Two wrongs don't make a right (1 Viewer)

[japandy]

So SISU have messed ACL about concerning non-payment of rent. Whether people like SISU or not they are perfectly entitled to challenge the 'legality' of the CCC bailing out a company,that without this 'assistance' would have gone into administration themselves soleely to take another company into administration. This ia an unlawful act and abuse of public funds.
If people are so unsure about this then why couldn't ACL borrow this money from the bank, where most of us would do?
There are a number of Councillors who seem to think they have the 'right' to use public money just because they don't like someone's face. The Council have acted, not in the public's interest but in the interest of their own wellbeing.
Schools and hospitals are cutting back all the time so how can the Council say that this 'loan' is in the best interest of the public. This 14 million loan is being used to wind up a club who contibute so much to the City's past, present and future.
I look at this from a 'legal' perspective and it is imperative that SISU do this because the Council should not use public funds. My view has nothing to do with the football side of things.
I am sure the management of SISU want shut of us as quickly as we do of them. BUT this whole scenerio should be done in a way that will enable the club to prosper, and not done that make the name CCFC a laughing stock in the world of sports.

 

[SkyBlueBlood]

The council are making a profit from this deal with money that would never have been used for the community, so are completely entitled to do so. This is yet another transparent attempt to stall the administration so SISU can bleed the club from any season ticket sales they can get before they go.

 

[torchomatic]

What season ticket sales?

The council are making a profit from this deal with money that would never have been used for the community, so are completely entitled to do so. This is yet another transparent attempt to stall the administration so SISU can bleed the club from any season ticket sales they can get before they go.

 

[japandy]

On the contrary SBB. If SISU win this case then the legality of our administration can, and will be contested. If the Council are found to have been in the wrong over this loan then ACL may themselves face a winding up order thereby allowing SISU to try and purchase the Ricoh at a low price.

 

[Tonylinc]

Your wrong Japandy. If Sisu ever got their grubby little fingers on the Ricoh do you think that the citizens of Coventry would benefit? NO they would not. This way at least they will abd the stadium is protected from the greed of a hedge fund.

 

[letsallsingtogether]

The council have to be transparent with money they spend.
Sisu however do not
Sold players no fee ever declared
Brought players never declared
payed no rent after agreement
No Debt now 60 million
Bankrupting a company but with no equity or has it

This is now getting tiresome SISU JUST FUCK OFF

:blue::blue::blue::blue::blue::blue::blue::blue::blue::blue::blue:

 

[torchomatic]

And how do the the citizens of Coventry benefit now?

 

[Tonylinc]

Your wrong Japandy. If Sisu ever got their grubby little fingers on the Ricoh do you think that the citizens of Coventry would benefit? NO they would not. This way at least they will abd the stadium is protected from the greed of a hedge fund.

"and", must proof read before posting in future!

 

[Tonylinc]

They benefit by the payments made by ACL to the Council.

 

[stupot07]

The council have to be transparent with money they spend.
Sisu however do not
Sold players no fee ever declared
Brought players never declared

Undisclosed fees are pretty much standard practice in all transfers these days, nearly all clubs do this.

 

[stupot07]

They benefit by the payments made by ACL to the Council.

ACL don't make any payments to the council.

 

[letsallsingtogether]

That maybe so when players are going for millions
But how many clubs struggle to put in there finances on time every year,

We were blaming managers for not strengthening their teams when all along we had an embargo on us they even let the manager take the blame for that by staying quiet



Sorry they are just scum how can anyone defend them.......:blue::blue::blue:

Undisclosed fees are pretty much standard practice in all transfers these days, nearly all clubs do this.

 

[Bennets Afro]

How can the administration be contested?
SISU put us in admin!!!!

 

[fernandopartridge]

The council are making a profit from this deal with money that would never have been used for the community, so are completely entitled to do so. This is yet another transparent attempt to stall the administration so SISU can bleed the club from any season ticket sales they can get before they go.

What if you were in charge of a facilities management company?

 

[Broken Hearted Sky Blue]

Undisclosed fees are pretty much standard practice in all transfers these days, nearly all clubs do this.

No they dont

 

[japandy]

How can the administration be contested?
SISU put us in admin!!!!

If SISU want to contest the administration, that was forced on them due to the writ served by ACL, they are perfectly in their rights to do so. But if they have be able to lose 60million of bad loses due to this administration they may not contest OUR administration, which would be wise.
If the High Court find the Council have unfairly loaned public moneys to allow a company, ACL, to serve a writ on another company then SISU can sue the Council. What is even worse is that councillors are on the board of ACL thus showing they are acting in 'self-interest' and NOT in the interest of the public, who they represent.

 

[WillieStanley]

And how do the the citizens of Coventry benefit now?

Well, the £14m bailout comes coincidentally at the same time as CCC announce adult social housing cuts, the allowance of Coventry schools to become sponsored academies, cuts on the redevelopment of the most deprived areas in Coventry and adult support services for the vulnerable go to tendering for cheaper alternatives.

Still... The Ricoh is an asset which must be protected.

 

[stupot07]

No they dont

Yeah they do. Here's June 2012 transfers - they are either freebies or undisclosed....would you like me to post Julys for you?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/18294258
30 JUNE

Kyle Lafferty [Rangers - Sion] Free
Steven Whittaker [Rangers - Norwich] Free
29 JUNE

Keith Andrews [West Brom - Bolton] Free
Michael Coulson [Grimsby - York] Free
Warren Cummings [Unattached - AFC Wimbledon]
Ben Foster [Birmingham City - West Brom] Undisclosed
Danny Guthrie [Newcastle United - Reading] Free
John McReady [Darlington - York] Free
James Meredith [York - Bradford] Free
Oliver Norwood [Manchester United - Huddersfield] Free
28 JUNE

Mathieu Baudry [Bournemouth - Leyton Orient] Free
Jordan Brown [West Ham - Barnet] Free
Tom Cruise [Arsenal - Torquay] Free
James Hayter [Doncaster - Yeovil] Free
Jamie McAllister [Bristol City - Yeovil] Free
Mladen Petric [Hamburg - Fulham] Free
Michael Poke [Brighton - Torquay] Free
Michael Symes [Bournemouth - Leyton Orient] Free
Yakubu [Blackburn - Guangzhou R&F] Undisclosed
27 JUNE

Robbie Blake [Bolton - Doncaster] Free
David Cotterill [Unattached - Doncaster] Free
Ishmel Demontagnac [Notts County - Northampton] Free*
Samba Diakite [Nancy - QPR] Undisclosed
Paul Dixon [Dundee United - Huddersfield] Free*
Mark Ellis [Torquay - Crewe] Undisclosed
Lewis Hatch [Unattached - Accrington]
Damien McCrory [Dagenham & Redbridge - Burton] Free
26 JUNE

Troy Archibald-Henville [Exeter - Swindon] Undisclosed*
Craig Easton [Unattached - Torquay United]
Olivier Giroud [Montpellier - Arsenal] Undisclosed
Michael Jacobs [Northampton - Derby County] Undisclosed*
Oli Johnson [Oxford United - York City] Free
Dean Leacock [Leyton Orient - Notts County] Free
Bruno Saltor [Valencia - Brighton] Free
James Wallace [Everton - Tranmere] Undisclosed
25 JUNE

Guy Branston [Bradford - Aldershot] Free
Danny Murphy [Fulham - Blackburn] Free
23 JUNE

Sean Scannell [Crystal Palace - Huddersfield] Undisclosed
22 JUNE

Gary Jones [Rochdale - Bradford City] Free *
Shinji Kagawa [Borussia Dortmund - Manchester United] Undisclosed *
Jordon Mutch [Birmingham - Cardiff] Undisclosed
Frank Nouble [West Ham - Wolves] Free
Jamie Tank [Walsall - Wolves] Undisclosed
21 JUNE

Danny Cadamarteri [Unattached - Carlisle]
Anthony Gardner [Crystal Palace - Sheffield Wednesday ] Free *
Robert Green [West Ham - QPR] Free *
Kevan Hurst [Walsall - Southend] Free
Gary Liddle [Hartlepool - Notts County] Free
Chris Maguire [Derby County - Sheffield Wednesday] Undisclosed
Jay McEveley [Barnsley - Swindon] Free
Mido [Zamalek - Barnsley] Free
Tommy Miller [Huddersfield - Swindon] Free
Alan Navarro [Brighton - Swindon] Free
20 JUNE

Mohamed Diame [Wigan - West Ham] Free
Ryan Doble [Southampton - Shrewsbury] Free
Didier Drogba [Chelsea - Shanghai Shenhua] Free
Paul Green [Derby - Leeds] Free *
Callum Kennedy [Swindon - Scunthorpe] Free
Tomasz Kuszczak [Manchester United - Brighton] Free
Laurence Wilson [Morecambe - Rotherham] Free
19 JUNE

Jean-Louis Akpa Akpro [Rochdale - Tranmere] Free
Adam Drury [Norwich - Leeds] Free
Jacob Mellis [Chelsea - Barnsley] Free
George Miller [Preston - Accrington] Free
Bjorn Sigurdarson [Lillestrom - Wolves] Undisclosed **
18 JUNE

Lionel Ainsworth [Shrewsbury Town - Rotherham United] Undisclosed
Sol Bamba [Leicester - Trabzonspor] Undisclosed
James Collins [Shrewsbury - Swindon] Free
Rhys Evans [Staines Town - Exeter City] Free
Steven Gillespie [Colchester - Fleetwood] Undisclosed
Andrew Johnson [Fulham- QPR] Free
Ryan Nelsen [Tottenham - QPR] Free
Bobby Olejnik [Torquay - Peterborough United] Undisclosed
Gary Roberts [Huddersfield - Swindon] Free
Daniel Taylor [Newcastle - Oldham] Free
Andy Williams [Yeovil - Swindon] Free
15 JUNE

Bartosz Bialkowski [Southampton - Notts County] Free
Luke O'Neill [Mansfield - Burnley] Undisclosed
14 JUNE

Troy Brown [Rotherham - Aldershot] Free
Sam Cowler [West Ham - Barnet] Undisclosed
David Gray [Preston - Stevenage] Free
Olly Lancashire [Walsall - Aldershot] Free]
David Syers [Bradford - Doncaster] Free
George Williams [MK Dons - Fulham] Undisclosed
13 JUNE

Terrell Forbes [Leyton Orient - Chesterfield] Free
Anthony Grant [Southend - Stevenage] Free *
Jussi Jaaskelainen [Bolton - West Ham] Free *
Jon Parkin [Cardiff - Fleetwood] Free
12 JUNE

Josh Lillis [Scunthorpe - Rochdale] Free *
Jody Morris [St Johnstone - Bristol City] Free *
Nick Powell [Crewe - Manchester United] Undisclosed *
Enoch Showunmi [Tranmere - Notts County] Free
11 JUNE

Rhys Bennett [Bolton - Rochdale] Free *
Mike Edwards [Notts County - Carlisle] Free
Sam Foley [Newport County - Yeovil] Free
Louis Harris [Wolves - AFC Wimbledon] Free
Stacy Long [Stevenage - AFC Wimbledon] Free
10 JUNE

Jay Rodriguez [Burnley - Southampton] Undisclosed
9 JUNE

Joe Mattock [West Bromwich Albion - Sheffield Wednesday] Free
Kelvin Etuhu [Portsmouth - Barnsley] Free
8 JUNE

Marcus Bean [Brentford - Colchester United] Free
Connor Brown [Sheffield United - Oldham] Free
Peter Cavanagh [Fleetwood - Rochdale] Free
Darren Jones [Aldershot - Shrewsbury] Free *
Mat Sadler [Walsall - Crawley] Free
7 JUNE

Kari Arnason [Aberdeen - Rotherham] Free *
Lee Bullock [Bradford City - York City] Free
Danny Harrison [Rotherham United - Tranmere Rovers] Free
Damien Johnson [Plymouth Argyle - Fleetwood Town] Free
Keith Keane [Luton - Preston] Free *
Niko Kranjcar [Tottenham - Dynamo Kiev] Undisclosed
Rory McArdle [Aberdeen - Bradford City] Free *
6 JUNE

Danny Swanson [Dundee United - Peterborough United] Free
5 JUNE

Zander Diamond [Oldham - Burton] Free
4 JUNE

Eden Hazard [Lille - Chelsea] Undisclosed
3 JUNE

Dirk Kuyt [Liverpool - Fenerbahce] Undisclosed
2 JUNE

Sam Hird [Doncaster - Chesterfield] Free *
Reuben Reid [Oldham - Yeovil] Free *
1 JUNE

Ben Burgess [Notts County - Tranmere] Free *
Lewis Grabban [Rotherham - Bournemouth] Undisclosed *
Alex Nicholls [Walsall - Northampton] Free *

 

[GaryPendrysEyes]

If SISU want to contest the administration, that was forced on them due to the writ served by ACL, they are perfectly in their rights to do so. But if they have be able to lose 60million of bad loses due to this administration they may not contest OUR administration, which would be wise.
If the High Court find the Council have unfairly loaned public moneys to allow a company, ACL, to serve a writ on another company then SISU can sue the Council. What is even worse is that councillors are on the board of ACL thus showing they are acting in 'self-interest' and NOT in the interest of the public, who they represent.

This makes no sense. ACL had every legal right to pursue the money they were owed under a contract Sisu broke. Its a contract law issue.

 

[wingy]

What a Cock of SHIT.

 

[WillieStanley]

Well, the £14m bailout comes coincidentally at the same time as CCC announce adult social housing cuts, the allowance of Coventry schools to become sponsored academies, cuts on the redevelopment of the most deprived areas in Coventry and adult support services for the vulnerable go to tendering for cheaper alternatives.

Still... The Ricoh is an asset which must be protected.

Oh and homeless hostels can only accept you if you can provide 6 months of Coventry addresses from the past 12 - sorry rough sleepers... The Ricoh creates jobs.

 

[Bennets Afro]

Japandy... So ACL had no right to go after the money legally owed by the football club?

 

[theferret]

Well, the £14m bailout comes coincidentally at the same time as CCC announce adult social housing cuts, the allowance of Coventry schools to become sponsored academies, cuts on the redevelopment of the most deprived areas in Coventry and adult support services for the vulnerable go to tendering for cheaper alternatives.

Still... The Ricoh is an asset which must be protected.

None of this is relevant because the council intend to borrow the £14 million they used to pay off the mortgage, the repayments for which will be met by ACL (plus the council will make a small profit because of preferential interest rates).

 

[japandy]

Japandy... So ACL had no right to go after the money legally owed by the football club?

Benny. I had a problem with my bank who through their bank charges took me overdrawn and then they incurred £25 a day charges on top of that. I refused to pay and my account went £500 over the limit. I contested that the bank were in the wrong because they had taken me overdrawn in the first place. They threatened to take me to court and I agreed to that action. In the space of two weeks I had 3 offers from them to first halve the amount, then third the amount and then quarter the amount. I then refuse completely not to pay a penny because they seem NOT to trust the amount I actually owed. The case went to the ombudsman and I won damages.
ACL are acting in the same way. They first state SISU owes them 1million, then 600,000 and then 400,000, so how much does SISU actually owe ACL?
KIf this was me I would also refuse to pay the amount until an actual amount had been settled.
I know you will say why have SISU not paid for so long? Sure the same can be said to why ACL allowed this amount to grow and grow?

 

[WillieStanley]

None of this is relevant because the council intend to borrow the £14 million they used to pay off the mortgage, the repayments for which will be met by ACL (plus the council will make a small profit because of preferential interest rates).

The date they intend to subsidize the £14m is not yet decided. Possibly at a date when they aren't so choked by the coalition. I get that the Ricoh is an asset and they have a duty of care, however they also have a duty of care to the most vulnerable members of our society. Arguably a greater duty of care.to

 

[Samo]

So SISU have messed ACL about concerning non-payment of rent. Whether people like SISU or not they are perfectly entitled to challenge the 'legality' of the CCC bailing out a company,that without this 'assistance' would have gone into administration themselves soleely to take another company into administration. This ia an unlawful act and abuse of public funds.
If people are so unsure about this then why couldn't ACL borrow this money from the bank, where most of us would do?
There are a number of Councillors who seem to think they have the 'right' to use public money just because they don't like someone's face. The Council have acted, not in the public's interest but in the interest of their own wellbeing.
Schools and hospitals are cutting back all the time so how can the Council say that this 'loan' is in the best interest of the public. This 14 million loan is being used to wind up a club who contibute so much to the City's past, present and future.
I look at this from a 'legal' perspective and it is imperative that SISU do this because the Council should not use public funds. My view has nothing to do with the football side of things.
I am sure the management of SISU want shut of us as quickly as we do of them. BUT this whole scenerio should be done in a way that will enable the club to prosper, and not done that make the name CCFC a laughing stock in the world of sports.

I assume from your comments that you are a lawyer?

 

[CJparker]

SISU = scum :jerkit::jerkit:

 

[Waldorf]

So SISU have messed ACL about concerning non-payment of rent. Whether people like SISU or not they are perfectly entitled to challenge the 'legality' of the CCC bailing out a company,that without this 'assistance' would have gone into administration themselves soleely to take another company into administration. This ia an unlawful act and abuse of public funds.
If people are so unsure about this then why couldn't ACL borrow this money from the bank, where most of us would do?
There are a number of Councillors who seem to think they have the 'right' to use public money just because they don't like someone's face. The Council have acted, not in the public's interest but in the interest of their own wellbeing.
Schools and hospitals are cutting back all the time so how can the Council say that this 'loan' is in the best interest of the public. This 14 million loan is being used to wind up a club who contibute so much to the City's past, present and future.
I look at this from a 'legal' perspective and it is imperative that SISU do this because the Council should not use public funds. My view has nothing to do with the football side of things.
I am sure the management of SISU want shut of us as quickly as we do of them. BUT this whole scenerio should be done in a way that will enable the club to prosper, and not done that make the name CCFC a laughing stock in the world of sports.

Sorry Japandy, but this is nonsense on several levels. First of all the council were not "bailing out" a company (we'll ignore the fact that they owned half of that company), they provided a loan which enabled them to restructure a debt by paying at a lower interest rate that the one they were paying to the bank. Note that. They had a loan from a bank already. Where is the evidence that ACL were about to go into administration, other than some spin by our Tim? There is none. The purpose of transferring the loan was, if anything, to allow ACL to offer a better deal to the club. So in whose interest was that? Maybe you can tell me what "personal well being" councillors get out of the loan? To claim that the purpose of the loan was to put the club into admin is pure fantasy. As i said, its purpose was to allow ACL to restructure its debt. You seem to forget that it was SISU who put the club into admin. You also forget that the Ricoh is a public asset, owned by the council on behalf of its council tax payers. Protecting its asset is a very sensible use of public funds.
I suggest you learn a little about local government before you make more pronoun cements.

 

[Mucca Mad Boys]

And how do the the citizens of Coventry benefit now?

I love it when people make out that ACL owning the RICOH benefits the people, how's that? If anything, if the club owned the ground, stabilising the finances somewhat, would thus allow greater movement and easier mobilisation of the budget, which could lead to promotion, if we get promoted, the city benefits from larger away followings, larger home followings etc.

I love (I don't actually, because hypocrites annoy me) how no one uses that argument when PH4 comes into the picture of buying at least half the stadium. Their argument from then on is flawed

 

[Delboycov]

Got a lot of time for you Japandy...legendary poster on GMK...but I have to say I don't agree with you at all here. Although not squeaky clean, ACL are not the real villains here. Columbo would've solved this case in the first 2 minutes...it was SISU wot done it!

 

[japandy]

Got a lot of time for you Japandy...legendary poster on GMK...but I have to say I don't agree with you at all here. Although not squeaky clean, ACL are not the real villains here. Columbo would've solved this case in the first 2 minutes...it was SISU wot done it!

Thank you for those kind comments Dellboy.

In answer to a few other comments. I graduated from LSE along time ago in Law but never got involved as I enter into education. Three and a half years ago I came back to the UK for personal reason and have been involved in immigration for the last 2 years. An old friend from my university day, who is American, has a Law Firm (Solicitors) and he is involved in this case. I PERSONALLY DON'T PROFESS TO KNOW ANYTHING BUT ONLY TALK ABOUT WHAT i KNOW.
As you see from another thread, two weeks ago I told you what my friend told me and his exact words are true.
The biggest problem with the council is it is run by laymen and not professionals and have contributed in getting us into this mess.

98% of items and contributions on these fans sites are hearsay, or opinions, so I will not delve into debates on which we know very little about. I can only say SISU have excellent solicitors working for them and will do everything they can to bring the Council to book.

I am not pro or anti anything in life apart from PRO - God, CCFC, family and friends and work.

 

[bigfatronssba]

If SISU want to contest the administration, that was forced on them due to the writ served by ACL, they are perfectly in their rights to do so. But if they have be able to lose 60million of bad loses due to this administration they may not contest OUR administration, which would be wise.
If the High Court find the Council have unfairly loaned public moneys to allow a company, ACL, to serve a writ on another company then SISU can sue the Council. What is even worse is that councillors are on the board of ACL thus showing they are acting in 'self-interest' and NOT in the interest of the public, who they represent.

Please name which Councillors are on the board of ACL?

 

[japandy]

Sorry Japandy, but this is nonsense on several levels. First of all the council were not "bailing out" a company (we'll ignore the fact that they owned half of that company), they provided a loan which enabled them to restructure a debt by paying at a lower interest rate that the one they were paying to the bank. Note that. They had a loan from a bank already. Where is the evidence that ACL were about to go into administration, other than some spin by our Tim? There is none. The purpose of transferring the loan was, if anything, to allow ACL to offer a better deal to the club. So in whose interest was that? Maybe you can tell me what "personal well being" councillors get out of the loan? To claim that the purpose of the loan was to put the club into admin is pure fantasy. As i said, its purpose was to allow ACL to restructure its debt. You seem to forget that it was SISU who put the club into admin. You also forget that the Ricoh is a public asset, owned by the council on behalf of its council tax payers. Protecting its asset is a very sensible use of public funds.
I suggest you learn a little about local government before you make more pronoun cements.

HAhaha that is one of the funniest things I've read for ages. Thank you Waldorf

 

[japandy]

Please name which Councillors are on the board of ACL?

http://www.ricoharena.com/about-us/meet-the-team/board-members/

Dr Martin Reeves

Chris West

 

[bigfatronssba]

http://www.ricoharena.com/about-us/meet-the-team/board-members/

Dr Martin Reeves

Chris West

Martin Reeves is CCC Chief Exec & Chris West is the Finance Director. Neither are Councillors, and in theory have no authority over council policy.