The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (59 Viewers)

[mark82]

Another labour mp left to join independent group. 40 years she’s been a member wow!

Yeah, the chair of LFI. Assume her reasoning may be similar. Her stance on Israel is obviously at odds with Corbyns pro-Palestine position.

 

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[mark82]

Please... the same Joan Ryan that was filmed at conference saying she could secure £1m to take down some Tory ministers and the Labour leadership to protect Israel’s interests....

Exactly.

 

[Ian1779]

The Chukka crew?

I mean Umunna has the political nous of a wet rag so wouldn’t be surprised if they’ve just fuck it up.

Did see an interesting take on how it might play into an early GE though, if you’re up for believing in 4D chess.

I can’t see the 7 (now 8) standing in their existing constituencies as they’d lose comfortably. So then they target marginals... but whose? Labour is the obvious but what about Lib Dem ones? Either way they are really only interested in facilitating the Tories and manintaning the status quo.

One of the main gripes of members in their constituencies was that they had little or no connection to the area and were ‘dropped in’ to safe seats. Will that come back to haunt them if they try the same later on?

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Eighth MP quits Labour for Independent Group

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

The Times and The Mail on Sunday are liberal they certainly are not Tory lapdog press.

People also choose the media they want to purchase

The Mail is liberal

Yes he did just say that

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I think Ruth George has more than redressed the balance. Also most labour MPs have been appalled at the Jew hating rhetoric that Berger has been subjected to by a clearly and obvious racist local labour Liverpool membership. The fact Hatton is coming back literally is taking the piss. What next - Adolf Livingstone coming back for a bit of a goose step?

Just call Corbyn a Nazi you’re so close

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Wrong poll.

Voting intention polls have a load of holes in them, not least the trouble with modelling our FPTP system (see the 2016 US election for a similar issue with constituency based voting systems and national polls).

Consistently the most reliable indicator is the “Who would make the best PM” poll, and yes he’s being beaten to a pulp in that. Not just by May but by don’t know as well.

I mean the fact that he’s in opposition against the worse government in living memory and still can’t get a lead also shows we won’t win. Opposition peaks outside of elections. To win you have to be well well ahead to account for the incumbent bounce the government always gets.

Again, I’m saying this despite the fact I want Labour to win the next GE and I voted for a Corbyn in 2015.

Find me an alternative who will do the same policies and poll better and I’ll back them instead. Right now I don’t know who that is. Always been about the policies above the individual for me.

However-Brexit is a massive clusterfuck for people’s political opinions now and when it eventually passes the polls will reflect that. Whoever is Labour leader has to square the circle and please the large numbers of Leave and Remain voters in its base. Do you know how to do that? I’ve no idea.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

The mail On sunday is explicitly remain and has numerous liberal contributors

Which is great if they do but I said the Mail

 

[Ian1779]

Find me an alternative who will do the same policies and poll better and I’ll back them instead. Right now I don’t know who that is. Always been about the policies above the individual for me.

However-Brexit is a massive clusterfuck for people’s political opinions now and when it eventually passes the polls will reflect that. Whoever is Labour leader has to square the circle and please the large numbers of Leave and Remain voters in its base. Do you know how to do that? I’ve no idea.

No one has an answer.... that’s why it’s so easy to pin indecisiveness on him.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

No one has an answer.... that’s why it’s so easy to pin indecisiveness on him.

He could’ve pitched a second referendum as a ‘once and for all’ vote to settle the issue one way or the other. Going down the general election route was stupid

 

[chiefdave]

Please... the same Joan Ryan that was filmed at conference saying she could secure £1m to take down some Tory ministers and the Labour leadership to protect Israel’s interests....

Well at least we know where their funding comes from now.

Are any MPs who aren’t about to be deselected going to leave? She’d already lost a confidence vote.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Well at least we know where their funding comes from now.

Are any MPs who aren’t about to be deselected going to leave? She’d already lost a confidence vote.

No she’s quite happy to get elected on a Corbyn manifesto and would rather not stand on her individual merits

 

[Ian1779]

He could’ve pitched a second referendum as a ‘once and for all’ vote to settle the issue one way or the other. Going down the general election route was stupid

And then if Remain won? Best of 3? That would literally been the daftest move of all and would have consigned the party into oblivion.

GE route was actually smart because if they were in power their deal reflects them. At the moment he’s expected to have done more for a deal he’s had no part in making.... nor would ever been allowed to.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

And then if Remain won? Best of 3? That would literally been the daftest move of all and would have consigned the party into oblivion.

GE route was actually smart because if they were in power their deal reflects them. At the moment he’s expected to have done more for a deal he’s had no part in making.... nor would ever been allowed to.

Then if Remain won Parliament has a course of action. If we still wanted to flip off the continent and fuck ourselves over the same applies. It would have provided a lot more clarity than what is happening now. Calling an election at such a crucial time would have resulted in electoral disaster.

Note how May is arguing that her deal is the least bad option, not a good one. She knows it is worse than staying but is going ahead with it anyway.

 

[SkyblueBazza]

Then if Remain won Parliament has a course of action. If we still wanted to flip off the continent and fuck ourselves over the same applies. It would have provided a lot more clarity than what is happening now. Calling an election at such a crucial time would have resulted in electoral disaster.

Note how May is arguing that her deal is the least bad option, not a good one. She knows it is worse than staying but is going ahead with it anyway.

That is because the course of action has already been defined. Britain as a whole decided to leave the EU...she is carrying put that course of action as best she can. Sadly I think, her heart isnt really in it though. She just wants to get a deal. If she had real conviction she would perhaps be saying "my deal or no deal" to the EU instead? (If she hasn't already)

That would be showing the clear areas, to one & all, where real negotiation was needed quite early on.

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[Grendel]

Yeah, the chair of LFI. Assume her reasoning may be similar. Her stance on Israel is obviously at odds with Corbyns pro-Palestine position.

Ah yes the friend of Hammas - how lovely

 

[Grendel]

No she’s quite happy to get elected on a Corbyn manifesto and would rather not stand on her individual merits

Mr Corbyn did that for years - please - he opposed everything the Blair creature, Smith and even Kinnock stood for but was more than happy to hide behind a popular party to earn his keep

 

[Ian1779]

Then if Remain won Parliament has a course of action. If we still wanted to flip off the continent and fuck ourselves over the same applies. It would have provided a lot more clarity than what is happening now. Calling an election at such a crucial time would have resulted in electoral disaster.

Note how May is arguing that her deal is the least bad option, not a good one. She knows it is worse than staying but is going ahead with it anyway.

If there is no election it doesn’t matter what Corbyn does or says. The Tories made this mess, and they have to own it. If Corbyn came out tomorrow for a 2nd referendum it’s not going to take down parliament is it? He won’t suddenly become PM. All that would happen is that the focus will be on him being ‘an enemy of democracy’ - which ironically would probably lead to a snap election and Labour being wiped out.

I don’t disagree with your view about Brexit. But I can’t see how you can just ignore 2016. It’s dangerous territory for society as a whole.

 

[Ian1779]

Mr Corbyn did that for years - please - he opposed everything the Blair creature, Smith and even Kinnock stood for but was more than happy to hide behind a popular party to earn his keep

 

[Grappa]

Britain as a whole decided to leave the EU

52% is not Britain as a whole.

 

[SkyblueBazza]

52% is not Britain as a whole.

Oh please...let us not reignite that debate.

A single election that yeilds a majority government might not deliver Britain as a whole. 99% is not as a whole. We choose to go with the majority...unless the majority disagrees with what you vote for yourself.
I voted remain. The majority that cared enough voted to leave. Decision made...I decide to make the most of a shit scenario. Britain will bothe survive and thrive imo.

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[Grappa]

You voted remain. Of course you did. Taking lessons from the neutral guy. Here's the fucking catastrophe that all the remoaners bored on about but I never voted for it, I'm just a martyr for democracy. Fuck off.

 

[Astute]

I'm sure the uncertainty doesn't help. They've said its not, and as much as I'm pro-remain I'm not sure what incentive they'd have to lie about it.

Are they pulling out of Turkey as well because of Brexit?

They don't need a plant in the EU anymore. There is a trade deal between Japan and the EU. The cars they make will become tariff free. They can now make everything in Japan and ship it here and around Europe tax free.

 

[Astute]

Just call Corbyn a Nazi you’re so close

Most of those who have left were in very safe Labour seats. Antisemitism and bullying in the Labour party has been in the spotlight for ages. Yet the same people always try to find excuses for it.

Now Hatton has rejoined the Labour party after getting kicked out years ago. Corbyn spoke out against him getting removed from the Labour party.

Opinion: Why letting Derek Hatton back into the Labour Party is a big deal

The return of King Rat Derek Hatton marks a new low for Labour

Who is Derek Hatton?

Are we all still happy with the direction the Labour party is going in?

 

[dutchman]

The truth is the Labour rebels would rather have a Tory government than a socialist one, just like they did under Tony Blair.

Would love to see how 'safe' their seats are if they stood for re-election.

 

[martcov]

Most of those who have left were in very safe Labour seats. Antisemitism and bullying in the Labour party has been in the spotlight for ages. Yet the same people always try to find excuses for it.

Now Hatton has rejoined the Labour party after getting kicked out years ago. Corbyn spoke out against him getting removed from the Labour party.

Opinion: Why letting Derek Hatton back into the Labour Party is a big deal

The return of King Rat Derek Hatton marks a new low for Labour

Who is Derek Hatton?

Are we all still happy with the direction the Labour party is going in?

Hatton is scum. Totally corrupt and mercenary. See the watch advert. Not the answer to labour‘s problems or anyone else‘s.

 

[Astute]

Hatton is scum. Totally corrupt and mercenary. See the watch advert. Not the answer to labour‘s problems or anyone else‘s.

WOW we agree on something.

I just hope people start opening their eyes to what is happening in the Labour party. The more undesirables that join the less people will vote Labour. But some still can't see anything wrong and have an excuse and someone to blame for everything.

 

[martcov]

Are they pulling out of Turkey as well because of Brexit?

They don't need a plant in the EU anymore. There is a trade deal between Japan and the EU. The cars they make will become tariff free. They can now make everything in Japan and ship it here and around Europe tax free.

Yes. No import taxes. No barriers. That’s what they had in the UK, and they saved 6 weeks transport and transport costs. JIT production in the EU, the market where they were selling the cars. Why do you the Japanese are starting to pull out of that great deal?

 

[martcov]

WOW we agree on something.

I just hope people start opening their eyes to what is happening in the Labour party. The more undesirables that join the less people will vote Labour. But some still can't see anything wrong and have an excuse and someone to blame for everything.

Yes, well I remember that time and the documentaries about him. The ASDA land deal included. Shiny suits, flash cars, drunkenness and I think he was even a councilor in Skelmersdale at the same time claiming expenses for meetings he was never at. To claim to be a socialist is a mockery of the word. Just a gobby crook. Really surprised at labour even tolerating him.

 

[Astute]

Yes. No import taxes. No barriers. That’s what they had in the UK, and they saved 6 weeks transport and transport costs. JIT production in the EU, the market where they were selling the cars. Why do you the Japanese are starting to pull out of that great deal?

If what you are insinuating is right why aren't they opening a plant up in an EU country? Why are they closing the Turkish plant?

Now they have free access to the EU they will make everything in Japan. We lose jobs building the cars. EU countries lose jobs making parts and more. Yet I sense a bit of celebrating from you.

 

[Astute]

Yes, well I remember that time and the documentaries about him. The ASDA land deal included. Shiny suits, flash cars, drunkenness and I think he was even a councilor in Skelmersdale at the same time claiming expenses for meetings he was never at. To claim to be a socialist is a mockery of the word. Just a gobby crook. Really surprised at labour even tolerating him.

He is a mate of Corbyn. Corbyn tried to stop him getting kicked out of the Labour party. Now Corbyn is leader he is back in.

Kind of backs up what a lot of people are saying.

 

[Captain Dart]

Most of those who have left were in very safe Labour seats. Antisemitism and bullying in the Labour party has been in the spotlight for ages. Yet the same people always try to find excuses for it.

Now Hatton has rejoined the Labour party after getting kicked out years ago. Corbyn spoke out against him getting removed from the Labour party.

Opinion: Why letting Derek Hatton back into the Labour Party is a big deal

The return of King Rat Derek Hatton marks a new low for Labour

Who is Derek Hatton?

Are we all still happy with the direction the Labour party is going in?

Probably Galloway back in next.

 

[Grendel]

Probably Galloway back in next.

Yep

Galloway slams ‘Seven Dwarfs’ for ditching Labour, says he wants to rejoin party (VIDEO)

 

[Captain Dart]

Meanwhile 3 Torys join TIG.

Soubry, Allen and Woolaston.

Political melt down the EU will be loving it.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

We’re probably heading toward a general election if more Tories resign the whip, and there’s an indication more could follow.