50+1 Fan Control of club (1 Viewer)

[NTFC]

Why are you guys holding out for a mystery investor and continuing to doff your caps to the "businessmen" who have corrupted every level of football.

Surely now is a prime chance to have a fan owned club according to the German 50+1 model (successfully used throughout Europe)

Coventry AFC Pheonix club, back at the Ricoh and in the FL withing a few years.

Ask Portmouth if they would go back to the merry go round of dodgy types using their club for their own means.

 

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[shmmeee]

Thanks for the idea but believe moves down that road have been being pursued. Why do you think we're so pally with the Pompey trust?

 

[Manchester_sky_blue]

There are discussions taking place about a Phoenix club (look at the Coventry 1883 threads on here) but setting up a new club, at least one with serious ambitions, is time consuming, labour intensive and can be very expensive. Plus it would have to start from the bottom of the FL pyramid and would therefore take 10 years to reach the football league.

Many fans are not willing to support a phoenix club whilst CCFC still exists so there are a lot of questions still to be resolved.

Everyone seems to be holding up the Pompey situation as some kind of ideal model for future football in England but you have to remember that its still in its infancy and not as free of the shackles of money and business as people seem to think. The supporters trust were only able to buy Pompey by virtue of some generous donations from local business' and a whacking great loan from Portsmouth Council. It remains to be seen how stable and successful their fan-owned model will prove to be. Also worth pointing out that they were able to buy their exisiting club and a place in league 2 with all the incomes that come with a place in the league proper. There is no suggestion that SISU would be willing to sell to a Coventry fans trust.

 

[CovFan]

The 50+1 model that the Football League chairman has already derided and said that fan ownership is a bad idea?

 

[duffer]

Why are you guys holding out for a mystery investor and continuing to doff your caps to the "businessmen" who have corrupted every level of football.

You mean like Cardoza?

Surely now is a prime chance to have a fan owned club according to the German 50+1 model (successfully used throughout Europe)

Coventry AFC Pheonix club, back at the Ricoh and in the FL withing a few years.

Ask Portmouth if they would go back to the merry go round of dodgy types using their club for their own means.

We're fighting because we don't think we've lost our club yet, despite all the crap that's gone on.

Politely, why don't you start a Phoenix club in Northampton on the 50+1 basis? That way you wouldn't be exposed to dodgy types doing things like groundsharing just to make a few bob.

Is it perhaps because there's an awful lot of history and memories held within your current club that you don't want to sacrifice, even if it is currently owned by someone who values money above all other things.

 

[shmmeee]

Sorry misread OP: no Phoenix club til were dead. I meant buying the current club. They have to go one day, would be nice if we're in the position to bid seriously this time.

 

[mark82]

The 50+1 model that the Football League chairman has already derided and said that fan ownership is a bad idea?

Since when did the football league know what was right. I can see it now... "No fan owned club has ever had success apart from Bayern Munich, Borussia Dortmund, Barcelona, Real Madrid..... Oh wait"

 

[CovFan]

Since when did the football league know what was right. I can see it now... "No fan owned club has ever had success apart from Bayern Munich, Borussia Dortmund, Barcelona, Real Madrid..... Oh wait"

I get the feeling they'd directly oppose any way of fan ownership becoming the norm, regardless of its success.

 

[Gint11]

Why are you guys holding out for a mystery investor and continuing to doff your caps to the "businessmen" who have corrupted every level of football.

Surely now is a prime chance to have a fan owned club according to the German 50+1 model (successfully used throughout Europe)

Coventry AFC Pheonix club, back at the Ricoh and in the FL withing a few years.

NTFC, is it that easy to 'just become a fan owned club' ? Dont be silly.

Ask Portmouth if they would go back to the merry go round of dodgy types using their club for their own means.

NTFC, is it that easy to 'just become a fan owned club' ? Dont be silly.

 

[oldskyblue58]

its got to be for sale first and CCFC isnt according to TF/ML etc ...... so fans ownership this moment is not something achievable........ should there be plans to get involved yes but that will depend on having owners open to the idea and being able to outbid other potential buyers

As for a pheonix club for me that is a non starter until such time as CCFC ceases to exist. A new club at the Ricoh would be exactly that, something new, and not what I have supported for over 45 years. Yes a pheonix club can be done and yes it could be fan owned but that path is not all sweetness and light

just my opinion

 

[RFC]

Won't work here IMHO for many years to come!

 

[James Smith]

Won't work here IMHO for many years to come!

But if people want to try, they still can - there's no law against it.

 

[ccfcway]

But if people want to try, they still can - there's no law against it.

what about the pig idea ?

 

[James Smith]

what about the pig idea ?

I'm can't stop you from trying it but personally I think it's a dumb idea as a vegetarian and given the religious sentiments involved.

 

[chiefdave]

its got to be for sale first and CCFC isnt according to TF/ML etc ...... so fans ownership this moment is not something achievable........ should there be plans to get involved yes but that will depend on having owners open to the idea and being able to outbid other potential buyers

doesn't just have to be for sale it has to be for sale at the right price. how much would SISU want? If we say our hardcore fanbase is as high as 10K a lot of them wouldn't be able to afford to invest in the club so say you had 5K who say they will make a financial commitment. Even if you can knock SISU down as low as 10m that's still 2K each with no ownership stake in the Ricoh.

Pompey had quite the struggle to raise a relatively small amount, and if you really dig into it they're aren't as much of a fan owned club as people think they are. To equate it to our situation it would be like Joe ande Hoff putting a few quid in then asking the fans to chip in and asking the council and PK4 to loan them a few million to buy the Ricoh (in return for PK4 getting the development land and a green light on any planning application). They're also still millions in debt with multiple charges over their assets, if any of their projections in their business plan prove to be over estimates they could have a big problem. Think people would be wise to give it a few years before holding Pompey up as a shining example.

 

[Cobblers36]

Honestly reading some of the stuff on here it's no wonder your club is fucked.

 

[James Smith]

doesn't just have to be for sale it has to be for sale at the right price. how much would SISU want? If we say our hardcore fanbase is as high as 10K a lot of them wouldn't be able to afford to invest in the club so say you had 5K who say they will make a financial commitment. Even if you can knock SISU down as low as 10m that's still 2K each with no ownership stake in the Ricoh.

Pompey had quite the struggle to raise a relatively small amount, and if you really dig into it they're aren't as much of a fan owned club as people think they are. To equate it to our situation it would be like Joe ande Hoff putting a few quid in then asking the fans to chip in and asking the council and PK4 to loan them a few million to buy the Ricoh (in return for PK4 getting the development land and a green light on any planning application). They're also still millions in debt with multiple charges over their assets, if any of their projections in their business plan prove to be over estimates they could have a big problem. Think people would be wise to give it a few years before holding Pompey up as a shining example.

The ACL statement a few Saturdays ago said

Statement from the Board of Arena Coventry Limited
Mr Fisher has also now chosen to make factually inaccurate public statements relating to the meeting attended by Joy Seppala as well as ACL Board members on Thursday 25 July. It is interesting to note Mr Fisher’s failure to mention Ms Seppala’s verbal statement during this meeting, made in the presence of her own lawyers that the only circumstance in which the Club would return to the Ricoh would be upon SISU assuming full ownership of the venue without any negotiation on purchase price. Ms Seppala also stated at this meeting her intention to continue to threaten ACL and its shareholders with expensive litigation at every possible opportunity. Perhaps the fact that Mr Fisher was not himself present at this meeting has distorted his view of what was really discussed.

I've snipped out the relevant paragraph and it is my bolding.

Now OSB reckons that Joy offered the council £5m for the freehold of the Ricoh,

Only a guess but I would bet on Seppala wanting the freehold of the whole site for somewhere less than £5m (why offer a sensible sum ?) and her being prepared to keep going to legal actions to drain the stakeholders of cash so picking up the freehold and ACL. Pick it up for a pittance flip the site for a big gain. No tax to pay because of losses, repay the SISU debt job done.

Just a thought though but in a contaminated state the site was purchased for something like £15m and half sold to Tesco for 62m. So the real value of the freehold stadium/complex and development land remaining is ?

a lot more than SISU want/expect to pay

Again my bolding.


I think that's possible based on past events and could have been less. But we don't know the exact figure she offered to the council, that's the £5m question

 

[James Smith]

Honestly reading some of the stuff on here it's no wonder your club is fucked.

I just hope you aren't sorry you ever heard the name SISU in connection with your club.

 

[skyblueman]

Honestly reading some of the stuff on here it's no wonder your club is fucked.

A little insensitive but I concede you do have a point there

 

[rustyredline]

Is it just me or are certain Northampton fans trying to blame us for the mess at ccfc. Its as if we've been kicked out by our wife and we're crashing at their's for a few nights and now they getting sick of us and starting to lecture and nitpick. no 1 apart from sisu chooses to be in Northampton. no decent cov fan wants to go to ur shed. Do 1 and instead of lecturing us on what we should be doing all the time, concentrate on your own team or is it too dull?

 

[mark82]

Honestly reading some of the stuff on here it's no wonder your club is fucked.

What would you do then?

 

[Broken Hearted Sky Blue]

What would you do then?

I would imagine that after taking one of the free tickets on offer in Northampton He'd come on here and.........

 

[RogerH]

So what do we do, then?

If we accept that the club is not for sale, and nobody has the money to make SISU change their mind.
It seems unlikely that SISU will ever return to the Ricoh as ACL/Council/Higgs seem to be totally opposed to allowing SISU to own any part of the Ricoh which appears to be SISU's pre-requisite for negotiations.

It seems to me that there are two distinct choices.

1. We wait for SISU to build their new stadium and come back to the Coventry area. How long do we wait for something to happen ? What if nothing does ? What if SISU apply for planning permission for one or more sites and are unsuccessful ? What then ? The club would still exist but not in Coventry.

2. Planning goes ahead to form a new club with a view to start playing at the Ricoh in August 2014. Such a club would have to start at the same level as AFC Wimbledon did, and work it's way up.

So what is it to be, an exiled CCFC with no guarantees whatsoever of a return to Coventry, or a new club, or both ?
Do fans prefer to support the existing club at Northampton or wherever, or put their faith in something new ?

Not taking sides, but every fan will have to make the above choice sooner or later.

 

[Broken Hearted Sky Blue]

So what do we do, then?

If we accept that the club is not for sale, and nobody has the money to make SISU change their mind.
It seems unlikely that SISU will ever return to the Ricoh as ACL/Council/Higgs seem to be totally opposed to allowing SISU to own any part of the Ricoh which appears to be SISU's pre-requisite for negotiations.

It seems to me that there are two distinct choices.

1. We wait for SISU to build their new stadium and come back to the Coventry area. How long do we wait for something to happen ? What if nothing does ? What if SISU apply for planning permission for one or more sites and are unsuccessful ? What then ? The club would still exist but not in Coventry.

2. Planning goes ahead to form a new club with a view to start playing at the Ricoh in August 2014. Such a club would have to start at the same level as AFC Wimbledon did, and work it's way up.

So what is it to be, an exiled CCFC with no guarantees whatsoever of a return to Coventry, or a new club, or both ?
Do fans prefer to support the existing club at Northampton or wherever, or put their faith in something new ?

Not taking sides, but every fan will have to make the above choice sooner or later.

I knew I should have been a Manchester United fan:facepalm:

 

[mark82]

I knew I should have been a Manchester United fan:facepalm:

Haha. Even some of them are not happy! Just shows success on the pitch is not everything.

 

[ian lollipop]

So what do we do, then?

If we accept that the club is not for sale, and nobody has the money to make SISU change their mind.
It seems unlikely that SISU will ever return to the Ricoh as ACL/Council/Higgs seem to be totally opposed to allowing SISU to own any part of the Ricoh which appears to be SISU's pre-requisite for negotiations.

It seems to me that there are two distinct choices.

1. We wait for SISU to build their new stadium and come back to the Coventry area. How long do we wait for something to happen ? What if nothing does ? What if SISU apply for planning permission for one or more sites and are unsuccessful ? What then ? The club would still exist but not in Coventry.

2. Planning goes ahead to form a new club with a view to start playing at the Ricoh in August 2014. Such a club would have to start at the same level as AFC Wimbledon did, and work it's way up.

So what is it to be, an exiled CCFC with no guarantees whatsoever of a return to Coventry, or a new club, or both ?
Do fans prefer to support the existing club at Northampton or wherever, or put their faith in something new ?

Not taking sides, but every fan will have to make the above choice sooner or later.

To me the choice will be sooner than we think sisu had many chances to return home but turned them all down flat so we should seriously be looking at the second option or in 3 years time when there still in Northampton the fans will be no further forward and will still be moaning on threads on these forums