Do you want to discuss boring politics? (5 Viewers)

Mucca Mad Boys · Jul 2, 2025

fernandopartridge said:
Oh how will I cope without the approval of you and that buffoon.
I have never said that a government can print more and more money without consequence, I have consistently said that a government that issues its own currency is not dependent on tax to spend.
It must always spend first otherwise it would be unable to collect any tax.
I'm sure fatlad will agree that a sensible government should tax passive income and unearned wealth to mitigate inflationary pressure and encourage fairer asset distribution.

Oh, co’mon Fern, I’m only pulling your leg!

It’s not strictly true that the government needs to ‘spend and tax’. After all, how else would have a budget surplus?

‘Unearned wealth’ is one of those slippery terms used by the left. If I invest money into companies that allows them to raise funds, grow and employ more people… Investors getting paid dividends isn’t ’unearned wealth’ because it has helped boost tax revenues for the treasury via corporation and tax-paying workers.

Going after investors and savers will backfire and have a negative impact on the economy. Just as non-dom clampdown has.

Sky_Blue_Dreamer · Jul 2, 2025

Captain Dart said:
“Favorite rejoinder of Senator Harry S. Truman, when a member of his war contracts investigating committee objects to his strenuous pace: ‘If you don’t like the heat, get out of the kitchen’.”

Yes they are human beings who are taking it hard but to be a front line politician you must be very very robust. Are they suited to the job at hand, I do not think so.

Of course having a thick skin is necessary as a politician because you're clearly going to upset some people all of the time and all of the people some of the time and get shit thrown at you but at the same time isn't have a bunch of hard-nosed, career and prestige driven egomaniacs a big part of the problem?

Maybe we could do with more people with human emotions in politics. When Theresa May cried leaving as PM it's about the only time she's felt even vaguely relatable to normal people.

fernandopartridge · Jul 3, 2025

This is correct

Mcbean · Jul 3, 2025

Farage was being interviewed this morning - while I don’t agree with everything he stands for he didn’t duck any questions and he told the guy that clearly had an issue with him - don’t vote for me - unlike Starmer who never answers a question directly !

Brighton Sky Blue · Jul 3, 2025

Sky Blue Pete said:
Harsh from bsb gutted

How so?

Sky Blue Pete · Jul 3, 2025

Mcbean said:
Farage was being interviewed this morning - while I don’t agree with everything he stands for he didn’t duck any questions and he told the guy that clearly had an issue with him - don’t vote for me - unlike Starmer who never answers a question directly !

That’s cause he’s lying
I can’t believe populists get willing members throughout history time and time again
Look here a tricky issue no no it’s black and white it’s this groups fault and these are who you can blame
You and your group won’t need to do anything but just blame them and remove them
It’s fuckin infantile

Sky Blue Pete · Jul 3, 2025

Brighton Sky Blue said:
How so?

You said I wouldn’t say boo to a goose

Brighton Sky Blue · Jul 3, 2025

Sky Blue Pete said:
You said I wouldn’t say boo to a goose

That isn’t necessarily a criticism

wingy · Jul 3, 2025

How's the dollar doing, surely that's tanking as well as ours?

Sky Blue Pete · Jul 3, 2025

Brighton Sky Blue said:
That isn’t necessarily a criticism

Pray tell

Sky Blue Pete · Jul 3, 2025

wingy said:
How's the dollar doing, surely that's tanking as well as ours?

Massively

wingy · Jul 3, 2025

Won't be in hock to China for long then will they?

tisza · Jul 3, 2025

Sky Blue Pete said:
That’s cause he’s lying
I can’t believe populists get willing members throughout history time and time again
Look here a tricky issue no no it’s black and white it’s this groups fault and these are who you can blame
You and your group won’t need to do anything but just blame them and remove them
It’s fuckin infantile

Every political party in UK has a target group(s) that are responsible for the bulk of problems - can be immigrants, business, trade unions,wealthy, over-educated, under-educated, nationalists and so on. Reform aren't going to win an election on immigration alone. All parties legislate to restrict/hamper/affect their target groups.

Sky Blue Pete · Jul 3, 2025

tisza said:
Every political party in UK has a target group(s) that are responsible for the bulk of problems - can be immigrants, business, trade unions,wealthy, over-educated, under-educated, nationalists and so on. Reform aren't going to win an election on immigration alone. All parties legislate to restrict/hamper/affect their target groups.

They will

shmmeee · Jul 3, 2025

SBAndy said:
McSweeney is, to my mind at least, undoubtedly the key protagonist behind all of this. But track record suggests he above all else will be retained by Starmer.

What track record? Comms and strategy the first twelve months have been a disaster. He might be a good campaigner but there isn’t a campaign for a good three years. I think it’s significantly easier to ship him out, as we saw the assumption with sacking the Chancellor is because it’s Labour the next one will spend loads, even though anyone with any knowledge of Labour knows that’s not the case with McFadden who would be the replacement, but the money markets run on memes and cocaine so.

shmmeee · Jul 3, 2025

tisza said:
Every political party in UK has a target group(s) that are responsible for the bulk of problems - can be immigrants, business, trade unions,wealthy, over-educated, under-educated, nationalists and so on. Reform aren't going to win an election on immigration alone. All parties legislate to restrict/hamper/affect their target groups.

Yeah they’re all the same Vote for whoever it makes no difference.

Fucking mantra of fascists and chancers.

tisza · Jul 3, 2025

shmmeee said:
Yeah they’re all the same Vote for whoever it makes no difference.

Fucking mantra of fascists and chancers.

Makes no sense whatsoever.

duffer · Jul 3, 2025

shmmeee said:
What track record? Comms and strategy the first twelve months have been a disaster. He might be a good campaigner but there isn’t a campaign for a good three years. I think it’s significantly easier to ship him out, as we saw the assumption with sacking the Chancellor is because it’s Labour the next one will spend loads, even though anyone with any knowledge of Labour knows that’s not the case with McFadden who would be the replacement, but the money markets run on memes and cocaine so.

I'm not sure he's even a good campaigner, the previous Government was so widely hated that all Labour had to do was keep quiet and let them fuck up. Even then, the vote share was hardly stellar.

The best thing that could happen to Starmer might have just happened; the backbenches have found a spine and some vestige of a social consience might be emerging in the Labour party.

Shifting potential Reform voters might now be impossible now that the lunatic element of the current Tory party, and Starmer himself to some degree, has validated them.

However, bringing back centre left progressives (or just getting them to turn out) might still be possible if Labour shifts back in that direction. I guess we'll see.

wingy · Jul 3, 2025

Anything in the currency shift to say we possibly had to do this to not look out of place with the dollar,interst rates out of step with the majority at this point?

SBAndy · Jul 3, 2025

shmmeee said:
What track record? Comms and strategy the first twelve months have been a disaster. He might be a good campaigner but there isn’t a campaign for a good three years. I think it’s significantly easier to ship him out, as we saw the assumption with sacking the Chancellor is because it’s Labour the next one will spend loads, even though anyone with any knowledge of Labour knows that’s not the case with McFadden who would be the replacement, but the money markets run on memes and cocaine so.

You’ve assumed I was on about his performance track record. I’m not. He’s Starmer’s right-hand man, he was the driving force behind his leadership campaign, then the election campaign (I agree with the above comments on this element; shooting fish in a barrel), he outstayed Sue Gray for a reason. He’s not going anywhere.

Ironically, Wes Streeting is actually McSweeney’s man so I expect that to play out at some point.

Edit: thinking about it, the key problem is Labour still seem to be in campaign mode, not governing mode.

Marty · Jul 3, 2025

Sky Blue Pete said:
That’s cause he’s lying
I can’t believe populists get willing members throughout history time and time again
Look here a tricky issue no no it’s black and white it’s this groups fault and these are who you can blame
You and your group won’t need to do anything but just blame them and remove them
It’s fuckin infantile

I can see why you like Starmer so much. 2 peas in a pod.

Nick · Jul 3, 2025

Sky Blue Pete said:
That’s cause he’s lying
I can’t believe populists get willing members throughout history time and time again
Look here a tricky issue no no it’s black and white it’s this groups fault and these are who you can blame
You and your group won’t need to do anything but just blame them and remove them
It’s fuckin infantile

Surely you do realise they are all full of shit?

That's not defending him specifically it is just weird how people say "he's a liar" because he is in a different party, meanwhile whoever is in their favourite party never lies.

fatso · Jul 3, 2025

Mucca Mad Boys said:
Oh, co’mon Fern, I’m only pulling your leg!

It’s not strictly true that the government needs to ‘spend and tax’. After all, how else would have a budget surplus?

‘Unearned wealth’ is one of those slippery terms used by the left. If I invest money into companies that allows them to raise funds, grow and employ more people… Investors getting paid dividends isn’t ’unearned wealth’ because it has helped boost tax revenues for the treasury via corporation and tax-paying workers.

Going after investors and savers will backfire and have a negative impact on the economy. Just as non-dom clampdown has.

Exactly, if you tax unearned wealth or savings within the UK, then those with significant wealth will invest it abroad, isnt that obvious?

The more you tax the wealthy, the less of their money becomes available to tax, the big money just goes to cheaper tax havens, or into off shore investments and trusts.
(There's always a loop hole for the rich)
All us mugs on PAYE are easy targets with nowhere to hide.

A good example is Elon Musk's tax situation, he's one of the richest men on earth but pays peanuts in tax due to very clever (and legal) tax avoidance schemes.
Like getting paid in share allocations instead of cash, then putting all his business assets into trusts, so they arnt liable to personal income tax, then using the value of those trusts to borrow funds on the international markets, and declaring those loans as debt on his tax returns, thus negating much of his tax liabilities.

Now in fairness the rich still pay a lot in tax, in fact the top 1% of earners pay 30% of the total tax received.
But in relation to their income its a lot less than those of us on PAYE.

fatso · Jul 3, 2025

Sky Blue Pete said:
That’s cause he’s lying
I can’t believe populists get willing members throughout history time and time again
Look here a tricky issue no no it’s black and white it’s this groups fault and these are who you can blame
You and your group won’t need to do anything but just blame them and remove them
It’s fuckin infantile

They are all liers Pete, every politician from every party is full of shit.
They bullshit themselves into power.

Look at Starmer, he said he would stop the boats and smash the smuggling gangs
All bullshit.

Look at his manifesto, where was stopping the winter fuel allowance???
Where was welfare reform???
Where was the child benefit cap ???
Where was increasing taxation ???
Where was increasing council tax ???
Etc etc. All a work of bullshit.

Nick · Jul 3, 2025

EXC: Motability Scandal Deepens as £600 Million Worth of Free Cars Go to People With 'Stress', 'Generalised Anxiety' and 'Tennis Elbow'

The Motability Scheme, the government-backed programme that hands out cars in exchange for PIP benefits, is back in the spotlight. Fresh figures quietly

order-order.com

Looks like it's data from here : https://questions-statements.parliament.uk/written-questions/detail/2025-06-24/62284

How do I get me a new car?

chiefdave · Jul 3, 2025

Nick said:
How do I get me a new car?

If its as easy as that why not just pop along and get one?

Nick · Jul 3, 2025

chiefdave said:
If its as easy as that why not just pop along and get one?

That's why I was asking how to get one.

Unless it means going to a job centre, used to work a few doors down from one and they had more security than any nightclub I have ever been in. Fuck that.

fernandopartridge · Jul 3, 2025

fatso said:
Exactly, if you tax unearned wealth or savings within the UK, then those with significant wealth will invest it abroad, isnt that obvious?

The more you tax the wealthy, the less of their money becomes available to tax, the big money just goes to cheaper tax havens, or into off shore investments and trusts.
(There's always a loop hole for the rich)
All us mugs on PAYE are easy targets with nowhere to hide.

A good example is Elon Musk's tax situation, he's one of the richest men on earth but pays peanuts in tax due to very clever (and legal) tax avoidance schemes.
Like getting paid in share allocations instead of cash, then putting all his business assets into trusts, so they arnt liable to personal income tax, then using the value of those trusts to borrow funds on the international markets, and declaring those loans as debt on his tax returns, thus negating much of his tax liabilities.

Now in fairness the rich still pay a lot in tax, in fact the top 1% of earners pay 30% of the total tax received.
But in relation to their income its a lot less than those of us on PAYE.

Can you make your mind up? Do the rich pay a lot of tax or not

fatso · Jul 3, 2025

fernandopartridge said:
Can you make your mind up? Do the rich pay a lot of tax or not

I thought I'd explained it.

They pay enough tax, but if you keep coming and coming after them, they either fuck off, or use legitimate off shore investments to avoid it.

So the rediculous argument from the loonies of "just tax the rich more" doesn't actually stack up.

Captain Dart · Jul 3, 2025

Nick said:
EXC: Motability Scandal Deepens as £600 Million Worth of Free Cars Go to People With 'Stress', 'Generalised Anxiety' and 'Tennis Elbow'

The Motability Scheme, the government-backed programme that hands out cars in exchange for PIP benefits, is back in the spotlight. Fresh figures quietly

order-order.com

Looks like it's data from here : https://questions-statements.parliament.uk/written-questions/detail/2025-06-24/62284

How do I get me a new car?

I would 2 foot you and see if I can break both legs except for the fact I'm bound to come of worse.

Nick · Jul 3, 2025

Captain Dart said:
I would 2 foot you and see if I can break both legs except for the fact I'm bound to come of worse.

I probably already qualify for a few before broken bones.

CCFCSteve · Jul 3, 2025

chiefdave said:
If its as easy as that why not just pop along and get one?

Hopefully because he’s honest. People in this country, especially some on the left. need to get it into their heads that there’s plenty of people who aren’t nice and honest and are happy to abuse the system. I’ve posted about this recently when I highlighted the spike in PIP/DLA claims, as well as anecdotal evidence which has been backed up by what I’ve read and heard recently.

The ‘safety net’ is that wide that it’s harder to find people who aren’t claiming some form of benefit these days. All well and good if we had amazing public services and the poorest in society were being well looked after, but they’re not. I heard some calls on lbc on this subject a couple of days ago and there’s people who didnt get PIP assistance when they genuinely needed it and others gaming the system/not as needy getting it which suggest the whole assessment process is a shambles

ps and yes, there’s also plenty of rich people gaming the tax system and hopefully hmrc can continue their recent success in investigating the ultra wealthy

Nick · Jul 3, 2025

CCFCSteve said:
Hopefully because he’s honest. People in this country, especially some on the left. need to get it through there heads that there’s plenty of people who aren’t nice and honest and are happy to abuse the system. I’ve posted about this recently when I highlighted the spike in PIP/DLA claims, as well as anecdotal evidence which has been backed up by what I’ve read and heard recently.

The ‘safety net’ is that wide that it’s harder to find people who aren’t claiming some form of benefit these days. All well and good if we had amazing public services and the poorest in society were being well looked after, but they’re not. I heard some calls on lbc on this subject a couple of days ago and there’s people who didnt get PIP assistance when they genuinely needed it and others gaming the system/not as needy getting it which suggest the whole assessment process is a shambles

ps and yes, there’s also plenty of rich people gaming the tax system and hopefully hmrc can continue their recent success in investigating the ultra wealthy

Nah everybody needs it and nobody at all is taking the piss.

I didn't even know you could claim for it unless you were physically disabled and needed a special car to get around.

Looking at some of the nice beemas you can get though....

Sky Blue Pete · Jul 3, 2025

Are we all team Zarah from now?

Nick · Jul 3, 2025

Sky Blue Pete said:
Are we all team Zarah from now?

Another bullshitter.

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