Unusual grounds (9 Viewers)

[Deleted member 5849]

They're ghosts of the past, places that maybe shouldn't rally have existed. Anyway, let's start with New Brighton's Tower Athletic Ground.

1. 

Capacity? Anywhere from 80,000 to 100,000. Built by the New Brighton Tower Company, they decided a football team was a good money generating idea. So they spent big on players, but gates fell as low as 1,000 at times. Very lonely in such a big place. New Brighton Tower FC went bust.

Not the end though, as even if the tower itself went, its base stayed. New Brighton AFC moved in too, after houses were built on their bomb damaged ground after World War II! Not a successful league team, they went the same way as their more illustrious predecessors. Even the Tower theatre/ballroom went destroyed by fire, and then the ground too...

 

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[henry the wasp]

Great little read that. Any more?

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Great little read that. Any more?

Coming soon

 

[torchomatic]

They're ghosts of the past, places that maybe shouldn't rally have existed. Anyway, let's start with New Brighton's Tower Athletic Ground.

1. 

Capacity? Anywhere from 80,000 to 100,000. Built by the New Brighton Tower Company, they decided a football team was a good money generating idea. So they spent big on players, but gates fell as low as 1,000 at times. Very lonely in such a big place. New Brighton Tower FC went bust.

Not the end though, as even if the tower itself went, its base stayed. New Brighton AFC moved in too, after houses were built on their bomb damaged ground after World War II! Not a successful league team, they went the same way as their more illustrious predecessors. Even the Tower theatre/ballroom went destroyed by fire, and then the ground too...

My Dad buys/sells programmes and New Brighton go for loads.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

My Dad buys/sells programmes and New Brighton go for loads.

Out of idle curiosity, how do Bradford PA ones go? They're my guilty pleasure in terms of clubs and history, I have a couple of programmes myself (and the 'homecoming' one... which turns out to be a sheet of A5 paper!). They weren't exactly expensive though.

 

[torchomatic]

Here's one of their programmes.

 

[torchomatic]

Out of idle curiosity, how do Bradford PA ones go? They're my guilty pleasure in terms of clubs and history, I have a couple of programmes myself (and the 'homecoming' one... which turns out to be a sheet of A5 paper!). They weren't exactly expensive though.

Not sure, I'll ask him. The NB one I've just posted above went for £137 yesterday. October 1938. He uses my account so I get a cut!

 

[Deleted member 5849]

£137:woot:

I'm in the wrong career!

 

[torchomatic]

£137:woot:

I'm in the wrong career!

He's sold stuff for well over £200 before. When eBay first started anything pre-60s used to go for a lot, but really it's the pre-wars ones now that do. Or, those unofficial games they played during the war, Blues Vs Reds, etc which could be City vs Utd. Fascinating stuff really.

 

[Nick]

£137:woot:

I'm in the wrong career!

Get a photocopier!

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Yeah, I'm genuinely interested in those tags of days gone by. The newspaper reports too, that now and again switch without warning from dry description, to a spell of purple prose Stuart Hall would've been proud of.

 

[Joy Division]

80,000-100,000 looks way off the mark, I assume that was an initial bold claim from the time to try and big up the project. Looks more like 20/30,000 at best.

 

[Nick]

80,000-100,000 looks way off the mark, I assume that was an initial bold claim from the time to try and big up the project. Looks more like 20/30,000 at best.

Yeah but don't they cram loads in? Like sardines!

 

[Deleted member 5849]

80,000-100,000 looks way off the mark, I assume that was an initial bold claim from the time to try and big up the project. Looks more like 20/30,000 at best.

Remember the second pic is after New Brighton AFC moved in. The Tower had gone by then, along with pretensions of top flight football. By now it was an emergency cobble together of something, as their own ground didn't exist anymore.

 

[Joy Division]

Even still, i've not seen any photos to suggest it was anywhere near that size

 

[Deleted member 5849]

The same principle as the old West Ham Stadium (coming soon to this thread!) a big bowl that can house many other things as well, but building up Kops and the like not the done thing.

It'd be how far back you could stand, and what you'd see. Crystal Palace ground didn't look huge either, in most of its images, but could fit more in than that ground.

 

[Nick]

It is just like being at a park or something.

I reckon if we move to the butts we can go in bowler hats and suits and request any pictures are in black and white.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Of course they never got near to testing it!

Club was formed though, to make sure the Tower company had 365 day revenues Signed loads of England Internationals early on, got met with resistance as that wasn't the done thing, and not sporting... as it happened no bugger turned up to watch them, anyway!

 

[torchomatic]

Have you ever seen the book, Football: The Golden Age? It's brilliant. Loads of old photos of footy, not just the players but the crowd too.

 

[torchomatic]

Of course they never got near to testing it!

Club was formed though, to make sure the Tower company had 365 day revenues Signed loads of England Internationals early on, got met with resistance as that wasn't the done thing, and not sporting... as it happened no bugger turned up to watch them, anyway!

That's why their programmes are so rare. As few were printed and even fewer sold. Also, people used to write on them with team changes or to write the scores on, then they would be folded and put in a back pocket. Getting a good quality programme from those pre-war days is pretty difficult. They were generally just four fold too. Title page, teams in the middle, advertising on the back.

My Dad tells me the story of in the 50s he wrote to loads of teams all across Europe for programmes. Loads of teams from France, Russia, Poland, Germany, etc sent him bundles of them. After he left home his Mom threw them all out! They would have been worth a fortune now.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

That's why their programmes are so rare. As few were printed and even fewer sold. Also, people used to write on them with team changes or to write the scores on, then they would be folded and put in a back pocket. Getting a good quality programme from those pre-war days is pretty difficult. They were generally just four fold too. Title page, teams in the middle, advertising on the back.

Wasn't New Brighton Tower before programmes, even?

 

[torchomatic]

Wasn't New Brighton Tower before programmes, even?

Yes, they went under when Queen Vic was still around, I think. It was a good twenty years or so before New Brighton were formed.

*Edit. Sorry, I was talking about NB not NBT.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Yes, they went under when Queen Vic was still around, I think. It was a good twenty years or so before New Brighton were formed.

They did. 1899 I think (kind of off the top of my head, but I did check it yesterday!)

 

[Deleted member 5849]

So here's the next one. What better name for a ground where the Canaries (Norwich, in case you need to know!) played than the Nest? But look at that cliff.

So we're bothered about squeezing a ground into the space around the Butts? It's nothing compared to here.

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They're all a bit crammed into a chalk cliff, and they somehow squeezed 25,000 into here once, although it scared the FA enough to tell the club it wasn't safe... and this was the FA saying it wasn't safe in 1935, must have been lethal! Hence Carrow Road being thrown up quickly (a whole 82 days it took). And the Nest was still about in part until just half a dozen years ago, despite them moving out in 1935.

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Can still see that it's a bit of a slope for the crowd, it's like a mini Mestella!

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[jimmyhillsfanclub]

Fascinating stuff NW.....great pictures.....enjoying this.

 

[torchomatic]

Hope you don't mind me joining the party, NW. Here's Peel Park, 1969.

 

[Nick]

Imagine standing on that cliff after an ale or too.

Or if you slipped while celebrating!

 

[torchomatic]

The Fallowfield, Manchester. FA Cup Final. 45000 attendance. 25 March 1893

 

[torchomatic]

Or if you slipped while celebrating!

Perfectly safe for City fans then luckily.

 

[Nick]

The Fallowfield, Manchester. FA Cup Final. 45000 attendance. 25 March 1893

You are screwed if you were small.

 

[Captain Dart]

This ground is in Slovakia, it is handy for the train.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Where should we go this evening?

Let's go for Park Avenue, Bradford, as much because it was one of those cricket/football grounds that doubled up.

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It was reckoned to be a better ground than Valley Parade, and Bradford PA hit the top flight too. It even had a Doll's House in the corner, a pavilion like FUlham had.

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The club got voted out the league after selling Kevin Hector to Derby. The ground declined.

In those days there was no automatic promotion and relegation from the league, so being voted out was a bit of a death knell. Their chairman died, they ran out of cash, they sold the ground and rented Valley Parade for a season at stupid rates before going bust. The ground was considered an option after the Valley Parade fire, and Bradford PA were reformed in the 80s... and as Park Avenue still existed, played a homecoming game there.

But since then, a sports centre has been built on part of the pitch.

You can see the echoes of the terraces in the trees however. Still there. Outside, you can see doors and turnstile entries, still lurking.

Wath this video, seriously. It's how a club's fans never really leave. Whatever happens there's an almost spiritual connection with place.



This is one of my favourite projects. If I'd known about it at the time, I'd have volunteered.

http://www.bpadmc.co.uk/category/bpafc-history/breaking-ground-bpa/

Bradford's Park Avenue, it lives on.

 

[Gaz71]

Great pics, great read, cheers NW.

 

[torchomatic]

This is probably my fave ever footy pic, Craven Cottage, 1957. Reminds me of standing on the Kop in the rain and snow.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Archibald Leitch did both grounds, hence the similarity.

Tempting to ask whether if the system was like it is now where there's the incentive of promotion to the league, it'd have actually saved a club like Bradford PA. Bristol Rovers have made it back to the league after all, and they're the second of a two-club city... far below their rivals traditionally too, whereas City and PA were (usually!) fairly closely matched.