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The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (29 Viewers)

  • Thread starter jimmyhillsfanclub
  • Start date Jun 8, 2016
Forums New posts

As of right now, how are thinking of voting? In or out

  • Remain

    Votes: 23 37.1%
  • Leave

    Votes: 35 56.5%
  • Undecided

    Votes: 3 4.8%
  • Not registered or not intention to vote

    Votes: 1 1.6%

  • Total voters
    62
  • Poll closed Jun 15, 2016.
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SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 11, 2018
  • #19,076
skybluetony176 said:
I’ve already told you the domestic policies. Try reading what I’ve already posted. There isn’t an open border between Turkey and Greece or Libya and Italy so yes they would have ended up in EU countries regardless of the open borders given that they entered the EU through closed borders. Am I really having to explain this to you?

You’re making out that I’m making out that the U.K. hasn’t taken any of them. I actually think David Cameron had it right in that he wanted to go to the camps to take the most needy and vulnerable. As I’ve already said, if you wanted to talk truth you could blame Merkel for the refugee crisis given her very public invitation for them to come to Germany. Germany’s unemployment rate is actually very similar to ours ( captain confirmed this morning with his link) 3.8% compared to Germany’s 3.5%. Swedens unemployment rate is almost 6% so not sure your argument stands up based on the facts (I know you like facts). Germany benefits from the Euro? Sounds like you’re advocating remaining and joining the Euro to boot.
Click to expand...
Even the UK has no real open border. All ypu need is a worthy vessel to float across the channel from 1 pretty obscure point to another. It isn't difficult to walk through from one country to another via fields/forests is it?

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 11, 2018
  • #19,077
SkyblueBazza said:
In fairness...they sort of invited them by saying they would be welcome.

Even the AFD are only saying words to the effect that now Germany has accepted them...the rest of the EU has to take a share of them. Given the lax enforcement of secondary movement - I don't know why they feel the need to bother though tbh

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

There has to be sharing of the burden. They were allowed in because of the Geneva convention. The European ruling on that was the Dublin arrangement which obviously never envisaged what happened in 2015. we need a European Solution to master the problem and future migration from Africa to the Mediterranean countries. We don’t have one which is a major problem.
 
S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 11, 2018
  • #19,078
SIR ERNIE said:
Ah ok, I understand now. There are no open borders, you can’t just walk in.

Unless that is, some mad woman invites a million into Germany, in which case Stavros at the border gate in Kos does a runner when he sees thousands of Syrians, Pakistanis, Afghans and Iraqis pouring off the ferry.

Only when that happens are the borders open and you can walk in.
Click to expand...
No...I have to disagree. If you are sufficiently motivated you can walk anywhere virtually undetected

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 11, 2018
  • #19,079
SkyblueBazza said:
And Germany guides & influences the EU in line with it's own domestic policies. Keep feeding the 'Fatherland'???

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Germany wants a unified EU policy. It’s not fair that the Mediterranean countries are left with the problem of refugees. Germany is working with others on that including France and Italy.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 11, 2018
  • #19,080
SkyblueBazza said:
No...I have to disagree. If you are sufficiently motivated you can walk anywhere virtually undetected

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Try walking to the UK.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 11, 2018
  • #19,081
skybluetony176 said:
Because they’ve applied. Tends to be how these things work.
Click to expand...
Ah. So Merkel got involved with the name change for Macedonia because they won't be able to join the EU?

Albania are changing their laws as they won't be able to join the EU?

Yeah OK. There was me thinking that it was going to make the EU bigger and devalue the Euro more for Germany
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 11, 2018
  • #19,082
Astute said:
Ah. So Merkel got involved with the name change for Macedonia because they won't be able to join the EU?

Albania are changing their laws as they won't be able to join the EU?

Yeah OK. There was me thinking that it was going to make the EU bigger and devalue the Euro more for Germany
Click to expand...

The name problem was agreed on a while ago as far as I remember.

Do you seriously think that the only reason the EU will accept Macedonia is to devalue the Euro for Germany? Why haven’t they accepted Romania to the Euro then?
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 11, 2018
  • #19,083
Astute said:
Ah. So Merkel got involved with the name change for Macedonia because they won't be able to join the EU?

Albania are changing their laws as they won't be able to join the EU?

Yeah OK. There was me thinking that it was going to make the EU bigger and devalue the Euro more for Germany
Click to expand...

You don’t half waffle some shit.
 
Reactions: martcov

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 11, 2018
  • #19,084
martcov said:
The EU has nothing to with the atrocities committed by ISIS. Germany doesn’t have more terrorism than the UK or France. Despite over a million refugees. Why do you think that is?
Click to expand...
If they think they will get to stay they keep to the law to not get kicked out. But otherwise they do not.

Violent crime rises in Germany and is attributed to refugees
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 11, 2018
  • #19,085
martcov said:
There has to be sharing of the burden. They were allowed in because of the Geneva convention. The European ruling on that was the Dublin arrangement which obviously never envisaged what happened in 2015. we need a European Solution to master the problem and future migration from Africa to the Mediterranean countries. We don’t have one which is a major problem.
Click to expand...
So why is Germany bringing in holding areas with the EU to keep Merkel in as running the country?
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 11, 2018
  • #19,086
skybluetony176 said:
You don’t half waffle some shit.
Click to expand...
You don't half dodge questions and then make out that you have answered them.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 11, 2018
  • #19,087
martcov said:
The name problem was agreed on a while ago as far as I remember.

Do you seriously think that the only reason the EU will accept Macedonia is to devalue the Euro for Germany? Why haven’t they accepted Romania to the Euro then?
Click to expand...
Romania's ruling party congress votes to join euro in 2024
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 11, 2018
  • #19,088
Astute said:
You don't half dodge questions and then make out that you have answered them.
Click to expand...

Whatever. You’re still waffling a load of shit.
 
Reactions: martcov

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Sep 11, 2018
  • #19,089
Astute said:
You don't half dodge questions and then make out that you have answered them.
Click to expand...

Most people on this thread have probably done it multiple times.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 11, 2018
  • #19,090
Sick Boy said:
Most people on this thread have probably done it multiple times.
Click to expand...
And calling others for coming out with shit to try and cover for what they have said?
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,091
Astute said:
And calling others for coming out with shit to try and cover for what they have said?
Click to expand...

You've done it yourself, so no need to get all high and mighty about it.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,092
Astute said:
Romania's ruling party congress votes to join euro in 2024
Click to expand...

In 2024. that is from when they joined. It took years to get them to that point. If your theory were correct that they didn’t care and just want weaker currencies, they would have joined years ago. You proved my points.
 
Reactions: Sick Boy
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,093
Astute said:
So why is Germany bringing in holding areas with the EU to keep Merkel in as running the country?
Click to expand...

Germany has watered the proposal to virtually nothing. Very few cases and no new buildings. Because of the rules of the Geneva convention.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,094
Astute said:
If they think they will get to stay they keep to the law to not get kicked out. But otherwise they do not.

Violent crime rises in Germany and is attributed to refugees
Click to expand...

If you bothered to read the report, it said that it is not Syrians fleeing a war that are the problem, but the Nafris ( mainly Maroccans and Tunisians ) who won’t get asylum granted. I have constantly said that the Nafris are a problem. They came without papers and their home countries are not cooperative about issuing new documents, or it is hard to establish their true identities. They are not fleeing a war, but are chancers.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,095
Astute said:
And calling others for coming out with shit to try and cover for what they have said?
Click to expand...

You spent most of yesterday either telling me I’d said something I hadn’t, telling me I hadn’t said something I had and then returning to type of replying what about Junker and his irrelevant croanie who’s name I can’t even remember. You keep saying that Macedonia is next without any context to what that means when in fact next won’t happen until 2025 at the earliest so has no bearing on our future whatsoever so is just more irrelevant waffle, you then start going on about Albania who are even less likely to be next and even more irrelevant. Just all irrelevant shit and you’re waffling while doing it bouncing around like an out of control pinball
 
Reactions: martcov
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,096
Astute said:
So why is Germany bringing in holding areas with the EU to keep Merkel in as running the country?
Click to expand...

Seehofer was the one pushing for holding areas. He is CSU and a twat.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,097
skybluetony176 said:
You spent most of yesterday either telling me I’d said something I hadn’t, telling me I hadn’t said something I had and then returning to type of replying what about Junker and his irrelevant croanie who’s name I can’t even remember. You keep saying that Macedonia is next without any context to what that means when in fact next won’t happen until 2025 at the earliest so has no bearing on our future whatsoever so is just more irrelevant waffle, you then start going on about Albania who are even less likely to be next and even more irrelevant. Just all irrelevant shit and you’re waffling while doing it bouncing around like an out of control pinball
Click to expand...

Basically Brexit is dead. Leaving the EU would be a disaster. The leavers have blown it. Rees Mogg is now in fantasy land and the whole leave group is reduced to rowing in circles without a rudder. Expect more about EU internal scandals, German immigration policies and crimes committed by coloured people. Mogg is now adding project hope to project faith started by BoJo. Next is project charity for all the people losing out by the uncertainty caused by this unthoughtout idea of trying to be an important world power again telling other countries what to do if they want to trade with us. We are becoming laughing stock as virtually every day a new problem comes to light.

People on here rejoicing when Neonazis have some success, hoping to fxxk that somehow the EU will collapse and they will by proved to have been right to vote leave. They would take the collapse of Europe and a follow up of National Socialism into account... just for the pleasure of saying I told you so.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,098
Sick Boy said:
You've done it yourself, so no need to get all high and mighty about it.
Click to expand...
I give a reason for each statement that I make. I then have you, Tony and Mart trying to make out that it isn't true. Then when it can't be defended you all go quiet for a couple of days and then come back with the same old crap.

Read back. You will see it is true.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,099
martcov said:
In 2024. that is from when they joined. It took years to get them to that point. If your theory were correct that they didn’t care and just want weaker currencies, they would have joined years ago. You proved my points.
Click to expand...
Proved what points?

They have 7 targets to reach. None of them are to do with how weak their own currency or economy is doing.

When they join the Euro how many economies will be weaker?
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,100
martcov said:
Germany has watered the proposal to virtually nothing. Very few cases and no new buildings. Because of the rules of the Geneva convention.
Click to expand...
It was pointed out to them that it would be a breach of human rights if they did what they wanted. I remember pointing it out to you. So they didn't do it through choice. But there still isn't a plan B. So it is still all that is on the table. So nothing has changed.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,101
martcov said:
If you bothered to read the report, it said that it is not Syrians fleeing a war that are the problem, but the Nafris ( mainly Maroccans and Tunisians ) who won’t get asylum granted. I have constantly said that the Nafris are a problem. They came without papers and their home countries are not cooperative about issuing new documents, or it is hard to establish their true identities. They are not fleeing a war, but are chancers.
Click to expand...
So you ignored what I said as usual. Those with the chance to stay keep their noses clean. Those without much of a chance cause chaos. And they commit the atrocities that you say doesn't happen. Then you compare Germany to the UK.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,102
martcov said:
Seehofer was the one pushing for holding areas. He is CSU and a twat.
Click to expand...
Merkel not involved?

Terms of Service Violation
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,103
martcov said:
Basically Brexit is dead. Leaving the EU would be a disaster. The leavers have blown it. Rees Mogg is now in fantasy land and the whole leave group is reduced to rowing in circles without a rudder. Expect more about EU internal scandals, German immigration policies and crimes committed by coloured people. Mogg is now adding project hope to project faith started by BoJo. Next is project charity for all the people losing out by the uncertainty caused by this unthoughtout idea of trying to be an important world power again telling other countries what to do if they want to trade with us. We are becoming laughing stock as virtually every day a new problem comes to light.

People on here rejoicing when Neonazis have some success, hoping to fxxk that somehow the EU will collapse and they will by proved to have been right to vote leave. They would take the collapse of Europe and a follow up of National Socialism into account... just for the pleasure of saying I told you so.
Click to expand...
So you say.

But you would do.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,104
Astute said:
I give a reason for each statement that I make. I then have you, Tony and Mart trying to make out that it isn't true. Then when it can't be defended you all go quiet for a couple of days and then come back with the same old crap.

Read back. You will see it is true.
Click to expand...

A bit like when you blamed the EU for Italy's issues with money lost through organised crime? Yeah right.
 
Reactions: martcov
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,105
Astute said:
Proved what points?

They have 7 targets to reach. None of them are to do with how weak their own currency or economy is doing.

When they join the Euro how many economies will be weaker?
Click to expand...

They have to meet criteria.

When they have met them they can join. They were supposed to join in 2015, but didn’t meet the criteria.

Why should economies automatically become weaker? Romania is not exactly a major player. When people do deals in Romania they often talk in Euros. That was so in 2010, last time I was there, when my mate was extending his hotel. His costs were in Euros as the materials, such as shower units, were imported. The prostitutes were talking euros long before any official policy. I don’t think there will be any major changes. It will save costs for business though as exchange rates and forward buying and selling to cover import and export trades will fall away.

I don’t see why the current economy should be a criterium as it will probably be different in 2024.

More anti EU waffle. Now, back to the UK.... how’s Brexit playing out? And what known benefits can we look forward to?
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,106
Astute said:
It was pointed out to them that it would be a breach of human rights if they did what they wanted. I remember pointing it out to you. So they didn't do it through choice. But there still isn't a plan B. So it is still all that is on the table. So nothing has changed.
Click to expand...

It was Seehofer‘s idea. Merkel was against and so was the SPD. It got watered down as I said.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,107
Astute said:
Merkel not involved?

Terms of Service Violation
Click to expand...

Merkel wanted to send them back to where they first registered, if they were already registered. That is only a small percentage of migrants. She has signed several countries up to that. Seehofer wanted the holding camps. The SPD put paid to that. No new buildings were built and the time of holding people before sending them back was reduced to a few days.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,108
Astute said:
So you ignored what I said as usual. Those with the chance to stay keep their noses clean. Those without much of a chance cause chaos. And they commit the atrocities that you say doesn't happen. Then you compare Germany to the UK.
Click to expand...

What atrocities? Violent crimes, yes, but atrocities no. And not that many violent crimes. A 10% increase in total. Not necessarily just migrants.

The latest crime in the headlines will probably be manslaughter because the guy died of a heart attack caused by having a heart disease ( and the stress of the fight ). Hardly premeditated murder or an atrocity.

The last atrocity was December 2016y
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,109
Astute said:
So you say.

But you would do.
Click to expand...

Still waiting for tangible benefits. We are now being told not to be too optimistic by Liam Fox. I thought it was all going to be easy peasy according to Fox. Apparently not.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 12, 2018
  • #19,110
Astute said:
So you ignored what I said as usual. Those with the chance to stay keep their noses clean. Those without much of a chance cause chaos. And they commit the atrocities that you say doesn't happen. Then you compare Germany to the UK.
Click to expand...

If I wanted to compare Germany to the UK, I would simply take knife crime and murder rate in London and compare it with Berlin. Game over. But what has that got to do with leaving the EU? Do you expect terror atrocities in the UK to stop, or knife crime, acid sttacks and Moped robbery in London to drop as a benefit of Brexit? I don’t get your logic. I think you have poor arguments and so just attack Juncker, Selmayr and Germany in general instead of putting forward coherent arguments for leaving the EU and telling us what benefits we can expect in Brexit Britain.
 
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