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Wasps downward spiral... (6 Viewers)

  • Thread starter CCFC54321
  • Start date Oct 20, 2018
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Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,241
Liquid Gold said:
The only way it could possibly work is if he wrote off all his debt then paid off the bond holders himself for the arena.

The thing has been a shit show from the start of its build and will only ever potentially work without a mountain of debt around it but nobody has ever managed to make it work.
Click to expand...

Knowing Wasps’ luck that’s what he’ll do
 
B

bradwellskyblues

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,242
i hope we are back at the Ricoh soon but in the medium term the Ricoh is doomed it will be the largest white elephant in Coventry and will be knocked down eventually
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,243
bradwellskyblues said:
i hope we are back at the Ricoh soon but in the medium term the Ricoh is doomed it will be the largest white elephant in Coventry and will be knocked down eventually
Click to expand...

Yeah people laughed when I said it was a white elephant
bradwellskyblues said:
i hope we are back at the Ricoh soon but in the medium term the Ricoh is doomed it will be the largest white elephant in Coventry and will be knocked down eventually
Click to expand...

Yeah people laughed when I said it years ago

Positive News for the Academy - Wasps pull out of Higgs

Scenario 3 whilst watching Wasps and doing everything they can possibly do to make life financially difficult for them. When eventually Wasps decide to sell the business up to anyone apart from SISU abd we start again. Surely Joy wants an exit strategy that entails her getting her clients money...
www.skybluestalk.co.uk
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,244
Grendel said:
Yeah people laughed when I said it was a white elephant


Yeah people laughed when I said it years ago

Positive News for the Academy - Wasps pull out of Higgs

Scenario 3 whilst watching Wasps and doing everything they can possibly do to make life financially difficult for them. When eventually Wasps decide to sell the business up to anyone apart from SISU abd we start again. Surely Joy wants an exit strategy that entails her getting her clients money...
www.skybluestalk.co.uk
Click to expand...

When did you say it G?
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,245
Brighton Sky Blue said:
When did you say it G?
Click to expand...

2017 - the fact is in their own sport they are more successful than us but it still can’t work. It will never work
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,246
Grendel said:
2017 - the fact is in their own sport they are more successful than us but it still can’t work. It will never work
Click to expand...

So what's the answer?
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,247
Brighton Sky Blue said:
So what's the answer?
Click to expand...

In normal cities the council would have to own it and would have done it properly from day one
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,248
Grendel said:
2017 - the fact is in their own sport they are more successful than us but it still can’t work. It will never work
Click to expand...
Indeed, the arena, casino and exhibition hall was a shaky proposition in the first place further hamstrung by the stupid Yorkshire Bank loan which has effectively resurfaced as the bond.
 
Reactions: duffer and Sick Boy

Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,249
Wonder what the prize money is? Huge win today
 

shepardo01

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,250
Sky Blue Pete said:
Wonder what the prize money is? Huge win today
Click to expand...
Hopefully not a lot!
..... can't imagine it will be....
Or that, whatever the amount, it will put a dent in their debt!!

Exeter in the Final??.....
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,251
shepardo01 said:
Hopefully not a lot!
..... can't imagine it will be....
Or that, whatever the amount, it will put a dent in their debt!!

Exeter in the Final??.....
Click to expand...

Considering this is 2020 they'll probably get £100 million per point
 
Reactions: shepardo01

shepardo01

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,252
Brighton Sky Blue said:
Considering this is 2020 they'll probably get £100 million per point
Click to expand...
.....that is what Bobby and the Telegraph will say anyway!!
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,253
shepardo01 said:
.....that is what Bobby and the Telegraph will say anyway!!
Click to expand...

He’ll need to keep a pillow over his lap
 
Reactions: duffer and shepardo01

jordan210

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,254
How does the league work. Do play off games just give you an extra 3 points ?

So in theory if Exeter win today they win the league
 

speedie87

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,255
jordan210 said:
How does the league work. Do play off games just give you an extra 3 points ?

So in theory if Exeter win today they win the league
Click to expand...

no playoffs are like football playlffs winner takes all
 

Terry Gibson's perm

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,256
Probably get a special bonus from the council if they win something
 
Reactions: duffer

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,257
speedie87 said:
no playoffs are like football playlffs winner takes all
Click to expand...
Doesn't that end up making loads of league games dead rubbers with teams that are either already in the playoffs or def out not giving a shit?
 
Reactions: Kneeza

shepardo01

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,258
chiefdave said:
Doesn't that end up making loads of league games dead rubbers with teams that are either already in the playoffs or def out not giving a shit?
Click to expand...
Yes.... Wasps last game vs Exeter.
Wasps needed to win to guarantee playoffs.
Exeter fighting it out in Europe and guaranteed top spot for playoffs.
Apparently played basically their 3rd team.
Wasps hammered them.....
 

jordan210

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,259
speedie87 said:
no playoffs are like football playlffs winner takes all
Click to expand...

So basically the league is completely pointless for finishing 1st. No wonder the buy in from TV is low
 
Reactions: vow, Kneeza and Frostie

steveo1987

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,260
jordan210 said:
So basically the league is completely pointless for finishing 1st. No wonder the buy in from TV is low
Click to expand...
In a nutshell, yes..just like the league version of the beautiful egg game.
 
Reactions: duffer

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,261
Liquid Gold said:
The only way it could possibly work is if he wrote off all his debt then paid off the bond holders himself for the arena.

The thing has been a shit show from the start of its build and will only ever potentially work without a mountain of debt around it but nobody has ever managed to make it work.
Click to expand...

the debt is group debt so he could leave that in Wasps Holdings or certainly a significant percentage
 

Nick

Administrator
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,262
Anybody seen that video Bobby Bridge posted of Wasps celebrations?

It's so shit it's amazing, partridge-esque.
 
Reactions: AOM, Frostie, Liquid Gold and 1 other person

shepardo01

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2020
  • #2,263
Nick said:
Anybody seen that video Bobby Bridge posted of Wasps celebrations?

It's so shit it's amazing, partridge-esque.
Click to expand...
Saw some pictures of the event... full of oldies.... like a scene from Cocoon.
Any celebration or excitement could have tipped a load of them over the literal edge!
..... mind you, will be interesting to see if some of them out-live Wasps themselves.....

As an aside..... what are the actual regulations with regards to something like this.....

And could CCFC put something together for some games to add some revenue?
Question would be where.....
St Andrews?
Warwick Uni?

Just a thought....
 
Reactions: Peter Billing

jordan210

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 12, 2020
  • #2,264
'You would like to think that as many of the bondholders are fans, Richardson would refinance and repay in full at some point rather than letting the business go bust, even if that means forgoing the interest payments at some points along the way.

I understand the current situation is a bit crap, but cannot see how a team now in the Premiership final with arguably the best stadium in domestic rugby would not be attractive to an outside investor or potential buyer. If they were to let it go bust and return very little cash to investors, not only does that have serious repercussions for the team, but would alienate the fans they will be relying on in 12 months time to come back to the games and buy the pies and pints.'

Business 101

is company making huge losses and isn't feasible, If yes dont invest....
 
Reactions: chiefdave
D

djbooth

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 12, 2020
  • #2,265
jordan210 said:
'You would like to think that as many of the bondholders are fans, Richardson would refinance and repay in full at some point rather than letting the business go bust, even if that means forgoing the interest payments at some points along the way.

I understand the current situation is a bit crap, but cannot see how a team now in the Premiership final with arguably the best stadium in domestic rugby would not be attractive to an outside investor or potential buyer. If they were to let it go bust and return very little cash to investors, not only does that have serious repercussions for the team, but would alienate the fans they will be relying on in 12 months time to come back to the games and buy the pies and pints.'

Business 101

is company making huge losses and isn't feasible, If yes dont invest....
Click to expand...
I think wasps fan seems to forget they couldn’t get a lender so what down the bonds route. If that’s not the correct then Richardson is stupid. The interest from a bank would have been alot less
 

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 12, 2020
  • #2,266
jordan210 said:
'You would like to think that as many of the bondholders are fans, Richardson would refinance and repay in full at some point rather than letting the business go bust, even if that means forgoing the interest payments at some points along the way.
Click to expand...
I really hope none of their supporters have invested on the basis that Richardson will sort them out if it all goes tits up. If he had that sort of money to throw around they wouldn't need a bond in the first place.
 

Philosoraptor

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 12, 2020
  • #2,267
If I was to put a guess forward.

Looking at over £20 Mil losses for next accounting year plus the added revaluation of the stadium to contend with in the accounts whilst trying to refinance the loan.

Going to be fun!



 

jordan210

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 12, 2020
  • #2,268
Some more interesting comments

"finkie: You are missing the point. Bondholders are being invited to dilute their security for what exactly? One or two more interest payments, just maybe, while others will be invited to share what we have for whose benefit? Not bondholders, for sure. No thanks. I would rather take the pain now. If that means less that 100p, so be it. Let's resolve this now as the future for bondholders does not look good. In your parlance, let's take the pain now for it is not up to us to make the books balance. We are not equity investors. Besides, it might be a wake-up call for this lousy so-called government if WASPS is the first to go under."


"
I'm a noobie here, and I won't be staying. I've been a retail bond investor for many years and have never seen anything like this before.

It seems bizarre to expect existing bondholders to *release*, rather than *waive*, parts of their covenant package; in their previous consent solicitation in 2017/18, and in all others that I've been involved with, temporary waivers, or tinkering at the margins, of potential temporary default events, have been asked for - in exchange for consideration in the form of increased interest coupons, consent fees etc. Nothing appears to be on offer here.

It feels as though they expect to remain in permanent covenant breach - in which case, if security over the stadium is solid, where is there any incentive for bondholders to agrre to any of this? Aren't we better off allowing the whole pack of cards to collapse now, so security can be enforced?"
 
Reactions: fernandopartridge, oldfiver and ccfcchris

jordan210

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 13, 2020
  • #2,269
"I have voted in favour of the resolution.

The covenant package is no longer relevant and expecting covenants to be met or something in return for waiving covenants is not realistic at this point. Full face value repayment and whole interest payments are clearly relevant.

These provisions allow the company to raise more debt in a way that specifically does not impact on the bondholders' security. This may be favorable government debt.

So I can't really see any downside and I can see upside.

Shadeysaga, there is no upside of making the company go bust now. The company should be given a fair chance to refinance the bonds. If that fails to result in full payout for bondholders then clearly there will be meaningful decisions to be made about the optimum way forwards for bondholders but we are nowhere near that at the moment. The company should be allowed its first attempt to achieve the refinancing and these provisions help towards that."
 

Liquid Gold

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 13, 2020
  • #2,270
I expect it to get voted through but I hope it's closer than they'd like. Would mean any refinancing by that route would be virtually impossible.
 

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 14, 2020
  • #2,271
Wonder if Wasps fans are having second thoughts about when they were pushing for Sale to forfeit their game due to a covid outbreak in their squad.

Wasps: Four players and three staff members test positive for Covid-19

Four Wasps players and three staff members who work in the playing department of the Premiership finalists test positive for Covid-19.
www.bbc.co.uk
 
Reactions: Peter Billing, Moff and TomRad85

Saddlebrains

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 14, 2020
  • #2,272
chiefdave said:
Wonder if Wasps fans are having second thoughts about when they were pushing for Sale to forfeit their game due to a covid outbreak in their squad.

Wasps: Four players and three staff members test positive for Covid-19

Four Wasps players and three staff members who work in the playing department of the Premiership finalists test positive for Covid-19.
www.bbc.co.uk
Click to expand...
HAHAHAHAHAHA
 

Kneeza

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 14, 2020
  • #2,273
chiefdave said:
Wonder if Wasps fans are having second thoughts about when they were pushing for Sale to forfeit their game due to a covid outbreak in their squad.

Wasps: Four players and three staff members test positive for Covid-19

Four Wasps players and three staff members who work in the playing department of the Premiership finalists test positive for Covid-19.
www.bbc.co.uk
Click to expand...
Couldn't make it up.
 

Terry Gibson's perm

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 14, 2020
  • #2,274
Just play the game tough luck
 
D

djbooth

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 14, 2020
  • #2,275
Kneeza said:
Couldn't make it up.
Click to expand...
Interesting that there star player is injured. Has anyone got any foil I’ve used the last making my hat
 
Reactions: vow
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