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The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (9 Viewers)

  • Thread starter jimmyhillsfanclub
  • Start date Jun 8, 2016
Forums New posts

As of right now, how are thinking of voting? In or out

  • Remain

    Votes: 23 37.1%
  • Leave

    Votes: 35 56.5%
  • Undecided

    Votes: 3 4.8%
  • Not registered or not intention to vote

    Votes: 1 1.6%

  • Total voters
    62
  • Poll closed Jun 15, 2016.
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M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #17,991
Grendel said:
You love forcing people to answer questions so answer this please. How long will these payments be due, what is the net payment and will it be more or less than the contribution we pay in an average year.
Click to expand...

There are various calculations. The last I saw was 39 bn. But some things are liabilities on guarantees on loans which may be called on in future years. We pay our contribution to the EU budget until the end of the 7 year period in 2020. 39bn is a net payment assuming we get so much back for our share of EU property. Some say we will paying something for 50 years. But, I doubt that as there will be some final deal at the end of current negotiations, but, I only know as much as anyone else.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #17,992
fernandopartridge said:
The EU is not forcing the UK into a no deal position. It made clear its position a long time ago. The disaster capitalists of this world like that horrible c**t Rees Mogg are pushing this, they'll clean up from short selling shares and currency.
Click to expand...

As Farage‘s mates did when he said that leave had lost on the evening of the referendum, although he knew from private polling commissioned by those mates that leave had won. They made quick forward transactions whilst the rest of the world thought remain had won. Cashed in millions when the pound fell.
 
Reactions: Sick Boy

torchomatic

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #17,993
Grendel said:
Time will tell
Click to expand...

Time will tell? But I thought it was all going to be a brilliant new era full of prosperity for the NHS and the rest of us. I expect the sun to be shining and eveything perfect on the 30th March 2019.
 
Reactions: Deleted member 5849, Sick Boy and martcov

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #17,994
torchomatic said:
Time will tell? But I thought it was all going to be a brilliant new era full of prosperity for the NHS and the rest of us. I expect the sun to be shining and eveything perfect on the 30th March 2019.
Click to expand...

So do I
 

torchomatic

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #17,995
Grendel said:
So do I
Click to expand...

All we need now is a law to be passed so the divorce bill is paid by everyone who voted for Brexit. Don't see why I should pay for your madness.
 
Reactions: martcov

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 30, 2018
  • #17,996
torchomatic said:
All we need now is a law to be passed so the divorce bill is paid by everyone who voted for Brexit. Don't see why I should pay for your madness.
Click to expand...

Er you do realise we will be paying less every year we leave and that the bill saves us billions a year?
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #17,997
martcov said:
There are various calculations. The last I saw was 39 bn. But some things are liabilities on guarantees on loans which may be called on in future years. We pay our contribution to the EU budget until the end of the 7 year period in 2020. 39bn is a net payment assuming we get so much back for our share of EU property. Some say we will paying something for 50 years. But, I doubt that as there will be some final deal at the end of current negotiations, but, I only know as much as anyone else.
Click to expand...
But are due to leave in 2019.

You don't seem to know a lot on the subject.

They refused to even consider letting us have any money back from the money we put into the buildings of the EU. They said they don't belong to us.

The money we will get back is the money we have provided for loans. This is only if the money is repaid though.

We only have to pay the 39b if there is a deal. This includes an agreement in Ireland. And no there is nothing to make us pay if there is no deal.

If you think there is how about showing evidence for once.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #17,998
fernandopartridge said:
The EU is not forcing the UK into a no deal position. It made clear its position a long time ago. The disaster capitalists of this world like that horrible c**t Rees Mogg are pushing this, they'll clean up from short selling shares and currency.
Click to expand...
The EU is not forcing us into a no deal situation as long as we don't pull out fully from the EU.

So in other words we would be half in half out and still have to pay billions in each year. They still want open borders which in their words is freedom of movement.

So in other words just like it is now but we would lose the small say that we have presently.

So in other words if we are to leave the EU like was voted for we are being pushed towards a no deal.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #17,999
Astute said:
The EU is not forcing us into a no deal situation as long as we don't pull out fully from the EU.

So in other words we would be half in half out and still have to pay billions in each year. They still want open borders which in their words is freedom of movement.

So in other words just like it is now but we would lose the small say that we have presently.

So in other words if we are to leave the EU like was voted for we are being pushed towards a no deal.
Click to expand...

How does an open border involve showing a passport to enter the country?

How is Britain's say any smaller than the other countries?

Your post shows the madness of trying to claim you are anything but for Leaving. No doubt if it's shown to have been a majorly bad decision in the long term you'll be back on here going on about how you were all for remain.

It's up to the UK to come with a workable solution, which it's failed to do so far due to incompetence.
 
Reactions: martcov and torchomatic
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,000
Astute said:
But are due to leave in 2019.

You don't seem to know a lot on the subject.

They refused to even consider letting us have any money back from the money we put into the buildings of the EU. They said they don't belong to us.

The money we will get back is the money we have provided for loans. This is only if the money is repaid though.

We only have to pay the 39b if there is a deal. This includes an agreement in Ireland. And no there is nothing to make us pay if there is no deal.

If you think there is how about showing evidence for once.
Click to expand...

The budget goes to 2020. whether we leave or not.

We are liable under international law for the things we signed up for. I posted a link from the FT explaining that. E.g. when we signed guarantees, there was no get out clause as no one knew we were leaving.

The figure is a net figure. That means it includes money we get back.

I said liabilities which may be called upon. That means if loans are not repaid which we have guaranteed.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,001
Astute said:
The EU is not forcing us into a no deal situation as long as we don't pull out fully from the EU.

So in other words we would be half in half out and still have to pay billions in each year. They still want open borders which in their words is freedom of movement.

So in other words just like it is now but we would lose the small say that we have presently.

So in other words if we are to leave the EU like was voted for we are being pushed towards a no deal.
Click to expand...

We want the benefits of membership without paying or complying with the rules. In other words it is our aim to be half in ( benefits) and half out ( we’re not paying).

We have over 70 MEPs and have people in important positions on committees, we are members of the EU Council and the EU commission. Saying that we have little influence is a Faragism.

Open Borders is a Faragism and is not FOM of EU citizens.
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,002
Astute said:
The EU is not forcing us into a no deal situation as long as we don't pull out fully from the EU.

So in other words we would be half in half out and still have to pay billions in each year. They still want open borders which in their words is freedom of movement.

So in other words just like it is now but we would lose the small say that we have presently.

So in other words if we are to leave the EU like was voted for we are being pushed towards a no deal.
Click to expand...
Nonsense.
 
Reactions: Sick Boy, torchomatic and martcov

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,003
Grendel said:
Er you do realise we will be paying less every year we leave and that the bill saves us billions a year?
Click to expand...

Define “paying less”? You’re talking specifically about the amount of money we send to the EU aren’t you? What if it costs us in different ways? There’s more than one way that Brexit can cost us.
 
Reactions: lifeskyblue
S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,004
martcov said:
In other words you couldn’t answer the question and explain the difference and decided to insult me. Even got a like from your mentor.
Click to expand...
You asked a straight question...clever clogs

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
 
S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,005
Sick Boy said:
I will remain am EU citizen whatever, I'm not the one losing my rights.
Click to expand...
So what are you moaning about?

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
 
S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,006
torchomatic said:
Time will tell? But I thought it was all going to be a brilliant new era full of prosperity for the NHS and the rest of us. I expect the sun to be shining and eveything perfect on the 30th March 2019.
Click to expand...
Well you expect far too much. It just shows how gullible you must be

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
 

torchomatic

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,007
SkyblueBazza said:
Well you expect far too much. It just shows how gullible you must be

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

I'm only repeating what you lot have said about Brexit.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,008
fernandopartridge said:
Nonsense.
Click to expand...
Why is it nonsense?

They have agreed in principle that if a deal has been made in principle that although if we leave nothing will change until the end of 2020 as there will be a transitional period. All good so far.

But what has the EU said that they would be happy with so far?

Terms of Service Violation

What the EU really wants from the UK

Then you have this from the EU. Something simple like residential rights even have points added that shouldn't be there. Look at the last one. After leaving the EU if an EU resident loses their job after working in the UK for 10 years they would be entitled to our benefits wherever they live. So say someone came here at 18 and stayed until they are 28 we would have to pay benefits for the rest of their life if they don't work.

The EU's position on the rights of EU citizens in the UK after Brexit - United Kingdom - European Commission

Yes they should be able to live where they want under present rules. But even something that should be simple to sort out has points added that shouldn't be there. Poi ts that could be a deal breaker.

Then we move on to what is allowed. They will decide what happens and will happen. And they can change anything they want without warning.

Brexit: EU to have power to punish UK at will during transition
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,009
torchomatic said:
I'm only repeating what you lot have said about Brexit.
Click to expand...

Don’t think I’ve ever said that
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,010
skybluetony176 said:
Define “paying less”? You’re talking specifically about the amount of money we send to the EU aren’t you? What if it costs us in different ways? There’s more than one way that Brexit can cost us.
Click to expand...
You say about cherry picking not being allowed.

But it is OK for the EU to cherry pick. Look at the fisheries policy changes. They don't want anything to change. They still want to fish in our waters and restrict what we catch. They catch the most fish in our waters. So that should stay as it is.
 

torchomatic

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,011
Grendel said:
Don’t think I’ve ever said that
Click to expand...

Apologies then. Must have been some other right-wing nutter.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,012
SkyblueBazza said:
So what are you moaning about?

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Because I'm not selfish and genuinely believe that the current situation is going to lead to long-term damage to the country
 
Reactions: martcov

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,013
torchomatic said:
Apologies then. Must have been some other right-wing nutter.
Click to expand...

Can’t see how I’m a right wing nutter. If anything I’d say my views are more akin on the Eu to the party you voted for.
 

Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,014
torchomatic said:
All we need now is a law to be passed so the divorce bill is paid by everyone who voted for Brexit. Don't see why I should pay for your madness.
Click to expand...

How about blame the EU for being shit, just for once?

They caused this.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,015
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
How about blame the EU for being shit, just for once?

They caused this.
Click to expand...

The EU is the blame for Brexit and the subsequent incompetence of the government?
 
Reactions: martcov

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,016
torchomatic said:
Apologies then. Must have been some other right-wing nutter.
Click to expand...
And this shows a problem that we have.

Some people say that anyone who isn't pro EU is right wing. You are not allowed an opinion.

Look at the comments that I get. I don't praise anyone. I have never said a good thing about May. But I am supposed to love what she is doing. In fact I haven't said a good thing about anyone. I think we might be better off staying in the EU. But because I don't join in with the pro EU propaganda I am seen by some as a right winger.

I am not supposed to mention the bad parts of the EU like how they put certain people in certain places. But I am supposed to have a go at anything to do with remaining. I am not supposed to have a go at Juncker for the billions of lost tax payments each year. But I am supposed to froth at the mouth at any brexiter that has dodged tax. But not mention any remainer that has dodged tax.

And then I am seen as a brexiter because I don't stick to these rules.

And Cameron gets away with everything with some people. He started it all off by offering the referendum to get a few more votes in the election.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,017
Sick Boy said:
The EU is the blame for Brexit and the subsequent incompetence of the government?
Click to expand...
The EU is innocent of everything. Even how they put certain people in certain positions even if it is against their own rules. They never do anything wrong.

They don't want to cherry pick. Look at the fishing policies they have said will happen. If we don't agree there won't be a deal. But that is our fault.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,018
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
How about blame the EU for being shit, just for once?

They caused this.
Click to expand...

No. Brexit caused this. The EU is against Brexit and the resulting chaos.
 
Reactions: torchomatic
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,019
Astute said:
The EU is innocent of everything. Even how they put certain people in certain positions even if it is against their own rules. They never do anything wrong.

They don't want to cherry pick. Look at the fishing policies they have said will happen. If we don't agree there won't be a deal. But that is our fault.
Click to expand...

They are innocent of Brexit. Brexit was decided before Selmayr became the latest scape goat.

The EU are not leaving us, we are leaving them.
 

Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,020
Sick Boy said:
The EU is the blame for Brexit and the subsequent incompetence of the government?
Click to expand...

Of course the EU is to blame for Brexit. 17.4 million people would not have voted for it if they were doing a good job. I find it amazing some people cannot hold them remotely accountable.

As for the government, they're useless, but to suggest we shouldn't have voted for it because they are useless is ridiculous. It fits into the notion that we cannot survive without the EU and we shouldn't be allowed to leave.

What the people voted for should be learned from, rather than blamed.
 
Reactions: Astute

Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,021
martcov said:
No. Brexit caused this. The EU is against Brexit and the resulting chaos.
Click to expand...

No, Brexit happened because people wanted out of the EU.

Therefore the EU are not doing a good enough job. - This is the single biggest reason. Not the voters, not Farage, not Breitbart.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,022
SkyblueBazza said:
You asked a straight question...clever clogs

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

What is the difference between being on stand by and the „ normal „ status?
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,023
martcov said:
They are innocent of Brexit. Brexit was decided before Selmayr became the latest scape goat.

The EU are not leaving us, we are leaving them.
Click to expand...
Selmayr has been the puppet master for years. There is no doubt in the fact.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,024
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
No, Brexit happened because people wanted out of the EU.

Therefore the EU are not doing a good enough job. - This is the single biggest reason. Not the voters, not Farage, not Breitbart.
Click to expand...

How did you measure that? Is leaving the only remedy? My opinion is that immigration is the main reason and 45% of leave fb adverts were targeted at people who may have been anti immigrant. Misinformation spreads over social media.
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 31, 2018
  • #18,025
martcov said:
No. Brexit caused this. The EU is against Brexit and the resulting chaos.
Click to expand...
And why is the EU against us leaving?

There wouldn't be any chaos if they all sat around a table and acted like adults. There wouldn't be any chaos if they wanted what was best for all. But they want to keep us in. They are trying to force us into a corner. They want to cherry pick. But they turn the tables and say it is us.
 
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