System and players (1 Viewer)

The players we have acquired have been signed to play in this style though.

We are making very basic mistakes consistently that don't have much at all to do with the system

I agree in the main But when we were down to 10 men and it was clear that we don’t have enough to play through Their midfield then we really needed 2 up top and try to bypass the midfield a bit.

SlowerThanPlatt said:

The players we have acquired have been signed to play in this style though.

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in which case he's going to need to get creative.

What has the system had to do with the 2 sendings off we've had in 7 games?

We played well against Swansea, Bristol and QPR second half and your reason for changing the system is two games where we played with ten men for large periods, against established Championship / recent relegated Prem teams?

Jamesimus said:

What has the system had to do with the 2 sendings off we've had in 7 games?

We played well against Swansea, Bristol and QPR second half and your reason for changing the system is two games where we played with ten men for large periods, against established Championship / recent relegated Prem teams?

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The table reads 5 points and 1 win from 7 though. Every team has hard luck stories where they feel as if they deserved more, we’re conceding on average 2 goals a game so we need to score 3 to win one.

SlowerThanPlatt said:

The table reads 5 points and 1 win from 7 though. Every team has hard luck stories where they feel as if they deserved more, we’re conceding on average 2 goals a game so we need to score 3 to win one.

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We've got players out too.

I think people are panicking. Talk of changing a system that a lot of these players are now very much used to. Could see that ending up even worse.

We were never going to get a result against Bournemouth and after going down to ten men today, was never going to happen today either.

I doubt we've even seen the desired "first 11" this season yet.

AFCCOVENTRY said:

Let the dust settle a little after watching that shambles. Regardless of the Rose sending off., I’ve come to the conclusion that we are trying to play too much how we did last season in L1 which was fantastic for us in that league. However, we don’t have the players to play that same system at a Championship intensity.

I’m hoping Robins is able to see the light soon and change the formation to suit the level we are at and with the players at his disposal.

Hamer, Walker, Shipley, Dabo, Hilsner, Jobello, Dacosta, Bapaga are to come back over the next few games and into next month. Leo will now come in for a Rose.

There’s an opportunity and still time to really think what is the best way to get the best impact on the pitch with these additional players. We have to start getting as many points through scrapping and fighting, and sometimes forget the fancy playing out from the back if we have any chance of staying up.

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What utter bollocks. Change the system my fucking arse.

Get a grip.

Londonccfcfan said:

What utter bollocks. Change the system my fucking arse.

Get a grip.

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If we continue to leak 2 goals a game we may be forced to have a chance of winning games

SlowerThanPlatt said:

If we continue to leak 2 goals a game we may be forced to have a chance of winning games

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We should try to keep 11 players on the pitch.

What's that 5/6 goals conceded with 10 men on pitch.

Londonccfcfan said:

We should try to keep 11 players on the pitch.

What's that 5/6 goals conceded with 10 men on pitch.

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Can't really disagree with the idea of a system that involves 11 players, sounds ideal

Londonccfcfan said:

What utter bollocks. Change the system my fucking arse.

Get a grip.

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Every team in this league will have now seen how we've struggled each game we've come up against a press. We aren't good enough to try the slow build from the back in this league when put under pressure and we are making basic, fundamental errors because of it. We could barely get out of our half today before the sending off and when we hit the post it was a swift, incisive counter attack.

Need a minimum of 4 points from the next 4 games and if not I'd be looking to use the mid-November 2 week international break for a re-think.

I’ll reiterate my view that we should play 3-4-1-2 when Walker is back and getting game time.

But, we’ve had a real tough run of games to start the season. By next Friday, we would have played 4 of the top 6, including 1st and 2nd. The early front runners in Brentford and a Blackburn team who have scored the most goals in the league.

Context is everything, and we should have beaten Bristol and Swansea, so we can perform against the big boys in this league. But, what’s been shown is that the gulf in quality is big, and that’s a given looking at the costs of our respective squads.

The reality is, we need to gradually build ourselves up over a few season in this league to compete. We’re a newly promoted side in a league that spends silly money.

Well Boro also play a similar formation to us but have 2 up top they play a 3-5-2 or a 3-1-4-2 formation so I think we should not make mass change to formation in my opinion just have to win our match ups I would like to see us play 2 up top ideally so I'd quite like to match up with their 3-1-4-2 formation especially with Hamer back - I'd like us to go with the following.

Marosi

Hyam, McFadz Osti\

Kelly

Giles Hamer O'Hare McCallum

Walker Godden


Subs: Wilson, Pask, Kastaneer, Allen, Sheaf, Baka, Biamou

Doubt MR will do 2 up top though if he does but want to make centre of park more solid woud give O'Hare a rest and put Sheaf in alongside Hamer.

Esoterica said:

Every team in this league will have now seen how we've struggled each game we've come up against a press. We aren't good enough to try the slow build from the back in this league when put under pressure and we are making basic, fundamental errors because of it. We could barely get out of our half today before the sending off and when we hit the post it was a swift, incisive counter attack.

Need a minimum of 4 points from the next 4 games and if not I'd be looking to use the mid-November 2 week international break for a re-think.

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Take the point based on Brentford and Barnsley. Today, we had the best chance of the game before the red card. We’re always going to struggle against Blackburn if we have 10 men. They’ve battered a few teams this season already.

I do agree that we need an option to be more direct. Which is why I think Walker will eventually get a shot. Just being able to play a long ball over the defence and have Walker stretch that defence. When Jobello is fit, he’ll be an additional option I’d consider too.

AFCCOVENTRY said:

If it doesn’t yield results or players are struggling, the manager has a duty to look at different formations and tactics.

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And do what? The entire system is built around wing backs. We don’t even have and straight up full backs on the books AFAIK. We’ve got no strength and pace up front. We’ve got a handful of CBS who struggle in a two. We’ve got loads of decent DMs. It’s 3421 or 3412 basically.

Londonccfcfan said:

What utter bollocks. Change the system my fucking arse.

Get a grip.

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You only have to watch how a simple press against us works.

Within minutes today Armstrong was stood on the edge of the box for our goal kick and we were aimlessly giving them the ball every time.

AFCCOVENTRY said:

If it doesn’t yield results or players are struggling, the manager has a duty to look at different formations and tactics.

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Robins comments are insightful. He often talks about ‘coming to grips’ with this league. That will eventually come and we’ve been naive in a lot of games so far.

Considering we have next to no wingers we don’t have many options. Your options probably look like 4-1-2-1-2 (diamond) or 3-4-1-2.

7 games in is too early to change course now, especially given that we’ve played the best/in-form teams in the division too.

Today was a write off from minute 15. If Rose had been sent off and they missed tthe pen, we have half a chance. But to go down to ten and conceed the goal, fuck off

I know I’m in the minority here, but I think we have started this season better than expected. There is a huge gulf between this division and league one.

we can compete in all games but are far too far behind quality wise to makea difference so need to Pick our battles.

Mucca Mad Boys said:

I’ll reiterate my view that we should play 3-4-1-2 when Walker is back and getting game time.

But, we’ve had a real tough run of games to start the season. By next Friday, we would have played 4 of the top 6, including 1st and 2nd. The early front runners in Brentford and a Blackburn team who have scored the most goals in the league.

Context is everything, and we should have beaten Bristol and Swansea, so we can perform against the big boys in this league. But, what’s been shown is that the gulf in quality is big, and that’s a given looking at the costs of our respective squads.

The reality is, we need to gradually build ourselves up over a few season in this league to compete. We’re a newly promoted side in a league that spends silly money.

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We went 2 up front against Brentford and looked totally over ran is my worry

Esoterica said:

Every team in this league will have now seen how we've struggled each game we've come up against a press. We aren't good enough to try the slow build from the back in this league when put under pressure and we are making basic, fundamental errors because of it. We could barely get out of our half today before the sending off and when we hit the post it was a swift, incisive counter attack.

Need a minimum of 4 points from the next 4 games and if not I'd be looking to use the mid-November 2 week international break for a re-think.

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Sort of agree but we have managed to use it to our advantage and the transition to counter attack was borne out of our build up, think Allen’s disallowed goal v Swansea is a case in point

Agree on the more general point though, we’re getting caught out when we get pressed when we try to build from a goal kick, cause we’re just not quite up to that standard

There’s a theme where many here (including myself over the last few weeks) are pointing out that opposing teams high press CCFC. It seems that they’ve figured that that stops us playing our preferred game.

A high press is a dangerous tactic if the team you are pressing has the ability to get into the gap between the (pushed up (pressing)) defence and goal. A ball pinged over the top into the gap into the run of a pacy / physical forward whilst the defence is pressing provides danger.

It seems as though the CCFC planned tactic to counter this was to get Sheaf / Hamer to act as the deep playmaker (pinger); sensible stuff.

Perhaps the other part of the plan was to have one of Jones / Walker / Jobello offering pace or power running off Godden whilst having a playmaker roaming in the hole. An interchangeable triangle rather than a front two but you get the idea.

-Godden or alternatively a spearhead (Biamou, Baka?)
-A playmaker (o’h, Allen, Shipley even)
-A counterattack threat (Walker, Jones, Jobello, even Kastaneer)

The threat of a having a quick marauding opponent therefore stops defences pressing high so readily.

Fairly simple stuff.

I’ve mentioned (as have others since) before that having Godden, Allen and O’Hare up front is seriously strange since it invites the press and puts us on the back foot. The opposition must have the same pre match plan: “they’ve got the diddymen on again boys. Press ‘em high and wait until one of their defenders gives us a penalty”.

For me it’s really simple: keep the same format that we’ve trained for and FFS don’t play Allen and O’Hare at the same time. One starts, one comes on as an impact sub (and not in the 89th minute. 65-70. It’s like Sillett in the late 80’s where he’d throw in a sub on the 88th minute rather than 75th. Still loved him though).

Each time I see the starting team sheet I wonder “where’s the direct threat and counter attack threat? Where’s the aerial offence? Why is Allen playing as well as O’Hare again?”

I really hope that they (CCFC) get a grip on this - it’s getting silly.

cc84cov said:

We went 2 up front against Brentford and looked totally over ran is my worry

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Brentford are very good team! Comparing ourselves to them isn’t going to help. It didn’t help that we had a weakened side too.

Mucca Mad Boys said:

Brentford are very good team! Comparing ourselves to them isn’t going to help. It didn’t help that we had a weakened side too.

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We’ve gone 2 up front in other games and lost momentum bringing on walker I think it was to partner Godden