Poll: How long will Trump be President? (1 Viewer)

Firstly the left leaning media is all over it again. Many on here as in the wider world simply don't want to hear the truth or try and get to the truth. We are lied to more than ever on so many issues by our politicians and media. Social media has opened up a cascade of information and the mainstream media is getting caught out causing divide among themselves on the left and right. (CNN & Fox an example) You have to determine what's fake or true. Agenda's exist on both sides of the political spectrum, you need to judge things carefully and not just listen to what a headline says.
An example is the so called caging of children and migrants. The separation of children and parents. This was not a Trump policy! It has existed for years. Obama, Bush and others were doing the exact same thing on their watch. So now because it's under Trump's watch it is highlighted. So after the outcry he has decided to end the practice of separation. But make no mistake these immigrants are illegally crossing the border in the full knowledge they can be arrested and detained then sent back. It is an offence punishable by jail time for repeat offenders. These laws have existed in America for a very long time. You can't just up and say "oh I'll go live there". That's why we have borders. So lets put the left or right aside, Trump's not perfect but he is doing what he was elected to do. Some good points are made here:

Just seen this from x22 report and it seems like the deep state is planning another chaos.

Paxman II said:

Firstly the left leaning media is all over it again. Many on here as in the wider world simply don't want to hear the truth or try and get to the truth. We are lied to more than ever on so many issues by our politicians and media. Social media has opened up a cascade of information and the mainstream media is getting caught out causing divide among themselves on the left and right. (CNN & Fox an example) You have to determine what's fake or true. Agenda's exist on both sides of the political spectrum, you need to judge things carefully and not just listen to what a headline says.
An example is the so called caging of children and migrants. The separation of children and parents. This was not a Trump policy! It has existed for years. Obama, Bush and others were doing the exact same thing on their watch. So now because it's under Trump's watch it is highlighted. So after the outcry he has decided to end the practice of separation. But make no mistake these immigrants are illegally crossing the border in the full knowledge they can be arrested and detained then sent back. It is an offence punishable by jail time for repeat offenders. These laws have existed in America for a very long time. You can't just up and say "oh I'll go live there". That's why we have borders. So lets put the left or right aside, Trump's not perfect but he is doing what he was elected to do. Some good points are made here:

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Forget about left and right you say, and then post an alt-right constructed video littered with dubious statistics from such commendably blinkered, bigoted sources such as David Vance ('Briebart is the truth' ).

Well done....

Paxman II said:

Firstly the left leaning media is all over it again. Many on here as in the wider world simply don't want to hear the truth or try and get to the truth. We are lied to more than ever on so many issues by our politicians and media. Social media has opened up a cascade of information and the mainstream media is getting caught out causing divide among themselves on the left and right. (CNN & Fox an example) You have to determine what's fake or true. Agenda's exist on both sides of the political spectrum, you need to judge things carefully and not just listen to what a headline says.
An example is the so called caging of children and migrants. The separation of children and parents. This was not a Trump policy! It has existed for years. Obama, Bush and others were doing the exact same thing on their watch. So now because it's under Trump's watch it is highlighted. So after the outcry he has decided to end the practice of separation. But make no mistake these immigrants are illegally crossing the border in the full knowledge they can be arrested and detained then sent back. It is an offence punishable by jail time for repeat offenders. These laws have existed in America for a very long time. You can't just up and say "oh I'll go live there". That's why we have borders. So lets put the left or right aside, Trump's not perfect but he is doing what he was elected to do. Some good points are made here:

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Trump is dumb, but ruthless. He was elected as the leader of the „free world“, or at least that was the role of the US in the past. He is an ignorant lying corrupt right wing opportunist. Creating trade wars and fascist style immigration policy is not what America once stood for and the majority of Americans are not dumb ass Trump fans. There is no comparison between CNN and Fox. Fox is more like a State propaganda Channel with arse lickers like Hannity ( who is a client of the same crooked lawyer who fixes things for Trump ).

martcov said:

Trump is dumb, but ruthless. He was elected as the leader of the „free world“, or at least that was the role of the US in the past. He is an ignorant lying corrupt right wing opportunist. Creating trade wars and fascist style immigration policy is not what America once stood for and the majority of Americans are not dumb ass Trump fans. There is no comparison between CNN and Fox. Fox is more like a State propaganda Channel with arse lickers like Hannity ( who is a client of the same crooked lawyer who fixes things for Trump ).

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Strange your obsessive hatred with trump given the same qualities can be seen in the vile corrupt c**t Junker

Paxman II said:

This was not a Trump policy! It has existed for years.

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The law hasn't changed however policy has. It was Trump and Sessions that brought in the zero tolerance policy in May. The change in policy means adults who try to cross the border, including those seeking asylum, are immediately placed into custody and therefore separated from their children.

Paxman II said:

Obama, Bush and others were doing the exact same thing on their watch.

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Not sure what you're referring to with Bush so won't comment on that. With Obama I assume you're referring to the 2014 border crisis where there was a huge surge in numbers crossing the border due to various issues in South America. There was no Obama policy to separate children from parents as a matter of course. It only occurred where the parents were placed in to custody for an issue additional to the border crossing itself, for example smuggling drugs.

The bigger problem for Obama was the sudden huge increase number of unaccompanied children. This led to the system getting overloaded and the Obama-era policy, which was to have all unaccompanied children processed within 72 hours and placed with a foster family being unachievable.

The result was temporary facilities which is what I assume you are likening to now. The key difference here is one was for unaccompanied children, one for children who had been removed from their parents; one to cope with a sudden surge in immigration numbers; one when immigration numbers are at normal or even low levels.

Paxman II said:

So now because it's under Trump's watch it is highlighted. So after the outcry he has decided to end the practice of separation.

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It is highlighted under Trumps watch because its a direct result of his zero tolerance policy.

I wouldn't be so sure about the executive order ending this mess. The executive order requires that families be detained in immigration centres until their case is complete. This would breach the Flores settlement.

Paxman II said:

But make no mistake these immigrants are illegally crossing the border in the full knowledge they can be arrested and detained then sent back. It is an offence punishable by jail time for repeat offenders. These laws have existed in America for a very long time. You can't just up and say "oh I'll go live there". That's why we have borders.

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They aren't all illegal immigrants, many of them are seeking asylum or refuge. It is a breach of international law for the US to turn away those with legitimate claims, hence the universal condemnation.

Even federal law states anyone who comes to the US without legal status and makes a claim for asylum has the right to an interview to determine if their case is credible, if it is they have the right to formally seek asylum.

The issue is, as a result of Trumps policy, those who attempt to enter the county the correct way are being turned away and denied their rights. CBP agents are physically blocking them from setting foot on US soil.

Obviously this results in people attempting to enter the country in other ways which means that some of those parents who have had their children taken away and are now imprisioned while they work their way through the legal system have a valid claim for asylum. Even if they later prove that claim they will still have a criminal record for entering the country illegally despite the way they are legally entitled to enter the country being blocked. And that before we even consider if the system currently in place is keeping track of where everyone is so families can eventually be reunited.

torchomatic said:

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Apparently that little girl wasn't separated from her mother ?

Westendlad said:

Apparently that little girl wasn't separated from her mother ?

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The assertion that the girl wasn’t separated from the mother seems to have stemmed from a Daily Mail article where they speak to the father. However in that article he says he hasn’t spoken to the mother or daughter in 3 weeks.

chiefdave said:

The assertion that the girl wasn’t separated from the mother seems to have stemmed from a Daily Mail article where they speak to the father. However in that article he says he hasn’t spoken to the mother or daughter in 3 weeks.

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Seriously? The Washington post have confirmed the same and the BBC. They got this from the Mail? Really?

The crying Honduran girl on the cover of Time was not separated from her mother



The widely shared photo of the little girl crying as a U.S. Border Patrol agent patted down her mother became a symbol of the families pulled apart by the Trump administration’s “zero tolerance” policy at the border, even landing on the new cover of Time magazine.

But the girl’s father told The Washington Post on Thursday night that his child and her mother were not separated, and a U.S. Customs and Border Protection spokesman confirmed that the family was not separated while in the agency’s custody. In an interview with CBS News, Border Patrol agent Carlos Ruiz, who was among the first to encounter the mother and her daughter at the border in Texas, said the image had been used to symbolize a policy but “that was not the case in this picture.”

Ruiz, who was not available for an interview Friday, said agents asked the mother, Sandra Sanchez, to put down her daughter, nearly 2-year-old Yanela, so they could search her. Agents patted down the mother for less than two minutes, and she immediately picked up her daughter, who then stopped crying.

“I personally went up to the mother and asked her, ‘Are you doing okay? Is the kid okay?’ and she said, ‘Yes. She’s tired and thirsty. It’s 11 o’clock at night,” Ruiz told CBS News.

Grendel said:

Strange your obsessive hatred with trump given the same qualities can be seen in the vile corrupt c**t Junker

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No connection between what I said about the most powerful man in the world and the head of the EU civil service. Juncker is more eloquent, speaks several languages fluently, is better educated and works for a multilateral organisation dedicated to bringing countries together born originally as a result of the disasters of the 20 century wars between competing self centered nation states. Trump is a simplistic impulsive idiot who is jeopardizing world trade to keep his base happy and his Fox and Breitbart brainwashed fans chanting „space force“ etc at his party rallies. His former employees are being indicted and his slush fund named as a charity is under criminal investigation. Juncker was also under Investigation, but that is as far as you can take your comparison. Nothing on the same scale as collusion with Russia or obstruction of justice.

Having said that, I wouldn’t want Juncker as leader of the free world, but that doesn’t let Trump off the hook.

dutchman said:

The crying Honduran girl on the cover of Time was not separated from her mother

The widely shared photo of the little girl crying as a U.S. Border Patrol agent patted down her mother became a symbol of the families pulled apart by the Trump administration’s “zero tolerance” policy at the border, even landing on the new cover of Time magazine.

But the girl’s father told The Washington Post on Thursday night that his child and her mother were not separated, and a U.S. Customs and Border Protection spokesman confirmed that the family was not separated while in the agency’s custody. In an interview with CBS News, Border Patrol agent Carlos Ruiz, who was among the first to encounter the mother and her daughter at the border in Texas, said the image had been used to symbolize a policy but “that was not the case in this picture.”

Ruiz, who was not available for an interview Friday, said agents asked the mother, Sandra Sanchez, to put down her daughter, nearly 2-year-old Yanela, so they could search her. Agents patted down the mother for less than two minutes, and she immediately picked up her daughter, who then stopped crying.

“I personally went up to the mother and asked her, ‘Are you doing okay? Is the kid okay?’ and she said, ‘Yes. She’s tired and thirsty. It’s 11 o’clock at night,” Ruiz told CBS News.

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Oh well. That’s fine then. Trump’s policy must be ok if the photo was of the wrong person.

Wait, even Trump has signed an executive order to try and undo some of the damage that he has done to the image of the country he was elected apparently to make great again.

Trade wars with everyone including the allies, kids in cages, rambling nonsensical speeches at party rallies to chanting masses. Corruption and lobbying swamp fuller than it ever was instead of being drained. But, look over there, Time got the photo wrong.

Westendlad said:

Apparently that little girl wasn't separated from her mother ?

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So? Everything‘s fine then?

Grendel said:

Seriously? The Washington post have confirmed the same and the BBC. They got this from the Mail? Really?

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Read the articles you are referencing. One quotes a CBP agent who has no idea where the mother and child currently are, the other quotes her father who by his own admission hasn't spoken to the mother or daughter since prior to them leaving Hondouras.

But lets just pretend everything is OK shall we?

The picture is symbolic of the situation, a situation that personally I think is a disgrace.

OK as I thought some will just hate on Trump and make false statements up. matCov you are blinded by your hate for Trump. I have lived a long time in the USA and in Texas where a large border exist. What I have seen and what I know is not one bit like you infer.
I paid handsomely for my legal right to live there with my kids. People south of the border continue to cross illegally and know what they are doing is illegal.
I employed many illegal Mexican workers in my restaurants there who obtain fake social security cards. I know the reality, you just need to be there to get an unbiased opinion. You think Trump is not popular among the majority? Wrong there, he is adored. As for tariffs, the EU is the worse offender.

Paxman II said:

OK as I thought some will just hate on Trump and make false statements up. matCov you are blinded by your hate for Trump. I have lived a long time in the USA and in Texas where a large border exist. What I have seen and what I know is not one bit like you infer.
I paid handsomely for my legal right to live there with my kids. People south of the border continue to cross illegally and know what they are doing is illegal.
I employed many illegal Mexican workers in my restaurants there who obtain fake social security cards. I know the reality, you just need to be there to get an unbiased opinion. You think Trump is not popular among the majority? Wrong there, he is adored. As for tariffs, the EU is the worse offender.

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I don’t deny there is a problem and that immigrants work black. I don’t like Trump‘s bull in a China Shop tactics. Putting kids in cages has discredited him. He just isn’t a good president. Even if his base adores him. He had to at least partly retract and contradict himself and there are still kids in limbo in the US after the parents have been deported. Just more chaos from this illiterate idiot.

Paxman II said:

OK as I thought some will just hate on Trump and make false statements up. matCov you are blinded by your hate for Trump. I have lived a long time in the USA and in Texas where a large border exist. What I have seen and what I know is not one bit like you infer.
I paid handsomely for my legal right to live there with my kids. People south of the border continue to cross illegally and know what they are doing is illegal.
I employed many illegal Mexican workers in my restaurants there who obtain fake social security cards. I know the reality, you just need to be there to get an unbiased opinion. You think Trump is not popular among the majority? Wrong there, he is adored. As for tariffs, the EU is the worse offender.

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"Hate on Trump". [cringe]

Mike Huckabee done an interview recently with Donald Trump on Kim Yong Un, tariffs etc..

Paxman II said:

OK as I thought some will just hate on Trump and make false statements up.

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Which statements are false?

Paxman II said:

I employed many illegal Mexican workers in my restaurants there who obtain fake social security cards.

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Aren't you then part of the problem? If you're emptying illegal Mexican workers you're giving them reason to attempt to cross the border.

Trump administration officials, under pressure from the White House to provide a rationale for reducing the number of refugees allowed into the United States next year, rejected a study by the Department of Health and Human Services that found that refugees brought in $63 billion more in government revenues over the past decade than they cost.

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Trump Administration Rejects Study Showing Positive Impact of Refugees

The completely predictable results of starting a trade war with no real clue what you're doing begin:
Harley US plants lose out over Trump tariffs

chiefdave said:

The completely predictable results of starting a trade war with no real clue what you're doing begin:
Harley US plants lose out over Trump tariffs

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It's funny, on both sides of the Atlantic we've got governments who are apparently pro enterprise and business, yet both seem to be doing their level best to piss businesses off.

chiefdave said:

Which statements are false?

Aren't you then part of the problem? If you're emptying illegal Mexican workers you're giving them reason to attempt to cross the border.

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No the point I'm making is that they cross illegally, obtain false papers with false ID's from various scumbag resources which are impossible to check. The feds can then bust you for employing illegals.
There are many Hispanic families in Texas who are legal so it's a real problem for employers. All the money they earn (even the few legal ones) goes back to the family in Mexico, not spent within the economy. Every few months they go home to Mexico and then come back to repeat. While here they live in rented apartments and fill them with several families to cut their cost, fraudulently cheating the landlords. They drive cars around and nearly all have no insurance or even a driving license. When they cause an accident the victim in the other vehicle is left with no redress. It's a mess, always has been. The good citizens respect the law while these people ignore it.

Not sure why some seem so intent on stopping those less fortunate than themselves from having better lives. I remember during the Brexit campaign they interviewed this thick chav (surprise surprise) who said immigrants just come over here because they have better lives. And?

Paxman II said:

No the point I'm making is that they cross illegally, obtain false papers with false ID's from various scumbag resources which are impossible to check. The feds can then bust you for employing illegals.

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Surely that needs a change to the system rather than stopping people coming in. In this day and age the technology exists for this to not be an issue.

You say they don't benefit the economy and send all the money back home yet the study commissioned by Trump (and buried when it didn't give him the result he wanted) show they do.

Moving past economic migrants what do you think of the border agents physically blocking access to border crossings to those seeking refuge and then arresting them when they cross elsewhere despite them claiming refuge as soon as they cross? Do you think it is acceptable that those people get thrown in jail and their children taken from them?

torchomatic said:

Not sure why some seem so intent on stopping those less fortunate than themselves from having better lives. I remember during the Brexit campaign they interviewed this thick chav (surprise surprise) who said immigrants just come over here because they have better lives. And?

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If people in America are so concerned about this presumably they are all going to move elsewhere and hand the country back to the native Americans.

chiefdave said:

If people in America are so concerned about this presumably they are all going to move elsewhere and hand the country back to the native Americans.

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too late, they killed them all.

chiefdave said:

Surely that needs a change to the system rather than stopping people coming in. In this day and age the technology exists for this to not be an issue.

You say they don't benefit the economy and send all the money back home yet the study commissioned by Trump (and buried when it didn't give him the result he wanted) show they do.

Moving past economic migrants what do you think of the border agents physically blocking access to border crossings to those seeking refuge and then arresting them when they cross elsewhere despite them claiming refuge as soon as they cross? Do you think it is acceptable that those people get thrown in jail and their children taken from them?

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Mexico is not a 3rd world country. People can make claim through normal channels if they wish to seek refuge as you put it or asylum. No one needs to turn up at the border and cross illegally. Having said that yes the separation of the children is wrong and I'm pleased that has stopped (although this was going on under Obama too)

Satire gotta love it.

Paxman II said:

Mexico is not a 3rd world country. People can make claim through normal channels if they wish to seek refuge as you put it or asylum. No one needs to turn up at the border and cross illegally.

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What's the America's equivalent of the Dublin agreement? You're ignoring the fact that they aren't turning up to cross illegally, they are trying to present themselves at legal entry points and make their claim there. They are being blocked from doing so which is actually in breach of international law.

See the courts are now stepping in as despite the fuss Trump made proclaiming he had solved the problem with his executive order, ignoring the fact he'd created the problem in the first place, nothing has been done.

The CEO of Harley Davidson: "Our decision to move some of our operations is 100% based on President Trumps tariffs. Mr. Trump knows nothing about economics and even less about trade. The man is a moron."

They're wrong !
He's a Cumt worse than that ,he's a bad Cant

chiefdave said:

What's the America's equivalent of the Dublin agreement? You're ignoring the fact that they aren't turning up to cross illegally, they are trying to present themselves at legal entry points and make their claim there. They are being blocked from doing so which is actually in breach of international law.

See the courts are now stepping in as despite the fuss Trump made proclaiming he had solved the problem with his executive order, ignoring the fact he'd created the problem in the first place, nothing has been done.

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I can't spend my days debating the finer points of your argument so will leave you with a recent clip on CNN with a border patrol agent. Nohttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGuSdXiFtLk