Astute
Well-Known Member
And we are not staying in a crooked institution that costs us billions a year to be a part of just to be told what we can and can't do.
And we are not staying in a crooked institution that costs us billions a year to be a part of just to be told what we can and can't do.That is not true. They are not changing the rules of 27 countries because one arrogant PM tells them to.
So we voted to stay in the EU all them years ago. But now you change it a bit.....
So we never voted to join or stay in the EU then.Our elected government sighed the Maastricht Treaty in 1992 and the EEC became the EU. Greenland left in 85. Greenland joined in 1973 as part of Denmark, in 79 Denmark issued Greenland the right to self govern and after that they left the EEC as a Danish self governed territory. They never had to trigger article 50 and still aren’t recognised as a sovereign country to this day. They’re going through the process of gaining a seat on the UN at which point they will become a country in its own right, can apply to the IOC, UAFA and FIFA as a country. How many ways one person can be wrong and still try to kid people they’re the one who’s wrong is flabbergasting. No surprise you’re buying it though.
No mate, I am watching your deflections and frustration as you see your beloved Brexit descending into a heap of crap. 27 heads of state representing 440 million people just sent out ridiculous PM packing. Priceless.
Every one who voted for the vaguely termed „leave“, should hang their head in shame. Our country looks like a fool. We said we were leaving, but as of yet, we haven’t got a workable exit strategy. You all should have questioned the liars more. Asked what leave actually meant. Now you are told by BoJo that it meant having faith ( WTF? ), and Mogg says it means having „hope“ and that it will be fine long after many of us on here are dead.
All you come out with is Juncker, Selmayr, blue passports and fish, and the hope that the EU needs us more than we need them. Pathetic.
Why aren’t people, leavers, on here asking the liars to explain why negotiations are going so badly and humiliatingly? No. You try and deflect and mock the people who predicted this disaster, or point out that you have been lied to. Anything, but blame the culprits.
Get rid of May and you might well get him. But that doesn't stop you from saying that May needs to go.Bojo is the real liar. His column the week following the referendum he described his vision of Brexit and it was a lot nearer to EEA membership than the chequers proposal yet now he’s saying that the chequers deal doesn’t go far enough. He’s a pure populist who will say anything in an attempt to gain popularity regardless of how much he contradicts himself. It will be a sad day if he ever becomes PM. I’d take Gove or Rees-Mogg as PM any day of the week over Boris. In the same sense I’d rather take George W over Trump as an American President. Not much of choice.
So we never voted to join or stay in the EU then.
Why didn't you agree to that last time the debate cane up?
Get rid of May and you might well get him. But that doesn't stop you from saying that May needs to go.
So we has changed to you. Your guard has dropped.
Yes we are leaving the SM. It is the only way of getting our independence back. Let your country GERMANY take the piss.
Greenland would have had trouble triggering article 50 as it did not exist until the wonderful Lisbon treaty
There is at least an acknowledgement here from Tony and Martcov that the eec and the Eu are very very different animals so any suggestion the previous referendum has any significance is an absurdity despite their mutual claim to the contrary
And we are not staying in a crooked institution that costs us billions a year to be a part of just to be told what we can and can't do.
Not at all.
Did we ever choose to join or stay in the EU?
Did Greenland leave the EEC And not EU?
How do you expect anyone to be effective when you are getting battered from all sides?That’s because May does need to go. She’s the most ineffective inept PM in my lifetime. Doesn’t mean Boris will be any better. If nothing else it could quite entertaining seeing him inevitably falling on his sword but for the good of the country I’d rather not have that luxury. Gove or Rees-Mogg would make many times a better PM than Boris in my opinion but they’d still be on a hiding to nowhere with Brexit to oversee.
Now you are taking the piss.What have they told you to do, or the country to do which has a negative effect on you?
Or we can have the truth.How often do we have a vote to stay in the United Kingdom? Were you ever asked? You don’t keep getting votes as an organisation progresses. You could vote out the government if you didn’t like it. But nobody was that angry to do that at the time of Lisbon. The anger only came big time after the liars started using social media.
Or we can have the truth.
Over the years rules and regulations are brought in. Our voice constantly gets diluted. The system is crooked. And now we have the internet people know how bad it is. All we had before was newspapers telling us how good it is. Now we know differently. Especially since the Brexit vote. Now many who voted remain know they were wrong about the EU. They just want it all over.
But of course you will twist the numbers.
Or we can have the truth.
Over the years rules and regulations are brought in. Our voice constantly gets diluted. The system is crooked. And now we have the internet people know how bad it is. All we had before was newspapers telling us how good it is. Now we know differently. Especially since the Brexit vote. Now many who voted remain know they were wrong about the EU. They just want it all over.
But of course you will twist the numbers.
Now you are taking the piss.
How do you expect anyone to be effective when you are getting battered from all sides?
We are leaving. The EU will do anything but let us leave as much as they can. Those who want to remain constantly have a go at May. But if it was down to her personal choice we would remain. Then you would love her. Those who want to exit the EU don't trust her as she was a remainer.
So whatever she says or does will be wrong.
If BJ got made PM he would be rated much higher. Over half of the UK would have someone who would try his best to give what they want.
Rees Mogg would be my choice. When I have seen him on TV he has explained everything clearly. Speaks better than his accent or name suggests.
What now? We are leaving the single market and creating problems for ourselves. Germany is getting on with it’s own problems. My country? My country is making a fool of itself and I had to be prudent, like Grendel with his portfolio, and take out German citizenship to remain in the EU. Picked my ID card yesterday. Fits in my wallet like a credit card and I have an online pin that goes with it for internet identification. Can’t understand why Britain doesn’t introduce ID cards with all the knife attacks and terrorism at the moment. It would help identifying people.
BoJo is a known liar. Even sacked twice for lying. He won’t be rated higher than May. Mogg is a sneaky posh liar who you like to listen to. Just because you like listening to his bullshit doesn’t make it any more valuable than Boris‘ or Farage‘s crap. He said the UK will be booming after I am dead. I’ll never know whether he is right. The economy was growing whist in the EU. That we know as a fact. Wealth distribution and austerity were the problems, having a hedge fund part owner at the helm won’t change that.
Most far right and left countries who despise individual identity have ID cards. No sensible democracy supports it and no civil libertarians ever would
All rated higher than the French president whose words you highly value
You changed a fact? Oh that's okay then.I changed 1 fact not facts. Sounds like you were in the same maths class as Grendull. I also said it very much tongue in cheek. Sorry that was beyond you.
It could mean everything to them. It’s still only a percentage of a percentage of a percentage so on and so on and it means jack to the other 26 members who have their own interests and a veto. Germany’s car industry runs the EU even less than some bloke I never heard of appointed by Junker.
In this case I value then because he publicly called out the Brexit culprits. It could have been worse.. he could have called us a nation of shopkeepers.
What now? We are leaving the single market and creating problems for ourselves.
And that is the worry.The EU is more democratic now than it was, not less. There are ideas to make the parliament more powerful or do away with some veto rights and make more things majority voting and to maybe merge the commission with the council to make it more efficient. The evolution hasn’t stopped and will probably move faster now that the UK isn’t there.
I back up everything from creditable sources. Then you and others use sources that you used to have a go at others for using.No we don’t. The internet is riddled with liars such as Breitbart and CA and fake news stories. Just look at some of the right wing crap on twitter. You don’t know much if you rely on the wrong sources on the internet.
One thing what?So. You can’t name one thing.
And that is the worry.
Democratic? Ask the vast majority who were pissed off with the way Selmayr got his position. Even the EU commission enquiry said it broke rules and regulations. But he kept his position.
There is good and bad about the direction it is going in. But many in the EU are uneasy about the way those at the top can have such disregard for rules and regulations with nothing happening about it.
I back up everything from creditable sources. Then you and others use sources that you used to have a go at others for using.
TBF you have started being more selective. If you always read past the first paragraph of your links, you will get nearer the truth. Mogg is not a credible source. He speaks slowly and can be witty. That gives an air of seriousness, but he still believes in a wizard in the sky, backs the extreme economist and climate denier favouring scrapping all border controls for trade ( hugely risky for our existing economy), is for more ex commonwealth immigration ( after a short term immigration immigration pause - I would stick with freedom of movement because it is reciprocal and more flexible due to geography ) and is anti abortion ( which is regressive and not based on a reasoned justification).
Not nearly as many problems as it's making for the EU, which is why they oppose it so strongly
Rees Moggs stance on abortion is based on his religious beliefs which he seems to use selectively when it suits cherry picking the bits that fit his agenda.
Rees Mogg is a hedge fund part owner. His hedge fund invests mainly in emerging markets, and now, to a much lesser extent, the EU via Dublin. Not in Brexit Britain. Emerging markets will profit from a splitting of the trade bloc EU starting with Britain. I think he is a successful hedge fund boss, but whether that helps the leavers who have been whipped up to hate the EU, is another question. I can see him doing a SISU Joy if he gets to be PM, by saying he „empathises“ with the poorer leavers. Apart from them being able, maybe, to buy cheaper Australian wine and tell their kids that the UK wil be booming in 2068, they will not be better off and may have lost their livelihoods.
Yet when someone calls out anyone who is in the position to direct the EU in any way you defend them.In this case I value then because he publicly called out the Brexit culprits. It could have been worse.. he could have called us a nation of shopkeepers.
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