The only way to hurt sisu (1 Viewer)

Kingokings204 · Jan 7, 2017

shmmeee said:
They can accept any offer. The club is worthless, the question is how much do they want for the debt. If they're holding out for £60m or whatever the fuck is our debt these days (what is our debt?) then they're mental.

In terms of real debt osb before has cleared up its around 8 million. So I think anywhere between 3-5 million could do it. They clearly haven't received that money offer.

I genuinely believe people are out there but not at that price hence why we are where we are. We have a reluctant seller (club is breaking even) and a reluctant buyer (don't want to pay circa 5m) so we are are a stalemate. Ticking along in league 1 trying to stay up and selling any player worth a price.

Grendel · Jan 7, 2017

Kingokings204 said:
In terms of real debt osb before has cleared up its around 8 million. So I think anywhere between 3-5 million could do it. They clearly haven't received that money offer.

I genuinely believe people are out there but not at that price hence why we are where we are. We have a reluctant seller (club is breaking even) and a reluctant buyer (don't want to pay circa 5m) so we are are a stalemate. Ticking along in league 1 trying to stay up and selling any player worth a price.

The level of capital actually owed is around £36 million.

Brylowes · Jan 7, 2017

The Reverend Skyblue said:
We should start an East Anglian branch of the skyblues supporters club, there's quite a few of us in the sticks around here.
Could hire minibuses etc and get to the odd game together

"Silly Suffolk Supporters Society"

wince · Jan 7, 2017

Comments. Not going to get in to discussion about this, it is my busiest time of the year and i am playing catch up following my operation

- I "pick holes" in someones argument only when i consider what is said is fundamentally wron That was the point of the OP

Nick · Jan 7, 2017

wince said:
Comments. Not going to get in to discussion about this, it is my busiest time of the year and i am playing catch up following my operation

- I "pick holes" in someones argument only when i consider what is said is fundamentally wron That was the point of the OP

What was the point of it?

wince · Jan 8, 2017

Comments. Not going to get in to discussion about this, it is my busiest time of the year and i am playing catch up following my operation

- I "pick holes" in someones argument only when i consider what is said is fundamentally wrong BUT That is the point of the OP ,Fisher and JOY haven't got the time to spend on little ccfc making a million pound if they are dealing with Talk sport . the FA ,Sky ect explaining things, Time is money , it can not be worth there while spending more and more time on ccfc ., While of course they can afford it as per accounts if it wasn't ccfc would they keep chasing a return on A N other company and why

Nick · Jan 8, 2017

They wouldn't spend the time doing that, the inconvenience would be on ccfc.

I suggested a massive walk up to get the sheff United game delayed as a one off.

Not sure I could afford to pay match day costs every game either, and it's a bigger inconvenience.

The cup game would be ideal for that next week, it still wouldn't bother sisu though.

Kingokings204 · Jan 8, 2017

Grendel said:
The level of capital actually owed is around £36 million.

They are never getting this figure back. Ever.

Isnt the true debt figure around 8-10m with 28m Coverted to shares or equity?

Astute · Jan 8, 2017

Nick said:
People don't, I bet a decent chunk of our fans wouldn't be able to say who otium was. The same as they wouldn't know who Mondelez International were if they ate a Dairy Milk.

(I would like to say I didn't have to Google that, but I did)

No wonder you are always defending Otium if you had to Google who they are

Astute · Jan 8, 2017

covman said:
It isn't true that SISU will not benefit from getting your ticket money.

Forget all the bullshit about the links between CCFC and SISU. I could not give a crap about how they make their accounts look.

The simple fact is that by paying into CCFC you are personally benefitting SISU. A company who had pulled YOUR club to shreds.

OK let's try explaining it another way.

I am SISU. My wife is CCFC. When we first got together she was spending money like it was going out of fashion. Her income was nowhere near her outgoings. When we got together my outgoings went seriously up. But over the years I brought them under control again. I am back to having more coming in than going out. But although my wife has a decent income her outgoings can exceed this. So occasionally I have to inject money into her account.

We are still married. But I am not her and she is not me :smuggrin:

Astute · Jan 8, 2017

SkyBlueZack said:
Yeah but isn't that money to cover the running costs? As fisher is chairman, wouldn't his salary be considered a running cost? I don't for one moment believe he's doing it out of the goodness of his heart. If money was going to buy designer clothes fir joy it would be different? That wouldn't be a running cost.

But what if she wears them for one of the court cases?

Astute · Jan 8, 2017

Nick said:
I've said prove that money is taken before telling everybody it is. Instead it's just guessing.

A bit like saying that Fisher works for free.

Astute · Jan 8, 2017

Nick said:
The thread is about if it hurts ccfc or sisu isn't it? It's only going to hurt ccfc and not sisu.

It hurts both. But I only care about CCFC.

Hedge funds are all about making money. SISU have lost money in CCFC. Hedge funds are also about reputation. SISU keep losing in court. They keep up with court cases though.

If you wanted to invest in a hedge fund would you put it into SISU? And if we can keep what is happening in the media it will get worse for them.

clint van damme · Jan 8, 2017

Astute said:
It hurts both. But I only care about CCFC.

Hedge funds are all about making money. SISU have lost money in CCFC. Hedge funds are also about reputation. SISU keep losing in court. They keep up with court cases though.

If you wanted to invest in a hedge fund would you put it into SISU? And if we can keep what is happening in the media it will get worse for them.

which is why I think they're stuck between a rock and a hard place.
What's going on at the minute is damaging their reputation but they can't write off the 28 million or however much it is which has been converted into shares - I think if they could come up with a face saving way out they'd be gone.

fernandopartridge · Jan 8, 2017

The same old boring NOPM dickheads trying to justify themselves not attending as some sort of moral crusade rather than admitting they don't like 3rd tier football.

Deleted member 5849 · Jan 8, 2017

clint van damme said:
which is why I think they're stuck between a rock and a hard place.
What's going on at the minute is damaging their reputation but they can't write off the 28 million or however much it is which has been converted into shares - I think if they could come up with a face saving way out they'd be gone.

Thing is, her reputation is about playing hardball, not giving in if they're confronted, and preparing to fight even if it costs more, then just meekly roll over...

(That too, is a standard hedge fund strategy btw)

Astute · Jan 8, 2017

Deleted member 5849 said:
Thing is, her reputation is about playing hardball, not giving in if they're confronted, and preparing to fight even if it costs more, then just meekly roll over...

(That too, is a standard hedge fund strategy btw)

And also knowing when to cut your losses.

Deleted member 5849 · Jan 8, 2017

Astute said:
And also knowing when to cut your losses.

Not necessarily, no...

Astute · Jan 8, 2017

Deleted member 5849 said:
Not necessarily, no...

People put their money into hedge funds that make the most money. They take it out of those that don't.

The more money made the more those running the funds make.

Deleted member 5849 · Jan 8, 2017

Astute said:
People put their money into hedge funds that make the most money. They take it out of those that don't.

The more money made the more those running the funds make.

No, you're looking at this very narrowly.

People put money into hedge funds for the high risk / high return. Hedge funds also run counter to 'common sense' at times. They also tend to either decide on fight or flight.

SISU are most definitely on the fight. It's worth them taking more of a hit to do so, in the wider context.

rondog1973 · Jan 8, 2017

fernandopartridge said:
The same old boring NOPM dickheads trying to justify themselves not attending as some sort of moral crusade rather than admitting they don't like 3rd tier football.

Same old boring self appointed superfan shite who don't like to accept they'll be no about turn in fortunes whilst we have the owners we have.

dongonzalos · Jan 8, 2017

Astute said:
OK let's try explaining it another way.

I am SISU. My wife is CCFC. When we first got together she was spending money like it was going out of fashion. Her income was nowhere near her outgoings. When we got together my outgoings went seriously up. But over the years I brought them under control again. I am back to having more coming in than going out. But although my wife has a decent income her outgoings can exceed this. So occasionally I have to inject money into her account.

We are still married. But I am not her and she is not me :smuggrin:

When you first saw her she was fit carefree and exciting, you got in quick and snapped her up just before she was about try speed dating. You took her to fancy restaurants and you bullshitted to her that with you she was going to live the high life with you.
Then when you realised you couldn't live up to your promises you became a crap husband controlled her spending made her shop at the pound and charity shops. Sold her prize possessions. She had an option to buy her family home but you got involved in her relationship with the owner and tried to do business your way, the hard way and screwed it up for her. The owner sold to someone else and hardly speaks to her now and barely tolerates you both.
The sparkle went out of her eye.
She was never the same person and she wishes she never met you.
However like all control freaks even though you know you are not good for her and that you can't really afford her.
Despite her getting admiring glances from other men who may be able to breath life into her again.
You can't let her go and you would rather her stay with you even if it ruins both your life's.
Rather than moving on and her flourishing again with someone else.
Hey ho at least her spending is under control now.

Astute · Jan 8, 2017

Deleted member 5849 said:
No, you're looking at this very narrowly.

People put money into hedge funds for the high risk / high return. Hedge funds also run counter to 'common sense' at times. They also tend to either decide on fight or flight.

SISU are most definitely on the fight. It's worth them taking more of a hit to do so, in the wider context.

OK I will invest in the SISU way.

'We might lose you money each year. But we will work hard in doing so'

I invest in medium risk. I always go for commodities that pay a decent dividend. It takes some of the risk away. I wouldn't invest in someone who is in court all the time....especially losing nearly all the time.

oldskyblue58 · Jan 8, 2017

wince said:
Comments. Not going to get in to discussion about this, it is my busiest time of the year and i am playing catch up following my operation

- I "pick holes" in someones argument only when i consider what is said is fundamentally wrong BUT That is the point of the OP ,Fisher and JOY haven't got the time to spend on little ccfc making a million pound if they are dealing with Talk sport . the FA ,Sky ect explaining things, Time is money , it can not be worth there while spending more and more time on ccfc ., While of course they can afford it as per accounts if it wasn't ccfc would they keep chasing a return on A N other company and why

Doesnt what i started my post with also provide the counter point to what you are saying though. I choose when or whether to get involved or not. Is it not the same for JS and TF

JS simply does not issue statements, she would not be the contact with FL, she can delegate anything to her assistant Laura Deering who is a director of SBS&L . She chooses not to be involved other than general oversight of the figures of clients investment in a club that has been left to its own means.

TF - it is only a few weeks ago that posters were wondering where he was and if he was at the club still. He had a brief round of interviews that he chose to do because he needed to prove to several different parties that the club was taking a hard line on fans behaviour, and to show that finances were firmly controlled. He doesnt speak direct to the CT any more, the SCG is defunct so time saved, when he does speak its on the end of a phone for 10 or 15 minutes except for the CWR session. But since then nothing. He can also delegate behind the scenes. But his role has always been to be the public head of the club (unfortunately). Not a lot of time really and what time there is he chooses very often and for particular reasons.

As for if it were A N Other company if the same drivers for them were there then yes probably they would it just wouldnt be so public

fernandopartridge · Jan 8, 2017

rondog1973 said:
Same old boring self appointed superfan shite who don't like to accept they'll be no about turn in fortunes whilst we have the owners we have.

Where have I said that I don't believe there will be an about turn in fortune? I'm talking about here and now and any about turn in fortune will have nothing to do with NOPM, it'll be a coincidence.

wince · Jan 8, 2017

oldskyblue58 said:
Doesnt what i started my post with also provide the counter point to what you are saying though. I choose when or whether to get involved or not. Is it not the same for JS and TF

JS simply does not issue statements, she would not be the contact with FL, she can delegate anything to her assistant Laura Deering who is a director of SBS&L . She chooses not to be involved other than general oversight of the figures of clients investment in a club that has been left to its own means.

TF - it is only a few weeks ago that posters were wondering where he was and if he was at the club still. He had a brief round of interviews that he chose to do because he needed to prove to several different parties that the club was taking a hard line on fans behaviour, and to show that finances were firmly controlled. He doesnt speak direct to the CT any more, the SCG is defunct so time saved, when he does speak its on the end of a phone for 10 or 15 minutes except for the CWR session. But since then nothing. He can also delegate behind the scenes. But his role has always been to be the public head of the club (unfortunately). Not a lot of time really and what time there is he chooses very often and for particular reasons.

As for if it were A N Other company if the same drivers for them were there then yes probably they would it just wouldnt be so public

Thank you a good reasoned answer as allways

rondog1973 · Jan 8, 2017

fernandopartridge said:
Where have I said that I don't believe there will be an about turn in fortune? I'm talking about here and now and any about turn in fortune will have nothing to do with NOPM, it'll be a coincidence.

People are staying away because they think, not unreasonably, that there is no prospect of anything like a promotion challenge whilst we are Sisu owned.

It's that lack of realistic hope that sees fans think better of investing their time, money and support on such a futility. They are not making a declaration of NOPM, I'd say most are just putting their support in hibernation until Sisu fuck off.

Never said you said you didn't think there'd be an about turn in fortune. Such an response sounds like Nick's hijacked your account.

NortonSkyBlue · Jan 8, 2017

OSB58 has shone a light on to the known facts regarding the owners and their financial input and strategy and that has to be taken at face value but as Ashdown states in the post above #245 the lack of transparency results in suspicion which leads to speculation and that leads to......well we know where that leads to!
I have spent the past three weeks in Coventry and had a great time at the Sheffield United and Bolton matches, it was a throw back to a different era and one that I enjoyed, there was passion and desire on show both on the pitch and in the crowd and a massive difference to the Oldham game in September which was dire. In talking to friends it was clear that many had given up and others were on the verge of throwing in the towel and the reasons quoted were not about money from sales or the manager but more to do with the poor games and the contempt they felt the club had for them, their customer.
In any business you treat your customer with contempt they will stop being your customer.
The thread is entitled the only way to hurt sisu, which should therefore read THE ONLY WAY TO HURT CCFC. It is easy for me here in Riyadh to criticize that sentiment but come on guys all we do is cut off our nose to spite our face. All other protests have been met with apathy(marches apart) and have resulted in some discomfort but frankly a stiffening of sisu resolve to become further entrenched.
Rather than starving sisu we should be be supporting Coventry City by watching them, spending all we can on OUR team. As the chant goes love City, hate sisu.

Paxman II · Jan 8, 2017

Just to make a point here. Do you not think that the stay away fans are purely down to a lack of success on the pitch regardless of whoever 'owns' CCFC?
I accept a small percentage of hardened fans like many who keep up with a forum like this who tend to hold strong opinions may stay away, but overall if we get some success this starved club of ours will see crowds rise along with it. There was a sense of that when TM had us leading from the front for a while and when we had that cup game against Crewe a while back.
Support is there and ready. But this support has gone missing and become passive. I can talk to family members who have heard about SISU but little else and I suspect the vast majority of people hold the same view with only a fleeting thought on who controls CCFC. I'll bet that if Slade gets us hovering in the promotion race next season we will once again see crowds rise regardless of ownership. Such is football and the love of the game.

Astute · Jan 8, 2017

I am still going to games. But not every game I can make. The 4 hours or more drive home after watching the garbage we have had to put up with has got to me. It leaves you with too much time to think. And when you add the drive to the game where you are hoping not to see the same old garbage.....

torchomatic · Jan 8, 2017

Think you're right, Pax. Don't remember too many protests when we were top of the league. It isn't only about SISU it's our position in the league. Some fans will only go when we are winning, etc. I won't moan at them for it. Each to their own.

Generally Midfield · Jan 8, 2017

This thread has taken a few detours but does seem the key point is from a couple of days ago ie ccfc and sisu are separate entities but sisu control ccfc so protests should focus on sisu e.g. its investors, not ccfc. Seems like a view lots of people might be able to live with?

bawtryneal · Jan 8, 2017

oldskyblue58 said:
Doesnt what i started my post with also provide the counter point to what you are saying though. I choose when or whether to get involved or not. Is it not the same for JS and TF

JS simply does not issue statements, she would not be the contact with FL, she can delegate anything to her assistant Laura Deering who is a director of SBS&L . She chooses not to be involved other than general oversight of the figures of clients investment in a club that has been left to its own means.

TF - it is only a few weeks ago that posters were wondering where he was and if he was at the club still. He had a brief round of interviews that he chose to do because he needed to prove to several different parties that the club was taking a hard line on fans behaviour, and to show that finances were firmly controlled. He doesnt speak direct to the CT any more, the SCG is defunct so time saved, when he does speak its on the end of a phone for 10 or 15 minutes except for the CWR session. But since then nothing. He can also delegate behind the scenes. But his role has always been to be the public head of the club (unfortunately). Not a lot of time really and what time there is he chooses very often and for particular reasons.

As for if it were A N Other company if the same drivers for them were there then yes probably they would it just wouldnt be so public

Fisher does attend 99% of our matches both home and away in his capacity of Chairman.

Nick · Jan 8, 2017

Generally Midfield said:
This thread has taken a few detours but does seem the key point is from a couple of days ago ie ccfc and sisu are separate entities but sisu control ccfc so protests should focus on sisu e.g. its investors, not ccfc. Seems like a view lots of people might be able to live with?

Can't see anybody disagreeing with that at all.

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