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The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (4 Viewers)

  • Thread starter jimmyhillsfanclub
  • Start date Jun 8, 2016
Forums New posts

As of right now, how are thinking of voting? In or out

  • Remain

    Votes: 23 37.1%
  • Leave

    Votes: 35 56.5%
  • Undecided

    Votes: 3 4.8%
  • Not registered or not intention to vote

    Votes: 1 1.6%

  • Total voters
    62
  • Poll closed Jun 15, 2016.
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skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,581
Grendel said:
Tony should be advising the Civil Service - he clearly is something of an expert on this matter - as well as on the fact Switzerland only export cuckoo clocks
Click to expand...

Not even what I said. A typical response from you when you can’t argue the point so you attack the man. Even if you have to make things up to do it.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,582
Grappa said:
JIT came in over here mid 90s
Click to expand...

Toyota invented it in the 70’s for the purpose of cash flow. Even in its earliest incarnations it doesn’t predate what we now call the EU.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,583
skybluetony176 said:
Toyota invented it in the 70’s for the purpose of cash flow. Even in its earliest incarnations it doesn’t predate what we now call the EU.
Click to expand...

Wiki man

Just-in-time manufacturing - Wikipedia
 
G

Grappa

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,584
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,585
Grendel said:
Wiki man

Just-in-time manufacturing - Wikipedia
Click to expand...

Like I said. I’m involved in purchasing and aside from 10 years of my working life when I worked on building sites I always have been. In manufacturing and wholesaling. Because of that I’ve been on numerous courses for purchasing over the years and by and large they’re all based on Toyota philosophy and even the ones that wasn’t tend to cover JIT at some point. It’s called life experience. No need for Wikipedia although you clearly need it to check what I’m saying. I guess that makes you Wiki man. Wiki man.
 
Reactions: martcov
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,586
SkyblueBazza said:
JIT worked before the EU, it works in non-EU countries. The scheduling has to be changed, may or may not result in additional costs. Hardly a cliff-edge...but hey, I love a good drama

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

No it didn’t. International trade and JIT have grown immensely since the SM and CU came in.
 
G

Grappa

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,587

A 12 year old with a fucking monocle.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,588
SkyblueBazza said:
That's why the scheduling would need to be revisited. It isn't rocket science. They just simply undertake the same process in scheduling as they did in the first place...and no doubt revisit regularly...& make adjustments. Brexit is only one of a vast number of variables involved. That's the idea of JIT!

Stockpiling possibly, not definitely, will be needed in some cases, but only during transition.



Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Or, why bother. Just relocate to somewhere like e.g. Slovakia in the EU.
 
G

Grappa

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,589
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,590
Grappa said:
Click to expand...

Seriously hoping that this one is a joke.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,591
In the end this is a political game.

The anti EU leader of the Labour Party needs to be held to account for his duplicity

May needs to join the game and either propose a Norway solution or a Canada solution to parliament as a measure for now. The notion of Corbyn rejecting in particular the Norway solution (which he would as he’s fundamentally opposed to freedom of movement due to socialist ideology) would look absurd. Then she could call an election and Corbyn would be a busted flush.

It won’t happen but it should.
 

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,592
Grendel said:
In the end this is a political game.

The anti EU leader of the Labour Party needs to be held to account for his duplicity

May needs to join the game and either propose a Norway solution or a Canada solution to parliament as a measure for now. The notion of Corbyn rejecting in particular the Norway solution (which he would as he’s fundamentally opposed to freedom of movement due to socialist ideology) would look absurd. Then she could call an election and Corbyn would be a busted flush.

It won’t happen but it should.
Click to expand...

the EU will only except the Canada option if there is no border in Ireland so not going to happen as it would have to be on the mainland, DUP would never have it.
It doesn't cover services either so I'm not sure how they'd deal with that sector.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,593
clint van damme said:
the EU will only except the Canada option if there is no border in Ireland so not going to happen as it would have to be on the mainland, DUP would never have it.
It doesn't cover services either so I'm not sure how they'd deal with that sector.
Click to expand...

Then the British people can decide if they want to live in the Eu iron curtain or not
 
S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,594
clint van damme said:
Are they happening in the UK?
So tell me, if you add 10 minute processing time to each vehicle what do you think will happen?
Click to expand...
It adds no time to production...like I said, scheduling times have to be adjusted. In complex manufacturing that will take a little time to fathom & sort...but it will settle down within months.

You are merely fretful, and dramatic...& again revelling in what you perceive as a major f**k-up from a Brexit perspective.

However, if it is a bad scenario for our importers...some entrepenuer will seize the opportunity to make a positive outcome from it. Who knows - producing said items within our own shores for example?

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
 
Reactions: Westendlad
S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,595
clint van damme said:
Yahoo is now part of Oath
Click to expand...
What is ypur point? I don't do Yahoo & oath & all that

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
 
S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,596
skybluetony176 said:
Do you schedule based on the assumption that the consignment is going to fly through customs or schedule just in case it gets pulled for a full inspection? Just so you know if it gets pulled that’s an unknown quantity. It’s happened a few times on goods we’ve imported at work and it’s averaged out as an extra 2-3 days at port, although once it was 2 weeks.

So do you ship based on best case scenario or worse? If you do it on worse that means that good are more than likely going to be held somewhere until ready for use. Who covers that cost?

If you ship based on best case scenario and the goods get held up at customs that can stop production. Who covers the cost of that?
Click to expand...

That is what scheduling & lead times are for. Have you ever actually planned anything that requires timelines to be met? Overall the time to bring an item will be longer...that doesn't necessarily make it cost much more...all aspects of timelines will be reviewed...suppliers know any significant price increases leave them vulnerable to competition

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
 
S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,597
Captain Dart said:
Surely you just build in an extra customs delay. Not the end of the world. Same thing in reverse, and what about components sourced from USA/Taiwan/China etc., that is even more tricky.
Click to expand...
Can you try to explain it to Tony? He's struggling. He thinks the end of the world is nigh.

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
 
Reactions: Westendlad
S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,598
clint van damme said:
which means the whole supply chain needs realigning. What benefit is that seen as Brexit was supposed to deliver all sorts of benefits?
And even with factoring in extra time to clear customs we won't be ready by the end of next March.

Shipping chief predicts three years of no-deal Brexit chaos
Click to expand...
Nobody said it was a benefit.

Tony thinks the world will end as a result...people are just trying to explain what you have said. Perhaps he will like your explanation better & give it a 'Like'?

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
 
Reactions: Westendlad
S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,599
skybluetony176 said:
More than the likes of Boris and Rees-Mogg by the looks of it. I work in the manufacturing industry, not on the scale of a car factory but the principals are the same. I’m responsible for purchasing goods and some of them come from outside of the EU and I have to factor in every possibility when ordering. Our production schedule always revolves around what’s on the longest lead time and my purchasing schedule is the same. If you get it wrong or something goes wrong in the supply chain that means one of two things. You have components sitting waiting for everything else or you have production stop. Here’s the thing. The people who supply the components sitting around don’t care if something else is late and you can’t finish production, raise your invoice and collect your money. They’ve supplied the goods as ordered, they’ve raised their invoice and they want paying. That effects your cash flow and there’s a cost to that. Here’s the other thing, production stops and you have people sat twiddling their thumbs. They still want paying also.
Click to expand...
Does that mean we will be hearing from you less for a while?

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
 
Reactions: Westendlad

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,600
skybluetony176 said:
Seriously hoping that this one is a joke.
Click to expand...
It has to be, nobody can have such a lack of self awareness.
 
S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,601
Grappa said:
JIT came in over here mid 90s
Click to expand...
No it didn't. I worked for a company that employed it in the mid '80s. Not that that matters. Japan developed it & they aren't in the EU...you don't have to be in the EU to operate JIT

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
 
S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,602
Grappa said:

A 12 year old with a fucking monocle.
Click to expand...
Lol...and a bad haircut!

Maybe it was for a fancy-dress party? Or maybe his parents had weird dress tastes for their children...you know like some dress their daughters like 25yr-olds out on the town on a Saturday night, others dress their sons like chavs. Each to their own, eh?

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,603
SkyblueBazza said:
It adds no time to production...like I said, scheduling times have to be adjusted. In complex manufacturing that will take a little time to fathom & sort...but it will settle down within months.

You are merely fretful, and dramatic...& again revelling in what you perceive as a major f**k-up from a Brexit perspective.

However, if it is a bad scenario for our importers...some entrepenuer will seize the opportunity to make a positive outcome from it. Who knows - producing said items within our own shores for example?

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Or within the EU for example.....
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,604
SkyblueBazza said:
Lol...and a bad haircut!

Maybe it was for a fancy-dress party? Or maybe his parents had weird dress tastes for their children...you know like some dress their daughters like 25yr-olds out on the town on a Saturday night, others dress their sons like chavs. Each to their own, eh?

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

No. It was for a TV interview I think..
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,605
SkyblueBazza said:
No it didn't. I worked for a company that employed it in the mid '80s. Not that that matters. Japan developed it & they aren't in the EU...you don't have to be in the EU to operate JIT

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Did the Japanese rely on imports from outside of Japan? Did your company rely on foreign imports To be JIT?
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,606
SkyblueBazza said:
That is what scheduling & lead times are for. Have you ever actually planned anything that requires timelines to be met? Overall the time to bring an item will be longer...that doesn't necessarily make it cost much more...all aspects of timelines will be reviewed...suppliers know any significant price increases leave them vulnerable to competition

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

If transport takes longer, who pays the hauliers for the extra journey time?
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,607
Grendel said:
Then the British people can decide if they want to live in the Eu iron curtain or not
Click to expand...

Down to EUSSR now?
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 30, 2018
  • #20,608
SkyblueBazza said:
Does that mean we will be hearing from you less for a while?

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

What about Carnets? For exhibitions and samples?
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 1, 2018
  • #20,609
martcov said:
Did the Japanese rely on imports from outside of Japan? Did your company rely on foreign imports To be JIT?
Click to expand...
Look on the bright side.

Jobs will come back to the UK if the EU continues as they are. The company I work for imports a product from Spain that it used to get from the UK. It is only a small contract for us. Only worth about 20k a week. But to the company we buy from it is massive. Add a 5% tariff and it is the same price we can get it from in the UK. And it will then be from a reliable source without the lead time. Yes times are built in to the difference of ordering to delivery.

Then you have UK businesses that have plants in the EU. Then they bring the finished product back to the UK. Make this difficult and add tariffs and these jobs will come back once the cheap labour becomes more expensive through associated costs.

I am sure that once the EU knows their plan to make us stay in has failed that common sense will prevail. It is you that doubts their common sense.

There is a fine line between punishing us for leaving and having massive job losses throughout the EU to pay for punishing us.
 

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 1, 2018
  • #20,610
SkyblueBazza said:
Nobody said it was a benefit.

Tony thinks the world will end as a result...people are just trying to explain what you have said. Perhaps he will like your explanation better & give it a 'Like'?

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

you can't hide the fact you are burying your head in the sand by making flippant remarks about likes. I certainly don't rule out the possibility that it may not be as bad as I think it will be, (though I can't see any evidence to prove me wrong at the moment).

As bad as I think this whole thing has the potential to be even I wouldn't have predicted 3 years worth of disruption but that is what this fella is predicting. Though I'm sure you subscribe to the Michael Gove 'we've had enough of experts' train of thought.

Shipping chief predicts three years of no-deal Brexit chaos

And we're talking here about customs, look at how unprepared we are in general:

The UK still isn’t ready for a no deal Brexit
 
Reactions: Sick Boy
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 1, 2018
  • #20,611
Astute said:
Look on the bright side.

Jobs will come back to the UK if the EU continues as they are. The company I work for imports a product from Spain that it used to get from the UK. It is only a small contract for us. Only worth about 20k a week. But to the company we buy from it is massive. Add a 5% tariff and it is the same price we can get it from in the UK. And it will then be from a reliable source without the lead time. Yes times are built in to the difference of ordering to delivery.

Then you have UK businesses that have plants in the EU. Then they bring the finished product back to the UK. Make this difficult and add tariffs and these jobs will come back once the cheap labour becomes more expensive through associated costs.

I am sure that once the EU knows their plan to make us stay in has failed that common sense will prevail. It is you that doubts their common sense.

There is a fine line between punishing us for leaving and having massive job losses throughout the EU to pay for punishing us.
Click to expand...

We have full employment in the UK. If in your scenario we will create even more jobs, who is going to fill the vacancies? You claim we have no houses and our roads are full and falling apart, who is going to build houses and repair our infrastructure? Without free movement of people, which you say „is just wrong“, we will have a crisis of not enough labour. Plus we will need to invest in more staff, civil servants, to replicate EU bureaucracy and to control our borders. Whatever happens we are creating costs and extra bureaucracy. Not in the spirit of the wider JIT philosophy.
 
Reactions: Sick Boy
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 1, 2018
  • #20,612
Astute said:
Add a 5% tariff and it is the same price we can get it from in the UK. And it will then be from a reliable source without the lead time. Yes times are built in to the difference of ordering to delivery.
Click to expand...

So, are you suggesting that Brexit will increase the costs of production by 5%? Decreased competition of suppliers, increased freight costs because of lost time on journeys through customs checks, tariffs, more bureaucracy, labour shortages and maybe lack of UK alternative suppliers at least in the short term .... are these benefits of Brexit that we can look forward to?

Why do you think Thatcher pushed the single market and CU? Do you think that it had no effect on the overall efficiency of UK manufacturing? We just wanted it for fun? Business is just being petty about constantly mentioning the effects of a no deal in the short term? That because some firms will take a hit in the EU, it is all worthwhile?

Bazza says it will be no Problem because it worked in a company where he worked in the 80s. Just increase the journey time and factor that in. Easy peasy. Pity he is not in charge of a major manufacturer. There would be no worries.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Oct 1, 2018
  • #20,613
martcov said:
Down to EUSSR now?
Click to expand...

Jeremy Hunt has made the comparison now as well and said that a bad Brexit deal will stir the British people's 'Dunkirk spirit'.

It's all just jingoistic nonsense.
 
Reactions: clint van damme
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 1, 2018
  • #20,614
Sick Boy said:
Jeremy Hunt has made the comparison now as well and said that a bad Brexit deal will stir the British people's 'Dunkirk spirit'.

It's all just jingoistic nonsense.
Click to expand...

No. Another Brexit benefit. The country uniting together in adversity. Plucky Brits fighting back, by retreating.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 1, 2018
  • #20,615
SkyblueBazza said:
It adds no time to production...like I said, scheduling times have to be adjusted. In complex manufacturing that will take a little time to fathom & sort...but it will settle down within months.

You are merely fretful, and dramatic...& again revelling in what you perceive as a major f**k-up from a Brexit perspective.

However, if it is a bad scenario for our importers...some entrepenuer will seize the opportunity to make a positive outcome from it. Who knows - producing said items within our own shores for example?

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

It adds time to production if it’s stuck at port.

Presumably some EU entrepreneurs will also seize the moment and start manufacturing some of the stuff we export to the EU for JIT manufacturing. The door swings both ways.
 
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