JP heading out on loan (1 Viewer)

Nonleagueherewecome said:

Maybe like McSheffrey at Luton? But like McSheffrey, he was already good enough, actually...

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Yep was thinking of the same scenario!

shmmeee said:

I'd argue about him not being prolific TBF.

Here's his stats from last season (if Im reading transfermarkt properly, which isn't a given)

League (Inc playoffs): Minutes: 541 (6 game equivalents) Goals: 3 Ratio: 2 game equivalents per goal.

Cups: Minutes: 161 (1.79 game equivalents) Goals: 3 Ratio: 0.6 game equivalents per goal.

Overall: 702 minutes (7.8 games) to 6 goals, a goal every 1.3 games.

Sure the sample size is small and easily skewed, but he can only work with what he's given and that's pretty prolific.

I'd say the kid deserves his chance.

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Even if you just look at his league form it was a goal every 150 minutes, I know its a very small number of games/minutes but that is up there with McNulty and much higher than bakayokos goal every 580 minutes in the league last season (513 mins career in the league)

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An obvious solution is for us to loan JP to Portsmouth, to sit on their bench, and then they can release Conor Chaplin to play for us!
Perfect solution.

stupot07 said:

Even if you just look at his league form it was a goal every 150 minutes, I know its a very small number of games/minutes but that is up there with McNulty and much higher than bakayokos goal every 580 minutes in the league last season (513 mins career in the league

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Agreed, to an extent.

As I’ve stated previously, I’d give him a run in the team. But Robins seems to think he’s not ready, which I don’t necessarily disagree with. A short-term loan could be beneficial to JP and us.

We’ve spent money on Bakayoko and Hiwula. Bakayoko seems like a bit of a gamble, hence the relatively short-term contract. Both us and Bristol Rovers were willing to spend 200k on him, suggests there’s something they’ve seen in him. We’ve got to develop players and he seems like a ‘diamond in the rough’ type player if he can improve his finishing. Whilst not making a direct comparison, but it’s in a similar vain to Callum Wilson — who before that breakthrough season, was garbage. To the extent that Pressley ‘threatened’ to rip his contract up in the preseason of the 13/14 season (I think that was the year) and had we sold him for 200k that preseason, I’d have taken it all day. We all would have.

Mucca Mad Boys said:

For me, Ponticelli needs game time. Whether it be with us or out on loan, 20m cameos will stunt his development. Personally, I’d be tempted to give him a go upfront. However, if Robins doesn’t feel he’s ready, a loan to L2 and a few goals at senior level will force him back into the picture with us.

The lads needs quality game time or we’ll waste his talent.

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Completely agree. Especially since he's with us for at least 5 years. Would be a complete waste if he wasn't used at all by anyone and would certainly impact his development in the game. It is a short enough career as it is

Mucca Mad Boys said:

Agreed, to an extent.

As I’ve stated previously, I’d give him a run in the team. But Robins seems to think he’s not ready, which I don’t necessarily disagree with. A short-term loan could be beneficial to JP and us.

We’ve spent money on Bakayoko and Hiwula. Bakayoko seems like a bit of a gamble, hence the relatively short-term contract. Both us and Bristol Rovers were willing to spend 200k on him, suggests there’s something they’ve seen in him. We’ve got to develop players and he seems like a ‘diamond in the rough’ type player if he can improve his finishing. Whilst not making a direct comparison, but it’s in a similar vain to Callum Wilson — who before that breakthrough season, was garbage. To the extent that Pressley ‘threatened’ to rip his contract up in the preseason of the 13/14 season (I think that was the year) and had we sold him for 200k that preseason, I’d have taken it all day. We all would have.

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Not having a pop, but Wilson had played just 14 games and had a number of long term injury problems, bakayoko had played over 100 games for Walsall plus a number of other games on loan. We also developed Wilson from being a young kid. There aren't great comparisons.

Given the similar ages when signing them, you could throw in Manset, slager, kwame Thomas, lateef elford-alliyu, Nouble, Turgott. Young 'diamond in the rough' strikers signed at a similar age with the view of developing them into decent strikers.


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stupot07 said:

Not having a pop, but Wilson had played just 14 games and had a number of long term injury problems, bakayoko had played over 100 games for Walsall plus a number of other games on loan. We also developed Wilson from being a young kid. There aren't great comparisons.

Given the similar ages when signing them, you could throw in Manset, slager, kwame Thomas, lateef elford-alliyu, Nouble, Turgott. Young 'diamond in the rough' strikers signed at a similar age with the view of developing them into decent strikers

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Wilson also had a loan spell in non-league where he scored 1 in 46. Bakayoko scores 9 goals last season which isn’t a terrible return. With a little bit of work, it isn’t unreasonable to think he could score 15 goals in a season.

All the other names you mentioned were free agents, for good reason, as it so happened.

Mucca Mad Boys said:

Agreed, to an extent.
As I’ve stated previously, I’d give him a run in the team. But Robins seems to think he’s not ready, which I don’t necessarily disagree with. A short-term loan could be beneficial to JP and us.

We’ve spent money on Bakayoko and Hiwula. Bakayoko seems like a bit of a gamble, hence the relatively short-term contract. Both us and Bristol Rovers were willing to spend 200k on him, suggests there’s something they’ve seen in him. We’ve got to develop players and he seems like a ‘diamond in the rough’ type player if he can improve his finishing. Whilst not making a direct comparison, but it’s in a similar vain to Callum Wilson — who before that breakthrough season, was garbage. To the extent that Pressley ‘threatened’ to rip his contract up in the preseason of the 13/14 season (I think that was the year) and had we sold him for 200k that preseason, I’d have taken it all day. We all would have.

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The fact Bristol Rovers were also willing to shell out £200k is very misleading. There is a common denominator in Tommy Widdrington.

skyblueeyesrevisited said:

The fact Bristol Rovers were also willing to shell out £200k is very misleading. There is a common denominator in Tommy Widdrington.

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How is it misleading that Bristol Rovers nearly signed Bakayoko? Wriddrington is no longer involved at the club. If anything, it’s a validation that someone involved bringing in McNulty, Biamou, Nazon and JCH was willing to pay 200k for Bakayoko. That’s assuming TW has anything to do with Rovers decision to bid for Bakayoko.

stupot07 said:

Not having a pop, but Wilson had played just 14 games and had a number of long term injury problems, bakayoko had played over 100 games for Walsall plus a number of other games on loan. We also developed Wilson from being a young kid. There aren't great comparisons.

Given the similar ages when signing them, you could throw in Manset, slager, kwame Thomas, lateef elford-alliyu, Nouble, Turgott. Young 'diamond in the rough' strikers signed at a similar age with the view of developing them into decent strikers.


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Wow there’s some drab mentioned in that thread! Had managed to forget a fair few of them too, Ok, A couple

skyblueeyesrevisited said:

The fact Bristol Rovers were also willing to shell out £200k is very misleading. There is a common denominator in Tommy Widdrington.

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Maybe that was his intention; start a bidding war with his ex employer and make out he rated Bakayoko when really he didn’t have any interest what so ever. Clever guy

Mucca Mad Boys said:

Wilson also had a loan spell in non-league where he scored 1 in 46. Bakayoko scores 9 goals last season which isn’t a terrible return. With a little bit of work, it isn’t unreasonable to think he could score 15 goals in a season.

All the other names you mentioned were free agents, for good reason, as it so happened.

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Bakayoko scored 5 in 41 in the league at 580 minutes per goal, that requires a lot of work, and I dont think he can get anywhere near 15 league goals in a season. (He scored 8 not 9 in 47 total appearances last season). I hope robins can coach him in to a world beater, that will mean success for us, I just don't see it.

Wilson score 1 in 17 at Kettering aged 18 I believe playing on the wing for them. and 1 in 3 (plus 2 assists) at Tamworth.

Just because we paid money for bakayoko doesn't render the other examples reduntant, we signed McNulty on a free after all. Was he a free agent for good reason? Nor does it mean he is a better player, we've paid good money for some dross over the years


Apples and oranges.

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Keep JP and bloody play him up front. Let him get the experience and game time with us. To be honest I think he;s been treated pretty shabbily,

Nonleagueherewecome said:

I think he had the best minutes per goal ratio at the club didn't he? It was certainly better than McNulty's at one stage. He barely started and usually when he did it was out wide.

Robins waxed lyrical at times about what a natural goalscorer he is, just needed to learn the other parts of the game. He's hungry for goals, his first thought is "how can I score". Like Micky Quinn, he might miss a few, but he'll get chances and take shots that other forwards don't.

The long range screamer I spoke about wasn't just a hit it and hope, it was a work of art in the discipline of scoring a goal. Calculated, cool, outrageous and clinical. Here's what Robins said about him afterwards: Mark Robins hails Coventry City hero Jordan Ponticelli

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I agree I think he could be a goalscorer if he's developed right but he needs to go out on loan. But could be is the operative phrase there. Whether that will happen or not is a different matter as unless someone else comes in before the window closes I'd be hesitant to let him go.

But yes he probably did have the best minutes to goal ratio last season considering he was usually only brought on in the last quarter of the game during his appearances. I suppose I was harsh as his record last season should be taken with a pinch of salt considering he was played completely out of position during a number of games.

I spoke to MR at the Harry Redknapp night and he couldn't of spoken higher of Ponti. Everything in that article he pretty much reiterated to me.

Amcoventry said:

Keep JP and bloody play him up front. Let him get the experience and game time with us. To be honest I think he;s been treated pretty shabbily,

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I like Ponticelli and at some stage he will get a chance. However, in both the pre season games at WBA and against Derby he seemed way off the pace. I thought he may have been one of the players referred to by Robins after the Albion game along with JCH, McDonald and Grimmer who I all thought were poor. When he next gets a chance he needs to make an impact even if that is out wide.

stupot07 said:

Bakayoko scored 5 in 41 in the league at 580 minutes per goal, that requires a lot of work, and I dont think he can get anywhere near 15 league goals in a season. (He scored 8 not 9 in 47 total appearances last season). I hope robins can coach him in to a world beater, that will mean success for us, I just don't see it.

Wilson score 1 in 17 at Kettering aged 18 I believe playing on the wing for them. and 1 in 3 (plus 2 assists) at Tamworth.

Just because we paid money for bakayoko doesn't render the other examples reduntant, we signed McNulty on a free after all. Was he a free agent for good reason? Nor does it mean he is a better player, we've paid good money for some dross over the years


Apples and oranges.

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You’ve made the mistake of thinking I’m making a direct comparison. Which I specifically said it wasn’t.

My point was that’s Callum Wilson didn’t even look like cutting it for us in L1, let alone turning out to be a decent Prem striker. So stats aren’t everything, per se. Pressley saw something he could work with, have him a chance and he thrived. The fact that two teams were willing to pay decent money for him suggests that a few scouts think there’s something there. Don’t conflate that with me saying that will mean he’s worth the gamble. I’ve stated that I felt underwhelmed by this transfer, but I accept the management and recruitment team know something most of us do not. Again, this doesn’t mean they’re right. But I do trust them. The lad is 22 so for him to get 10 goals in a season isn’t unreasonable, then the next goal is 15 — in all competitions, not just in the league.

I’m not disagreeing with you entirely, but I’m certainly not going to dismiss a player off the back of a few performances. I shall reserve my judgement. The Wilson point was there to show that a player that we would’ve took 200k (as fans) for who we later sold for £3m.

Otis said:

He is a natural goalscorer. I think you know exactly what I mean by that.

JCH isn't a natural goalscorer. Biamou isn't a natural goalscorer. Bakayoko isn't a natural goalscorer.

McNulty was. McGoldrick was. Think you know exactly what I mean. It's a instinct thing and a natural finisher thing.

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We don't have room for a natural goal-scorer in our team!

Gazolba said:

We don't have room for a natural goal-scorer in our team!

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Better tell Robins then, cos he's still looking to bring Conor Chaplin in.

And besides, we had a natural goalscorer in our team last year in McNulty.

"Look Jordan" - "when I said you need to change your style to get game time I meant the way you play"!
Now take off the comedy beard and get back on the bloody bench!

FWIW the few times I saw Ponti play at youth level he seemed like a natural forward and goalscorer. He made intelligent runs into space and 'knew where the goal was' - without looking up he instinctively got his efforts on target. That counts for a great deal at any level of football. I'd say the bigger issue is if he's mentally ready for the barrage of opinions that come from being in the first team and inevitable criticism if he hits a dry patch.

At the moment I'd definitely be giving him 90mins in the cup games for experience. It'd be nice to give him, and a few other graduates, a decent half hour on a regular basis but the only teams who really get to do that are the top teams who are coasting quite nicely.

At the moment I'm a bit concerned he might lose a bit of sharpness as he's not featured for the U23 this season but isn't getting a great deal of time as a sub. MR needs to decide to either give him more time on the pitch even if just for the U23 or send him on loan to play regularly. Just sitting on the bench isn't doing anyone any favours.

I can’t see Bakayoko scoring fifteen goals in his whole time here let alone this season.

GaryJones said:

"Look Jordan" - "when I said you need to change your style to get game time I meant the way you play"!
Now take off the comedy beard and get back on the bloody bench!

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:emoji_joy:

For the sake of his career the lad desperately needs a loan. Will only happen if we sign Chaplin.

Was watched by Notts County but Nolan thought he was too small. Maybe now with a change of management, he might be on his way there?

should loan him out Notts County as he will be definately playing week in week out. Coincide the loan to match Thomas's contract with us

Warwickhunt said:

should loan him out Notts County as he will be definately playing week in week out. Coincide the loan to match Thomas's contract with us

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Is he going to get in before Dennis, Stead and Hemmings?

Nick said:

Is he going to get in before Dennis, Stead and Hemmings?

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would rather he went to a team who’s doing well in league 2 Exeter etc rather than a struggling side like Notts County.

cc84cov said:

would rather he went to a team who’s doing well in league 2 Exeter etc rather than a struggling side like Notts County.

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He isn't going to get straight in, won't do him much good being on the bench there.

Nick said:

He isn't going to get straight in, won't do him much good being on the bench there.

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Hmm good point maybe a midlands side mid table.

Nick said:

Is he going to get in before Dennis, Stead and Hemmings?

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Dont really know Nick but my mate who is a notts county supporter says Hemmings is injured but not been told how bad

CCFC54321 said:

Oh FFS get the shit of your eyes and be honest the guys utter shite and if you was honest you would admit that and also admit that he isn’t going to improve a great deal.

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Which of the weirdos who ring cwr each week are you?

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If we do get another striker in(!) I could possibly see Nuneaton asking the question of if they can loan him for a bit. Don't know if either the club or JP would be OK with that but 'men's' football would probably be better than U23 and as we've seen ourselves players do sometimes end up going back to play in youth teams as well.

I think it will be good for the lad and then good for us long term.