Passport Control

For or Against Vaccine Passports?

  • For

    Votes: 30 65.2%
  • Against

    Votes: 16 34.8%

  • Total voters
    46

Sick Boy

Well-Known Member
Sep 29, 2008
18,963
10,386
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Verona, Italy
Again an absurd comparison if coming from a high risk country then clearly they will have to and it’s a 10 day restriction not one for an unspecified time period.

I actually think if it’s high risk and someone elects to travel they should be regardless of vaccine status
Would you say the amber list countries in Europe are ‘high risk’ considering comparable rates of vaccination and lower case numbers?
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Sep 19, 2011
62,700
20,667
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Not a big fan of them but been using them for a few weeks now and cases in Italy are at around 2500 cases a day and decreasing - if it avoids a lockdown then it’s better all round for the country.
Those who are too scared to get the vaccine pay €15 to be tested and that gives them a ‘Green Pass’ for 48 hours.
The daily cases are a misnomer really and is skewed by the number of tests each country does. The U.K. reported test figures are much higher
 

SBT

Well-Known Member
Sep 14, 2012
1,967
2,040
163
Again an absurd comparison if coming from a high risk country then clearly they will have to and it’s a 10 day restriction not one for an unspecified time period.

I actually think if it’s high risk and someone elects to travel they should be regardless of vaccine status
So why isn’t forcibly keeping people in their homes irrespective of whether they have the virus a slippery slope? I assume you think they should be allowed out to live freely once they produce the proper paperwork to show they likely don’t have Covid?
 

Sick Boy

Well-Known Member
Sep 29, 2008
18,963
10,386
313
Verona, Italy
The daily cases are a misnomer really and is skewed by the number of tests each country does. The U.K. reported test figures are much higher
Maybe because there are actually more people requiring tests?
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Sep 19, 2011
62,700
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Would you say the amber list countries in Europe are ‘high risk’ considering comparable rates of vaccination and lower case numbers?
The lower case numbers are a misnomer as I’ve stated we have far higher test stats for some reason also as I’ve said vaccination figures aren’t that relevant either as it’s transmitted anyway and many people of vulnerable age groups are not vaccinated
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Sep 19, 2011
62,700
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So why isn’t forcibly keeping people in their homes irrespective of whether they have the virus a slippery slope? I assume you think they should be allowed out to live freely once they produce the proper paperwork to show they likely don’t have Covid?
It’s a 10 day process which is not discriminatory
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Sep 19, 2011
62,700
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It’s only 10 days if you’re not vaccinated from Amber.
Even then it’s a situation which is a short time frame and a consequence of leaving a country. It’s not a restriction that will apply potentially for years to come is it?
 

Sick Boy

Well-Known Member
Sep 29, 2008
18,963
10,386
313
Verona, Italy
Even then it’s a situation which is a short time frame and a consequence of leaving a country. It’s not a restriction that will apply potentially for years to come is it?
In that case there’s no evidence to suggest that vaccine passports would be required for years to come either.
 
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Nick

Administrator
Feb 25, 2008
118,561
40,046
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Coventry
I admire your persistence at trying to push this obesity angle still despite it being shot down every time.

It's not remotely comparable. Last time I checked obesity still isn't contagious.
OK, so obesity isn't a factor with COVID hospitalisations / deaths?

Would a decrease in obesity make a difference in hospitalisations / deaths from COVID?
 
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Grendel

Well-Known Member
Sep 19, 2011
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In that case there’s no evidence to suggest that vaccine passports would be required for years to come either.
You miss the point. An isolation period is 10 days a vaccine passport is not invalid in 10 days is it?
 

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
May 3, 2015
25,792
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OK, so obesity isn't a factor with COVID hospitalisations / deaths?
It's about halfway down the list of underlying health conditions which exacerbate covid.
Can't remember what was top, diabetes is second though they'll be a certain amount of crossover with obesity, and it wasn't broken down into types 1and 2.
 

PVA

Well-Known Member
Apr 22, 2011
6,301
4,596
163
OK, so obesity isn't a factor with COVID hospitalisations / deaths?

Would a decrease in obesity make a difference in hospitalisations / deaths from COVID?
Nobody has said it isn't a factor.

But what's a quicker way out of this - getting everyone jabbed or getting all obese people to lose weight?
 

SBT

Well-Known Member
Sep 14, 2012
1,967
2,040
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It’s a 10 day process which is not discriminatory
???

The quarantine rules have got progressively more restrictive, including forcing people to stay in government-approved hotels rather than their own homes. But no slippery slope there I take it?

And again - presumably you think people should be allowed out of quarantine once they produce the paperwork that shows they likely don’t have Covid?
 

Nick

Administrator
Feb 25, 2008
118,561
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Coventry
It's about halfway down the list of underlying health conditions which exacerbate covid.
Can't remember what was top, diabetes is second though they'll be a certain amount of crossover with obesity, and it wasn't broken down into types 1and 2.
One study found that for people with a BMI of 35 to 40, risk of death from COVID-19 increases by 40% and with a BMI over 40 by 90%, compared to those not living with obesity. Other data found that in intensive care units, 7.9% of critically ill patients with COVID-19 had a BMI over 40 compared with 2.9% of the general population.
Obesity is a choice for some people. So when can we expect obese passports for them?
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Sep 19, 2011
62,700
20,667
813
???

The quarantine rules have got progressively more restrictive, including forcing people to stay in government-approved hotels rather than their own homes. But no slippery slope there I take it?

And again - presumably you think people should be allowed out of quarantine once they produce the paperwork that shows they likely don’t have Covid?
And again it’s for 10 days - so if you agree or not with it it’s 10 days. I don’t agree with changing status without 14 days so it doesn’t impact those in travel but it’s nowhere near the same issue
 

Nick

Administrator
Feb 25, 2008
118,561
40,046
1,063
Coventry
Nobody has said it isn't a factor.

But what's a quicker way out of this - getting everyone jabbed or getting all obese people to lose weight?
It isn't ever going to go away, we need to live with it.

If we don't want the NHS to be crippled, ban people who choose to be obese from doing stuff. Where does it end? Smokers, drinkers, people who drive cars etc?
 

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
May 3, 2015
25,792
28,828
313
Obesity is a choice for some people. So when can we expect obese passports for them?
That doesn't make sense?
You can see if someone's obese andobese can and are refused certain treatments on the NHS.
I'm against vacinne passports but I don't see your argument as avalid comparison. It's not the same.
 

PVA

Well-Known Member
Apr 22, 2011
6,301
4,596
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It isn't ever going to go away, we need to live with it.

If we don't want the NHS to be crippled, ban people who choose to be obese from doing stuff. Where does it end? Smokers, drinkers, people who drive cars etc?
It's just a ridiculous argument and I can't see why you persist with it.

Lots is already done to prevent the things you mention. Smoking ban. Driving tests. Etc etc
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Sep 19, 2011
62,700
20,667
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Vaccine passports can ultimately be used for lifestyle and employment restrictions, insurance policy terms it’s hardly the same as isolating in an Ibis after a jaunt to a red zone country
 

Marty

Well-Known Member
Mar 20, 2011
6,260
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213
How many were at the protest with the woman calling for doctors and nurses to hang?
Probably an insignificant number compared to those who are unvaccinated.
 

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
May 3, 2015
25,792
28,828
313
I thought it was about not crippling the NHS though?
By stopping the spread.
You don't spread Obesity, or lung cancer or other mainly lifestyle diseases.
I just think there has to be a better way of containing it and that vacinne passports will be a gateway to fuck knows what else.
 

Sick Boy

Well-Known Member
Sep 29, 2008
18,963
10,386
313
Verona, Italy
How is it ridiculous?

The risk of COVID hospitalisation / death / severe illness from it increases massively with obesity. Obesity is a choice for some people.
Why would anyone choose to be obese?
 
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Grendel

Well-Known Member
Sep 19, 2011
62,700
20,667
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Probably an insignificant number compared to those who are vaccinated.
She did stage her own event in her town in Sussex - around 20 attended

Anti Vax brigade are rabble rousing anarchists no different to lunatics who think saving the planet is sitting on the M25 on a Monday morning
 
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Sick Boy

Well-Known Member
Sep 29, 2008
18,963
10,386
313
Verona, Italy
By stopping the spread.
You don't spread Obesity, or lung cancer or other mainly lifestyle diseases.
I just think there has to be a better way of containing it and that vacinne passports will be a gateway to fuck knows what else.
Apart from smoking 😉
It’s amazing so many get outraged about being tracked and their personal data yet happily have Facebook, Instagram etc accounts.
 
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Grendel

Well-Known Member
Sep 19, 2011
62,700
20,667
813
Apart from smoking 😉
It’s amazing so many get outraged about being tracked and their personal data yet happily have Facebook, Instagram etc accounts.
its nothing to do with personal data
 

SBT

Well-Known Member
Sep 14, 2012
1,967
2,040
163
And again it’s for 10 days - so if you agree or not with it it’s 10 days. I don’t agree with changing status without 14 days so it doesn’t impact those in travel but it’s nowhere near the same issue
I’m sorry, I genuinely can’t understand what you’ve written here (changing what status?)

If the government can legally imprison me for 10 days regardless of my health status, and won’t let me out until I prove I likely don’t have Covid, isn’t the vaccine passport question already settled in principle?