New Ricoh deal (1 Viewer)

letsallsingtogether · Apr 30, 2013

So ACL Give in to SISU'S pressure rent at £450,000 and a share in the takings at football matches.

So how much Profit do they actually make on a match day.
It Can't be more then £10,000 so a 50 percent share would give them a massive 5 grand to spend.

How is that going to cut the 60 million debt we incurred in the last season ?:thinking about:

lordsummerisle · Apr 30, 2013

letsallsingtogether said:
So ACL Give in to SISU'S pressure rent at £450,000 and a share in the takings at football matches.

So how much Profit do they actually make on a match day.
It Can't be more then £10,000 so a 50 percent share would give them a massive 5 grand to spend.

How is that going to cut the 60 million debt we incurred in the last season ?:thinking about:

You're not really encouraging anybody to want to buy the club and half of ACL with figures like that are you?

fernandopartridge · Apr 30, 2013

Oh. Wish somebody mentioned this already.

Baginton · Apr 30, 2013

they didnt incure it in the last season

its a debenture, not debt, only come debt when people want to buy the club

rupert_bear · Apr 30, 2013

lordsummerisle said:
You're not really encouraging anybody to want to buy the club and half of ACL with figures like that are you?

But any would be buyer of the half share would tap into 50% of the whole Ricoh profit (or loss) not just matchdays and this is i believe the stumbling block. SISU fucked up and have missed the half share boat and are only being offered proceeds from matchday revenue and now have their arses in their hands. In fact if i was ACL i would drop the rent to a reasonable percentage per 1000 on the gate and give them (sisu) all the f&b revenue profit. That might encourage sisu to put more effort into getting things right ON the pitch.

psgm1 · Apr 30, 2013

letsallsingtogether said:
So ACL Give in to SISU'S pressure rent at £450,000 and a share in the takings at football matches.

So how much Profit do they actually make on a match day.
It Can't be more then £10,000 so a 50 percent share would give them a massive 5 grand to spend.

How is that going to cut the 60 million debt we incurred in the last season ?:thinking about:

Where has this gem come from? Not showing on the sisu telegraph. THis is bad news if true

@richh87 · Apr 30, 2013

Can't see this anywhere. Have you made it up?

ashbyjan · Apr 30, 2013

I think it was an attempt at irony or is it infamy - infamy infamy they've all got it in for me!!!!!!

Ashdown1 · Apr 30, 2013

letsallsingtogether said:
So ACL Give in to SISU'S pressure rent at £450,000 and a share in the takings at football matches.

So how much Profit do they actually make on a match day.
It Can't be more then £10,000 so a 50 percent share would give them a massive 5 grand to spend.

How is that going to cut the 60 million debt we incurred in the last season ?:thinking about:

When you take out SISU's two admin fees totalling about £25 million, You'd probably find we are just about breaking even now. With the forthcoming cuts to high wage earners and a better rent and F &B deal the club could move forward now quite successfully without the same unscrupulous wankers loading debt against it !

Skybluesquirrel · Apr 30, 2013

Ashdown1 said:
When you take out SISU's two admin fees totalling about £25 million, You'd probably find we are just about breaking even now. With the forthcoming cuts to high wage earners and a better rent and F &B deal the club could move forward now quite successfully without the same unscrupulous wankers loading debt against it !

Where do you get the info on the admin fee charges from? Im trying to dissect the accounts at the moment and haven't come across anything like that...

torchomatic · Apr 30, 2013

We'll no doubt have a different set of unscrupulous wankers loading debt. Different regime. Different wankers. The way of the world.

Ashdown1 said:
When you take out SISU's two admin fees totalling about £25 million, You'd probably find we are just about breaking even now. With the forthcoming cuts to high wage earners and a better rent and F &B deal the club could move forward now quite successfully without the same unscrupulous wankers loading debt against it !

ajsccfc · Apr 30, 2013

I assume the original post is a hypothetical scenario with a question rather than a juicy piece of gossip.

Tank Top · Apr 30, 2013

New Ricol Deal >>> Well lets consider this, and please feel free to correct me if I'm wide of the mark.
According to our present owners, the only thing in LTD is the lease, with LTD being in administration, does this mean that ACL have no hope in recovering the 1.3 million of defaulted Rent owed by sisu, because LTD has no Assets.

Bearing this in mind, is it Likely that ACL will enter into an agreement with sisu to draw up another lease, when some subsidiary or other of sisu, still owes a fortune, and could/ Would, sisu have the Brass neck to pull the same stunt again?
Al this is Hypothetical if the G/S is not in holdings, as the Sky Blues will be playing nowhere if it cant be located, but I'm half expecting it to pop up, like one of those rubber Dolls in the back of Del Boys Van and Shout "April Fool"

BrisbaneBronco · Apr 30, 2013

IMHO I think hell will freeze over before SISU/ACL/Council work out another deal.
The situation is untenable.
We will never return to the Ricoh under SISU ownership

James Smith · Apr 30, 2013

ashbyjan said:
I think it was an attempt at irony or is it infamy - infamy infamy they've all got it in for me!!!!!!

Are you channelling Frankie by any chance?

SkyBlueHomer · Apr 30, 2013

BrisbaneBronco said:
IMHO I think hell will freeze over before SISU/ACL/Council work out another deal.
The situation is untenable.
We will never return to the Ricoh under SISU ownership

All parties must work out a deal. If the number of people stay away from 'home' games that is being threatened it could be curtains for the club.

I fear you may well be correct though

torchomatic · Apr 30, 2013

Kenny, surely? :thinking about:

James Smith said:
Are you channelling Frankie by any chance?

James Smith · Apr 30, 2013

torchomatic said:
Kenny, surely? :thinking about:

Up Pompei?

torchomatic · Apr 30, 2013

Carry On!

[video=youtube;kvs4bOMv5Xw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kvs4bOMv5Xw[/video]

James Smith said:
Up Pompei?

James Smith · Apr 30, 2013

torchomatic said:
Carry On!

[video=youtube;kvs4bOMv5Xw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kvs4bOMv5Xw[/video]

Thank you, that's one I don't own, yet!

torchomatic · Apr 30, 2013

I wouldn't be so sure. It doesn't suit ACL, SISU or more importantly the fans not to play at the Ricoh come August. Remember all the "we'll be playing our final three games at Walsall" fiasco? I think they'll sort it out eventually.

BrisbaneBronco said:
We will never return to the Ricoh under SISU ownership

letsallsingtogether · Apr 30, 2013

This is a scenario want to know how takings from match day takings is such a big issue when the taking are rather small.
Unless you buy a half share then you would get 50% of everything profit or loss

ajsccfc · Apr 30, 2013

Called it! I'm the perception king.

Skybluesquirrel · Apr 30, 2013

Tank Top said:
New Ricol Deal >>> Well lets consider this, and please feel free to correct me if I'm wide of the mark.
According to our present owners, the only thing in LTD is the lease, with LTD being in administration, does this mean that ACL have no hope in recovering the 1.3 million of defaulted Rent owed by sisu, because LTD has no Assets.

Bearing this in mind, is it Likely that ACL will enter into an agreement with sisu to draw up another lease, when some subsidiary or other of sisu, still owes a fortune, and could/ Would, sisu have the Brass neck to pull the same stunt again?
Al this is Hypothetical if the G/S is not in holdings, as the Sky Blues will be playing nowhere if it cant be located, but I'm half expecting it to pop up, like one of those rubber Dolls in the back of Del Boys Van and Shout "April Fool"

CCFC Ltd and CCFC Holdings both trade as companies with multiple transactions. What SISU release to the press isn't backed up in the financial reports that have been submitted. CCFC Ltd isn't just a holding company. I've just published a piece about the companies on my blog that debunks what SISU claim.

I think ACL will struggle to get the rent money owed, as their £1.3 million is only a small part of the £60 million of debt loaded onto the club by SISU.

Grendel · Apr 30, 2013

letsallsingtogether said:
So ACL Give in to SISU'S pressure rent at £450,000 and a share in the takings at football matches.

So how much Profit do they actually make on a match day.
It Can't be more then £10,000 so a 50 percent share would give them a massive 5 grand to spend.

How is that going to cut the 60 million debt we incurred in the last season ?:thinking about:

It's nothing to do with profit. It's revenue that counts.

No new owner will be paying that kind of rent anyway. ACL have fleeced the club for years.

I am genuinely staggered why anyone gives a stuff about them. Most clubs supporters' wouldn't. I hope it's just an anti owner thing and normality will come in when there are new owners - if not then some people really have to question what they really want.

letsallsingtogether · Apr 30, 2013

Grenel read the post before replying the profit is the revenue generated at match days which is what the stumbling block is.
All I am saying is that cannot amount to more then £10,000 per game.
You have 10,000 fans in the Arena only 10 % spend any money and the Rent is what the Rent is, as they have said they not happy so want to move away that is there prerogative but that puts the club under even more financial pressure, because they will borrow the money on the back of the club then the debt rises even further cant afford £400,000 rent but can build a new stadium at a cost of what 20 30 40 million? and the revenue stays the same but all running costs building repairs etc are paid by them.
As for new owners they have been here for 5 years

Grendel said:
It's nothing to do with profit. It's revenue that counts.

No new owner will be paying that kind of rent anyway. ACL have fleeced the club for years.

I am genuinely staggered why anyone gives a stuff about them. Most clubs supporters' wouldn't. I hope it's just an anti owner thing and normality will come in when there are new owners - if not then some people really have to question what they really want.

Grendel · Apr 30, 2013

letsallsingtogether said:
Grenel read the post before replying the profit is the revenue generated at match days which is what the stumbling block is.
All I am saying is that cannot amount to more then £10,000 per game.
You have 10,000 fans in the Arena only 10 % spend any money and the Rent is what the Rent is, as they have said they not happy so want to move away that is there prerogative but that puts the club under even more financial pressure, because they will borrow the money on the back of the club then the debt rises even further cant afford £400,000 rent but can build a new stadium at a cost of what 20 30 40 million? and the revenue stays the same but all running costs building repairs etc are paid by them.
As for new owners they have been here for 5 years

If a stadium was ever built they wouldn't pay for it. Revenue on food and drink averaged about £850,000 a year I believe from memory. 60% of that is worth a lot of wages in this league.

Bluegloucester · Apr 30, 2013

Grendel said:
If a stadium was ever built they wouldn't pay for it. Revenue on food and drink averaged about £850,000 a year I believe from memory. 60% of that is worth a lot of wages in this league.

You are comparing historic revenue in Championship with present day, does not compare.

Nonleagueherewecome · Apr 30, 2013

torchomatic said:
Carry On!

[video=youtube;kvs4bOMv5Xw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kvs4bOMv5Xw[/video]

Possibly the greatest Carry On line ever. Along with every time Sid James cackled his laugh, of course.

letsallsingtogether · Apr 30, 2013

Gendel do the maths for yourself.
When the stadium opened you could not get to the bar for love or money.
They had every bar open and even had people walking around with packs on there backs selling beer.
Now only a quarter of the bars are open you get served within ten minutes and they only have 2 people serving so where you get your figures from I don't know

Grendel said:
If a stadium was ever built they wouldn't pay for it. Revenue on food and drink averaged about £850,000 a year I believe from memory. 60% of that is worth a lot of wages in this league.

Jack Griffin · Apr 30, 2013

Grendel said:
If a stadium was ever built they wouldn't pay for it. Revenue on food and drink averaged about £850,000 a year I believe from memory. 60% of that is worth a lot of wages in this league.

Previous seasons.. taken from accounts, here
http://www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/23232-Published-Income-details?p=307117&viewfull=1#post307117
year............ Catering.......... Commercial........... Gate
2001 ............901,634 ............16,298,224 .......6,740,614
2002............ 537,156............. 11,930,492 ......3,978,066
2003 ..............78,926 .............11,032,834 ......3,388,323
2004 .............84,596.............. 4,411,966........ 3,391,876
2005 ............911,625 ..............3,782,202 .......3,992,244
2006 ...............6,630............... 4,528,260........ 5,391,012
2007 .....................0 ...............4,355,308........ 5,311,248
2008 .....................0............... 5,351,422 ........5,738,333
2009..................... 0 ...............5,908,511........ 4,945,740
2010..................... 0................ 6,593,786....... 4,360,518
2011 .....................0................ 8,133,123....... 3,925,900

Given the crowd are half as big then so will turnover, maybe £500,000, probaby less. ACL offered CCFC a deal where the amounts could be cross invoiced for SCMP purposes, so there shouldn't be an issue over this, they can include the F&B turnover if they accept the deal that was offered.

The issue is not as you suggest, it is about willingness to negotiate in good faith.

letsallsingtogether · Apr 30, 2013

Grendel said:
If a stadium was ever built they wouldn't pay for it..

So your saying they don't pay their rent so it is ACL's fault? and that they won't pay to have their new stadium built who they going to blame for that? the builder who has charged them too much even thou they agreed to it at the start? the council? rate payers? landowner? My cat? yes as usual any one but themselves who in their right mind would trust them.
sounds like we be in the same position as now???
If we do happen to play our home games at another ground I hope they get the money up front or they will moan again about the rent.
Then Grendel my mate who will you blame then for fleecing us? :blue::blue:

inside track · Apr 30, 2013

New deal IS being worked on. Council facing massive pay out if Sisu win court case, so secret talks going on to resolve all issues.

bigfatronssba · Apr 30, 2013

inside track said:
New deal IS being worked on. Council facing massive pay out if Sisu win court case, so secret talks going on to resolve all issues.

Deal can only be done with Ltd, it now has nothing to do with Sisu.

Grendel · Apr 30, 2013

Jack Griffin said:
Previous seasons.. taken from accounts, here
http://www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/23232-Published-Income-details?p=307117&viewfull=1#post307117
year............ Catering.......... Commercial........... Gate
2001 ............901,634 ............16,298,224 .......6,740,614
2002............ 537,156............. 11,930,492 ......3,978,066
2003 ..............78,926 .............11,032,834 ......3,388,323
2004 .............84,596.............. 4,411,966........ 3,391,876
2005 ............911,625 ..............3,782,202 .......3,992,244
2006 ...............6,630............... 4,528,260........ 5,391,012
2007 .....................0 ...............4,355,308........ 5,311,248
2008 .....................0............... 5,351,422 ........5,738,333
2009..................... 0 ...............5,908,511........ 4,945,740
2010..................... 0................ 6,593,786....... 4,360,518
2011 .....................0................ 8,133,123....... 3,925,900

Given the crowd are half as big then so will turnover, maybe £500,000, probaby less. ACL offered CCFC a deal where the amounts could be cross invoiced for SCMP purposes, so there shouldn't be an issue over this, they can include the F&B turnover if they accept the deal that was offered.

The issue is not as you suggest, it is about willingness to negotiate in good faith.

Considering the commercial side is only there as there is a football stadium this proves how greedy and disgusting the council are.

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