CCFC Statement on offal (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Hibbert
- Start date
Tankie
New Member
AJSCCFC.
I'm firmly with you on this one.
Garry Hoffman is a city fan, and his intentions and desire is to see the Football Club rise from the ashes of years of neglect and mediocrity.
Clearly Sisu are not in the least concerned about our fortunes on the pitch, they are not Football fans, let alone CCFC fans, and in fact refuse to call it a football club, continually refering to it as "The Business" a business they took over, and gained total holding of by holding a gun to the head of many, life time, small shareholders, some of who'm had held shares going back generations.
These honest, loyal, Coventry supporters, were put in an impossible position, and had to yield to the threat of Sisu pulling out and The sky blues going under.
what a cruel and vicious mill stone to place round the necks
of people who had given support to the City over the years.
They were in fact, mugged of their shares by Hoods from the City, who thought mistakenly, that the club could be turned round with minimum investment in the playing Side of things.
Sisus miscomprehension of the situation, has left us where we are today, an underfunded club, with a dangeriously thin squad, nestling in the drop zone.
Garry Hoffman may not be everyones cup of tea for various reasons, yes its difficult to love a multi millionaire banker, but I believe his connection to the club as a fan, Like geoff Robinson, has got to make his ownership a better bet for the future of this Football Club.
we've tried the DEvil..Lets give the deep blue Sea a chance.
Have a nice day....Tankie..Bedworthshire..
Sterling Archer
Well-Known Member
The issue I have with all of this has nothing to do with SISU. Its the blind faith a lot of fans are showing in Hoffman when, lets be honest, he hasn't really carried out any actions to do with buying the club worth making us back him. What also grinds my gears is the 'CCFC Legend Fan' status Joe Elliott has seemingly been elevated. Again, short memories, this guy has been part of the last 3 regimes you have all waved your fists in anger at.
Its the fickleness of the whole situation. You're either a "Hoffman bum licker" or a "SISU c*** smoker". Why can't some of us be wary of both parties? Why can't some of us see the good SISU have done in the last 3 years without posts such as "YOU ARE LEONARD BRODY! I HOPE YOU DIE" etc.
At the moment, I don't really trust either party for reasons that I have read and had confirmed. We need to think more logically and less on a reactionary scale to suit our agendas. Although in essence, both parties are higher up in the business world echelons than any of us fans are so probably care very little about what us fans are thinking/doing about the situation. I read a report saying 16 people protested after the game (or possibly before) ..... 16. Thats cringeworthy in my eyes.
Oh and anyone who thinks we are in a worse position at the moment, than any other we have been in, have very short memories.
I think we should contribute some of the blame to the previous managers we have had. Micky Adams, Chris Coleman and Aidy Boothroyd have all wasted money/wages (transfer budget) they have on quite frankly average to crap players.
Its the fickleness of the whole situation. You're either a "Hoffman bum licker" or a "SISU c*** smoker". Why can't some of us be wary of both parties? Why can't some of us see the good SISU have done in the last 3 years without posts such as "YOU ARE LEONARD BRODY! I HOPE YOU DIE" etc.
At the moment, I don't really trust either party for reasons that I have read and had confirmed. We need to think more logically and less on a reactionary scale to suit our agendas. Although in essence, both parties are higher up in the business world echelons than any of us fans are so probably care very little about what us fans are thinking/doing about the situation. I read a report saying 16 people protested after the game (or possibly before) ..... 16. Thats cringeworthy in my eyes.
Oh and anyone who thinks we are in a worse position at the moment, than any other we have been in, have very short memories.
I think we should contribute some of the blame to the previous managers we have had. Micky Adams, Chris Coleman and Aidy Boothroyd have all wasted money/wages (transfer budget) they have on quite frankly average to crap players.
the rabbit
New Member
Fans forum at Kenilworth what a joke.Paul Clouting more like Slippery Sam,he never answered one question,he evaded everything and every one.The cov. radio presenter was as bad,he didnt say any thing controversial incase they where barred from the club.:jerkit:
Moff
Well-Known Member
No I havent a short memory, just cant think of anthing much worse than this, apart from the day SISU took over, and look how well that has turned out.
Do you therefore feel we are much further forward now under their stewardship?
I'mARealWizard
New Member
Sterling Archer
Well-Known Member
Moff, first of all, thats twice you've mis read my posts and seemingly put me under the 'SISU apologists' category. Like I have mentioned, why can't I be wary of both parties? Why must I either be a SISU apologist or a Gary Hoffman supporter?
On the pitch we are in the same position we have been in for the last 8 or 9 years. Off the pitch, I fail to see how we aren't in the same state we have been for the last 8 or 9 years.
When SISU came in, we were in a dreadful position. That dreadful position had degenerated ever since relegation.
As for on the pitch, I still have nightmares of that season under McAllister where (if I remember correctly) we won 1 out of our last 21 games and had £0 to bring in any players as McAllister built a team around himself and youth which was painstakingly depressing.
sotv1987
Member
As much as i hate to say this, i tend to agree with yuo, if he was serious about a takeover, just get on with it, name the backers and stop all the bullshit propaganda has is generating, when he spkoe in the casino on saturday i came away slightly suspicious of this consotium, i really hope i'm wrong, but at the moment i'm not confidant in Hoffman!!!
Moff
Well-Known Member
Yes that was a depressing season.
I dont place you in the category of SISU apologists, nor does it matter who or what you do or dont support, I was just interested to see what your opinion was on why you perceive some people to have 'short memories', as personally I cant remember things as bad as this but respect your thoughts on why you think differently.
ajsccfc
Well-Known Member
Thing about SISU for me is that they may be incapable of producing the goods, but it is still in their interests to do so, even if it's self-interest. The way some people go on you'd think they're comic book villains out to sabotage us and leave us tied to the railroad tracks.
I have absolutely no doubt of Hoffman's intentions, but as we all surely know that's no more guarantee than anything. If his offer meets SISU's valuation I'd hope they come to an agreement, bearing in mind that as current owners SISU have every right to dictate terms.
cloughie
Well-Known Member
to quote hibbert. If Sisu go it wouldn't be admin, it would be liquidation. In simple terms, Coventry City football club will no longer exsist,
Not about agreeing with or disagreeing, as we have prospective buyers and who knows who else might be interested if in admin, is this a sensible statement? ( I mean Hibberts )
No longer exhist?! Take a look at what Coventry Football Club is in it's current form. It's a squad of players. Full stop. That's it! Coventry will always have a football club and they will always have the stadium to play in due to the fact the club don't own it. If we actually went into liquidation we will only lose a squad of players worthy of league 1. Wow! With our fan base and support we would do a Wimbledon.
Yep - and we could even be back to where we are now in about ... eh ... 20 years time?
ajsccfc
Well-Known Member
Did you mean to quote me? My point was about the abuse of opposing views that prevents any kind of discussion.
magic82ball
New Member
Right, well Wimbledon took 9 years to get back to the football league or was you massively exagerating for effect? What have Coventry City done in that 9 years?
Exactly! I'm not saying it's the definitive answer but it certainly makes you think. I don't personally want city to go into admin or liquidation but it certainly does not scare me. It's fast getting to the point where I'd rather take a bit of a hit just to see SISU get screwed over.
They also lost all their Wimbledon FC history and had to return their FA trophy won the year after us. They are battling a relatively huge debt and their fan base is down to about 3.000.
In those 9 years we have played in the championship, the league cup and the FA cup.
mattylad
Member
Think of it this way, SISU don't run Coventry city they back the vehicle that does, the people who attended the meeting were the ones that will run the club rather than the money men. I think this has pissed clouting and tango man off bcos they want to counter propose a deal that would keep them in there jobs. Tango man has spent years trying to be a football chairman so why would he now want to give that up.
I have seen a few posts that hints the chairman and board members will do whatever it takes to ruin any chance of a take over. In reality they know what kind of offer the owners will accept/consider and is acting as instructed.
Sterling Archer
Well-Known Member
I hate to go over old ground but I just fail to see SISU's end game if they don't sell. What are they realistically hoping to get out of the club? They have already said they aren't prepared to fund for another season after this one. Are they literally awaiting an offer of £30m for the club? Surely they are not that naive to think anyone is going to buy a League 1 bound club for that kind of money.
If anyone with any sense can shed some light on this it would be impressive. If you're just going to reply with "they are doing it deliberately because they hate our club and Ken Dulieu drowns puppies in his spare time" then don't bother.
If anyone with any sense can shed some light on this it would be impressive. If you're just going to reply with "they are doing it deliberately because they hate our club and Ken Dulieu drowns puppies in his spare time" then don't bother.
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oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
The original premise of the SISU fund investment is to take an ailing club turn it around and sell it on, thereby making profit for investors and SISU. That is still the objective but it is debateable if it can be achieved. It could now be to get the best deal and smallest loss on the loans that they can
At present the finances are improved in that less cashflow required to support the club and losses are lower - how long that lasts given falling crowds is open to debate. The board can at present turn round to SISU and say they are improving the cost structure of the club and at present reducing losses. This is important as it gave the board then SISU confidence to ask its fund investors for more money. The funds and SISU have given undertakings to fund club to next April/May..... that could be extended depending how this years financials turn out.... but it gives the Board time to sort out the finances and any deals to sell the club.
They dont expect to sell club for £30m they expect repayment of the loans there is a big difference - The end game is still the same for SISU and its investors its the figures that have changed - they never were going to be here long term
At present the finances are improved in that less cashflow required to support the club and losses are lower - how long that lasts given falling crowds is open to debate. The board can at present turn round to SISU and say they are improving the cost structure of the club and at present reducing losses. This is important as it gave the board then SISU confidence to ask its fund investors for more money. The funds and SISU have given undertakings to fund club to next April/May..... that could be extended depending how this years financials turn out.... but it gives the Board time to sort out the finances and any deals to sell the club.
They dont expect to sell club for £30m they expect repayment of the loans there is a big difference - The end game is still the same for SISU and its investors its the figures that have changed - they never were going to be here long term
skybluesam66
Well-Known Member
Liquidation talk is bollocks
Liquidation would realise nothing for SISU and creditors
Admin, would mean that an investor who came up with a sum greater than the separate parts - could buy the club
As the separate parts, are worth about £2.50 - The club would be taken over for a figure greater than that from Admin (subject to agreement ) - and anything is better than nothing, so liquidation would not happen
Liquidation would realise nothing for SISU and creditors
Admin, would mean that an investor who came up with a sum greater than the separate parts - could buy the club
As the separate parts, are worth about £2.50 - The club would be taken over for a figure greater than that from Admin (subject to agreement ) - and anything is better than nothing, so liquidation would not happen
oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
if they are paid anything then it is all out of the same pot - are they paid anything though? we just dont know. Board has said previously they were not paid and as yet no evidence to say they have been. Folk can say they have, they are ripping club off etc etc but they are only guessing - all it does is stoke up more ill feeling when same folk could be wrong (not saying they are just all things possible)
oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
and the difference between those options financially is?
The purpose of administration is to find a deal that satisfies in some way the creditors of a company that allows continued trading. It has nothing to do with what is best for a potential investor. If the creditors are to recieve basically nothing then there is no deal for the creditors to approve and liquidation is a possibility.
I agree for SISU neither option is best for them but they are not the only creditor and SISU might not get any choice
Sub
Well-Known Member
i was just thinking if we have saved all this money through restructering and releasing players and if we are paying all these directors surley that more or less puts us back to square one on a finacial side and put us on a weaker footing on the playing side :thinking about:
oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
see where you are coming from sub but would hope the new directors & restructuring etc do not take up all the cost savings because at the moment i would estimate those at £2m !
oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
Everyone keeps banging on about losing £500K per month losses ...... well we were to 31/05/10 (in round terms) but since then we have been cutting costs and the write down of player contracts is smaller. So logic says current losses should not be £500k.
In PR terms it is a double edged sword....... we are losing £500k ........... but on the plus side SISU are supporting the clubs finances. Makes SISU look better doesnt it.
But until the accounts for 2011 etc are released we dont know the real figures. However the SBS&L group made £6m losses in 2010 and in that year the debt to SISU grew £700K - kind of implies they dont fund all the losses doesnt it. As always smoke and mirrors at the Ricoh
In PR terms it is a double edged sword....... we are losing £500k ........... but on the plus side SISU are supporting the clubs finances. Makes SISU look better doesnt it.
But until the accounts for 2011 etc are released we dont know the real figures. However the SBS&L group made £6m losses in 2010 and in that year the debt to SISU grew £700K - kind of implies they dont fund all the losses doesnt it. As always smoke and mirrors at the Ricoh
ashbyjan
Well-Known Member
For me the worrying part is that we are starting to build up debt outside the SISU family - mortgaging to third parties, borrowing from banks etc - I guess SISU are underwriting these but should we start defaulting on them how will they react? That is when admin could become a reality. Also the losses are a much trumpeted £500k a month when it suits the board yet if they haven't been substantially reduced then heads should roll yet from a PR point of view the board seem to think that perpetuating the myth that SISU are paying in £500k every month to keep us going somehow will somehow appease the fans. As has been said before - Ken, the fans are not idiots and can see through the lies, misunderstandings, half truths that you and Clouting spout.
Yes, but we have already established that financial losses are not the same as cash flow deficit. Previous player sales could have been transformed from receivables in the previous account to actual cash in the last account.
Still, it is a fair assumption that the board have upped the external debts, but this is not a crime or even suspecious.
oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
Quite agree Godiva it isnt a crime or suspicious that external finance has been raised - they have to do what they have to so the club keeps going. Aside from the fact it increases the total debts and it isnt debt to SISU- i think that is the point being made, because that makes the risk of administration greater because external creditors might not be so patient
We have established the difference between cashflow and losses yes but the point being made is that KD and others regularly do not. The continue to talk of £500k losses and that SISU fund this - it implies to the layman that SISU put £500k into the club each month and clearly even by their own figures they do not.
Point is KD and co are being economic with what they tell us about the finances - i accept they do not actually have to say anything
We have established the difference between cashflow and losses yes but the point being made is that KD and others regularly do not. The continue to talk of £500k losses and that SISU fund this - it implies to the layman that SISU put £500k into the club each month and clearly even by their own figures they do not.
Point is KD and co are being economic with what they tell us about the finances - i accept they do not actually have to say anything
