Remember this thread when Gardener signed on loan (1 Viewer)

CUS Wyken · Dec 21, 2011

http://www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/12864-Gardner-In

Near enough everyone on here were saying what a great signing etc... will many of you now accept regardless of who we bring in player wise, the manager is not good enough.

I was one of the few who said he won't make any difference and i was proved correct. Since he signed we haven't even gained a point.

Where are all the Villa mongs who said what a great player he is now??? Shows you how much them brummies know about football eh.

covcity4life · Dec 21, 2011

he does look a good player,he scored in his first game and should have got one vs pboro aswell

thorn played him in defence pretty much,bad manager who needs to go

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar · Dec 21, 2011

CUS Wyken said:
http://www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/12864-Gardner-In

Near enough everyone on here were saying what a great signing etc... will many of you now accept regardless of who we bring in player wise, the manager is not good enough.

I was one of the few who said he won't make any difference and i was proved correct. Since he signed we haven't even gained a point.

Where are all the Villa mongs who said what a great player he is now??? Shows you how much them brummies know about football eh.

He's being recalled anyway http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/co...from-coventry-city-loan-spell-92746-29988380/

Otis · Dec 21, 2011

He does make me laugh though, Thorny.

Today he says; “It would be massive to beat Bristol who are down in the bottom half as well, and I think we will."

Why on earth does he think we will win? :thinking about: And before anyone says it is just positive talking, he can indeed talk without saying he thinks we will win. He could quite easily say "We're at home, we played well in our last game of course we can go into this game with confidence."

Saying he thinks we will win on the back of 4 consecutive defeats and just two wins all season is just crazy talk. :facepalm:

torchomatic · Dec 21, 2011

Oh bloody , bloody bollocks.

torchomatic · Dec 21, 2011

And imagine if he said:

“It would be massive to beat Bristol who are down in the bottom half as well, but I don't think we will as we are piss poor."

Then, folks like you would be starting hysterical threads. Give the guy some slack.

Otis said:
He does make me laugh though, Thorny.

Today he says; “It would be massive to beat Bristol who are down in the bottom half as well, and I think we will."

Why on earth does he think we will win? :thinking about: And before anyone says it is just positive talking, he can indeed talk without saying he thinks we will win. He could quite easily say "We're at home, we played well in our last game of course we can go into this game with confidence."

Saying he thinks we will win on the back of 4 consecutive defeats and just two wins all season is just crazy talk. :facepalm:

Otis · Dec 21, 2011

torchomatic said:
And imagine if he said:

“It would be massive to beat Bristol who are down in the bottom half as well, but I don't think we will as we are piss poor."

Then, folks like you would be starting hysterical threads. Give the guy some slack.

But that is just stupid. You've just turned it completely on it's head there. I didn't say he shouldn't be positive.

Has he said this season against anyone that he thinks we will win? No.

So why say it now when we are sinking deeper and deeper into trouble and haven't won since October?

Fine to try and stay positive, but there are limits. Otherwise you just look a buffoon!

torchomatic · Dec 21, 2011

I disagree. Why shouldn't he say we could win. They are struggling too, are they not? What's so weird about a manager saying "I reckon we'll win"? Nothing.

"But there are limits"? Oh OK, we might scrape a draw? We might get a lucky win?

He's trying to buoy the players and the fans. Nothing wrong with that.

Otis · Dec 21, 2011

I am fine him saying "we could win." that's a world away from "I think we will win."

The limits are that you can look a fool.

I haven't heard him say he thinks we will win all season. Why say it now?

torchomatic · Dec 21, 2011

Yes "thinks".

I hope he's right.

Otis · Dec 21, 2011

Just irks me because he hasn't said it all season. Now when we are at our lowest ebb he suddenly believes it.

And he has to say he "thinks." He can't say "we will" because then he would indeed be a complete and utter fool.

Don't think I have ever heard any manager anywhere say "we will win."

Gaz · Dec 21, 2011

What a load of bollocks

Moan if we don't beat Bristol by all means.
But to moan because our manager comes out with a positive comment like "we will win" is just dumb.

Otis · Dec 21, 2011

Please yourself.

He hasn't said it before. We haven't now won since October, so that sounds dumb to say it now.

I want him to be positive. Fine with positivity. Not stupidity though.

Nick · Dec 21, 2011

He would have been a great signing if he played just behind the front 2 in attacking midfields, you know, where he plays best....

CUS Wyken · Dec 21, 2011

gaz said:
What a load of bollocks

Moan if we don't beat Bristol by all means.
But to moan because our manager comes out with a positive comment like "we will win" is just dumb.

Thorn does talk bollocks though. He must think us fans are deluded. Why can't he admit. The table don't lie. We are the Blackburn of the Championship. Rubbish manager with shocking owners.

Look at the past 4 games. We have played teams (Exception of Hull) that were bottom half and struggling. We've accumlated a grand total of 0 points. We now play 2 teams at home that should be winnable. If we don't get at least 4 points then hes got to go. Simple as that.

We get a so called 'superstar' on loan and manage to make him look average at best.

CUS Wyken · Dec 21, 2011

Nick said:
He would have been a great signing if he played just behind the front 2 in attacking midfields, you know, where he plays best....

Well will never know becasue the great man Thorn does what he does best... plays players out of position.

Houchens Head · Dec 21, 2011

:thinking about:hmmmmmm... so, if I say I "WILL" win fridays lottery, rather than I "hope" I win it, then I'll be a millionaire on Saturday morning?

Otis · Dec 21, 2011

Can I be your friend?

Houchens Head · Dec 21, 2011

'Course you can Otis! (hoped you was my friend anyway! )

Otis · Dec 21, 2011

Cool.

Not been on SBT that long, but have to say the one thing that does annoy me a bit is that if you're not black you're white. If you are not pro you are anti, if you say anything against AT you are against AT and if you are pro AT you cannot say anything against him.

:facepalm:

I'm all for positivity but draw a line the talk gets plain daft.

rustyredline · Dec 21, 2011

Worst sky blues team if my lifetime, I doubt they will beat any1 this season until sisu are out. The shady owners are affecting the players. if sisu go i aint even bothered if we go down as long we look capable of getting back up next year. Whilst sisu are here i fear the team will lose practically every game like it's been this year even in L1. If by some miracle Sisu go they can take Thorn with them.imp:

torchomatic · Dec 21, 2011

It's got nothing to do with being pro or anti anything.

I'm all for people having a go at Thorn about his tactics, his substitutions, his selections, whatever, but I think when it comes down to being criticized for saying "I think we will win", then it starts to get a little ridiculous.

Otis said:
Cool.

Not been on SBT that long, but have to say the one thing that does annoy me a bit is that if you're not black you're white. If you are not pro you are anti, if you say anything against AT you are against AT and if you are pro AT you cannot say anything against him.

:facepalm:

I'm all for positivity but draw a line the talk gets plain daft.

smileycov · Dec 21, 2011

I think we will win! and we we will beat a shite brighton side, how much more we can do from there on in i don't know. But the games i
have watched we have come close to getting something, WHU didn't deserve to beat us....such a lucky 2nd goal. Boro we hit the post and should have had a pen. We have rarely been out of it in MOST games, be positive it has to be our turn with the luck soon.

Hate SISU, hate the will we/wont we be bought crap, hate the lack of funds and hate the fact we sell anything that looks half decent. It is what it is, so i am just gonna support the team pray for a win and see where it takes us. Beacuse everything except my support is out of my control.

Otis · Dec 21, 2011

torchomatic said:
It's got nothing to do with being pro or anti anything.

I'm all for people having a go at Thorn about his tactics, his substitutions, his selections, whatever, but I think when it comes down to being criticized for saying "I think we will win", then it starts to get a little ridiculous.

No, what is ridiculous is the manager suddenly out of the blue saying he thinks we will win after never saying it before and after an absolutely terrible run of form and no win since October.

torchomatic · Dec 21, 2011

Why is it? They are struggling to, so he thinks we might win. What's the problem?

Here's what I would say:

We are playing West Ham this week. I don't think we will win
We are playing a team in the lower reaches of the league, I think we will win.

There, not rocket science is it? If we were playing one of the top teams then we wouldn't be having this conversation, would we?

However, in the current climate it seems every word uttered by Thorn is subject to close scrutiny, which I guess is only natural.

Basically, I personally find nothing remotely strange about his comments, as I pointed out we are playing a struggling team. If we were playing more difficult opposition then I would tend to agree with you.

Otis said:
No, what is ridiculous is the manager suddenly out of the blue saying he thinks we will win after never saying it before and after an absolutely terrible run of form and no win since October.

Sterling Archer · Dec 21, 2011

I have stuck up for Thorn for reasons I have described in another thread about the standard of squad but I do think not playing Gardner behind the front 2 was a big mistake by him.

Otis · Dec 21, 2011

Last 9 games Bristol's record is;

Won 4
Draw 2
Lost 3.

For me there is a just a world of difference between I think we can win and I think we will win. Not going to argue the toss anymore to be honest.

CUS Wyken · Dec 21, 2011

Otis said:
Last 9 games Bristol's record is;

Won 4
Draw 2
Lost 3.

For me there is a just a world of difference between I think we can win and I think we will win. Not going to argue the toss anymore to be honest.

New manager syndrome...

torchomatic · Dec 21, 2011

Well, yes maybe he could've said "can" rather than "will". Maybe he didn't choose his words carefully enough or maybe he doesn't expect every word to be studied under the microscope of Sky Blues Talk.

I just hope we win.

DiveDiveWhereverYouMayBe · Dec 21, 2011

Managers have to say a lot. You can analyse the semantics of one line until the cows come home, but the bottom line is thus...

If you are looking to add fuel to the 'Thorn should be sacked' fire, you will read it as foolhardy.
If you see no reason to stoke this fire, you will read it as positive, hopefully based on a good week's training, although potentially wrong.

You are arguing the toss over a single word. He is an ex footballer, current football manager, they deal in cliches and hyperbole. No-one will remember the throwaway line, win or lose, unless it confirms their agenda.

I think any more negativity than 'I think we will win' would have been misplaced. We've lost a midfielder and are bottom of the League. There is plenty of negativity around the Club as it is... I would prefer Thorn to say this than to say the opposite, but I don't think it has any bearing on anything, either way.

The usefulness of hindsight comes to the fore again with this article. Gardner came with a good reputation, didn't really cut it, was only meant to be on loan for a month. I am not sure I have seen anywhere near enough of him to be so certain of his best position, but he didn't effect games as I'd hoped. Should have buried the chanceagainst Peterborough and an England Under 21 player should be able to affect games in the Championship if they are good enough despite being played ten or fifteen metres behind what is apparently their best position. He is a midfielder, he played in the midfield, he was a short term loan, he has gone back and our club is still bottom of the League. His signing was within SISU's budget... they have fallen short (we need more, as we were all but promised recently with the 'couple of Premiership loanees' statement). I wasn't expecting miracles from him, just acknowledging it is looking like we will need a miracle to be playing Championship football next season.

Gaz · Dec 21, 2011

I don't like a word Thorn has used

I am outraged !
Sack him sack him !

How dare he be positive ....

CUS Wyken · Dec 21, 2011

gaz said:
I don't like a word Thorn has used

I am outraged !
Sack him sack him !

How dare he be positive ....

Shame his tactics weren’t as positive as his comments eh.

Actions speak louder than words.

Otis · Dec 21, 2011

torchomatic said:
Well, yes maybe he could've said "can" rather than "will". Maybe he didn't choose his words carefully enough or maybe he doesn't expect every word to be studied under the microscope of Sky Blues Talk.

I just hope we win.

I think we will win.

Otis · Dec 21, 2011

gaz said:
I don't like a word Thorn has used

I am outraged !
Sack him sack him !

How dare he be positive ....

You seem to be a bit of a angry sort. Chill out, it's Christmas.

Sutty · Dec 21, 2011

Otis said:
No, what is ridiculous is the manager suddenly out of the blue saying he thinks we will win after never saying it before and after an absolutely terrible run of form and no win since October.

Hold up. I'm sure Thorn has received a lot of criticism for repeating the same thing again and again in his interviews? 'We were unlucky', 'false position' etc. So why are we now criticising him for saying something he's never said before?

Ultimately though, if you're bottom of the league with 13 points then anything positive you say is going to sound slightly ridiculous. I don't think he really could have said much else though could he?

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