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Wasps going into admin & the impact on CCFC (5 Viewers)

  • Thread starter Alkhen
  • Start date Sep 21, 2022
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HuckerbyDublinWhelan

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,401
mmttww said:
Anyone even hinting that Mike Ashley would be a good thing, I have two words for you: Joe Kinnear.
Click to expand...
I’ll trump that with “sold debt free and became the richest club in the world”
 
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,402
tisza said:
Just not been run properly by the various guises of ACL - CCFC, CCC and Wasps.
Even SISU realized they had to bring in someone to run the non-football side when they were looking for an events partner as part of their plans pre-Wasps.
Click to expand...

That was just one of the issues that Grendel had flagged though - he's been calling it a white elephant for years. I don't even disagree with him, I'm just curious why an Arena with a rubbish location, no parking, dominant rivals nearby and concerts that don't make any money would obviously attract significant interest.
 
Reactions: shmmeee

GIMOC

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,403
TomRad85 said:
Our season has been so shite so far I'm actually finding these rumours the most interesting thing about it. Will Wasps die? Will we get new owners? Will club and stadium finally be united? Knowing us, none of that will happen but its nice to think about for a bit.

Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
It’s like a throwback to mid 2010’s
 

jordan210

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,404
So what Ashley company do we want as the shirt sponsor.

Agent Provocateur
Game
Sports Direct
Evens cycles
House of Fraser
Flannels
USC
 

mmttww

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,405
HuckerbyDublinWhelan said:
I’ll trump that with “sold debt free and became the richest club in the world”
Click to expand...

Bloke appoints managers based on who he gets pissed with and runs his companies like sweat shops. Newcastle got relegated more than once under him and huge TV deals kept them "debt free", not his business skills.
 
H

HuckerbyDublinWhelan

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,406
mmttww said:
Bloke appoints managers based on who he gets pissed with and runs his companies like sweat shops. Newcastle got relegated more than once under him and huge TV deals kept them "debt free", not his business skills.
Click to expand...
But he spent to get them to the premier league each time. I’m not saying he’ll get us top half of the prem. but we’d be happy yoyoing between the prem and championship
 

slowpoke

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,407
wingy said:
It was as slowpoke stated.
The option was there to be in on it at the outset in the 70's but CCC passed on it.
Click to expand...
At the time we had a Tory council and it would have been a 50/50 split and I’m certain included the airport.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,408
SBT said:
That was just one of the issues that Grendel had flagged though - he's been calling it a white elephant for years. I don't even disagree with him, I'm just curious why an Arena with a rubbish location, no parking, dominant rivals nearby and concerts that don't make any money would obviously attract significant interest.
Click to expand...

Yawn

The NEC operation would not be a dominant rival would it and it’s said it would synergies costs and use to supplement its own bookings

The Armstrong bid would encounter exactly the same issues and fail. Ashley would probably fail as in terms of yield but would still see it as a portfolio additional worth taking a hit on
 
Reactions: 13th_choice_seamer

slowpoke

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,409
mmttww said:
Anyone even hinting that Mike Ashley would be a good thing, I have two words for you: Joe Kinnear.
Click to expand...
Anyone thinking Ashley wouldn’t be a better thing I’ll give you two words, well three, Sixfields & St.Andrews
 
Reactions: skybluepm2, Finham, TwistAndShoutCCFC1987 and 4 others

MusicDating

Euro 2016 Prediction League Champion!!
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,410
torchomatic said:
Makes this quote from Richardson even more amusing.
View attachment 26480
Click to expand...
Awww and they were so close! Curse you Covid...
 
Reactions: Moff, Skyblueweeman and duffer
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,411
Grendel said:
Yawn

The NEC operation would not be a dominant rival would it and it’s said it would synergies costs and use to supplement its own bookings

The Armstrong bid would encounter exactly the same issues and fail. Ashley would probably fail as in terms of yield but would still see it as a portfolio additional worth taking a hit on
Click to expand...

Where has NEC said that?

So all the other bids would be essentially non-starters except for NEC then in your view?
 

slowpoke

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,412
Grendel said:
Yawn

The NEC operation would not be a dominant rival would it and it’s said it would synergies costs and use to supplement its own bookings

The Armstrong bid would encounter exactly the same issues and fail. Ashley would probably fail as in terms of yield but would still see it as a portfolio additional worth taking a hit on
Click to expand...
As my football club I’d prefer a location closer to town like we had at HR but accept reluctantly what we now have but as a commercial venue such as a link to the NEC or similar imo it’s in an ideal position right on the motorway system room to expand too.
 

jordan210

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,413
torchomatic said:
Makes this quote from Richardson even more amusing.
View attachment 26480
Click to expand...


Did he really say this today ?

If I combine my net wealth with Elon Musks im now joint richest man in the world
 
Reactions: duffer and Samo

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,414
SBT said:
Where has NEC said that?

So all the other bids would be essentially non-starters except for NEC then in your view?
Click to expand...

Sky News have said Blackstone want to acquire venues across the West Midlands - it will run as part of the same company

Armstrong bid looks the same shambles as before.

Ashley of course will if successful drive the cost down and not be saddled with the debt. He will then almost certainly look to purchase the football club and try and drive the football clubs success upwards so that the value will escalate. I have my doubts this will succeed - he will also without question use it to promote his brand.

Whoever gets it its pretty safe to say the purchase value is never meeting shareholder expectations and unless its the event management arm I am doubtful it will succeed. The Armstrong bid looks about as worthwhile as the Richardson consortium
 
Reactions: Colin Steins Smile and SBT

oldskyblue58

CCFC Finance Director
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,415
Bit of perspective about Ashley based on published financials

I think a lot of the criticism of Ashley's involvement with NU stems from the fans over inflated ideas of what the club could achieve without a multi billionaire to back it. They expected to win the cups, leagues etc, instead results some seasons took them down and of course back up- is that the owner or the manager/players fault?

He took over in 2007, the balance sheet for the group had a value of minus £16m
By 30/06/2021 the balance sheet stood at plus £8M (including the amount owed to him)

During that period NU had purchased £554m worth of players and sold £347m worth

player value 30/06/2021 £102m per the balance sheet in 30/06/2007 it was £41m

By 30/06/2021 Ashley controlled companies were owed £107m. Most of which £100M came in 2007/2008 and accrued interest at 0.5% above Libor although it was not always charged. A quick look at the financials did not reveal huge interest charges

Hardly a scene of an owner not backing the club, seems to have left NU in a better place than when he found it ...... and encouraged a multi billionaire to step in . Not a man i instinctively like (quite the opposite) based on some of his other actions away from NU but as a football club owner he seems to have been more of a positive than a negative
 
Last edited: Oct 11, 2022
Reactions: ccfcchris, skybluepm2, Finham and 14 others

Nick

Administrator
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,416
I hope if he takes over Wasps he makes them wear Lonsdale and Dunlop.
 
Reactions: SBQuin, Astute, ccfcchris and 11 others

torchomatic

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,417
jordan210 said:
Did he really say this today ?

If I combine my net wealth with Elon Musks im now joint richest man in the world
Click to expand...

No, not today. When they first moved to Coventry.
 
Reactions: jordan210

torchomatic

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,418
Nick said:
I hope if he takes over Wasps he makes them wear Lonsdale and Dunlop.
Click to expand...

Seeing how Dunlop Greenflash perform in December should be fun to watch.
 
Reactions: Moff
H

HuckerbyDublinWhelan

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,419
oldskyblue58 said:
Bit of perspective about Ashley based on published financials

I think a lot of the criticism of Ashley's involvement with NU stems from the fans over inflated ideas of what the club could achieve without a multi billionaire to back it. They expected to win the cups, leagues etc, instead results some seasons took them down and of course back up- is that the owner or the manager/players fault?

He took over in 2007, the balance sheet for the group had a value of minus £16m
By 30/06/2021 the balance sheet stood at plus £8M (including the amount owed to him)

During that period NU had purchased £554m worth of players and sold £347m worth

player value 30/06/2021 £102m per the balance sheet in 30/06/2007 it was £41m

By 30/06/2021 Ashley controlled companies were owed £107m. Most of which £100M came in 2007/2008 and accrued interest at 0.5% above Libor although it was not always charged. A quick look at the financials did not reveal huge interest charges

Hardly a scene of an owner not backing the club, seems to have left NU in a better place than when he found it ...... and encouraged a multi billionaire to step in . Not a man i instinctively like based on some of his other actions away from NU but as a football club owner he seems to have been more of a positive than a negative
Click to expand...
So on average they spent 15m a season on players under Ashley?

id enjoy that summer
 
Reactions: robbiethemole and shmmeee

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,420
It’s interesting how all those concerned about CRFC because of the franchise suddenly wouldn’t care about screwing them over and being joined to the London rugby club.
 
Reactions: SBQuin, Moff, Deleted member 5849 and 1 other person

SlowerThanPlatt

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,421
HuckerbyDublinWhelan said:
So on average they spent 15m a season on players under Ashley?

id enjoy that summer
Click to expand...

Well yeah but with a turnover probably about 15x ours too!
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,422
Sick Boy said:
It’s interesting how all those concerned about CRFC because of the franchise suddenly wouldn’t care about screwing them over and being joined to the London rugby club.
Click to expand...

Weird. Almost like it was all performative
 

Calista

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,423
Aren’t there basically three businesses? The Arena / stadium; Coventry City Football Club; Wasps Rugby Union.

The football club is never going to own the Arena, and nor is the rugby club. Wasps (rugby club) didn’t ‘steal our stadium’. One hedge fund took it from under the noses of another. Sisu excluded themselves from ownership by a string of immoral and stupid actions, and another bunch of smart arses sold the Council the dream of elite sport which has gone belly up. The rugby franchise isn’t something we’ve ever had any control over, so all the moral arguments are academic. If they are a financial sinkhole, the new owners of the stadium will want to move them out again, but if they can be run as a top team that people enjoy watching and help turn the whole place into a viable business, I dare say they’ll try to do that.

There will always be a complex structure of separate companies. If the same entity ultimately owns both the stadium and CCFC, that probably helps, but is it essential? What matters to me is that whoever owns the place is ambitious enough to recognise the potential of a successful football side, and has financial stability and deep enough pockets to promote that. Sisu don’t tick any of those boxes, so why would we want them to have the Arena (either in the past or now)?

Whoever buys the Arena, please nurture CCFC and find a way to get Sisu out of town.
 
Reactions: bulko, CCFCSteve and shmmeee

SHUNT31

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,424
Sick Boy said:
It’s interesting how all those concerned about CRFC because of the franchise suddenly wouldn’t care about screwing them over and being joined to the London rugby club.
Click to expand...

Who has said they want to be joined with Wasps?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

AOM

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,425
Nick said:
I hope if he takes over Wasps he makes them wear Lonsdale and Dunlop.
Click to expand...

Replacing Hummel with Slazenger
 

oldskyblue58

CCFC Finance Director
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,426
HuckerbyDublinWhelan said:
So on average they spent 15m a season on players under Ashley?

id enjoy that summer
Click to expand...

yes

from 2018 to 2021 they spent 227m on players and recouped 145m

some fans can make a lot (most) of the noise without being particularly well informed or simply choosing not to listen and use their own eyes.
 
Reactions: Gynnsthetonic, Nick and CCFCSteve

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,427
Sick Boy said:
It’s interesting how all those concerned about CRFC because of the franchise suddenly wouldn’t care about screwing them over and being joined to the London rugby club.
Click to expand...
Most people want them gone from what I can see on this thread, who is suggesting screwing CRFC over?
 

SlowerThanPlatt

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,428
oldskyblue58 said:
yes

from 2018 to 2021 they spent 227m on players and recouped 145m

some fans can make a lot (most) of the noise without being particularly well informed or simply choosing not to listen and use their own eyes.
Click to expand...

What were their turnovers in that period compared to ours in last accounts (£11.8m)
 
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,429
SHUNT31 said:
Who has said they want to be joined with Wasps?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Anyone entertaining/supporting a Mike Ashley takeover of CCFC is also hoping for a future where Wasps' future in Coventry is not only secured, but their fortunes are directly tied to those of Coventry City for the foreseeable future as well. Sorry Cov!
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,430
SBT said:
Anyone entertaining/supporting a Mike Ashley takeover of CCFC is also hoping for a future where Wasps' future in Coventry is not only secured, but their fortunes are directly tied to those of Coventry City for the foreseeable future as well. Sorry Cov!
Click to expand...

Whose actually hoping for that?
 
Reactions: hutch1972
L

Legia Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,431
Sky Blue Harry H said:
If the Council get the lease back and sold it to AN Other and it effectively shafted the football club, then I for one would happily lead the march to the Council House with a pitchfork. Probably jumping the gun, but do CCFC have any sort of 'support/ers' within The Council ?
Click to expand...

If the Trust had anything about it, the information on which councillors are CCFC friendly should already be known and ready to act on if necessary. Unfortunately I suspect that forms no part of their agenda.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,432
I assume Hoffman is something to do with the Ashley bid
 

SHUNT31

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,433
SBT said:
Anyone entertaining/supporting a Mike Ashley takeover of CCFC is also hoping for a future where Wasps' future in Coventry is not only secured, but their fortunes are directly tied to those of Coventry City for the foreseeable future as well. Sorry Cov!
Click to expand...

Not at all. I would be open to Ashley but hope them fuckers burn.

Ashley won’t want the rugby club. He will be using it as an angle in for the football club.

Ashley is only going to take on Wasps if they go into admin. If they do, they get relegated and lose their P share. No money in Rugby.

As a club, we have decent potential. We could be a prem side with a decent facility which will mean a tidy profit when sold.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,434
Grendel said:
Whose actually hoping for that?
Click to expand...

Not many, yet, but we're only a few hours in I suppose:

Saddlebrains said:
Id Take Ashley over these current wankers
Click to expand...

HuckerbyDublinWhelan said:
So on average they spent 15m a season on players under Ashley?

id enjoy that summer
Click to expand...
 
Reactions: Sick Boy

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2022
  • #1,435
SBT said:
Not many, yet, but we're only a few hours in I suppose:
Click to expand...

That’s not hoping for wasps to stay though is it?
 
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