Exactly what I have been saying for ages but was seen as me being anti Labour. It is amazing how people have become blind to the truth. And thise who point out the truth are supposed to be the ones who are wrong.But the majority of the country believe it’s the better option than a Corbyn government
But the majority of the country believe it’s the better option than a Corbyn government
But the majority of the country believe it’s the better option than a Corbyn government
I don't disagree with any of what you say here.
For me the use of "betrayal" and "traitors" is a big fuss over nothing. For me the likes of Jo Swinson are attempting blatantly to prevent the democratic will of the people and so to me she is a "traitor" to the democratic principles so engrained in this country. If that makes me an extremist then I'm okay with it, me and millions of others.
Exactly what I have been saying for ages but was seen as me being anti Labour. It is amazing how people have become blind to the truth. And thise who point out the truth are supposed to be the ones who are wrong.
Never mind. It might be over one day....or one year.
That’s a fair point. Kinnocks amendment making the house vote on Mays deal again passed by accident didn’t it? What happened to that? Shouldn’t there be a vote on it soon? Or was it taken out somehow?
Interesting. Are you OK with the PM keeping Parliament, the embodiment of UK democracy, shut to force through No Deal?
Slightly more dramatic than the reality ! Due to the recently passed law and the time available between the EU summit and 31 Oct, I’m not convinced the proroguing wouldve done much other than avoid some of the noise (which is why I think it was a waste of political capital - very little to gain from it)
Corbyn closed a nearly 30 point polling deficit in about 6 weeks once the country heard his domestic agenda from himself as opposed to from the right wing press.
Sadly since then he has played Brexit so poorly he cannot be kept in the role for much longer. He must be replaced with a ‘clean’ figure who supports the same policy objectives.
He should have got off the fence he is still sitting on. His long term thoughts were we should leave the EU. Not what remainers want to hear. He now says remain. Not what leavers want to hear. So not what anyone wants. He needs to come out with it loud and clear. If he would have beat the Lib Dems to declaring staying in the EU was a top priority Labour would have gained the remain vote. But the Lib Dems have come from nowhere to their best level for many years. But Corbyn didn't want to risk upsetting the Leave voters that are normally Labour voters.Then tell me how he should have done it differently?
He should have got off the fence he is still sitting on. His long term thoughts were we should leave the EU. Not what remainers want to hear. He now says remain. Not what leavers want to hear. So not what anyone wants. He needs to come out with it loud and clear. If he would have beat the Lib Dems to declaring staying in the EU was a top priority Labour would have gained the remain vote. But the Lib Dems have come from nowhere to their best level for many years. But Corbyn didn't want to risk upsetting the Leave voters that are normally Labour voters.
Isn't it literally what happened?
Then tell me how he should have done it differently?
As in to ‘force through No Deal’ ?
Do you really believe that, many don’t, including me.
I’ve then explained that even if that had been his plan (which I don’t think it is), the steps taken make it difficult/impossible thereby the proroguing would be irrelevant.
He should have got off the fence he is still sitting on. His long term thoughts were we should leave the EU. Not what remainers want to hear. He now says remain. Not what leavers want to hear. So not what anyone wants. He needs to come out with it loud and clear. If he would have beat the Lib Dems to declaring staying in the EU was a top priority Labour would have gained the remain vote. But the Lib Dems have come from nowhere to their best level for many years. But Corbyn didn't want to risk upsetting the Leave voters that are normally Labour voters.
So are you saying that it is best he looks a blithering Idiot who says what he doesn't mean and can't make his mind up.which way he should go? He started off by saying that the result of the referendum should be respected and implemented. These days you have to check the news to see what his latest stance on the subject is.And yet you know that if he does that they will probably lose their Northern Leave Seats - for what? Even bigger majorities in safe London seats, or splitting the vote in Lib/Con marginals to hand more of them to Boris?
You know there is no way for Labour to kick out the Tories if they went full tilt remain - so I’ll ask again, what was he supposed to do differently?
It is a dangerous game to play. But a game he could go back on if needed. Just like the EU and their no negotiating stand. Take it all the way to the wire then finally negotiate if needed. But they most probably won't need to as parliament has made it easy for them.Former members of his cabinet seemed to believe it Steve, along with the two dozen MPs he's kicked out since he came in. The ramping up in No Deal preparations would seem to suggest that also. It was quite simple-deny Parliament as much time as possible so it couldn't continue to obstruct his efforts.
Pork pies all round?
It just shows he should have done something. They have taken both Labour and Tory votes. If he would have beat them to.it he would have kept a lot of voters he has lost and gained from the Tories.A shame that the Lib Dems who for years just took the half way position by default have decided to actually stick to an issue
And one point I would like answering.
It has been seen as a loaded question with the polls. Vote for Corbyn as PM or leave without a deal. There is a majority for a no deal. So no questions like this should be allowed. But the same people think that loaded questions should be allowed as in the type of Brexit v a no deal or type of Brexit v remain. Why?
Is it glasses or a memory that you are in need of?ahh yes because polls have been shown to be accurate in recent history.
who are these people and what question have they asked for?
Is it glasses or a memory that you are in need of?
So I suppose nobody has mentioned we should have a referendum on which type of leave against just remain or that nobody was told the details on how we would leave? Not even yourself?
Of course not. So here starts the next shitfest. Then I prove the point. Then you go quiet on the subject or come out with some sort of comment about me. The story of this thread so far
Slightly more dramatic than the reality ! Due to the recently passed law and the time available between the EU summit and 31 Oct, I’m not convinced the proroguing wouldve done much other than avoid some of the noise (which is why I think it was a waste of political capital - very little to gain from it)
Like I also said would you like to start yet another shitfest off then disappear as usual? You know who has said they are for a referendum but not just leave or remain again.I will ask again, who are these people on this thread and what question(s) have they asked for?
So are you saying that it is best he looks a blithering Idiot who says what he doesn't mean and can't make his mind up.which way he should go? He started off by saying that the result of the referendum should be respected and implemented. These days you have to check the news to see what his latest stance on the subject is.
Are you saying this is a better plan? Because he is losing voters that want to know who to vote for. This is why he is running scared of a GE.
None of them are easy to work out. Boris was one of not many who wanted the May agreement to go through. So is that what he is really after? Seems to me like he is but with changes to Ireland.I suspect it’s all been part of the electioneering TBH. I’m not convinced Cummings is the evil genius he’s made out to be, but I do think he’d have seen this coming. I think he wants to “trigger the libs” as much as possible ahead of an election, they want either a deal passed or a VoNC before Oct 31st. I think the not sending tellers trick was intentional so the deal vote would happen without it being pinned on them for bringing it back again.
Frankly though it’s like working out Sisus plans. God knows what they’re really up to.
Is that right?Come on Astute. No one is running from a GE at all. That’s pure Tory propaganda and I’m surprised to see you parroting it. There will be a GE once the Oct 31st deadline is resolved one way or another.
Is that right?
Tory propaganda? Have a word with yourself. I take no notice of propaganda. But I do take notice of what leaders and MP's are doing. Labour are at their lowest for ages. Why would Corbyn want a GE? With the Lib Dems being remain and the Tories leave there is a good chance Labour would be down to their hardcore support. And many of these would go for the other two. But if Labour then came out as remain the vote would be shared with the Lib Dems. This would let the Tories in.
Which part of this is incorrect?
Politically (especially as he probably isn't averse to a hard Brexit - a chance for nationalising industries, increasing income and inheritance tax while reducing VAT etc.) it'd seem wise to let Johnson make whatever mess he's set to make of Brexit. Let him get to 31st and cause chaos by allowing us to leave, or he has a humiliating climbdown which makes him look a fraud. The gamble is he somehow comes up with an acceptable deal, but then there's two years left before an election is due to let him implement it and show he can't do that.The other question is why *does* he want one when he must be capable of reading the polls?
Like I also said would you like to start yet another shitfest off then disappear as usual? You know who has said they are for a referendum but not just leave or remain again.
So why wouldn't he be able to implement an acceptable deal?Politically (especially as he probably isn't averse to a hard Brexit - a chance for nationalising industries, increasing income and inheritance tax while reducing VAT etc.) it'd seem wise to let Johnson make whatever mess he's set to make of Brexit. Let him get to 31st and cause chaos by allowing us to leave, or he has a humiliating climbdown which makes him look a fraud. The gamble is he somehow comes up with an acceptable deal, but then there's two years left before an election is due to let him implement it and show he can't do that.
You won't. Because you always agree with them even when you don't agree with what they are saying. For instance you agreed with a post saying May did an amazing job. But when I asked you if you thought she had done an amazing job you said she didn't.I don’t, actually. I’ve no idea on who wants to ask ‘loaded’ questions either, hence why I asked you.
And one point I would like answering.
It has been seen as a loaded question with the polls. Vote for Corbyn as PM or leave without a deal. There is a majority for a no deal. So no questions like this should be allowed. But the same people think that loaded questions should be allowed as in the type of Brexit v a no deal or type of Brexit v remain. Why?
I will ask again, who are these people on this thread and what question(s) have they asked for?
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