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Wasps going into admin & the impact on CCFC (4 Viewers)

  • Thread starter Alkhen
  • Start date Sep 21, 2022
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ajsccfc

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,006
Michael Byng is wiring his bid of four hundred shillings and all the riches of Mesopotamia from his palatial home in Ceylon.
 
Reactions: fernandopartridge

MAFF

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,007
https://twitter.com/davesidwell5?s=21&t=cfjjWEEo-6n7iSaT9VgRsg

somethings happening cause the faceless, anonymous accounts are out again…
 
Reactions: HuckerbyDublinWhelan

MalcSB

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,008
oldfiver said:
On a liquidation a Liquidator can act but he cannot undermine the BH security position

The BondHolders can sell to who they want
Click to expand...
Taken direct from the prospectus

Risks relating the head lease of the Arena granted to ACL2006

Under the terms of the head lease granted by Coventry City Council (“CCC”) to Arena Coventry (2006) Limited (“ACL2006”) in respect of the Arena (the “Head Lease”), CCC have reserved the right to forfeit the Head Lease if ACL2006 becomes insolvent. Insolvency in this scenario means a situation where ACL2006 becomes unable to pay its debts, has a receiver/administrator/provisional liquidator appointed over its assets, has assets seized in order to pay debts of ACL2006 or has a winding-up order made against it.

The effect of forfeiture would be that the 250 year Head Lease would fall away and that ACL would then become the tenant of CCC at the Arena for the remaining 38 years of its existing lease. However, the right of CCC to claim forfeiture of the Head Lease is not an automatic right. If CCC made a claim for such forfeiture, this could be contested by ACL2006, any third party that held security over ACL2006 and any subtenants of ACL2006 by making application to a court in England.

Further, if an administrator was to be appointed over the assets of ACL2006, then CCC would not be able to forfeit the Head Lease without the consent of the appointed administrator or with the leave of the courts.

If forfeiture was to take place prior to maturity of the Bonds, then U.S. Bank Trustees Limited, the entity that will hold the security on behalf of Bondholders, may not be in a position to assign the Head Lease for value in the event CCC forfeited the lease as described in the preceding paragraph. This may have an impact on the Bondholders’ ability to receive full repayment of their investment in the Bonds on the occurrence of such an insolvency event.
 
Reactions: shmmeee

Hiraeth

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,009
Liquid Gold said:
All sounds corrupt as fuck.

I'm going to raise a bond scheme to get £50m to bid for CCFC.

I'm going to secure that against Sky Blues Talk which an independent valuator (a pigeon that just flew past towards the east not the west) agreed is currently worth £100m.

Sound.
Click to expand...
Surely Greggs Owl would be a wiser choice to value Sky Blues Talk than a pigeon?
 
O

oldfiver

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,010
MalcSB said:
Taken direct from the prospectus

Risks relating the head lease of the Arena granted to ACL2006

Under the terms of the head lease granted by Coventry City Council (“CCC”) to Arena Coventry (2006) Limited (“ACL2006”) in respect of the Arena (the “Head Lease”), CCC have reserved the right to forfeit the Head Lease if ACL2006 becomes insolvent. Insolvency in this scenario means a situation where ACL2006 becomes unable to pay its debts, has a receiver/administrator/provisional liquidator appointed over its assets, has assets seized in order to pay debts of ACL2006 or has a winding-up order made against it.

The effect of forfeiture would be that the 250 year Head Lease would fall away and that ACL would then become the tenant of CCC at the Arena for the remaining 38 years of its existing lease. However, the right of CCC to claim forfeiture of the Head Lease is not an automatic right. If CCC made a claim for such forfeiture, this could be contested by ACL2006, any third party that held security over ACL2006 and any subtenants of ACL2006 by making application to a court in England.

Further, if an administrator was to be appointed over the assets of ACL2006, then CCC would not be able to forfeit the Head Lease without the consent of the appointed administrator or with the leave of the courts.

If forfeiture was to take place prior to maturity of the Bonds, then U.S. Bank Trustees Limited, the entity that will hold the security on behalf of Bondholders, may not be in a position to assign the Head Lease for value in the event CCC forfeited the lease as described in the preceding paragraph. This may have an impact on the Bondholders’ ability to receive full repayment of their investment in the Bonds on the occurrence of such an insolvency event.
Click to expand...


Lots of "Mays"
Would depend on a Court to decide - if necessary - CCC might not object
 
Reactions: duffer

Nick

Administrator
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,011
IMissMAF said:
https://twitter.com/davesidwell5?s=21&t=cfjjWEEo-6n7iSaT9VgRsg

somethings happening cause the faceless, anonymous accounts are out again…
Click to expand...

Yep, wheeled out at times like this.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,012
slowpoke said:
How real is this Byng bloke and how dangerous is his supposed bid/interest to MAs apparent preferred bid status.
Click to expand...
I thought you had inside info that everything was going to be sorted pre-Xmas?
 
Reactions: SkyBlueSam01, fernandopartridge and shmmeee

Flying Fokker

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,013
Nick said:
I'm starting to think ACL being liquidated is the best option for us.

Hopefully it would open it up to more potential people who would then want to have the club too and effectively a fresh start with it all.
Click to expand...

i saw one example of a bond holder who had 170k holding. I suppose he’ll have hold of a worthless certificate.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,014
Nick said:
Yep, wheeled out at times like this.
Click to expand...
Those accounts are fucking weird.
 
Reactions: AOM and Gynnsthetonic

Nick

Administrator
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,015
The bondholders have raised a few grand already for legal help.
 

Nick

Administrator
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,016
Flying Fokker said:
i saw one example of a bond holder who had 170k holding. I suppose he’ll have hold of a worthless certificate.
Click to expand...

Yeah think I saw that.

It's fucking madness, although if you have 170k knocking about for shit like that then you can't be that poor.
 
Reactions: Terry Gibson's perm and Flying Fokker

The Philosopher

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,017
Nick said:
So it would then be in the bondholders complete power to sell the lease to whoever, debt free once they are paid?
Click to expand...
Looks like the Bondholders could do worse than find an alternative partner.

The fact is company number 04187289 (Wasps) has gone (think of it as just a company number for a minute) and the creditors of the group (including Richardson) want the proceeds of the sale of the Arena Lease.

The Bondholders are in the strongest position because they have security (which is being argued but I still think is strong. I get criticism on here but DGAF. Let me explain: it was sold as being secure but there were loopholes. Think PPI - was sold as one thing and it was ruled the sale was misleading. Nothing is straightforward in commercial law).

It smells of a strong-arming. “Accept this or you’ll get nothing”

“The lease will revert to CCC”.

Who is going to blink first?
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,018
Samo said:
That would be a very uncomfortable month.
Click to expand...

Its OK youve got the free flowing football of England to distract you…
 
Reactions: duffer

Samo

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,019
shmmeee said:
Its OK youve got the free flowing football of England to distract you…
Click to expand...

For the first week anyway
 
Reactions: duffer

The Philosopher

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,020
This to me is far more interesting than watching some wannabe celebs eating ring pieces in a jungle. Proper twists and turns about things I find interesting: law, finances, politics and most of all CCFC.
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Dal, eastwoodsdustman, Red House Coaches and 2 others

tisza

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,021
fernandopartridge said:
there is a big subject to in it though:

View attachment 27231
Click to expand...
That's the issue bondholders are missing. They don't know the ratio between asset value and asset income value. They just keep assuming it will sell for the whole valuation amount but the "glossy" income that was in the Wasps brochure didn't stand up and that the facility is in A1 condition.
 

Liquid Gold

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,022
Hiraeth said:
Surely Greggs Owl would be a wiser choice to value Sky Blues Talk than a pigeon?
Click to expand...
See you in court
 
Reactions: duffer and Hiraeth

tisza

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,023
Nick said:
The bondholders have raised a few grand already for legal help.
Click to expand...
That'll pay for a couple of hours of legal work then.
 
Reactions: Colin Steins Smile
H

HuckerbyDublinWhelan

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,024
tisza said:
That's the issue bondholders are missing. They don't know the ratio between asset value and asset income value. They just keep assuming it will sell for the whole valuation amount but the "glossy" income that was in the Wasps brochure didn't stand up and that the facility is in A1 condition.
Click to expand...
To be fair this is good for us. Brings administration into play if Ashley throws a tantrum and pulls out
 
Reactions: Nick
O

oldfiver

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,025
Sick Boy said:
I thought you had inside info that everything was going to be sorted pre-Xmas?
Click to expand...


Probably waiting for the first HS2 train to arrive
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,026
Sick Boy said:
I thought you had inside info that everything was going to be sorted pre-Xmas?
Click to expand...

Yeah it’s all gravy
 

Nick

Administrator
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,027
Anybody want to tell Just Stop Oil that CCC are funding loads of oily stuff just to see if they kick off?
 
Reactions: duffer, Sky Blue Dal, RegTheDonk and 2 others

slowpoke

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,028
Sick Boy said:
I thought you had inside info that everything was going to be sorted pre-Xmas?
Click to expand...
Only things are on course for a happy xmas which apparently hasn’t changed.
 
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,029
slowpoke said:
How real is this Byng bloke and how dangerous is his supposed bid/interest to MAs apparent preferred bid status.
Click to expand...
The same as last time.
Deleted member 5849 said:
A joker who got expelled from the RICS under allegations of financial misconduct, and wanted to buy us around kickoff of all this way back when, but got undone by his lack of understanding of modern communications systems
Click to expand...
 
D

djr8369

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,030
chiefdave said:
There's a scenario there where the next 10 plus years are Ashley and Sepalla using the club as a pawn in an ongoing dispute, we know how well that kind of thing turns out for the club.
Click to expand...
This has been my worry. SISU will want the most money they can get and MA will want to pay as little as possible and neither will play nice.
chiefdave said:
I'm not convinced he would be. Wasps were broke and realised they needed us here, same can't be said of Ashley.

Without knowing his motives for buying the stadium how he will act as a landlord is very much an unknown.

He doesn't seem to have involvement in similar businesses we can look to as a guide
Click to expand...
If he’s landlord only he will surely be looking to gain as much in rent as possible unless his income is linked to F&B and such so his goal is to drive visitors rather than just take the highest rent payment.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,031
Deleted member 5849 said:
The same as last time.
Click to expand...

Is he the same bloke involved in that HS2 report that was supposed to be a bit dodgy as well?
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,032
ajsccfc said:
Michael Byng is wiring his bid of four hundred shillings and all the riches of Mesopotamia from his palatial home in Ceylon.
Click to expand...

Michael Byng STOP
 
Reactions: ajsccfc
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,033
shmmeee said:
Is he the same bloke involved in that HS2 report that was supposed to be a bit dodgy as well?
Click to expand...
I wouldn't know, but he certainly likes chatting HS2 on twitter.

He likes a crusade doesn't he. A bit like Joe Rukin, GMKMrAngry in that respect.
 

slowpoke

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,034
Deleted member 5849 said:
A joker who got expelled from the RICS under allegations of financial misconduct, and wanted to buy us around kickoff of all this way back when, but got undone by his lack of understanding of modern communications systems
Click to expand...
Right up Nick’s street then.
 
D

djr8369

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,035
Flying Fokker said:
i saw one example of a bond holder who had 170k holding. I suppose he’ll have hold of a worthless certificate.
Click to expand...
Don’t worry I’m sure they’ve got plenty in crypto as well so will be fine.
 
Reactions: Deleted member 5849 and shmmeee

Nick

Administrator
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,036
slowpoke said:
Right up Nick’s street then.
Click to expand...

How's that?
 

slowpoke

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,037
Can’t we give Jeff Bezos a ring he’s just announce he is giving most of his £124 billion away.
 
Reactions: RegTheDonk
S

steve cooper

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,038
Sick Boy said:
He's shown more interest in them than us so far.
Click to expand...
When I go to buy a car from a dealer I start off by looking at anything but the one I'm really interested in
 
Reactions: Sick Boy

Nick

Administrator
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,039

The bloke is all over the shop.

"No funding into Wasps"
"It wasn't about that, it was about the wider issue of the arena"
 
Reactions: skybluepm2

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Nov 14, 2022
  • #12,040
slowpoke said:
Can’t we give Jeff Bezos a ring he’s just announce he is giving most of his £124 billion away.
Click to expand...

He can start by paying tax.
 
Reactions: duffer
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