL. this is hardly a list of crap strikers:


 
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Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,387
shmmeee said:
Haaland missed more chances than anyone in the PL. this is hardly a list of crap strikers:


View attachment 30139
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Yep the best strikers score lots and miss lots
 

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,388
Astute said:
And if he was available for free what club wouldn't be interested in him. It would be instant profit as well as a very good prospect.

Can't see anything happening for a couple more weeks at least unless a club sees him as their main target and want to beat everyone else to his signing.
Click to expand...
But then you risk the chance of not getting him because he has more suitors. No instant profit to be had if he doesn't sign for you.
 

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,389
HuckerbyDublinWhelan said:
Becuase these days most football clubs operate a director of football model, the players are brought in to fit a system as is a manager. It’s a continuity thing - basically the manager effectively works with what he’s given
Click to expand...
And it's a stupid system.

If a manager is responsible for results on the field, then you have to give them the decision of who they buy to put out on that field.
 

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,390
Sky Blue Pete said:
Yep the best strikers score lots and miss lots
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Or the best teams create loads of chances making the strikers look better. If you're playing regulalry for the likes of Man City, Arsenal, Liverpool, Man u etc and you don't score 15-20 goals then you should be considered a bit of a failure.
 
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TomRad85

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,391
shmmeee said:
Haaland missed more chances than anyone in the PL. this is hardly a list of crap strikers:


View attachment 30139
Click to expand...
Bamford just delighted to be on a list of anything i would think
 
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Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,392
shmmeee said:
Haaland missed more chances than anyone in the PL. this is hardly a list of crap strikers:


View attachment 30139
Click to expand...

Certainly not the point I was making. It’s more of a consideration for Gyokeres’ potential suitors i.e. if they struggle to create chances perhaps they need to find a more clinical striker.
 
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,393
Mucca Mad Boys said:
Certainly not the point I was making. It’s more of a consideration for Gyokeres’ potential suitors i.e. if they struggle to create chances perhaps they need to find a more clinical striker.
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But then they'd create more chances if they signed Gyokeres
 
C

coop

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,394
Telegraph Says 12 million + 3m add-ons from Sporting Lisbon.Surely its 20m up front or fuck off.
 
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H

HuckerbyDublinWhelan

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,395
Sky_Blue_Dreamer said:
And it's a stupid system.

If a manager is responsible for results on the field, then you have to give them the decision of who they buy to put out on that field.
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Not necessarily - Mourinho for instance had an issue at United there wasn’t a director of football, to deal with the off the field stuff

the particular system also looks into the long term planning and development of the club. As I said Robins understands this and it is Dean Austin is in charge of this at CCFC. it allows an identity to be ingrained in a club.

id argue it is for a manager to fit In with the club culture rather than the other way round
 
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C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,396
Deleted member 5849 said:
But then they'd create more chances if they signed Gyokeres
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This is spot on, didnt Vik create one of the highest number of chances in the league ? Also why he missed some sitters* as they usually involved him sprinting past players and not having time to set himself

*barely any of them were. I class a sitter as standing still, six yards out and just keeper to beat. Not sprinting at full pelt, 18 yards out with keeper closing down angle
 
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,397
CCFCSteve said:
This is spot on, didnt Vik create one of the highest number of chances in the league ? Also why he missed some sitters* as they usually involved him sprinting past players and not having time to set himself

*barely any of them were. I class a sitter as standing still, six yards out and just keeper to beat. Not sprinting at full pelt, 18 yards out with keeper closing down angle
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He also made a fair few of his goals himself, too.

I really think we undervalue just how good he's been for us the past couple of seasons.
 
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MAFF

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,398
Deleted member 5849 said:
He also made a fair few of his goals himself, too.

I really think we undervalue just how good he's been for us the past couple of seasons.
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Yep. He should have won POTS. Recency bias swung it to Hamer because of how good he was in the run in.
 
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L

Legia Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,399
Greggs said:
thanks for explaining the joke
Click to expand...

Has Brewster signed yet?
 
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Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 7, 2023
  • #1,400
Deleted member 5849 said:
He also made a fair few of his goals himself, too.

I really think we undervalue just how good he's been for us the past couple of seasons.
Click to expand...
Deleted member 5849 said:
But then they'd create more chances if they signed Gyokeres
Click to expand...


shmmeee said:
Haaland missed more chances than anyone in the PL. this is hardly a list of crap strikers:


View attachment 30139
Click to expand...


I’m certainly not devaluing him. If he had another year on this contract, my asking price would be £35-40m comfortably. He’s the best striker I’ve had the pleasure of watching for Cov and I believe he’ll make a good Prem striker.

It’s undeniable that his conversion rate isn’t the best - 13.2% and he’s missed more big chances than he’s scored, 38 missed v 26 scored (since the 21/22 season). Which for context, @shmmeee the conversion rate would be one of, if not the lowest of the list you shared.

Gyokeres is still developing and he’ll improve his game so I’m certain he’ll make the grade at Premiership standard. It’s a shame it’ll be without us.
 
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