AFCCOVENTRY
Well-Known Member
Let's see what they have to say for themselves
Some statements from SISU tomorrow (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter AFCCOVENTRY
- Start date
Nonleagueherewecome
Well-Known Member
Where did you hear that they are making a statement tomorrow? Or do you think the Platt situation is big enough of an issue for Joy to host a personal press conference at The Ricoh? 
AFCCOVENTRY
Well-Known Member
Cov Tel tomorrow mate. No idea what it is about but I there is a lot of activity suddenly with Hoffman and Elliott being asked to come back.
dongonzalos
Well-Known Member
It weird I have this horrible feeling Hoff and JE are going to be asked to find investment for SISU.
So we will be stuck with SISU for the long term
Either they will be asked to find it for them or they already have.
Its strange as in one respect that would be awesome news as the club will be saved. In another way it will be horrible as it means SISU will be here for many moons.
Unless Hoff and JE are there to get the council to agree the sale to SISU, Knowing they will then smooth the deal between SISU and China or whoever
I dont know
For what its worth I think SISU's statement will say they welcome any bid from China but it does not exist yet.
They offer total transparency about ARVO and will have come up with some normal business explanation for it
They are still in negotiation with the council these are complicated negotiations. They are vital for the future of the club
They will then contradict themselves i.e we are trying to sign RK and MC they will play big roles in us bouncing straight back. AT also has his targets we are waiting to do the deals we know his targets want to come. However we need to get the negotiations on the rent and stadium sorted before we know where we stand.
The books are their ready to be submitted once this is agreed.
Yet despite offering RK and MC contracts and having a players budget just about sorted if the council don't agree to the deal ASAP the club is gone.
So we will be stuck with SISU for the long term
Either they will be asked to find it for them or they already have.
Its strange as in one respect that would be awesome news as the club will be saved. In another way it will be horrible as it means SISU will be here for many moons.
Unless Hoff and JE are there to get the council to agree the sale to SISU, Knowing they will then smooth the deal between SISU and China or whoever
I dont know
For what its worth I think SISU's statement will say they welcome any bid from China but it does not exist yet.
They offer total transparency about ARVO and will have come up with some normal business explanation for it
They are still in negotiation with the council these are complicated negotiations. They are vital for the future of the club
They will then contradict themselves i.e we are trying to sign RK and MC they will play big roles in us bouncing straight back. AT also has his targets we are waiting to do the deals we know his targets want to come. However we need to get the negotiations on the rent and stadium sorted before we know where we stand.
The books are their ready to be submitted once this is agreed.
Yet despite offering RK and MC contracts and having a players budget just about sorted if the council don't agree to the deal ASAP the club is gone.
singers_pore
Well-Known Member
You're better than Mystic Meg that's for sure. I reckon the above is more or less what SISU will say.
mark82
Moderator
Care to expand?
“Sisu is a privately owned company
that invests in a variety of
projects and organisations using
various legally approved and regulated
entities in different parts of the
world.
“Sisu is both an owner of, and
creditor to, Coventry City FC and, in
line with any other creditor, Sisu has
taken appropriate and necessary
steps to protect its interests over the
loans.
“Far from posing any threat to the
ongoing existence of the football
club, Sisu’s recent injections of capital
by way of loans has ensured the
football club’s survival during a very
difficult period. Sisu’s absolute focus
and priority, together with the
club’s executive team, is to find a solution
to bring together a closer
alignment of the club and the stadium.
“As such, Sisu and the club are
currently engaged in detailed and
constructive talks with Coventry
City Council, Higgs Charity, and
Arena Coventry Limited.
“Should the various parties reach
any form of agreement then detailed,
transparent, and legally binding
contracts will be put in place to safeguard
the interests of all interested
parties.
“Talks are progressing well but remain
commercially confidential to
the parties involved and at this time
neither Sisu nor the football club are
able to make any further comment.”
It refused to give further details of
Arvo’s business or value, amid concerns
about the Cayman Islands’
reputation as a hedge fund tax haven
shouded in business confidentiality.
Mr Fisher said in January the five
private equity funds initially set up
by Sisu to invest in Coventry City FC
were in 2010 “wrapped together to
form a single entity, Sconcett Capital
LP” - based in the Cayman Islands.
There was then no mention of Arvo.
Sisu also refused to say if has a
property developer/investor in place
to invest in the Ricoh and surrounding
land.
The club - which has witheld its
£100,000 Ricoh rental payments for
two months - says it wants a deal urgently
to get its accounts signed off,
which would lift a transfer embargo
and get players in for the third division
in August. Ricoh talks between
Sisu and the Higgs charity have entered
four weeks of “due diligence”,
and no deal, if any, is thought possible
by the Higgs charity for another
seven weeks.
that invests in a variety of
projects and organisations using
various legally approved and regulated
entities in different parts of the
world.
“Sisu is both an owner of, and
creditor to, Coventry City FC and, in
line with any other creditor, Sisu has
taken appropriate and necessary
steps to protect its interests over the
loans.
“Far from posing any threat to the
ongoing existence of the football
club, Sisu’s recent injections of capital
by way of loans has ensured the
football club’s survival during a very
difficult period. Sisu’s absolute focus
and priority, together with the
club’s executive team, is to find a solution
to bring together a closer
alignment of the club and the stadium.
“As such, Sisu and the club are
currently engaged in detailed and
constructive talks with Coventry
City Council, Higgs Charity, and
Arena Coventry Limited.
“Should the various parties reach
any form of agreement then detailed,
transparent, and legally binding
contracts will be put in place to safeguard
the interests of all interested
parties.
“Talks are progressing well but remain
commercially confidential to
the parties involved and at this time
neither Sisu nor the football club are
able to make any further comment.”
It refused to give further details of
Arvo’s business or value, amid concerns
about the Cayman Islands’
reputation as a hedge fund tax haven
shouded in business confidentiality.
Mr Fisher said in January the five
private equity funds initially set up
by Sisu to invest in Coventry City FC
were in 2010 “wrapped together to
form a single entity, Sconcett Capital
LP” - based in the Cayman Islands.
There was then no mention of Arvo.
Sisu also refused to say if has a
property developer/investor in place
to invest in the Ricoh and surrounding
land.
The club - which has witheld its
£100,000 Ricoh rental payments for
two months - says it wants a deal urgently
to get its accounts signed off,
which would lift a transfer embargo
and get players in for the third division
in August. Ricoh talks between
Sisu and the Higgs charity have entered
four weeks of “due diligence”,
and no deal, if any, is thought possible
by the Higgs charity for another
seven weeks.
DazzleTommyDazzle
Well-Known Member
If I've unerstood this correctly, CCFC say that they can't file their accounts until a deal has been agreed with the Council/Higgs re the Ricoh.
If SISU were prepared to guarantee not to call in their loans and to fund any gap in finances irrespective of this potential deal, then surely the accounts could be signed off on the basis of this base budget (let's call it Plan A) and if/when the Ricoh deal was done, they could move on to the better budget that would then be available (let's call it Plan B!).
Now as we're told that this can't be done, the only logical conclusion is that SISU are not prepared to give the guarantees noted above.
So, if the Ricoh deal isn't done - we are effrectively being told that CCFC has (at best) a significant chance of having the plug pulled by SISU.
So far, nothing really new - but I'd been wondering about the positions of Fisher and Clarke, as directors of CCFC. If all the above is true, then they must be aware that if the Ricoh deal isn't done (and based on what we're told by the Council and the Higgs there must be a reasonable chance of this) the club could/would go bust. In this situation where they were obviously aware of all this, I'd have thought that thet were in serious danger of being deemed to have been "trading insolvent" and so would be personably liable for the debts incurred in this period.
So - are Fisher and Clarke:
1) A bit dim and unaware of the dangers
2) Aware of the dangers but putting themselves on the line for the club
3) Happy because they've been told by SISU that this is all posturing to put pressure on the Council/Higgs and that they will fund the club anyway (not minding that by then it may be too late to assemble a sensible squad for next season.....)
If SISU were prepared to guarantee not to call in their loans and to fund any gap in finances irrespective of this potential deal, then surely the accounts could be signed off on the basis of this base budget (let's call it Plan A) and if/when the Ricoh deal was done, they could move on to the better budget that would then be available (let's call it Plan B!).
Now as we're told that this can't be done, the only logical conclusion is that SISU are not prepared to give the guarantees noted above.
So, if the Ricoh deal isn't done - we are effrectively being told that CCFC has (at best) a significant chance of having the plug pulled by SISU.
So far, nothing really new - but I'd been wondering about the positions of Fisher and Clarke, as directors of CCFC. If all the above is true, then they must be aware that if the Ricoh deal isn't done (and based on what we're told by the Council and the Higgs there must be a reasonable chance of this) the club could/would go bust. In this situation where they were obviously aware of all this, I'd have thought that thet were in serious danger of being deemed to have been "trading insolvent" and so would be personably liable for the debts incurred in this period.
So - are Fisher and Clarke:
1) A bit dim and unaware of the dangers
2) Aware of the dangers but putting themselves on the line for the club
3) Happy because they've been told by SISU that this is all posturing to put pressure on the Council/Higgs and that they will fund the club anyway (not minding that by then it may be too late to assemble a sensible squad for next season.....)
AFCCOVENTRY
Well-Known Member
We will not have our accounts filed until well into August by the looks of it. SISU are refusing to file them until they know the outcome of the Ricoh situation.
So Mr Thorn cannot go bang bang bang and get the players he wants.
Royal cock up this.
So Mr Thorn cannot go bang bang bang and get the players he wants.
Royal cock up this.
Its simple really ,IF they want us ,they're going to have to show a bit of commitment ,surely if they want the rest thats a prerequisite,if they don't have the means or commitment Jog On,can anyone say we are not the worst run football team in the country,you know the part that puts a team on the pitch.
mark82
Moderator
I've seen no reason to believe this yet.
dongonzalos
Well-Known Member
Johnnythespider
Well-Known Member
For what it's worth, which isn't very much as it's just my opinion, sisu have been given a length of rope that is just long enough. I expect us to start next season with a points deduction but shiny new owners, these talks are being held to draw out Hoffmans chinese investors who i believe have been known to the council for some time, but like i say it's just my opinion and has nothing to do with anything i heard anywhere off anybody who knows anybody who might have anything to do with the council. Honest !!!!!
oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
Just to comment on not a lot really frankly I think it is the CT filling up column inches by ..............
Sisu is a privately owned company that invests in a variety of projects and organisations using various legally approved and regulated entities in different parts of the world. No one has said that anything they have done is illegal (no one knows one way or tuther so you have to assume all above board however much we might dislkie what is going on) but SISU dont invest .... they manage their clients money who are the investors. This isnt a normal investment it is a series of loans - that isnt how the average person sees investment
“Sisu is both an owner of, and creditor to, Coventry City FC and, in line with any other creditor, Sisu has taken appropriate and necessary steps to protect its interests over the loans. Actually SISU are neither - they act as agents .... the club lists Sconset as the owners - a fund managed but not invested in by SISU edit but any other creditor cannot take a charge over the assets now and couldnt before because it would have needed SISU's approval
“Far from posing any threat to the ongoing existence of the football club, Sisu’s recent injections of capital by way of loans has ensured the football club’s survival during a very difficult period. Sisu’s absolute focus and priority, together with the club’s executive team, is to find a solution to bring together a closer alignment of the club and the stadium. BUT had they done their job right in the first place, provided credible management that knew what they were doing,( RR might have been the football expert but he was not the finance expert) .... then the club may well not have made the losses and loans in excess of £40m would not have been needed. The size of the loans and losses have a direct correlation to the mistakes SISU made in setting up and running the finances. They are funding their mistakes ! They are "investing" still because they are locked in and it is the only way to protect their investment - it isnt for the love of CCFC
edit - but directors or shadow directors (SISU exert control on ccfc ) have a legal duty to consider if company should continue to trade and this charge covers that situation first and foremost ..... ARVO/SISU retain any assets should the worst happen.... Sconset and the original funds made bigger loans and didnt get a charge but ARVO get the charge, why would that be if it is such normal business practice (charges are not unusual who gets the charge may be)
Of course they dont want it to fail but ARVO and its charge ensures any value there is goes on to be controlled by SISU by a company not involved in the financial management of the club so that makes it very hard for any other creditor to challenge SISU's actions over their period of control at CCFC. If SISU were found to be negligent then none of the assets could be claimed because they are charged against "loans" from another company (that just happens to be in bed with SISU)
“As such, Sisu and the club are currently engaged in detailed and constructive talks with Coventry City Council, Higgs Charity, and Arena Coventry Limited. “Should the various parties reach any form of agreement then detailed, transparent, and legally binding contracts will be put in place to safeguard the interests of all interested parties. You see I have a real problem with them using the words transparent ..... they keep saying it but it just doesnt happen ........ and transparency in this context has nothing to do with telling the fans what is going on. As mutton has said - there has to be a credible business plan for the whole process to go forward and for all sorts of reasons why would anyone trust what they are told by SISU. Yes at some point someone has to trust but SISU and the CCFC Board seem to adopt an arrogant superior attitude which is neither helpful nor likely to engender trust. The only thing SISU want safeguarded is their clients money and the management fees they earn from it - never lose sight of that
“Talks are progressing well but remain commercially confidential to the parties involved and at this time neither Sisu nor the football club are able to make any further comment.” Normal state of affairs and nothing sinister in that but they still choose how when and how much facts are known and regularly use the press (largely gullible) to strengthen their negotiations - dont like it the other way round though
It refused to give further details of Arvo’s business or value, amid concerns about the Cayman Islands’ reputation as a hedge fund tax haven shouded in business confidentiality. The CT fail to get the point ...... the important thing is not that the Hedge fund is based in the Caymans (that really is not unusual but makes a more eye catching headline)..... THE POINT IS THE ASSETS HAVE NOW EFFECTIVELY BEEN SEPERATED FROM THE CREDITORS AND THE SCONSET INVESTORS, CCFC NO LONGER CONTROLS ANY OF ITS ASSETS.
Is the charge over the CCFC assets an attempt to also charge the option to buy the shares ..... securing the price mechanism which could be valuable to a third party ......... my understanding is that the option agreement will fail if transferred charged or the club is in default. The Important value in the charge is not the dumb bells in the gym ...... it is the League registration, the value in the land, the trademarks, the online stuff and the share option
Mr Fisher said in January the five private equity funds initially set up by Sisu to invest in Coventry City FC were in 2010 “wrapped together to form a single entity, Sconcett Capital LP” - based in the Cayman Islands. There was then no mention of Arvo. Wasnt any mention until we we told the CT either
Sisu also refused to say if has a property developer/investor in place to invest in the Ricoh and surrounding land. Of course they wont thats not unusual and to be able to do this then they must have - wasnt there talk months ago (start of last season? ) that AEG were interested - they are a global company specialising in running stadiums ?The club - which has witheld its £100,000 Ricoh rental payments for two months (soon to be 3 months i would guess - puts the club in breach of contract and probably in breach of the share option agreement too) - says it wants a deal urgently to get its accounts signed off, which would lift a transfer embargo and get players in for the third division in August. Ricoh talks between Sisu and the Higgs charity have entered four weeks of “due diligence”, and no deal, if any, is thought possible by the Higgs charity for another seven weeks.
None of that guarantees a budget, or signing off the accounts or a deal for the shares - 7 weeks takes us into july to get a potential deal with the charity which then needs full council discussion and approval ..... Season starts 18th August ish ....... cant do accounts budget etc till then .......... what is holding the accounts and budget up is SISU no one else yet they are so unconvinced by their investment they cant sign a budget off yet pump in £500K + per month to support the club ..... no contradiction there then !
Sisu is a privately owned company that invests in a variety of projects and organisations using various legally approved and regulated entities in different parts of the world. No one has said that anything they have done is illegal (no one knows one way or tuther so you have to assume all above board however much we might dislkie what is going on) but SISU dont invest .... they manage their clients money who are the investors. This isnt a normal investment it is a series of loans - that isnt how the average person sees investment
“Sisu is both an owner of, and creditor to, Coventry City FC and, in line with any other creditor, Sisu has taken appropriate and necessary steps to protect its interests over the loans. Actually SISU are neither - they act as agents .... the club lists Sconset as the owners - a fund managed but not invested in by SISU edit but any other creditor cannot take a charge over the assets now and couldnt before because it would have needed SISU's approval
“Far from posing any threat to the ongoing existence of the football club, Sisu’s recent injections of capital by way of loans has ensured the football club’s survival during a very difficult period. Sisu’s absolute focus and priority, together with the club’s executive team, is to find a solution to bring together a closer alignment of the club and the stadium. BUT had they done their job right in the first place, provided credible management that knew what they were doing,( RR might have been the football expert but he was not the finance expert) .... then the club may well not have made the losses and loans in excess of £40m would not have been needed. The size of the loans and losses have a direct correlation to the mistakes SISU made in setting up and running the finances. They are funding their mistakes ! They are "investing" still because they are locked in and it is the only way to protect their investment - it isnt for the love of CCFC
edit - but directors or shadow directors (SISU exert control on ccfc ) have a legal duty to consider if company should continue to trade and this charge covers that situation first and foremost ..... ARVO/SISU retain any assets should the worst happen.... Sconset and the original funds made bigger loans and didnt get a charge but ARVO get the charge, why would that be if it is such normal business practice (charges are not unusual who gets the charge may be)
Of course they dont want it to fail but ARVO and its charge ensures any value there is goes on to be controlled by SISU by a company not involved in the financial management of the club so that makes it very hard for any other creditor to challenge SISU's actions over their period of control at CCFC. If SISU were found to be negligent then none of the assets could be claimed because they are charged against "loans" from another company (that just happens to be in bed with SISU)
“As such, Sisu and the club are currently engaged in detailed and constructive talks with Coventry City Council, Higgs Charity, and Arena Coventry Limited. “Should the various parties reach any form of agreement then detailed, transparent, and legally binding contracts will be put in place to safeguard the interests of all interested parties. You see I have a real problem with them using the words transparent ..... they keep saying it but it just doesnt happen ........ and transparency in this context has nothing to do with telling the fans what is going on. As mutton has said - there has to be a credible business plan for the whole process to go forward and for all sorts of reasons why would anyone trust what they are told by SISU. Yes at some point someone has to trust but SISU and the CCFC Board seem to adopt an arrogant superior attitude which is neither helpful nor likely to engender trust. The only thing SISU want safeguarded is their clients money and the management fees they earn from it - never lose sight of that
“Talks are progressing well but remain commercially confidential to the parties involved and at this time neither Sisu nor the football club are able to make any further comment.” Normal state of affairs and nothing sinister in that but they still choose how when and how much facts are known and regularly use the press (largely gullible) to strengthen their negotiations - dont like it the other way round though
It refused to give further details of Arvo’s business or value, amid concerns about the Cayman Islands’ reputation as a hedge fund tax haven shouded in business confidentiality. The CT fail to get the point ...... the important thing is not that the Hedge fund is based in the Caymans (that really is not unusual but makes a more eye catching headline)..... THE POINT IS THE ASSETS HAVE NOW EFFECTIVELY BEEN SEPERATED FROM THE CREDITORS AND THE SCONSET INVESTORS, CCFC NO LONGER CONTROLS ANY OF ITS ASSETS.
Is the charge over the CCFC assets an attempt to also charge the option to buy the shares ..... securing the price mechanism which could be valuable to a third party ......... my understanding is that the option agreement will fail if transferred charged or the club is in default. The Important value in the charge is not the dumb bells in the gym ...... it is the League registration, the value in the land, the trademarks, the online stuff and the share option
Mr Fisher said in January the five private equity funds initially set up by Sisu to invest in Coventry City FC were in 2010 “wrapped together to form a single entity, Sconcett Capital LP” - based in the Cayman Islands. There was then no mention of Arvo. Wasnt any mention until we we told the CT either
Sisu also refused to say if has a property developer/investor in place to invest in the Ricoh and surrounding land. Of course they wont thats not unusual and to be able to do this then they must have - wasnt there talk months ago (start of last season? ) that AEG were interested - they are a global company specialising in running stadiums ?The club - which has witheld its £100,000 Ricoh rental payments for two months (soon to be 3 months i would guess - puts the club in breach of contract and probably in breach of the share option agreement too) - says it wants a deal urgently to get its accounts signed off, which would lift a transfer embargo and get players in for the third division in August. Ricoh talks between Sisu and the Higgs charity have entered four weeks of “due diligence”, and no deal, if any, is thought possible by the Higgs charity for another seven weeks.
None of that guarantees a budget, or signing off the accounts or a deal for the shares - 7 weeks takes us into july to get a potential deal with the charity which then needs full council discussion and approval ..... Season starts 18th August ish ....... cant do accounts budget etc till then .......... what is holding the accounts and budget up is SISU no one else yet they are so unconvinced by their investment they cant sign a budget off yet pump in £500K + per month to support the club ..... no contradiction there then !
Last edited:
OSB-
You must be getting sick of the slaps on the back but by fook you explain all in the most legible way. I just hope those who keep trying to defend SISU read with interest and try to give one reason why we should believe anything they tell us.. I am very worried about SISUs motives and dont care for TF trying to pull our pants down every chance he gets... MY only hope other then they leave our club and you get to sit infront of TF and get him to answer staright question instead of pre designed statments that dont answer any of the question that are the most important...
You must be getting sick of the slaps on the back but by fook you explain all in the most legible way. I just hope those who keep trying to defend SISU read with interest and try to give one reason why we should believe anything they tell us.. I am very worried about SISUs motives and dont care for TF trying to pull our pants down every chance he gets... MY only hope other then they leave our club and you get to sit infront of TF and get him to answer staright question instead of pre designed statments that dont answer any of the question that are the most important...
dongonzalos
Well-Known Member
Have to agree with that, even if osb is just nicking the cet stories after they have been working on them for months.
TheRoyalScam
Well-Known Member
Thanks again OSB58 for taking the time to post these most informative facts and opinions.
WillieStanley
New Member
During the last 10 months, I have never seen or heard anyone try to defend SISU. I'd be happy to be proven wrong.
Surely suggests its personal funds now OSB ,the charge being placed now ,Joy's connection into this billionaire "Huntsman family" ,these are the whispers i've heard in the latter part of the season ,and would possibly be the reason for Keys and others speculating that Admin or worse is just around the bend ,only to be confounded.
oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
wouldnt know wingy but TF has said the club is surviving on funds that SISU & ARVO are putting in. Am certain that SISU & ARVO have operated together before and I would guess in similar situations.
Thought that goes through my mind is that Sconset is now a closed fund (ie taking no more money in) and that ARVO is a way of SISU taking the assets and saying to their investors tough luck there are no assets to recover ...... no loss if same investors in Sconset and ARVO or if ARVO takes Sconset over but if that isnt the case ..........
I would also be willing to bet that they would place the blame on the Council Charity and ACL ........ citing their unreasonable behaviour and self interest as the reason it all went bad
Thought that goes through my mind is that Sconset is now a closed fund (ie taking no more money in) and that ARVO is a way of SISU taking the assets and saying to their investors tough luck there are no assets to recover ...... no loss if same investors in Sconset and ARVO or if ARVO takes Sconset over but if that isnt the case ..........
I would also be willing to bet that they would place the blame on the Council Charity and ACL ........ citing their unreasonable behaviour and self interest as the reason it all went bad
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Extremely thorough scrutiny OSB-and, in short, the CT reveal nothing new. ARVO have first call on everything if the business fails-to the disadvantage of all other creditors; which makes the point of Sconset unclear. Indeed, it is ARVO supplying SISU with money to fund losses-so the amount owed to them may be a lot greater than we think.
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
Both. CCFC get the cash and use it to pay off the debt to ARVO.
Sub
Well-Known Member
SISU now want us to pay for the skyblue player so we can here waghorn talk about the club :facepalm::facepalm: although you get the first two minutes free
http://www.ccfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10269~2790623,00.html
http://www.ccfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10269~2790623,00.html
