SISU lost the club £4M (1 Viewer)

skybluetony176 · Apr 28, 2014

I was just reading a thread on GMK and someone has come up with a stat that we lost 197800 of our home attendance this season compared to last. At £20 a ticket thats almost £4M in lost revenue, not including lost sponsorship or merchandise sales.

Tell me again why the club mustn't accept the short term offer to play at the Ricoh that was made through the FL?

stupot07 · Apr 28, 2014

we only made £2.9m from ticket sales in 2012/13

Sky Blue Sports & Leisure 2013 accounts http://www.skybluestalk.co.uk/showthread.php?t=42971

But the point you are making is not rocket science and nothing we don't know.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors

Grendel · Apr 28, 2014

skybluetony176 said:
I was just reading a thread on GMK and someone has come up with a stat that we lost 197800 of our home attendance this season compared to last. At £20 a ticket thats almost £4M in lost revenue, not including lost sponsorship or merchandise sales.

Tell me again why the club mustn't accept the short term offer to play at the Ricoh that was made through the FL?

We never managed to charge more than £10 a ticket at the Ricoh.

Astute · Apr 28, 2014

Grendel said:
We never managed to charge more than £10 a ticket at the Ricoh.

So you have never paid more than a tenner to get in? I have never got in for a tenner.

Grendel · Apr 28, 2014

Astute said:
So you have never paid more than a tenner to get in? I have never got in for a tenner.

Are you disputing the statistic?

skybluetony176 · Apr 28, 2014

Grendel said:
We never managed to charge more than £10 a ticket at the Ricoh.

But you're happy they cost the club £2M in lost revenue?

skybluetony176 · Apr 28, 2014

skybluetony176 said:
But you're happy they cost the club £2M in lost revenue?

Plus merchandise and sponsorship

RoboCCFC90 · Apr 28, 2014

It's hardly nothing we don't know is it? Lower attednace = Less ticket sale revenue.

Astute · Apr 28, 2014

Grendel said:
Are you disputing the statistic?

You said they have never been able to charge more than a tenner for a ticket. I said I have never got a ticket for a tenner or less. Are you disputing this fact?

Deleted member 5849 · Apr 28, 2014

skybluetony176 said:
But you're happy they cost the club £2M in lost revenue?

As a general principle, if they gain the club more than £2mil in revenue further on down the line, then it's entirely sensible from their perspective.

But no, let's keep banging on about the bleeding obvious! At least you didn;t decide it was a racist revenue post.

lewys33 · Apr 28, 2014

To be fair Grendel is right you cant just base every ticket on that. Everyone knows that Sixfields makes no financial sense so lets not insult our (lack of) intelligence by making this a 20 page "nail-biter"

Grendel · Apr 28, 2014

Astute said:
You said they have never been able to charge more than a tenner for a ticket. I said I have never got a ticket for a tenner or less. Are you disputing this fact?

My season ticket was £13 a ticket. The oap I went with was £6.50 a ticket. So that's £10 a ticket

skybluesam66 · Apr 28, 2014

in terms of ticket prices - I used to buy an adult and 18-21 season ticket for about £480
thats £400 net of vat - or about £8.70 per game

so Grendel may not be wide of the mark with that

Norman Binns · Apr 28, 2014

Grendel said:
My season ticket was £13 a ticket. The oap I went with was £6.50 a ticket. So that's £10 a ticket

The King of statistical manipulation strikes YET again. So we have a 1:1 ratio of OAP’s to full paying adults do we and every fan that went to the Ricoh was a season ticket holder?

As I recall, the cheapest adult ticket in our last season at the Ricoh on a game by game basis was £19 in the JSB section. I think the most expensive was £27 in the centre section of the Tesco stand.

Going by your methodology then Grendel, that makes an average ticket price of £23 wouldn’t you agree? Great this statistical manipulation stuff ain’t it?

DazzleTommyDazzle · Apr 28, 2014

Deleted member 5849 said:
As a general principle, if they gain the club more than £2mil in revenue further on down the line, then it's entirely sensible from their perspective.

But no, let's keep banging on about the bleeding obvious! At least you didn;t decide it was a racist revenue post.

As a general principle that's true (subject to the present value of future income streams etc etc), but from where we are currently, getting back to the "Ricoh status quo" looks a pretty tall order let alone recouping how many years worth of £2m's (not to mention lost sponsorship and merchandise sales).

It seems to be "bleeding obvious" to everyone, except for the people who are in a position to do anything about it.

Grendel · Apr 28, 2014

Norman Binns said:
The King of statistical manipulation strikes YET again. So we have a 1:1 ratio of OAP’s to full paying adults do we and every fan that went to the Ricoh was a season ticket holder?

As I recall, the cheapest adult ticket in our last season at the Ricoh on a game by game basis was £19 in the JSB section. I think the most expensive was £27 in the centre section of the Tesco stand.

Going by your methodology then Grendel, that makes the average ticket price of £23 wouldn’t you agree? Great this statistical manipulation stuff ain’t it?

Are you disputing the statistic.

Norman Binns · Apr 28, 2014

Grendel said:
Are you disputing the statistic.

What statistic?

_brian_ · Apr 28, 2014

Statistics prove that statistics don't prove anything! LOL!!!

Astute · Apr 28, 2014

Norman Binns said:
What statistic?

The statistic where SISU showed their income. Last time the argument was whether it was before or after tax. Nobody knew if it included tickets given away. But we all know that the vast majority are not pensionable age or kids.

Mr T - Sukka! · Apr 28, 2014

For an adult it was £18 on tuesday night football.

And a normal Saturday was £22.

Dont know where this crap came from that tickets were sold for under a tenner.

Dont know what school some went to but £10 is definatley not £22.

duffer · Apr 28, 2014

_brian_ said:
Statistics prove that statistics don't prove anything! LOL!!!

Very true Brian - at least 57% of statistics are made up, apparently.

Grendel · Apr 28, 2014

Mr T - Sukka! said:
For an adult it was £18 on tuesday night football.

And a normal Saturday was £22.

Dont know where this crap came from that tickets were sold for under a tenner.

Dont know what school some went to but £10 is definatley not £22.

It comes from calculating the match day revenue and dividing by the number of attendees you ignoramus.

Grendel · Apr 28, 2014

Astute said:
The statistic where SISU showed their income. Last time the argument was whether it was before or after tax. Nobody knew if it included tickets given away. But we all know that the vast majority are not pensionable age or kids.

so you disagree with any poster who has stated the average ticket price has been £10 at the Ricoh?

fernandopartridge · Apr 28, 2014

Mr T - Sukka! said:
For an adult it was £18 on tuesday night football.

And a normal Saturday was £22.

Dont know where this crap came from that tickets were sold for under a tenner.

Dont know what school some went to but £10 is definatley not £22.

Although more than half of the average gate are or were season ticket holders and pay a lower price per game.

It can't be denied that playing at N'ton will have had a negative impact on income but also cannot be denied that expenditure playing there is lower than previous seasons at the Ricoh.

duffer · Apr 28, 2014

Just to add, whatever the loss of direct revenue from ticket sales you should probably add the possible impact as the result of those who drift away from the club forever, or the kids who never start supporting the club.

It's basically a pretty big gamble, financially, SISU's tactics. The longer it goes on the further entrenched everyone involved becomes too, I'd guess.

lordsummerisle · Apr 28, 2014

Grendel said:
so you disagree with any poster who has stated the average ticket price has been £10 at the Ricoh?

To be fair you're right, and the case for many clubs in Championship/Division One.

We shouldn't have sold tickets so low of course, as our major source of income, others that do so get the benefit of F@B's, only people who gained were ACL from low ticket prices.

wince · Apr 28, 2014

It comes from calculating the match day revenue and dividing by the number of attendees you ignoramus.

6000 wolves fans x £24

RoboCCFC90 · Apr 28, 2014

The math will always be disputed, only the Club will be 100% sure how much money has been lost due to falling attendances.

The question is, Should Sisu take all the blame for the fall in attendances? IMO No.

italiahorse · Apr 28, 2014

RoboCCFC90 said:
The math will always be disputed, only the Club will be 100% sure how much money has been lost due to falling attendances.

The question is, Should Sisu take all the blame for the fall in attendances? IMO No.

Managers and team performance I guess ?

wince · Apr 28, 2014

The math will always be disputed, only the Club will be 100% sure how much money has been lost due to falling attendances.

The question is, Should Sisu take all the blame for the fall in attendances? IMO No.

100% yes

RoboCCFC90 · Apr 28, 2014

italiahorse said:
Managers and team performance I guess ?

You have to blame Sisu for the managers that the picked, that isn't an issue, but even from the first season we moved into the Ricoh Arena, attendances began to fall season after season, including when the reign of Sisu started. Sisu are responsible for 95% of the fall in attendances.

wince · Apr 28, 2014

The question is, Should Sisu take all the blame for the fall in attendances? IMO No

bye the same token we had 28000 v leeds in the ground and sisu should take the credit for that

Grendel · Apr 28, 2014

lordsummerisle said:
To be fair you're right, and the case for many clubs in Championship/Division One.

We shouldn't have sold tickets so low of course, as our major source of income, others that do so get the benefit of F@B's, only people who gained were ACL from low ticket prices.

Exactly. If you had a car park ticket you'd actually be giving ACL more money than the club.

Norman Binns · Apr 28, 2014

RoboCCFC90 said:
You have to blame Sisu for the managers that the picked, that isn't an issue, but even from the first season we moved into the Ricoh Arena, attendances began to fall season after season, including when the reign of Sisu started. Sisu are responsible for 95% of the fall in attendances.

Phew! Only 95% responsible then, that's a relief. For a moment I was a bit worried about it being 100%.

Jack Griffin · Apr 28, 2014

In reality the average turnover per ticket isn't full face value, because there are corporate areas, concessions, cheap areas and free tickets. But of course other income flows from attendance & the good will of local business, a commodity that SISU have more or less discarded (e.g. for the first time in decades Cov Building Society have no commercial partnership with the club).

The prison of measured time blog researched some statistics,

Somewhat surprisingly, and I am sure an economist would laugh at the simplicity, but there appears to be a consistent relationship between the total attendance figures and total income. Total income includes sponsorship deals, TV rights and sales in the club shop, along with ticket sales. It would appear that the club’s attendance for the year, based on 25 games in a season, brings in around £25 per head in total.

Year................. 2011................2012................2013
Attendance.....407,675...........378,000...........274,325
Income............£10,200,000... £9,400,000.... £7,000,000
Average/fan....£25.02.............£24.87..............£25.52

http://aprisonofmeasuredtime.wordpr...n-the-almost-certain-demise-of-the-sky-blues/
* And yeah they didn't go down, but it was close..

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