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Do you want to discuss boring politics? (19 Viewers)

  • Thread starter mrtrench
  • Start date Jun 14, 2020
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shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,836
Loving the guys posting about serious proven economics while peddling reheated discredited Chicago School stuff.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,837
SBT said:
Huge strategic error by Reeves and Starmer to impose massive tariffs on UK exports to the United States imo
Click to expand...

Huge error to claim the March figures were down to Government strategy when it was artificial growth ahead of the tariffs.
 
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,838
Grendel said:
Huge error to claim the March figures were down to Government strategy when it was artificial growth ahead of the tariffs.
Click to expand...
I too was shocked that the government would try to take credit for economic growth - pure insanity
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,839
SBT said:
I too was shocked that the government would try to take credit for economic growth - pure insanity
Click to expand...

So by your own logic they accept responsibility the other way. Reeves said in March the plan was working. So now Reeves must accept it reality it is not and the forecast of reduced growth against yesterdays speech. This is a new honest straight talking government isn't it?
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,840
fernandopartridge said:
You are wrong, it's pointless talking to you
Click to expand...

It seems they will in reality increase forms of taxation though

Spending review assumes that all councils will hike taxes by 5%, warns IFS​

Paul Johnson now warns the chancellor's spending review has a "sting in the tail" - which is that it relies on all English councils raising tax by 5% every year.
This would lead to bills rising at their "fastest rate over any parliament since 2001-05", he says.
The IFS director explains: "Local government in England did perhaps a little better than it might have expected – it has so often been at the back of the queue.
"Its core 'spending power' is set to rise by 2.6% a year from next year. There is a sting in the tail though. This assumes that council tax bills will rise by 5% a year.
"Indeed, if English councils do choose 5% increases – and most are likely to – bills look set to rise at their fastest rate over any parliament since 2001-05.
"That might not be so bad if it weren’t for the fact that those bills are based on property values in 1991, and that the system is regressive."
 
Reactions: fernandopartridge
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,841
Grendel said:
So by your own logic they accept responsibility the other way. Reeves said in March the plan was working. So now Reeves must accept it reality it is not and the forecast of reduced growth against yesterdays speech. This is a new honest straight talking government isn't it?
Click to expand...
Lol yes I’m sure the resignation letter will be on Starmer’s desk by this afternoon
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,842
SBT said:
Lol yes I’m sure the resignation letter will be on Starmer’s desk by this afternoon
Click to expand...

Strange response.
 
Reactions: Bugsy

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,843
SBT said:
Lol yes I’m sure the resignation letter will be on Starmer’s desk by this afternoon
Click to expand...

Will have to get behind Miliband who is definitely on the way out and didn’t just get one of if not the largest cash settlement of all ministers for their agenda.

The right wing info bubble is just fan fiction these days.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,844
shmmeee said:
Will have to get behind Miliband who is definitely on the way out and didn’t just get one of if not the largest cash settlement of all ministers for their agenda.

The right wing info bubble is just fan fiction these days.
Click to expand...

Paul Johnson is right wing?

Genuinely are you OK? You seem more unhinged every day.
 

rob9872

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,845
My Economics background is a fantastic C grade A Level from 35 years ago. That still probably trumps most and my knowledge level is the square root of fek all.

We're very lucky to have such revered Economists posting on this board, especially those who are experts on almost all aspects of politics and post in such a condescending manner to anyone who disagrees.
 
Reactions: Bugsy

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,846
rob9872 said:
My Economics background is a fantastic C grade A Level from 35 years ago. That still probably trumps most and my knowledge level is the square root of fek all.

We're very lucky to have such revered Economists posting on this board, especially those who are experts on almost all aspects of politics and post in such a condescending manner to anyone who disagrees.
Click to expand...

We’ve had 14 years of your economics and it’s been an unmitigated disaster. Hearing the same myths and nonsense spouted that we heard in 2010 to justify it all grates a little TBH.
 

rob9872

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,847
shmmeee said:
We’ve had 14 years of your economics and it’s been an unmitigated disaster. Hearing the same myths and nonsense spouted that we heard in 2010 to justify it all grates a little TBH.
Click to expand...
I didn't realise I was in charge, but that's exactly the kind of response I'd expect.

Lots of things weren't great which is why we had a change, but included in that was initially a coalition, then Brexit and then Covid with a worldwide collapse and half the country on furlough. Many mistakes in other areas, but Economically I don't think they could have done much more.

Also had to contend with many on strike or threatening strike (largely because all these lovely socialists wanted more for themselves)
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,848
Captain Dart said:
It's not government spending it's borrowing.

You should find out how banks create money from nothing, biggest scam ever. If you have a mortgage you're paying intrest on that magic money.
Click to expand...
The government sells bonds to the private sector, it doesn't need to. It is a choice.
Grendel said:
It seems they will in reality increase forms of taxation though

Spending review assumes that all councils will hike taxes by 5%, warns IFS​

Paul Johnson now warns the chancellor's spending review has a "sting in the tail" - which is that it relies on all English councils raising tax by 5% every year.
This would lead to bills rising at their "fastest rate over any parliament since 2001-05", he says.
The IFS director explains: "Local government in England did perhaps a little better than it might have expected – it has so often been at the back of the queue.
"Its core 'spending power' is set to rise by 2.6% a year from next year. There is a sting in the tail though. This assumes that council tax bills will rise by 5% a year.
"Indeed, if English councils do choose 5% increases – and most are likely to – bills look set to rise at their fastest rate over any parliament since 2001-05.
"That might not be so bad if it weren’t for the fact that those bills are based on property values in 1991, and that the system is regressive."
Click to expand...
Yeah I heard this last night, it's quite underhand really but politically I suppose it makes sense to pass the blame onto Reform led councils
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,849
Grendel said:
Paul Johnson is right wing?

Genuinely are you OK? You seem more unhinged every day.
Click to expand...
Paul Johnson is right wing given that his whole schtick is based on government as household
 
N

Northants Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,850
rob9872 said:
Economically I don't think they could have done much more
Click to expand...
Liz Truss would like a word
 
Reactions: torchomatic

fatso

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,851
Captain Dart said:
It's not government spending it's borrowing.

You should find out how banks create money from nothing, biggest scam ever. If you have a mortgage you're paying intrest on that magic money.
Click to expand...
100% agree.

Between fractional reserve banking and quantative easing the whole global financial system is a corrupt scam designed to keep the bankers in control.

The banks lend money they don't have and charge interest on that non existant money that keeps the working class in jobs they don't like for their entire lives, if you default on that loan they seize your home which they then sell for money that does exist ???
It's totally fucked up. If you do keep up with the payments you are using real money to repay non existent money, while at the same time paying tax to the government for the privilege of working to pay your bank "debt" (which the bank never even had)
If you work 5 days a week and pay 40% tax, then you are working for the tax man 2 days a week, BEFORE you even start paying interest on the non existant money that the bank "loaned" to you.

How fucked up is that?

Countries that over spend or over comit can borrow on the international markets (money that doesn't exist) until the repayments become unaffordable, then they can just print more of their own currency, until that currency becomes de-valued and inflation cripples their economy.
 
Last edited: Jun 12, 2025
Reactions: Captain Dart

fatso

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,852
fernandopartridge said:
In the real world money is created every day through government spending, that is a fact. Here is some research into how it all works

Modern Monetary Theory - a brief introduction - The Gower Initiative for Modern Money Studies

Living within your means is a good rule for households, but a government with its own currency and its own central bank is not at all like a household.
gimms.org.uk

I'll give you your due, consistently clueless whether on or off topic
Click to expand...

Reeves refuses to rule out tax rises after economy shrinks

The chancellor highlights "uncertainty" in the world as economists warn of tax rises if the economy fails to grow.
www.bbc.co.uk

Proof your talking your usual bollocks.

New government spending commitments are almost always followed by increases in taxes or borrowing.

Your living in cuckoo land if you believe differently.

Your post has one thing right, any government that has its own currency and central bank can print its own money, (that's called quantative easing) the reason it isnt done routinely is that it de-values that currency and leads to rampant inflation.

The article you linked to conveniently chose to ignore the pitfalls of their theory!

If you don't understand that then at least ask yourself why it hasn't been done previously to wipe out our national debt?
 
Last edited: Jun 12, 2025

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,853
fatso said:

Reeves refuses to rule out tax rises after economy shrinks

The chancellor highlights "uncertainty" in the world as economists warn of tax rises if the economy fails to grow.
www.bbc.co.uk

Proof your talking your usual bollocks.

New government spending commitments are almost always followed by increases in taxes or borrowing.

Your living in cuckoo land if you believe differently.

Your post has one thing right, any government that has its own currency and central bank can print its own money, (that's called quantative easing) the reason it isnt done routinely is that it de-values that currency and leads to rampant inflation.

The article you linked to conveniently chose to ignore the pitfalls of their theory!

If you don't understand that then at least ask yourself why it hasn't been done previously to wipe out our national debt?
Click to expand...
Your comprehension is just abysmal
 
Reactions: torchomatic and Sick Boy
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,854
fatso said:
any government that has its own currency and central bank can print its own money, (that's called quantative easing)
Click to expand...
That’s not what quantitative easing is, and if you’re going to get so riled up by it, I would at least recommend learning how to spell it first.
 
Reactions: Northants Sky Blue

fatso

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,855
fernandopartridge said:
Your comprehension is just abysmal
Click to expand...
Yea ok mate,
 

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Reactions: PVA, SBT, SBAndy and 1 other person

mmttww

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,856
'Legacy Media' wtaf

What's the alternative?
 

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,857
fatso said:
100% agree.

Between fractional reserve banking and quantative easing the whole global financial system is a corrupt scam designed to keep the bankers in control.

The banks lend money they don't have and charge interest on that non existant money that keeps the working class in jobs they don't like for their entire lives, if you default on that loan they seize your home which they then sell for money that does exist ???
It's totally fucked up. If you do keep up with the payments you are using real money to repay non existent money, while at the same time paying tax to the government for the privilege of working to pay your bank "debt" (which the bank never even had)
If you work 5 days a week and pay 40% tax, then you are working for the tax man 2 days a week, BEFORE you even start paying interest on the non existant money that the bank "loaned" to you.

How fucked up is that?

Countries that over spend or over comit can borrow on the international markets (money that doesn't exist) until the repayments become unaffordable, then they can just print more of their own currency, until that currency becomes de-valued and inflation cripples their economy.
Click to expand...
You get so close to working it out, then fuck it at the last minute by blaming it on having to work two days for the tax man before you start earning.

you identify bankers as a big part of the problem. And do you know whose version of economics they side with...?

And just for clarity we've used QE twice in the last generation. Once for covid (which is fair enough, even if you can argue about the way it was used) and the other to dig the banks out of self-inflicted, greedy black hole. So as far as I'm concerned if we can laden the country with debt in perpetuity for that we can certainly do it to make ourselves energy secure and build infrastructure.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,858
mmttww said:
'Legacy Media' wtaf

What's the alternative?
Click to expand...

Social media, where what you see isn’t determined by right wing billionai…. Wait never mind.
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,859
mmttww said:
'Legacy Media' wtaf

What's the alternative?
Click to expand...
Wake up sheeple
 
Reactions: mmttww

mmttww

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,860
Sky_Blue_Dreamer said:
as far as I'm concerned if we can laden the country with debt in perpetuity for that we can certainly do it to make ourselves energy secure and build infrastructure.
Click to expand...

Ainnit.
 
P

PVA

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,861
mmttww said:
'Legacy Media' wtaf

What's the alternative?
Click to expand...

Well I've seen fatso post a convicted paedophile as a source on here before, so that maybe?

I think I'll stick with the 'Legacy Media'.
 

SBAndy

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,862
The irony of course being @fatso using a BBC article to try and back up his point only to criticise the legacy media within 3 posts.
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete

Captain Dart

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 12, 2025
  • #51,863
mmttww said:
'Legacy Media' wtaf

What's the alternative?
Click to expand...
Sure is easier than thinking so is AI.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 14, 2025
  • #51,864
Captain Dart said:
Sure is easier than thinking so is AI.
Click to expand...

Intelligence is application of knowledge, garbage in garbage out.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 14, 2025
  • #51,865
Meet the new right, same as the old right:

 
Reactions: torchomatic and Sky Blue Pete

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 14, 2025
  • #51,866


High court dismisses challenges against adding VAT to UK private school fees

Surcharge was a Labour party manifesto commitment at the 2024 general election
www.theguardian.com
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 14, 2025
  • #51,867
shmmeee said:


High court dismisses challenges against adding VAT to UK private school fees

Surcharge was a Labour party manifesto commitment at the 2024 general election
www.theguardian.com
Click to expand...
Finally. A Brexit benefit.
 

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 14, 2025
  • #51,868
shmmeee said:


High court dismisses challenges against adding VAT to UK private school fees

Surcharge was a Labour party manifesto commitment at the 2024 general election
www.theguardian.com
Click to expand...
Its hard not to feel sorry for these unfortunate people
 
Reactions: Sky_Blue_Dreamer, Brighton Sky Blue, CCFCSteve and 1 other person

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 14, 2025
  • #51,869
chiefdave said:
Its hard not to feel sorry for these unfortunate people
View attachment 43629
Click to expand...

 
Reactions: SBT
C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
  • Jun 14, 2025
  • #51,870
chiefdave said:
Its hard not to feel sorry for these unfortunate people
View attachment 43629
Click to expand...

Surely the telegraph has been taken over and being run as a parody ?!
 
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