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The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (22 Viewers)

  • Thread starter jimmyhillsfanclub
  • Start date Jun 8, 2016
Forums New posts

As of right now, how are thinking of voting? In or out

  • Remain

    Votes: 23 37.1%
  • Leave

    Votes: 35 56.5%
  • Undecided

    Votes: 3 4.8%
  • Not registered or not intention to vote

    Votes: 1 1.6%

  • Total voters
    62
  • Poll closed Jun 15, 2016.
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Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,266
Sick Boy said:
Yet more generalisations...my first job in my industry was unpaid and I found it using my own initiative as I decided I needed to get some experience.

I was also working 2 other jobs at the time and literally working on average 14 hours a day 7 days a week.

Granted this was back in 2009 when there were way less jobs about due to the recession but there are still plenty of people doing what you did.
Click to expand...

Says the person who constantly uses personal anecdotes
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,267
djr8369 said:
Good use of selective metrics there to try and wage generational warfare. Of course, you’ll be aware that some of the reasons interests rates are so much lower now is because of the crippling debt levels, the fact house prices have rocketed relative to the average rage and that they needed to be lowered in order to get the economy going again after deregulated capitalism brought it to its knees.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Didn’t they rise rapidly at one point due to the ERM?
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,268
skybluetony176 said:
One of my colleagues daughters has just been doing it for an entire year after leaving university. It’s almost broke him as it was in London and although she was doing paid work in the evenings/weekends she still couldn’t afford the cost of living so it was bank of mum and dad to make up the difference. It did lead to a very good job but to suggest that the practice doesn’t exist still is as you say nonsense.
Click to expand...

Good that’s life

I’m just pointing out realities to Brighton who thinks the world owes him a living and everything has to be handed to him on a silver platter
 
Reactions: SIR ERNIE

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,269
Grendel said:
Says the person who constantly uses personal anecdotes
Click to expand...

Which you have just done for your crass generalisations.

The truth to me seems that you now live in an isolated wealthy bubble and have been out of touch for quite a while
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,270
Sick Boy said:
Which you have just done for your crass generalisations.

The truth to me seems that you now live in an isolated wealthy bubble and have been out of touch for quite a while
Click to expand...

Not at all - one of my children who earns a very modest wage has now managed to save nearly 10% for a deposit on a property and will have achieved that by next year - it’s not impossible and the only thing that has changed is deposits are now much higher than decades ago and interest rates are much lower so monthly payments compensate for that

Areas such as London May be an issue but that’s the same the world over
 
Reactions: Sick Boy

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,271
Will Mr Johnson carry out his threat not to have appointed a European Commissioner so we cannot ask for an extension?
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,272
Grendel said:
Good that’s life

I’m just pointing out realities to Brighton who thinks the world owes him a living and everything has to be handed to him on a silver platter
Click to expand...

According to empirical studies on the matter the current generation will/does have it harder to create a living than the one before. You characterise degrees now as Mickey Mouse with 5 hours contact time a week and while some might be, my course hours were close to those of a working week notwithstanding the year spent in industry as part of it.

My profession has not seen a real terms pay rise in a decade. Class sizes increase but the resources available decrease and most times I buy my own. Coventry’s schools stand to actually lose money from their budgets if the ‘fair funding formula’ is implemented. Do I think I’m ‘owed’ a living no but a fair crack of the whip would be nice.
 
Reactions: shmmeee, Sick Boy and clint van damme

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,273
Brighton Sky Blue said:
According to empirical studies on the matter the current generation will/does have it harder to create a living than the one before. You characterise degrees now as Mickey Mouse with 5 hours contact time a week and while some might be, my course hours were close to those of a working week notwithstanding the year spent in industry as part of it.

My profession has not seen a real terms pay rise in a decade. Class sizes increase but the resources available decrease and most times I buy my own. Coventry’s schools stand to actually lose money from their budgets if the ‘fair funding formula’ is implemented. Do I think I’m ‘owed’ a living no but a fair crack of the whip would be nice.
Click to expand...

Certainly in the last 5 years I had pay rises of less than the increase in living costs

Take your frustration out on the Blair creature for the absurd university expansion and education dumb down
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,274
Grendel said:
Certainly in the last 5 years I had pay rises of less than the increase in living costs

Take your frustration out on the Blair creature for the absurd university expansion and education dumb down
Click to expand...

He deserves criticism for Iraq and exacerbating the financial services sector’s abuse of power. But he isn’t the one who kept the public sector pay freeze in place for a decade. You keep talking of the ‘dumbing down’ in education but that doesn’t really account for the scarcity of jobs in scientific industry around that time or recognise that you compete for positions with those of similar qualifications. The truth is that Britain has seen pharmaceutical/petrochemical companies shift their operations elsewhere.

Labour haven’t been in since 2010. At some point the Tories must take some of the blame for the rise in those depending on charity or welfare, for the rise in people my age who rent or live with parents instead of owning a home or for the increasing reliance on zero hour contracts and part time work.
 

SIR ERNIE

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,275
skybluetony176 said:
Fair play to her.

Just another indicator that the leave campaign was a Trojan horse for a no deal brexit so the disaster capitalist backers could capitalise on the impending disaster.

Click to expand...

Great news, hideous woman, good riddance.
 

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,276
Alan Dugdales Moustache said:
Clearly you know far more about everything than those 30 years and more your senior.
Click to expand...

Of course not. It's dependent on an individual and their experiences and knowledge. I will know more about some things than them, they'll know more about other things. Similarly there will be people younger than me that know more about some stuff and less about others. What those things are will differ depending on the individual.

Or are you suggesting age automatically gives you a better understanding of everything? In which case surely the best thing to do is just have the PM as the oldest person in the country and parliament as the next 649. Save all this time and money on having elections and we'd automatically have the most experienced and knowledgeable parliament available.

And Corbyn is older than Johnson, so guess he must know more about what gone wrong in the past
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,277
SIR ERNIE said:
Great news, hideous woman, good riddance.
Click to expand...

That’s true. Boris does seem to surround himself with hideous people. Obviously someone who is comfortable in this environment.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,278
Sky_Blue_Dreamer said:
Or are you suggesting age automatically gives you a better understanding of everything? In which case surely the best thing to do is just have the PM as the oldest person in the country and parliament as the next 649. Save all this time and money on having elections and we'd automatically have the most experienced and knowledgeable parliament available
Click to expand...

Ironic given that the idiotic remainers were pretty much trying to apply the logic to get s dribbling europhile to lead some stupid emergency government

I suspect they wouldn’t have applied the logic of the right honourable dribbler of Brussels had left and they had to turn to the next longest serving member
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,279
Grendel said:
Ironic given that the idiotic remainers were pretty much trying to apply the logic to get s dribbling europhile to lead some stupid emergency government

I suspect they wouldn’t have applied the logic of the right honourable dribbler of Brussels had left and they had to turn to the next longest serving member
Click to expand...

Could you just use names rather than keep up the ‘dribbling’ act?
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,280
Brighton Sky Blue said:
Could you just use names rather than keep up the ‘dribbling’ act?
Click to expand...

I'd rather be a dribbler than a frothing quitter.
 

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,281
Brighton Sky Blue said:
Could you just use names rather than keep up the ‘dribbling’ act?
Click to expand...

If we could get some names we could scout them for the ACM position. - could prove useful.
 
C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,282
Sick Boy said:
I'd rather be a dribbler than a frothing quitter.
Click to expand...
Who’s the frothing quitter though sick boy ?

If you mean Johnson, whatever people want to call him (and I don’t disagree with some of the stuff), at least he is trying every which way to finalise the Brexit situation once and for all.

I can’t say I agree with all of his methods but as someone else said on an earlier post at least he’s trying to finalise matters

Ps after thornberrys comments on QT there is no way Corbyn can be caretaker PM for any discussions with the EU
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,283
CCFCSteve said:
Who’s the frothing quitter though sick boy ?

If you mean Johnson, whatever people want to call him (and I don’t disagree with some of the stuff), at least he is trying every which way to finalise the Brexit situation once and for all.

I can’t say I agree with all of his methods but as someone else said on an earlier post at least he’s trying to finalise matters

Ps after thornberrys comments on QT there is no way Corbyn can be caretaker PM for any discussions with the EU
Click to expand...

It was a tongue in cheek remark to Grendel always describing anyone against Brexit as ‘dribbling’.

I see no way out of the current mess and imagine that in 300 years it will be going on and Brexit will mean Brexit but secretly no one will actually know what it is and the country would be no further along.
 

Ian1779

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,284
CCFCSteve said:
Ps after thornberrys comments on QT there is no way Corbyn can be caretaker PM for any discussions with the EU
Click to expand...

Let’s actually look at that in a bit more detail.

Corbyn has clearly said that he will give the final decision back to the people, and provide credible leave vs remain options.

He and his party are duty bound to negotiate a deal that can be put forward for people to vote on. It would I imagine be something like the SM/CU arrangement they talked about before.

I appreciate that it may then seem strange to campaign for remain, but they have a responsibility to try and get some kind of deal - which would make them more productive than Boris and his crack team of negotiators.
 
Reactions: oakey

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,285
Ian1779 said:
Let’s actually look at that in a bit more detail.

Corbyn has clearly said that he will give the final decision back to the people, and provide credible leave vs remain options.

He and his party are duty bound to negotiate a deal that can be put forward for people to vote on. It would I imagine be something like the SM/CU arrangement they talked about before.

I appreciate that it may then seem strange to campaign for remain, but they have a responsibility to try and get some kind of deal - which would make them more productive than Boris and his crack team of negotiators.
Click to expand...

Two senior members have his cabinet last week both confirmed whatever the deal is they’d urge the country to vote against it

Brilliant strategy. What do you think the Eu will offer better than they already have when Corbyn turns up drops his trousers and says we want to stay?

It’s actually so bad it’s embarrassing
 
Reactions: RegTheDonk and westcountry_skyblue

Ian1779

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,286
Grendel said:
Two senior members have his cabinet last week both confirmed whatever the deal is they’d urge the country to vote against it

Brilliant strategy. What do you think the Eu will offer better than they already have when Corbyn turns up drops his trousers and says we want to stay?

It’s actually so bad it’s embarrassing
Click to expand...

The offer from the EU will of course be different because Labour wouldn’t have May’s red lines.

It’s not about ‘dropping his trousers’ it’s about sensible negotiation.

It won’t matter anyway to you - unless you get your no-deal you’ll be frothing at the mouth, because you’ll never accept any version of Brexit that isn’t that.

It’s actually so bad it’s embarrassing.... mostly for you.
 
Reactions: bezzer, fernandopartridge, Sick Boy and 1 other person

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,287
Grendel said:
Two senior members have his cabinet last week both confirmed whatever the deal is they’d urge the country to vote against it

Brilliant strategy. What do you think the Eu will offer better than they already have when Corbyn turns up drops his trousers and says we want to stay?

It’s actually so bad it’s embarrassing
Click to expand...

So you want to deny MP’s the right to an opinion in a national referendum?
 

Ian1779

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,288
skybluetony176 said:
So you want to deny MP’s a right to an opinion in a national referendum?
Click to expand...

1st rule of communism.....?
 
Reactions: skybluetony176

Alan Dugdales Moustache

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,289
shmmeee said:
You say that, but all the evidence points to the contrary.
Click to expand...
Where's that then ?
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,290
Ian1779 said:
1st rule of communism.....?
Click to expand...

I wonder if Corbyn gets a deal and inevitably the Trojan horse parties, sorry ERG and Brexit parties inevitably campaign against it in the referendum does that mean we’ll have to label the ERG and Brexit parties dribbling europhiles for campaigning to keep us in the EU?
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,291
Grendel said:
It’s actually so bad it’s embarrassing
Click to expand...

We agree on something then. You're on about BoJo right?
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,292
skybluetony176 said:
So you want to deny MP’s the right to an opinion in a national referendum?
Click to expand...

This is not a normal referendum though it’s but yes and no but it’s a leave remain referendum on a deal the government even before its seen options in the table will vote down

Everyone thinks it’s hilarious
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,293
Brighton Sky Blue said:
We agree on something then. You're on about BoJo right?
Click to expand...

No Johnson wants to end the issue one way or the other. There is an opportunity to revoke article 50 but Mr Corbyn as ever dithers and refuses to take this to the electorate
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,294
skybluetony176 said:
I wonder if Corbyn gets a deal and inevitably the Trojan horse parties, sorry ERG and Brexit parties inevitably campaign against it in the referendum does that mean we’ll have to label the ERG and Brexit parties dribbling europhiles for campaigning to keep us in the EU?
Click to expand...

Oh dear leave the irony to me. Like everything else you are pretty poor on any issue or discussion
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,295
Grendel said:
No Johnson wants to end the issue one way or the other. There is an opportunity to revoke article 50 but Mr Corbyn as ever dithers and refuses to take this to the electorate
Click to expand...

The way to take it to the electorate is with a 2nd referendum rather than a sneaky attempt at a 2nd referendum by proxy. Leave without an agreement immediately or revoke Article 50 immediately. What is there to be concerned about? If enough people still want Brexit it would be voted through-if opinion has changed, this mistake can be forgotten about.
 
Reactions: djr8369, fernandopartridge, skybluetony176 and 4 others

oakey

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,296
Let's call the whole thing off
:banghead:
 

Ian1779

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,297
Grendel said:
Oh dear leave the irony to me. Like everything else you are pretty poor on any issue or discussion
Click to expand...

Please... your like an walking/talking version of ‘The Thick of It’

And I don’t mean Malcolm Tucker.
 
Reactions: skybluetony176

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 8, 2019
  • #41,298
Grendel said:
Two senior members have his cabinet last week both confirmed whatever the deal is they’d urge the country to vote against it

Brilliant strategy. What do you think the Eu will offer better than they already have when Corbyn turns up drops his trousers and says we want to stay?

It’s actually so bad it’s embarrassing
Click to expand...
It's actually embarrassing that after over 3 years people are still talking about this like its a commercial negotiation where the other party has a range of positions it might bargain.

This simplism is why we're marching towards fascism.
 
Reactions: djr8369, Deleted member 5849, shmmeee and 4 others

dutchman

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 9, 2019
  • #41,299
I'd have thought it was far more embarrasing that more than three years after voting to leave the EU Britain is still a fully paid up member of it?
 
Reactions: westcountry_skyblue

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Sep 9, 2019
  • #41,300
dutchman said:
I'd have thought it was far more embarrasing that more than three years after voting to leave the EU Britain is still a fully paid up member of it?
Click to expand...

Anyone who thinks extracting yourself from a 40 year political union should be over quickly is delusional.

We won’t be done with this in our lifetimes.
 
Reactions: skybluetony176 and Sick Boy
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