D
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It would indeed be pretty ludicrous to elect MEPs, that's true.
Although imagine the election campaigns!
It would indeed be pretty ludicrous to elect MEPs, that's true.It actually can’t be removed by the uk alone and the Eu have already said they want any extension limited to July to stop the farce of MEPs from the uk going to Brussels
The process to consider removing it would take is very close to deadline day. The second referendum argument becomes dead in the water as that would take months to organise - home office estimate 1 year
Bang onI just wish enough MPs had the courage to do what the majority of them want to do.
We keep hearing there is no majority in the house for any option, but there is, they are just too scared to say it or enact it.
This is what the majority think - There is no good Brexit deal: soft medium or hard that I can persuade the rest to vote for. A 'No deal' is out of the question. A people's vote though it might be convenient will cause more anger and division and probably just kicks the can down the road.
The only option left is revoke article 50 and remain in the EU. I know this is for the best but for many reasons I am scared to do it:
1) We voted to have a referendum. Doh!
2) We voted to trigger article 50. Oops.
3) We said in our manifestos we would honour the result. Duplicitous of us, agreed
4) People are very angry and there could be unrest. Indeed.
5) The twitter trolls will harass me. Unpalatable
6) My personal safety is at risk from nutjobs.
7) I could be deselected.
8) My party could split, collapse, implode. I love my party most of all.
9) I could lose my seat. Gulp!
10) I can't wait around for history to vindicate me.
Asking them to ignore all of the above and do the right thing - cancel Brexit, apologise to the nation, offer to stand down at the next GE - is asking for courage, vision and genuine patriotism.
So it won't happen and on with this national catastrophe we go.
Bang on
It can't even be done without changing the law.Can those of you closer to this, explain to a 'thickie' like me, why it's important for no deal to be taken off the table before they'll speak?
Taking aside that some of you do or don't want Brexit, I do get it. I can also see why lots are opposed to no deal. However, assuming that Brexit will still happen in some shape or form, how can it be sensible to announce that no deal isn't an option as it surely weakens any bargaining power if we're to go back to the EU and ask for more to get a deal through. Even if secretly they don't want it, the threat of it being there might surely help achieve a better UK deal, so what am I missing?
Ta
Spot on. But get your tin hat on as it is supposed to be the fault of May only.
I'm sure that, given the EU is a little frightened of a 'no deal' exit, leaving that option on the table would strengthen our position in any future negotiations.
They know the UK doesn’t have a hand to play, it’s always been bluffing throughout
And that's a long long timeIt’s a solution that would destroy democracy in this country for ever
I find it laughable that a man that spent 5 years playing party politics in a coalition (remember swapping welfare sanctions for a carrier bag charge!) has the cheek to call someone else out on it.
The Lib Dems abstaining on any future votes will have no impact on Labour as a party, and you are actually incorrect as the next stage of action for party members was the notion of a People's Vote... not a 2nd referendum.
PV is a second referendum in all but name ! people try to pretend it’s not by calling it that (I refuse to)
So what is a referendum by definition?
The definition I have is 'a general vote by the electorate on a single political question which has been referred to them for a direct decision'.
As someone who voted remain, I do have some sympathy for this view.Can those of you closer to this, explain to a 'thickie' like me, why it's important for no deal to be taken off the table before they'll speak?
Taking aside that some of you do or don't want Brexit, I do get it. I can also see why lots are opposed to no deal. However, assuming that Brexit will still happen in some shape or form, how can it be sensible to announce that no deal isn't an option as it surely weakens any bargaining power if we're to go back to the EU and ask for more to get a deal through. Even if secretly they don't want it, the threat of it being there might surely help achieve a better UK deal, so what am I missing?
Ta
May's very strategy is completely politicised. She is putting conservation of the Tories above everything else, including what she actually wants.
So what is a referendum by definition?
The definition I have is 'a general vote by the electorate on a single political question which has been referred to them for a direct decision'.
So what is a referendum by definition?
The definition I have is 'a general vote by the electorate on a single political question which has been referred to them for a direct decision'.
PV is a second referendum in all but name ! people try to pretend it’s not by calling it that (I refuse to)
That’s rubbish, she was trying to fudge a deal that was acceptable to the EU and also would command a majorly in the commons, knowing labour would vote against she has to try to please her party...do the numbers
Corbyn hasn’t wanted a deal because he wants a GE....that’s politicising ! Even labour are confirming it.
The Blair creature is on because labour now refuse to participate in a debate on the issue of Brexit. My oh my perhaps he should make a comeback
You’ve gone full Dan Hodges.
The Blair creature is on because labour now refuse to participate in a debate on the issue of Brexit. My oh my perhaps he should make a comeback
She invented the red lines and has stuck to them. She's a fucking idiot.That’s rubbish, she was trying to fudge a deal that was acceptable to the EU and also would command a majorly in the commons, knowing labour would vote against she has to try to please her party...do the numbers
Corbyn hasn’t wanted a deal because he wants a GE....that’s politicising ! Even labour are confirming it.
How would it fit in given the timescales involved?
As someone who voted remain, I do have some sympathy for this view.
Imagine I came to buy your second hand car off you and I started negotiations by saying, "OK, just before we start let me just tell you that I'm definitely going to buy your car, I won't be walking away without a deal. Right, what's your best price?" Seems a bit of a weak hand to me.
Mad Gordon is sticking his oar in, too.The Blair creature is on because labour now refuse to participate in a debate on the issue of Brexit. My oh my perhaps he should make a comeback
How can you justify a second referendum and assuming one did go ahead, what would you suggest the question should be?
You must find it somewhat odd that a man whose pretty happy to talk to mass murderers on British soil with no caveats is refusing to talk to the Prime Minister
Rubbish we’d get over itIt’s a solution that would destroy democracy in this country for ever
Cos of the economic impactCan those of you closer to this, explain to a 'thickie' like me, why it's important for no deal to be taken off the table before they'll speak?
Taking aside that some of you do or don't want Brexit, I do get it. I can also see why lots are opposed to no deal. However, assuming that Brexit will still happen in some shape or form, how can it be sensible to announce that no deal isn't an option as it surely weakens any bargaining power if we're to go back to the EU and ask for more to get a deal through. Even if secretly they don't want it, the threat of it being there might surely help achieve a better UK deal, so what am I missing?
Ta
Mad Gordon is sticking his oar in, too.
Were we right to have the first referendum ? Yes or NoHow can you justify a second referendum and assuming one did go ahead, what would you suggest the question should be?
Liverish my mom called it, might add him to my death 2019 listGod - I’ve just put BBC 2 on for politics live and the EU’s biggest supporter the blood stained Blair creature was there. He looks very yellow and strange.
Yep another good summaryIt leaves May‘s deal, GE or second referendum. Or the mystery plan, plan B. May‘s deal is dead. Corbyn wants a GE, or if that fails, his party will probably go for a second referendum. May is snookered if she agrees to take no deal off the table. Corbyn would take a CU. But, that sounds like cake and eat it. Don’t think anyone would like that. Too close to the EU for leavers, pointless from the point of view of remain. May as well be in the EU.
Easiest is to cancel article 50. People would not be happy unless that was done after a second referendum confirming remain. Some would still be unhappy, but many are unhappy with leave.
What a mess.
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