My thoughts on what CCFC should do (but won't)... (1 Viewer)

Voice_of_Reason · Oct 21, 2014

Get several vastly experienced players who are coming to, or about to, coming to the end of their careers.. ie in the Dennis Wise mould. Might be short term but this might, with the experienced young players, lift CCFC into the Championship. A team containing, say 6 experienced "names", might just do it. I ran a very successful business for 30 years before selling it in 2010 and I do know that you have to speculate to accumulate, not cut back to he bare bones. Crazy idea ? Well, let the abuse and sarcasm start now !

Skyblueweeman · Oct 21, 2014

No abuse/sarcasm VoR and I can see your point of view from looking at Dennis Wise. Unfortunately, for every Dennis Wise, there's a few Tim Sherwoods/Kevin Kilbanes etc.

WM

Evo1883 · Oct 21, 2014

Voice_of_Reason said:
Get several vastly experienced players who are coming to, or about to, coming to the end of their careers.. ie in the Dennis Wise mould. Might be short term but this might, with the experienced young players, lift CCFC into the Championship. A team containing, say 6 experienced "names", might just do it. I ran a very successful business for 30 years before selling it in 2010 and I do know that you have to speculate to accumulate, not cut back to he bare bones. Crazy idea ? Well, let the abuse and sarcasm start now !

Hasnt pressley just had a whole pre season to recruit this type of player ... Another reason he should go

Skyblueweeman · Oct 21, 2014

CraigSBA said:
Hasnt pressley just had a whole pre season to recruit this type of player ... Another reason he should go

Are Danny Pugh or Marcus Tudgay not experienced? Granted Tudgay's not done too well but Pughs been injured quite a lot.

shy_tall_knight · Oct 21, 2014

David Prutton was the answer just not sure of the question, older players too big a risk De Zeuw was another

Astute · Oct 21, 2014

CraigSBA said:
Hasnt pressley just had a whole pre season to recruit this type of player ... Another reason he should go

Most good players want good wages.

Evo1883 · Oct 21, 2014

Skyblueweeman said:
Are Danny Pugh or Marcus Tudgay not experienced? Granted Tudgay's not done too well but Pughs been injured quite a lot.

Yes i agree , however when the midfield was getting utterly bipassed last season , what manager in their right mind would stick with the same central 2 , he has recruited badly

covmark · Oct 21, 2014

Voice_of_Reason said:
Get several vastly experienced players who are coming to, or about to, coming to the end of their careers.. ie in the Dennis Wise mould. Might be short term but this might, with the experienced young players, lift CCFC into the Championship. A team containing, say 6 experienced "names", might just do it. I ran a very successful business for 30 years before selling it in 2010 and I do know that you have to speculate to accumulate, not cut back to he bare bones. Crazy idea ? Well, let the abuse and sarcasm start now !

Evo1883 · Oct 21, 2014

Astute said:
Most good players want good wages.

buy 4-5 good players on higher wage instead of 7-9 crap players on low wages

Evo1883 · Oct 21, 2014

We needed 2 good central midfielders , a good winger, a good keeper and a good striker , he failed to bring in any of these players .
obrien is a winger and is our most influencial central midfielder

shy_tall_knight · Oct 21, 2014

In defence of SP Chuba Akpom - had to be a waggot deal no manager would agree to a player coming on loan but leaving to play for another club's youth team - imagine the effect that has on the management and the squad, it was surely a freebie, as I fear a lot of the Bournmouth loans are if not free definitely on the cheap.

Nick · Oct 21, 2014

Skyblueweeman said:
Are Danny Pugh or Marcus Tudgay not experienced? Granted Tudgay's not done too well but Pughs been injured quite a lot.

And JOB and Johnson.

Just not a centre mid like we need.

Deleted member 5849 · Oct 21, 2014

Astute said:
Most good players want good wages.

Undoubtedly a truth, although often older players seem to get priced out of a lower league market as much by perception of anything, of clubs assuming they'd still want £20k pw as they got in their pomp.

It's not the most stupid suggestion from VoR but yeah, getting the right old head is the skill, and arguably we already have ours in Webster, and that's deemed sufficient... along with Pugh and Tudgay obviously!

Hobo · Oct 21, 2014

We have plenty of players who have played over 100 games, several more who have played 50 odd games. Hardly inexperienced.

to me it comes down to confidence, self belief and desire and sweet FA to do with formation. It is time players individually and collectively took some responsibility for the poor form and did something about it. No excuses.

Deleted member 5849 · Oct 21, 2014

Hobo said:
We have plenty of players who have played over 100 games, several more who have played 50 odd games. Hardly inexperienced.

There's always a danger with any player once the fall down the leagues, that they're doing it because the motivation's no longer there, either. Of course for some it's just that they're not as sharp as they used to be, but others it's just they've done everything in their career and so they can't keep their motivation right at the top level.

And if we want skilled players who maybe aren't quite as driven as they should be, then we already have the likes of Fleck. And he's played in a cup final and won a league title, so the pressure of our level should be nothing really.

stupot07 · Oct 21, 2014

Hobo said:
We have plenty of players who have played over 100 games, several more who have played 50 odd games. Hardly inexperienced.

to me it comes down to confidence, self belief and desire and sweet FA to do with formation. It is time players individually and collectively took some responsibility for the poor form and did something about it. No excuses.

They may have played 50-100 games but they still lack experience, especially in game management. Look at Saturday, how as soon as we scored they kept the ball bet well and slowed the game down. It's not just experience, it's also leadership. Without Reda we don't have any, we also lack physicality and pace. Our players are far too nice. So in a way I agree with VoR but it's about the right player or two for the right money.

Promotion is now all but gone, would need 60-61 points from 33 games to get to the magic 73-74 point mark, that's automatic promotion form from here on. We just haven't go a good enough squad or the right set of attributes to do that, even with the addition of 1-2 experienced players

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors

shy_tall_knight · Oct 21, 2014

stupot07 said:
They may have played 50-100 games but they still lack experience, especially in game management. Look at Saturday, how as soon as we scored they kept the ball bet well and slowed the game down. It's not just experience, it's also leadership. Without Reda we don't have any, we also lack physicality and pace. Our players are far too nice. So in a way I agree with VoR but it's about the right player or two for the right money.

Promotion is now all but gone, would need 60-61 points from 33 games to get to the magic 73-74 point mark, that's automatic promotion form from here on. We just haven't go a good enough squad or the right set of attributes to do that, even with the addition of 1-2 experienced players

Stupot not sure how much you have seen but promotion won't happen we are in a relegation dogfight, of the 6 games I have seen we haven't been dominant in any

Deleted member 5849 · Oct 21, 2014

shy_tall_knight said:
Stupot not sure how much you have seen but promotion won't happen we are in a relegation dogfight, of the 6 games I have seen we haven't been dominant in any

tbh, and while I don't disagree (another year betting on us to go down, from me!) I tend to agree with Pressley that we're not *that* far away from being, well... alright.

It's a bit, to me, like the season we suddenly turned it around, reached the cup quarter finals, went on a fair old unbeaten run. That wasn't so much a change in players or even system, but as much confidence from winning a game or two.

Now admittedly we have to do that(!) but part of the reason we build so slowly is, to me, confidence rather than formations. Players are thinking about what should come naturally.

So I'll hedge my bets and be hopeful it can click... while not expecting it to

stupot07 · Oct 21, 2014

Stk - seen enough to know we're in a relegation fight. Was more aimed at the OP. This is a poor squad.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors

RFC · Oct 21, 2014

Deleted member 5849 said:
tbh, and while I don't disagree (another year betting on us to go down, from me!) I tend to agree with Pressley that we're not *that* far away from being, well... alright.

It's a bit, to me, like the season we suddenly turned it around, reached the cup quarter finals, went on a fair old unbeaten run. That wasn't so much a change in players or even system, but as much confidence from winning a game or two.

Now admittedly we have to do that(!) but part of the reason we build so slowly is, to me, confidence rather than formations. Players are thinking about what should come naturally.

So I'll hedge my bets and be hopeful it can click... while not expecting it to

Very much with you on this one but we are sadly lacking both confidence and leadership at the moment.

Vital that we get some of the more experienced injured players back sooner rather than later.

fernandopartridge · Oct 21, 2014

Voice_of_Reason said:
Get several vastly experienced players who are coming to, or about to, coming to the end of their careers.. ie in the Dennis Wise mould. Might be short term but this might, with the experienced young players, lift CCFC into the Championship. A team containing, say 6 experienced "names", might just do it. I ran a very successful business for 30 years before selling it in 2010 and I do know that you have to speculate to accumulate, not cut back to he bare bones. Crazy idea ? Well, let the abuse and sarcasm start now !

Like Kevin Kilbane
Arjan De Zueew
Etc etc

ccfcway · Oct 21, 2014

CraigSBA said:
buy 4-5 good players on higher wage instead of 7-9 crap players on low wages

This.

A solid spine of a decent GK, CB, CM and proven striker would have been a start.

Del Boy 82 · Oct 21, 2014

Voice_of_Reason said:
Get several vastly experienced players who are coming to, or about to, coming to the end of their careers.. ie in the Dennis Wise mould. Might be short term but this might, with the experienced young players, lift CCFC into the Championship. A team containing, say 6 experienced "names", might just do it. I ran a very successful business for 30 years before selling it in 2010 and I do know that you have to speculate to accumulate, not cut back to he bare bones. Crazy idea ? Well, let the abuse and sarcasm start now !

Not crazy at all, that's the ideal way.
Problem is I personally think he's tried that but was unable to do that to well missing key areas.

Keeper. Lost Murphy an only brought in allsop to challenge burge.

Defence. Brought in reda, Pugh to go with Webster all experienced to go with willis, Haynes, Phillips an Jordan Clarke, released seaborne an got seb Hines in on loan.

Midfield. Brought in o'brien an Swanson to add to Thomas, fleck, Daniels coulibaly on loan, finch is a summer suprise an Barton brought back in

Forwards. Brought in tudgay, miller, Jackson an mcquoid an nouble on loan.

So no really experienced keeper, unlucky with johnsons injury an red mist moment. Pugh in an out with injury. Midfield only really o'brien that will make the difference an tudgay has not delivered. So the experienced has not really worked in this case an not goals really being taken. So is this just unlucky, wrong mix of players or formation....

ccfcmustang · Oct 21, 2014

Our league position tells us that our young players arent as good as what SP likes to make out

westcountry_skyblue · Oct 21, 2014

If you watch Bristol City's third goal on saturday,That is where we should be aiming.
2-1 up and could have settled for the result,But you watch as Jay Emmanuel Thomas breaks away the desire of Wagstaffe to get on the end of it.
He busts a gut with a 40/50 yard run to be there.
Very impresssed with that goal by them !

shy_tall_knight · Oct 21, 2014

ccfcmustang said:
Our league position tells us that our young players arent as good as what SP likes to make out

We had some young players but there was also a lot of experience out there.

Jack Griffin · Oct 21, 2014

ccfcmustang said:
Our league position tells us that our young players arent as good as what SP likes to make out

And the injury list shows that gambles have been taken on the fitness of some of the experienced players.
Well if the injuries clear up, maybe it is just bad luck, but I'm thinking 'what a bunch of crocks' ATM.

rupert_bear · Oct 21, 2014

The trouble we have is we need a number of better players in all departments, the minimum being a goalkeeper, a defender, a tough guy midfielder and a goalscorer, costs money, costs wages. SISU will not spend a penny on the team, after 7 years don't you realise that.

Nick · Oct 21, 2014

rupert_bear said:
The trouble we have is we need a number of better players in all departments, the minimum being a goalkeeper, a defender, a tough guy midfielder and a goalscorer, costs money, costs wages. SISU will not spend a penny on the team, after 7 years don't you realise that.

So the players we have now aren't getting wages and are playing for free?

Otis · Oct 21, 2014

ccfcway said:
This.

A solid spine of a decent GK, CB, CM and proven striker would have been a start.

But isn't Johnson supposed to be the decent centre back and Tudgay the proven striker?

Let's face it, when Tudgay came in we were all quite pleased weren't we? I know I was. Watching him though, he now looks shot to me. A player on a very steep decline, at the end of his career.

Think we must now all be disappointed in him, SP included. With McG being a gamble that worked, Tudgay has been a gamble that hasn't.

Still time of course, but I haven't seen anything to suggest he is suddenly going to come good. He appears to be running through treacle at the moment for us.

The keeper, yes, I agree, but I think Reda and Tudgay were supposed to be the very players you have alluded to.

Deleted member 5849 · Oct 21, 2014

Otis said:
Still time of course, but I haven't seen anything to suggest he is suddenly going to come good. He appears to be running through treacle at the moment for us.

Tudgay reminds me of when we had Dean Holdsworth; a striker who's forgotten he needs to go into the penalty area now and again!

Otis · Oct 21, 2014

Deleted member 5849 said:
Tudgay reminds me of when we had Dean Holdsworth; a striker who's forgotten he needs to go into the penalty area now and again!

I was chuffed when we got him too, but he was pretty well shot as a footballer as it turned out.

Deleted member 5849 · Oct 21, 2014

Otis said:
I was chuffed when we got him too, but he was pretty well shot as a footballer as it turned out.

Good goal against Cardiff.

Shame it was the only one!

Chipfat · Oct 21, 2014

Looking for a D Wise caliber player to drop to L1 is not going to happen while the club is in its current state, people like Wise, Macca and Roland Neilson of this world are and were unbelievable players. Wise was not rated by a lot of fans until he come and stood out by a country mile from the 1st min, these players cost too much and will not drop this far down when Championship clubs will be searching as well for these type of standard...

We as a club lack depth, quality and in experience but all of those assets are way out of our reach, if you are trying to sign the next D Wise.. I'm afraid Pruttons, Pugh's and the Hine's are about as much as we can go...

Nick · Oct 21, 2014

The thing is, Prutton wasn't really a midfield hard man was he.

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