Aled Williams & John Dempster (3 Viewers)

[Hobo]

But most of what's on here is speculation based on tip bits, rumour and mainly, what we,see at games.
Most of us have no more than that to go on.

Does it merit campaigns to get people sacked though and undermining a person's professional reputation - when as you as say it is speculation based on tit bits and rumour.

By all means suggest an upgrade. But when people state they are not fit for their role without offering any job related evidence of their incompetence in that role - I find hard to accept.

 

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[clint van damme]

Does it merit campaigns to get people sacked though and undermining a person's professional reputation - when as you as say it is speculation based on tit bits and rumour.

By all means suggest an upgrade. But when people state they are not fit for their role without offering any job related evidence of their incompetence in that role - I find hard to accept.

I doubt anyone's getting sacked or even had their professional reputation tarnished by any of the wittering on here.
In the same way we've never released a player to another club because someone on here has offered to 'drive them there themselves!'

 

[Hobo]

I doubt anyone's getting sacked or even had their professional reputation tarnished by any of the wittering on here.
In the same way we've never released a player to another club because someone on here has offered to 'drive them there themselves!'

So people aren't affected by posts on social media? Personally or professionally in the football world?

How naive are you!

 

[clint van damme]

So people aren't affected by posts on social media? Personally or professionally in the football world?

How naive are you!

That's not what you said, you said it undermines someones professional reputation, no one in the game is going to factor in posts on here when assessing someone's ability.
Could a person be be personally affected by it if they read it, definitely.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Let’s be honest this is like putting Gordon Ramsay in charge of prepping the ingredients but letting my Mrs cook the meal

 

[Briles]

Coaches can only tell the players what to do. In the heat of a match that's down to the players not the coaches. I doubt they were coached to concede 8 goals to set pieces

 

[procdoc]

I noticed Rushworth had a lot of praise for Aled Williams in the post-match interview

 

[Hobo]

I noticed Rushworth had a lot of praise for Aled Williams in the post-match interview

What is his opinion worth? Some of our fans who have never seen Aled Williams coach know better.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

I noticed Rushworth had a lot of praise for Aled Williams in the post-match interview

I find it odd that Aled Williams gets so much stick. If a GK loses form, it’s Williams’ fault but if any outfield player has a loss of form it’s never a specific coach’s fault. Why?

Dovin progressed nicely last season, no praise for Williams. Collins comes in, plays poorly and the usual suspects call for his head.

I don’t know how good or bad of a coach he is but Lampard would have scope to replace staff if they weren’t good enough you’d think.

 

[SBT]

I find it odd that Aled Williams gets so much stick. If a GK loses form, it’s Williams’ fault but if any outfield player has a loss of form it’s never a specific player’s fault. Why?

Dovin progressed nicely last season, no praise for Williams. Collins comes in, plays poorly and the usual suspects call for his head.

I don’t know how good or bad of a coach he is but Lampard would have scope to replace staff if they weren’t good enough you’d think.

It’s because people don’t know how else to explain goalkeeping errors that are often quite difficult to explain.

 

[Hobo]

It’s because people don’t know how else to explain goalkeeping errors that are often quite difficult to explain.

They are just errors. The goalkeeper is a very exposed position, where one mistake or error of judgement can cost you a goal or the match.
Football is a confidence sport and nothing tests your confidence more than goalkeeping.

Coaching is a long process to achieve progress or even decline.

The over the top criticisms of Aled Williams I can only put down to people trying to look ITK while displaying they know Jack Sh**!

 

[Dougin]

It’s nothing to do with them, it’s just the quality of players we’ve had.

 

[clint van damme]

They are just errors. The goalkeeper is a very exposed position, where one mistake or error of judgement can cost you a goal or the match.
Football is a confidence sport and nothing tests your confidence more than goalkeeping.

Coaching is a long process to achieve progress or even decline.

The over the top criticisms of Aled Williams I can only put down to people trying to look ITK while displaying they know Jack Sh**!

The idea that the goalkeeping coaches name shouldn't be brought into conversations about poor performances from the keepers is frankly mental.

Of course none of us know exactly what goes on, but on that premise there's no point to this forum as none of our opinions are informed enough.

 

[clint van damme]

It’s nothing to do with them, it’s just the quality of players we’ve had.

Marosi, Moore, Collins and Wilson all regressed.
That's beyond debate. The question is why?
It might be nothing to do with the coaching but to not question the person whose job title is goalkeeping coach would be peculiar to say the least.

 

[SBAndy]

Also the fact they seem to be responsible for set pieces which haven’t exactly gone to plan for a while.

 

[larry_david]

Marosi, Moore, Collins and Wilson all regressed.
That's beyond debate. The question is why?
It might be nothing to do with the coaching but to not question the person whose job title is goalkeeping coach would be peculiar to say the least.

Marosi- broken cheekbone which absolutely destroyed his confidence
Moore- widely rumoured went through some horrific personal life stuff
Collins - was never good enough
Wilson played less than 50 games at league 2, had an unreal run but form is temporary and class is forever. His class is back up keeper at best

Doug has proven he's ruthless. If Aled was no good there's no way in hell he's still be here

 

[Frostie]

Marosi, Moore, Collins and Wilson all regressed.
That's beyond debate. The question is why?
It might be nothing to do with the coaching but to not question the person whose job title is goalkeeping coach would be peculiar to say the least.

Depends on your point of view. There's an argument that most actually improved with us but then didn't sustain it as long as we'd have hoped.

Marosi was signed as a League 1 keeper, won the League 1 title with us & then became a regular in The Championship. He's back as a League 1 regular again after injuries.

Moore is a real shame. We took him from being a Championship/PL bench warmer to one of the top keepers in the league until it all fell apart for personal reasons by all accounts.

I'm not convinced Collins was ever that good but clearly had a crisis of confidence.

Wilson was a backup League 1/ League 2 keeper for the majority of his career, became a Championship Golden Glove winner.

Dovin certainly has improved.

 

[clint van damme]

Marosi- broken cheekbone which absolutely destroyed his confidence
Moore- widely rumoured went through some horrific personal life stuff
Collins - was never good enough
Wilson played less than 50 games at league 2, had an unreal run but form is temporary and class is forever. H8is class is back up keeper at best

Doug has proven he's ruthless. If Aled was no good there's no way in hell he's still be here

I agree with most of that post but whether Wiliams stays or not should be down to Lampard not King, and I believe that's a totally the case.
But my point still stands, when you have the keeping issues we've had in recent years, its crazy to think the keeping coach shouldn't be questioned.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I agree with most of that post but whether Wiliams stays or not should be down to Lampard not King, and I believe that's a totally the case.
But my point still stands, when you have the keeping issues we've had in recent years, its crazy to think the keeping coach shouldn't be questioned.

Collins especially did things you wouldn't expect even from amateur keepers, e.g. parrying the ball back towards the centre of goal. It wasn't ever coached out of him which was bizarre.

 

[CovRes]

Marosi, Moore, Collins and Wilson all regressed.
That's beyond debate. The question is why?
It might be nothing to do with the coaching but to not question the person whose job title is goalkeeping coach would be peculiar to say the least.

Moore was a bench warmer at Blades. Was allowed to leave on a free. And plenty of their fans said he wasn't good enough for the Championship.

Collins had been dropped by Barnsley by the time we signed him.

Marosi is a League One goalie.

Wilson had never been trusted as a number one until Moore shit the bed. And there's a case to be made for saying the Ben Wilson of today is a better keeper than the Ben Wilson that arrived from Bradford in 2019.

There are 2 things that the above players have in common.

1. They have only ever moved for free or for nominal fees.
2. Few, if any, of their old clubs suffered following their departure.

 

[clint van damme]

Moore was a bench warmer at Blades. Was allowed to leave on a free. And plenty of their fans said he wasn't good enough for the Championship.

Collins had been dropped by Barnsley by the time we signed him.

Marosi is a League One goalie.

Wilson had never been trusted as a number one until Moore shit the bed. And there's a case to be made for saying the Ben Wilson of today is a better keeper than the Ben Wilson that arrived from Bradford in 2019.

There are 2 things that the above players have in common.

1. They have only ever moved for free or for nominal fees.
2. Few, if any, of their old clubs suffered following their departure.

You've totally missed the point I'm making

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

Marosi, Moore, Collins and Wilson all regressed.
That's beyond debate. The question is why?
It might be nothing to do with the coaching but to not question the person whose job title is goalkeeping coach would be peculiar to say the least.

My honest opinion is that none of the goal keepers were particularly good to begin with.

1. Marosi didn't regress. We signed him for L1 and and we got promoted, broke his cheeckbone in the Championship and lost his place, L1 is his level and always has been
2. Moore by all accounts dealt with personal issues around the time his form dropped off
3. Wilson had 1 good season, but we can all agree even that season that CS stats flattered to deceive
4. Collins 'good form' had one good stretch of around 10 games (even RCC managed this) where had a high save % but overall faced a relatively low xG, also wasn't first choice to begin with

It's an overly simplistic view to say its the GK coach's fault, especially when the talent wasn't amazing to begin with. It's similar to the whole weird fixation with Dr Roberts being responsible for the teams results (rather than Robins lmao) because her job title was 'performance director'.

 

[fernandopartridge]

The idea that the goalkeeping coaches name shouldn't be brought into conversations about poor performances from the keepers is frankly mental.

Of course none of us know exactly what goes on, but on that premise there's no point to this forum as none of our opinions are informed enough.

The point is that his name wasn't mentioned when Dovin had a major uplift in form last season. Nor even when Wilson had his career highlight in 2023.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

The point is that his name wasn't mentioned when Dovin had a major uplift in form last season. Nor even when Wilson had his career highlight in 2023.

It's all one way traffic. Dovin's performances in Jan-Feb was a massive factor in the win streak, his average match rating was 8.05 over 8 games starting from Norwich (a) to Wednesday (a). That's crazy form for a GK and as you say, no one credited Aled Williams for it.

But, if Collins decides to throw the ball in his own net, it's open season on Collins and Williams...

 

[chiefdave]

It’s because people don’t know how else to explain goalkeeping errors that are often quite difficult to explain.

I don't think it's even particularly to do with errors. We all know keepers, as all players do, make mistakes and we all know at this level mistakes are more likely.

The bigger concern has been that two keepers in Moore and Collins who were both clearly signed to be first choice who didn't so much regress as seem to completely forget how to play football.

We've twice been at a point, with two different players, where them being picked left us concerned that every single shot would result in a goal which is probably not a good thing to be happening when you're the person responsible for coaching them.

For that to happen with one player would be a concern but could fairly easily be put down to an injury, external issue or some other reason out of the coaching staffs control. For it to happen to two keepers in quick succession is bound to raise questions.

Hopefully Dovin, and Rushworth while he's here, improve under their coaching and it's no longer considered anything worth commenting on.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

It's all one way traffic. Dovin's performances in Jan-Feb was a massive factor in the win streak, his average match rating was 8.05 over 8 games starting from Norwich (a) to Wednesday (a). That's crazy form for a GK and as you say, no one credited Aled Williams for it.

But, if Collins decides to throw the ball in his own net, it's open season on Collins and Williams...

I haven’t seen many Championship keepers who’ve really impressed me, but in Collins I saw things happening that made no sense for a keeper at this level. Very fundamental problems at that. You do wonder what was going on with his coaching.

As for Dovin, his form could have been down to coaching, confidence or both.

 

[Hobo]

Marosi, Moore, Collins and Wilson all regressed.
That's beyond debate. The question is why?
It might be nothing to do with the coaching but to not question the person whose job title is goalkeeping coach would be peculiar to say the least.

The truth is form has fluctuated and has been inconsistent. That might be just down to the level of the keeper.

When you look at the calibre of management and coaching staff that has been moved on, if he was as bad as people (who know very little) claim, he would have gone.

I don't have a problem with fans asking questions, but people are mounting campaigns. Even a top coach like Viveash was subjected to malicious rumour, speculation and lies, by our fans. Didn't one poster proclaim he would never coach again because of bullying junior players.

There is a big difference in suggesting we can upgrade in a position within in the club to headlining "How is....employed."

To me there seems to be strong gossip about Aled Williams being a poor coach without anybody evidencing why he is a bad coach. Apart from highlighting mistakes by keepers and also blaming goal keepers for conceding goals when they weren't at times the main fault.

Those keepers are part of a group, a squad. There are people above and alongside Aled Williams who are also responsible for the performance and welfare of players.

It seems to me for some fans it has become a fixation and gets trolled out after a bad performance or a keepers mistake.

 

[SBT]

We've twice been at a point, with two different players, where them being picked left us concerned that every single shot would result in a goal which is probably not a good thing to be happening when you're the person responsible for coaching them.

For that to happen with one player would be a concern but could fairly easily be put down to an injury, external issue or some other reason out of the coaching staffs control. For it to happen to two keepers in quick succession is bound to raise questions.

The suggestion is that Aled Williams is some kind of charismatic demon headmaster capable of single-handedly destroying a keeper’s confidence through the power of his coaching alone. I just don’t think it makes sense.

 

[chiefdave]

The suggestion is that Aled Williams is some kind of charismatic demon headmaster capable of single-handedly destroying a keeper’s confidence through the power of his coaching alone. I just don’t think it makes sense.

Since when have supporters made sense or through rationally

We've just been desperately unluckily. To have one keeper fall apart like that would be rare. To have two in quick succession is not something I can really recall happening elsewhere. Only natural that people are looking for a common denominator and someone to blame even if there's not really anyone to blame.

 

[SBT]

Since when have supporters made sense or through rationally

We've just been desperately unluckily. To have one keeper fall apart like that would be rare. To have two in quick succession is not something I can really recall happening elsewhere. Only natural that people are looking for a common denominator and someone to blame even if there's not really anyone to blame.

Really the common denominator is not investing very much in our goalkeepers. They’ve mostly been journeymen on the L1/Championship bubble and you get what you pay for.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

I haven’t seen many Championship keepers who’ve really impressed me, but in Collins I saw things happening that made no sense for a keeper at this level. Very fundamental problems at that. You do wonder what was going on with his coaching.

As for Dovin, his form could have been down to coaching, confidence or both.

Viveash personally wanted Collins and apparently had a fraught relationship with Wilson. That’s what I got told by a mate who may get some insider info.

This would make sense because Collins randomly went to 3rd choice and Wilson to 2nd for no apparent reason.

Really the common denominator is not investing very much in our goalkeepers. They’ve mostly been journeymen on the L1/Championship bubble and you get what you pay for.

Dovin was the first player we signed for a significant sum and lo and behold, he’s shown a lot of class at times.

 

[fernandopartridge]

Really the common denominator is not investing very much in our goalkeepers. They’ve mostly been journeymen on the L1/Championship bubble and you get what you pay for.

That's correct I think. I wonder how long we chased Dovin for though.

 

[clint van damme]

The point is that his name wasn't mentioned when Dovin had a major uplift in form last season. Nor even when Wilson had his career highlight in 2023.

It's all one way traffic. Dovin's performances in Jan-Feb was a massive factor in the win streak, his average match rating was 8.05 over 8 games starting from Norwich (a) to Wednesday (a). That's crazy form for a GK and as you say, no one credited Aled Williams for it.

But, if Collins decides to throw the ball in his own net, it's open season on Collins and Williams...

That's a fair point and he should be part of that conversation
For me the fact Lampard has kept him while others have departed suggests he has something about him, but again, thats just guesswork.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Viveash personally wanted Collins and apparently had a fraught relationship with Wilson. That’s what I got told by a mate who may get some insider info.

This would make sense because Collins randomly went to 3rd choice and Wilson to 2nd for no apparent reason.



Dovin was the first player we signed for a significant sum and lo and behold, he’s shown a lot of class at times.

Well, Collins had a Chelsea connection along with Dasilva and Palmer. You’d still expect a goalkeeping coach to tell him to parry the ball away from goal.

 

[Sick Boy]

We were operating on a limited budget for years and the GK position wasn’t one we deemed worth spending a lot of money on.