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Lucy Letby (1 Viewer)

  • Thread starter Saddlebrains
  • Start date Nov 12, 2020
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S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • May 24, 2024
  • #281
Grendel said:
Oooh a conspiracy- better get on it Basildon Bob Woodwood.
Click to expand...
I’m not suggesting “Woodwood” and Bernstein need to investigate a conspiracy here, but this case has shone a light on just how restrictive UK law can be on some court proceedings. Think it’s worth exploring if some of those laws may be out of date.
 

Liquid Gold

Well-Known Member
  • May 24, 2024
  • #282
SBT said:
From the BBC article on it:



There does seem to be an awful lot of secrecy and legal red tape around this case
Click to expand...
Bit Tommy Robinson
 
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • May 24, 2024
  • #283
Liquid Gold said:
Bit Tommy Robinson
Click to expand...
Bit of a stretch. I just want as much transparency as possible in our legal system.

There’s an article I shouldn't tell you about – is contempt law in a losing battle with reality? | Archie Bland

The concept behind the Contempt of Court Act is laudable, but in the age of social media it is clear an update is needed, says Archie Bland, editor of the Guardian’s First Edition newsletter
www.theguardian.com
 

Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
  • May 24, 2024
  • #284
SBT said:
From the BBC article on it:



There does seem to be an awful lot of secrecy and legal red tape around this case
Click to expand...
Understandable as there’s another case to prosecute still
 
Reactions: Otis, shmmeee and Deleted member 5849

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • May 24, 2024
  • #285
SBT said:
Bit of a stretch. I just want as much transparency as possible in our legal system.

There’s an article I shouldn't tell you about – is contempt law in a losing battle with reality? | Archie Bland

The concept behind the Contempt of Court Act is laudable, but in the age of social media it is clear an update is needed, says Archie Bland, editor of the Guardian’s First Edition newsletter
www.theguardian.com
Click to expand...

This is always read media whining that they can’t join in the social media rumour mill and speculation fest TBH.

I don’t buy the idea that the professional press should hold themselves to the same standards as boblotsanumbers on X.

While a case is ongoing I don’t see the public interest in allowing excessive media reporting. Even in 2024 reading something on Facebook and reading it in The Mail are treated differently by the vast majority of people.
 
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • May 24, 2024
  • #286
shmmeee said:
I don’t buy the idea that the professional press should hold themselves to the same standards as boblotsanumbers on X.
Click to expand...
Neither do I, but I think there’s a compelling case to be made for bringing a 40-year old law up to date with the internet age.
 

Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
  • May 26, 2024
  • #287
shmmeee said:
This is always read media whining that they can’t join in the social media rumour mill and speculation fest TBH.

I don’t buy the idea that the professional press should hold themselves to the same standards as boblotsanumbers on X.

While a case is ongoing I don’t see the public interest in allowing excessive media reporting. Even in 2024 reading something on Facebook and reading it in The Mail are treated differently by the vast majority of people.
Click to expand...
There’s a significant minority who get their news piped to say exactly what the want of their opinions to be sated
 

Nick

Administrator
  • Jul 2, 2024
  • #288
Found guilty of attempted murder on a different baby
 

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 2, 2024
  • #289
Nick said:
Found guilty of attempted murder on a different baby
Click to expand...

Having listened to the detail I can't for the life of me work out why this needed a retrial.
 

Nick

Administrator
  • Jul 2, 2024
  • #290
clint van damme said:
Having listened to the detail I can't for the life of me work out why this needed a retrial.
Click to expand...

Literally seen stood over the baby after messing with the breathing tube, not doing anything to save it....
 
Reactions: AOM and Sky Blue Pete

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 2, 2024
  • #291
Nick said:
Literally seen stood over the baby after messing with the breathing tube, not doing anything to save it....
Click to expand...

Alarms not working either so assume she'd tampered with them.
Baby died a few days later, though it can't be proven it had anything to do with this.
Horrendous for the parents.
 
Reactions: Nick

dutchman

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 21, 2024
  • #292

NHS hospital told nurse who tried to support Lucy Letby ‘she shouldn’t give evidence’

Medics say they were advised against getting involved in the case as it could harm their career
www.telegraph.co.uk

An NHS hospital told a nurse who wanted to support Lucy Letby she should not give evidence in her case, it has been claimed.

A nurse who trained with Letby at the Countess of Chester Hospital told The Telegraph that she was asked to be a character witness by the defence but her NHS trust advised her against getting involved.

A second nurse, and a registrar who still work for the hospital, also said they had been instructed by NHS bosses not to talk about the case, despite previously voicing their support for Letby.

The nurse who trained with Letby said she believed she was innocent, and had been made a scapegoat for bad practice on the neonatal ward, which she witnessed first hand.
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete

dutchman

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 4, 2024
  • #293

Hospital where Lucy Letby worked suffered bacteria outbreak ‘lethal’ to babies

Leaked risk report shows Pseudomonas aeruginosa colonised taps in nurseries of neonatal unit
www.telegraph.co.uk

The neonatal unit where Lucy Letby worked suffered an outbreak of bacteria lethal to babies, a leaked risk report shows.

David Livermore, professor of Medical Microbiology, at the University of East Anglia said: “Pseudomonas aeruginosa is an environmental organism that likes moisture.

“It can be lethal in newborns, especially premature ones, who lack a properly developed immune system.

“From mid-2015 to mid-2016 there were around 17 infant deaths at the Countess of Chester unit.

“We are asked to believe that this comprised two superimposed clusters, one of seven murders by Lucy Letby, and one where, to quote the crown prosecution expert, they died for the usual problems why small babies die: haemorrhage, infection, congenital problems.

“It is simpler to believe that we are looking at a single spike of fatal infections in a chaotic unit.”
 
Reactions: TarkaSB, chiefdave, wingy and 2 others

Diogenes

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 4, 2024
  • #294
Is that actually a thing, that people think it's a miscarriage of justice?

Genuinely don't know either way as I haven't kept tabs with any of the case, I just assumed she was bang to rights, didn't she have a diary recording everything that she'd done?
 

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 4, 2024
  • #295
Diogenes said:
Is that actually a thing, that people think it's a miscarriage of justice?

Genuinely don't know either way as I haven't kept tabs with any of the case, I just assumed she was bang to rights, didn't she have a diary recording everything that she'd done?
Click to expand...
There does seem to be a number of journalists looking into this and questioning her guilt. If there is anything to it or not I have no idea. Would be a huge miscarriage of justice if she's taken the fall for failings at the hospital.
 

rob9872

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 4, 2024
  • #296
Diogenes said:
Is that actually a thing, that people think it's a miscarriage of justice?

Genuinely don't know either way as I haven't kept tabs with any of the case, I just assumed she was bang to rights, didn't she have a diary recording everything that she'd done?
Click to expand...
I thought other factors convicted her. The diary was argued as a feeling guilty died on her watch kind of admission rather than actually killing them.
 
W

wingy

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 4, 2024
  • #297
rob9872 said:
I thought other factors convicted her. The diary was argued as a feeling guilty died on her watch kind of admission rather than actually killing them.
Click to expand...
Down to interpretation though isn't it, then expert opinion relied on?
 
Reactions: rob9872

Nuskyblue

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 4, 2024
  • #298
chiefdave said:
There does seem to be a number of journalists looking into this and questioning her guilt. If there is anything to it or not I have no idea. Would be a huge miscarriage of justice if she's taken the fall for failings at the hospital.
Click to expand...
There was a similar case in Canada or something. Same sort of thing, a nurse was banged up for a bunch of deaths on her ward, the statistics were the smoking gun which were later proved to be wrong.
 

MalcSB

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 4, 2024
  • #299
Diogenes said:
Is that actually a thing, that people think it's a miscarriage of justice?

Genuinely don't know either way as I haven't kept tabs with any of the case, I just assumed she was bang to rights, didn't she have a diary recording everything that she'd done?
Click to expand...
There are quite a number who think it’s a miscarriage of justice. Apparently a lot of hypothesising on the prosecutions part rather than bang to rights evidence.
 
Reactions: dutchman, Terry_dactyl and wingy

dutchman

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 6, 2024
  • #300

Neonatal nurses ‘resigning amid Lucy Letby fallout’

Staff fear being accused of harming babies, senior consultants says
www.telegraph.co.uk

Neonatal nurses are resigning from Britain’s baby units because they fear being accused of harming infants like in the case of Lucy Letby, a consultant has claimed in a new Channel 5 documentary.

In the documentary, which looks into concerns with the Letby conviction, Dr Svilena Dimitrova, a consultant neonatologist, warned that NHS problems were “endemic” and nurses were frightened they could be scapegoated for failing wards.

An experienced neonatal nurse, who chose to remain anonymous, told the documentary-makers the Letby conviction had left staff concerned that they may be accused of killing babies.

“It’s made me and others quite worried,” she said. “I think there is a general fear of speaking up.

“The conviction has had a negative effect on our profession, it’s made us more worried about what the parents might think.

“I think it’s alarming how they’ve thrown allegations at Lucy. I realise how easily it could have been one of my colleagues or me. What’s gone on with Lucy is very close to home.”
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete

Robinshio

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 7, 2024
  • #301
program on 5 now casting doubt that the evidence is sound
 

MalcSB

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 12, 2024
  • #302
Robinshio said:
program on 5 now casting doubt that the evidence is sound
Click to expand...
Enough doubt to challenge the beyond reasonable doubt criterion for a guilty verdict.
 

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 12, 2024
  • #303
Interesting watch, Not completely convinced me she didn't do it but certainly enough I think to have it looked at.
 
Reactions: Otis

MalcSB

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 12, 2024
  • #304
Sky_Blue_Dreamer said:
Interesting watch, Not completely convinced me she didn't do it but certainly enough I think to have it looked at.
Click to expand...
The thing is, you may not have been completely convinced that she didn’t do it, but were you convinced, beyond reasonable doubt, that she did.
The major evidence was presented but challenged in the programme. It sounds as if her defence team did not do a brilliant job, although if expert witnesses who have doubts are frightened to appear before the court that is a very sad state of affairs. Albeit not a surprise in the NHS,
 
Reactions: Terry_dactyl, Alan Dugdales Moustache, Sky Blue Pete and 2 others

Otis

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 12, 2024
  • #305
Sky_Blue_Dreamer said:
Interesting watch, Not completely convinced me she didn't do it but certainly enough I think to have it looked at.
Click to expand...
Said this before. Absolutely no harm in checking to see that they got it right and that new information doesn't change anything.
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 12, 2024
  • #306
Otis said:
Said this before. Absolutely no harm in checking to see that they got it right and that new information doesn't change anything.
Click to expand...

Who is going to "check" it?
 

MalcSB

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 12, 2024
  • #307
Grendel said:
Who is going to "check" it?
Click to expand...
It has to be an appeal court, but they seem remarkably reluctant to review cases - hence innocent people stay in jail for decades.
 
Reactions: Otis

Otis

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 12, 2024
  • #308
MalcSB said:
It has to be an appeal court, but they seem remarkably reluctant to review cases - hence innocent people stay in jail for decades.
Click to expand...
Sad isn't it.
 
Reactions: RedSalmon and MalcSB

Alan Dugdales Moustache

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 13, 2024
  • #309
She's innocent . That's my take.
 
Reactions: nicksar

Terry_dactyl

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 21, 2024
  • #310
Alan Dugdales Moustache said:
She's innocent . That's my take.
Click to expand...
I’ve read a few articles now, and Private Eye has been covering it too.
As has been said already, it seems ‘the beyond reasonable doubt’ verdict is shaky to say the least.
 
Reactions: nicksar and MalcSB

Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 21, 2024
  • #311
https://www.private-eye.co.uk/pictures/special_reports/lucy-letby-2.pdf
 

MalcSB

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 21, 2024
  • #312
Sky Blue Pete said:
https://www.private-eye.co.uk/pictures/special_reports/lucy-letby-2.pdf
Click to expand...
Most of the recent TV programme was based on what is presented in this article. More and more commentators seem to be casting doubt on the safety of the verdict. I read recently that a review could take 5 years which is incredibly sad if true and if Letby is innocent.
 
Reactions: nicksar, Sky Blue Pete and wingy

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 23, 2024
  • #313
dutchman said:

Neonatal nurses ‘resigning amid Lucy Letby fallout’

Staff fear being accused of harming babies, senior consultants says
www.telegraph.co.uk

Neonatal nurses are resigning from Britain’s baby units because they fear being accused of harming infants like in the case of Lucy Letby, a consultant has claimed in a new Channel 5 documentary.

In the documentary, which looks into concerns with the Letby conviction, Dr Svilena Dimitrova, a consultant neonatologist, warned that NHS problems were “endemic” and nurses were frightened they could be scapegoated for failing wards.

An experienced neonatal nurse, who chose to remain anonymous, told the documentary-makers the Letby conviction had left staff concerned that they may be accused of killing babies.

“It’s made me and others quite worried,” she said. “I think there is a general fear of speaking up.

“The conviction has had a negative effect on our profession, it’s made us more worried about what the parents might think.

“I think it’s alarming how they’ve thrown allegations at Lucy. I realise how easily it could have been one of my colleagues or me. What’s gone on with Lucy is very close to home.”
Click to expand...

This is TBF and entire article based around “Sharon from work said…”
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete

MalcSB

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 23, 2024
  • #314
shmmeee said:
This is TBF and entire article based around “Sharon from work said…”
Click to expand...
Have a read of this and let us know what you think.

Stats about the letby case

www.triedbystats.com
 
Reactions: dutchman
W

wingy

Well-Known Member
  • Aug 23, 2024
  • #315
I think the defence or after being denied appeal it was always the interpretation of the stastical data presentation that was always open to question,and how those specialists were allowed to give their opinion but an absence of a counterpoint at trial wasn't it?
 
Reactions: dutchman and MalcSB
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