You’re reading this wrong - I’m not overly critical of Southgate. I get why he values defensive solidity above attacking flair. But (and I appreciate I’m being slightly churlish) Man City play with a single pivot and 2 attacking midfielders. We could replicate that setup and have some real fun. Ok it may not be successful and it’d be (rightly) used as a stick to beat Southgate with if we went out earlier than expected, but I’m just really intrigued to see how it’d get on.
Guardiola has a lot more time to drill his players than any international team. His teams have tended to succeed at the highest level too so Guardiola isn’t the manager to follow here - he should’ve won more UCL’s with the teams he’s managed.
Over a 38 game season, no one comes close to Pep but I don’t think he’d do well as an international manager.
The Czech team that gets to a quarter final in 2020 is worst than their 2016 when they finished last in their group with 1 point?Netherlands haven't been good for years lol
Czech Republic in 2020 were shit , lost twice to Scotland in 2020 and Wales in 2021 , beat cyprus by a goal ... shiteThe Czech team that gets to a quarter final in 2020 is worst than their 2016 when they finished last in their group with 1 point?
Their last quarter final appearance was when they won a group of Greece, Russia and Poland and there was no Round of 16.
I know! Just humour my irrationality!!
Czech Republic in 2020 were shit , lost twice to Scotland in 2020 and Wales in 2021 , beat cyprus by a goal ... shite
You're arguing as per usual and have no idea what you're saying
International football tournaments are bigger now and also weaker for it , hence easier games generally than years ago
Keep arguing though that England haven't had the easiest routes in their existence under Southgate
If you set up so defensively but concede poor goals and allow the opposition to cut through you anyway, what purpose does it serve? Thought the same watching CCFC many times last season.I’m pretty excited about our team and think the set up is pretty bang on. Perhaps Bellingham as an 8 might work, but it could limit his ability to operate in the final 3rd.
You made a claim that the Czech team was ‘the worst in years’ when it clearly wasn’t, they beat the Netherlands and had their best tournament since Nedved played for them.
The only results that actually matter is when you’re in the tournament. If you qualify for a tournament, who cares?!
We won 10/10 games and the best qualification record for Euro 2016 under Hodgson and when we got there, flopped. All these Nations League and friendlies are irrelevant and it’s clear you out far too much weight on these performances.
I’m pretty excited about our team, having a Cole Palmer or a Saka
You made a claim that the Czech team was ‘the worst in years’ when it clearly wasn’t, they beat the Netherlands and had their best tournament since Nedved played for them.
The only results that actually matter is when you’re in the tournament. If you qualify for a tournament, who cares?!
We won 10/10 games and the best qualification record for Euro 2016 under Hodgson and when we got there, flopped. All these Nations League and friendlies are irrelevant and it’s clear you out far too much weight on these performances.
They had their best tournament because 3 teams went through the fucking group , in the old format they were out in the groups again .
Their group in 2016 was Spain Croatia and Turkey and 2 went through so they went out , they beat Scotland to go through in 2021 then beat a shite Holland 2-1
There's no asterisks, easier groups , weaker teams , weaker tournaments, still failedIt’s funny that there’s all these asterisks to justify your feelings toward Southgate. Just look at our previous results with the ‘golden generation’. 2010 we can second in the group with USA, Algeria and Slovenia and got battered to Germany.
Tournament football is all about outcomes and 2020 we lost to the better team in the tournament and 2018 our team was shit. Possibly the worst team we brought to a major tournament in my lifetime. 2022, we lost to a good France team because Kane missed a penalty but otherwise, we were just about on top.
You probably have this idea in your head that another manager will just come in and make everything better… Unlikely.
What are you doing? I’ve got Italy Albania in Dortmund and Georgia Czechia in Hamburg.May pop over to Lux. for a mooch didn't realise how close it was
Have got ticket to a couple of neutral games as well as England's three group games so will slot it in somewhere
That’s the spirit. Failed to get out of the Championship for the last four seasons. Don’t waste your money on next season’s season ticket.Failed in 2018 , nations league 2019 , 2021 , 2022 and relegated us in the nations league 2022 , will fail miserably in Germany , can't beat good teams and both routes have 3 top 10 opponents to beat to win it
Don't waste your money
Was the case throughout 1990-2018 too? Overturning failure for so many years isn’t an easy task, evidence by countless leading coaches failing as our national team coach.There's no asterisks, easier groups , weaker teams , weaker tournaments, still failed
Southgate tactically inept
You see the quality of top international teams throughout the 90s and 00s ??Was the case throughout 1990-2018 too? Overturning failure for so many years isn’t an easy task, evidence by countless leading coaches failing as our national team coach.
That’s the spirit. Failed to get out of the Championship for the last four seasons. Don’t waste your money on next season’s season ticket.
Unless you are weird Cov should always mean more than England thoughThat’s the spirit. Failed to get out of the Championship for the last four seasons. Don’t waste your money on next season’s season ticket.
Failed in 2018 , nations league 2019 , 2021 , 2022 and relegated us in the nations league 2022 , will fail miserably in Germany , can't beat good teams and both routes have 3 top 10 opponents to beat to win it
Don't waste your money
Come on evo. ‘Failed’ is a strong word. To get to a World Cup semi and losing a Euro final on pens is hardly failure
Failure is getting knocked out of Euros by Iceland in final 16 in 2016 or not even qualifying in 2008 or finishing bottom in our World Cup Group in 2014 with one point
We weren’t tactically bad against France and didn’t lose to Italy, so it’s not as black and white as you make out.It's not worth celebrating either , easiest routes ever and tactically bad in every big game
I'd give you France but Italy, Croatia and Holland in the NL he just didn't know how to get the resultWe weren’t tactically bad against France and didn’t lose to Italy, so it’s not as black and white as you make out.
Croatia had a better team than us in 2018, particularly in midfield which is where they won that game. Prime Modric and Rakitic against Lingard, Alli and Hendo…I'd give you France but Italy, Croatia and Holland in the NL he just didn't know how to get the result
His record is also shite against top sides
Croatia had a better team than us in 2018, particularly in midfield which is where they won that game. Prime Modric and Rakitic against Lingard, Alli and Hendo…
Nations League, it’s a glorified friendly so I don’t put too much on that. Italy is a 50:50 in my view, they were the in-form team and got a fortunate goal to tie things up. It was a pretty drab game and think it’s easier said than done to ‘go for the kill’. It wasn’t a tactical blunder by any stretch.
Qatar was technically his worst tournament but there was clear and obvious improvement in the side and the way we approach games. There’s been a lot of ‘meh’ performances but that happens when the international calendar is full of fixtures that are forgone conclusions.
I’ll find common ground with you, if we don’t get past the quarter finals, I think Southgate should step down. If we fail to win the group, he best win the tournament!
Separate topic, the international calendar needs reforming. No one wants or needs for games like England v Malta / San Marino or whatever city-state or island has a football team.
Beat Italy twice in qualification so there’s signs of improvement there. If we’re being fair.
All those managers would probably have done exactly if not more than Southgate with these players at this time , he's not special and they all have better CVs than Gareth
I can't imagine Gareth doing better with their teams in their eras considering he relegated boro
Different eras , with some of the greatest international teams ever , our golden generation were not as good as the best in the world there were many great sides in that period ..hardly astonishingAstonishing. The Sven team had:
Neville
Campbell
Ferdinand
Terry
Ashley Cole
Beckham
Scholes
Lampard
Gerrard
Owen
Rooney
There’s been other good players in and out the team in those years. There is no excuse for not getting past the quarter final with that cohort of players. That is failure.
2002, we beat Argentina, drew to Sweden and Nigeria to finish 2nd in the group
2004, lost to France in the group and finished 2nd in the group
2006, won an easy group, lost to Portugal on pens - scored 6 goals in total
2008, didn’t qualify
2010 - finished second in a group consisting of; USA, Algeria and Slovenia - the headline after the draw was EASY. Get battered 4-1 by Germany
2012-2016, let’s not even talk about.
That was the golden generation who passed up easy run ins themselves but didn’t capitalise.
Our team is still young and with the exception of Walker, Kane, Shaw and Stones, this team will be together for the next 8-10 years. There’s a lot to be optimistic about.
Also, has to be said, the Gerrard/Lampard combination never, ever really worked. It was just a pairing where it never quite came off and that hurt us.Different eras , with some of the greatest international teams ever , our golden generation were not as good as the best in the world there were many great sides in that period ..hardly astonishing
Also, has to be said, the Gerrard/Lampard combination never, ever really worked. It was just a pairing where it never quite came off and that hurt us.
What frustrates me the most, is that we have so many flair players right now and as soon as they pull on an England shirt, it seems to be stifled.
We HAVE shown what we are capable of on occasion, but for the most part, it's been almost like we are playing with a straitjacket on.
Romania v Ukraine in Munich on Monday (and a nice night train after the England game Sunday) cause I have never been to the Allianz before and my trip there when we played them in the Nations League the other year fell through at the last minute then Poland v Austria in Berlin a week on FridayWhat are you doing? I’ve got Italy Albania in Dortmund and Georgia Czechia in Hamburg.
Only have to look at which side this country has (at risk of making this a political thread, rightfully) taken in the Balkans in living memory of people older than myself to work out we probably aren't going to be flavor of the month with the SerbiansSo 500 Serbs on the hunt for a fight apparently. Overblown or a possibility? Personally I feel they're probably overhyping it but Serbia are a similar lot to the Russians so I'll keep my distance.
I think going to the England fanzine at the racecourse and then into the stadium nice and early should be enough.
I won't teach any of my group the two headed eagle sign either.
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