left wing agitation and John Mcdonnell (13 Viewers)

eastwoodsdustman · Jun 23, 2017

There seems to have been a real push by the hard left recently to stir up trouble on any manner of things from Question time to inciting trouble over the Grenfell tower fire.
There were loads of Socialist worker signs on the Grenfell march last week with a lot of people covering their faces when trying to incite the crowd and entering the council house.
Last nights goon on question time was just another in a growing list.
I cant see what they hope to achieve by trying to Hijack something so awful as the Grenfell fire tower and Mr Mcdonnell as a supposed politician should be ashamed of himself for trying to incite trouble.
Just imagine if Labour had got into office, he's have been one of the first in the cabinet.

Philosoraptor · Jun 23, 2017

I don't see the connection.

Nick · Jun 23, 2017

Isn't people in masks just twats who like kicking off at protests for the sake of it rather than for a reason?

ConnorDevine · Jun 23, 2017

eastwoodsdustman said:
I cant see what they hope to achieve by trying to Hijack something so awful as the Grenfell fire tower and Mr Mcdonnell as a supposed politician should be ashamed of himself for trying to incite trouble.

The Grenfell Tower fire is being seen as many as an issue of rich vs poor and therefore left vs right since the money on renovation was all spent on the cladding to make the tower less of an eye sore to the rich people who lived near it rather than on fire safety/anything which actually benefited the residents themselves despite their constantly aired concerns about the safety of the tower, and to add insult to injury it was the cladding which made the fire so lethal.

And in regards to causing trouble I see where you're coming from but honestly with 7 years of austerity and 10 years since the financial crash it's fairly understandable that the downtrodden are starting to feel a bit unheard by those in positions of power.

Deleted member 5849 · Jun 23, 2017

Philosorapter said:
I don't see the connection.

Indeed. The OP mentions some things to do with Grenfell then just throws John McDonnell's name in. At least say what he's supposed to have done with respect to it!

SkyBlueScottie · Jun 23, 2017

How the feck is it hard left to stand up for better public services, and a fairer country for all? Nurses, Dr's Teachers, Social Workers, Fire, Police, Ambulance are all in the front line and all saying the same thing! Since when did this country become so narrow minded and to only think of something and worse than that turn their noses up at helping others...

eastwoodsdustman · Jun 23, 2017

Philosorapter said:
I don't see the connection.

He was calling for a million people to march on parliament at the time when people were agitating and organising marches to protest about the fire. Poor timing? doubt it very much.

How the feck is it hard left to stand up for better public services, and a fairer country for all? Nurses, Dr's Teachers, Social Workers, Fire, Police, Ambulance are all in the front line and all saying the same thing! Since when did this country become so narrow minded and to only think of something and worse than that turn their noses up at helping others...

Not standing up for services it it though. Its just stirring up political unrest and in my opinion they're just using some of the people from Grenfell Tower to try and push their own aims.

clint van damme · Jun 23, 2017

those bloody plebs - why couldn't they have burned to death quietly instead of having all this fuss.

eastwoodsdustman · Jun 23, 2017

clint van damme said:
those bloody plebs - why couldn't they have burned to death quietly instead of having all this fuss.

its not about fuss though is it. Its about people using someones misfortune (to put it mildly) to stir up unrest.

clint van damme · Jun 23, 2017

eastwoodsdustman said:
its not about fuss though is it. Its about people using someones misfortune (to put it mildly) to stir up unrest.

will always happen. What is more important is the back story to these recent tragedies.
Police chiefs warned May cuts would leave us unable to stem the threat of terrorist attacks.
Residents warned of H&S risk of flat and ministers ignored recommendations from the Chiswick flat fires.
But no, lets concentrate on a few commies getting their SWP banners out and marching - you couldn't make it up.

Ian1779 · Jun 23, 2017

Trying to suggest that McDonnell is whipping up a frenzy on the back of a tragedy is ridiculous. There are valid questions that need answering - would you feel the same if it was someone in your family that died?

If you want to discuss agitation generally then lets just put up a compendium of Daily Mail front pages.

Philosoraptor · Jun 23, 2017

This is why I love this place, a place for everyone to meet that has some connection to Coventry.

Don't get me wrong, forget Twitter, this place has a larger reach and can change directly the voting intention of people from Coventry.

You can do more good here then you ever could as a Councillor.

Here's looking directly at you the right wing of the Coventry Labour group. I think your time is coming to an end.

eastwoodsdustman · Jun 23, 2017

Ian1779 said:
Trying to suggest that McDonnell is whipping up a frenzy on the back of a tragedy is ridiculous. There are valid questions that need answering - would you feel the same if it was someone in your family that died?

If you want to discuss agitation generally then lets just put up a compendium of Daily Mail front pages.

Its not about the mail inciting anything on this though is it? Surely for a long serving politician to say what he did when he did is either deliberately inciting trouble or very naive. I don't think he's naive for one minute.
Questions won't get answered by people trying to cause trouble playing on the tenants anger and grief.

Philosoraptor · Jun 23, 2017

What did he say?

Philosoraptor · Jun 23, 2017

Still waiting for the agitation part of this to be revealed.

clint van damme · Jun 23, 2017

Ian1779 said:
Trying to suggest that McDonnell is whipping up a frenzy on the back of a tragedy is ridiculous. There are valid questions that need answering - would you feel the same if it was someone in your family that died?

If you want to discuss agitation generally then lets just put up a compendium of Daily Mail front pages.

Philosoraptor · Jun 23, 2017

I'm amazed there's not a Princess Diana story in that spread,

eastwoodsdustman · Jun 23, 2017

clint van damme said:
View attachment 7618

Nice. I take it that's not your wallpaper at home!
Mcdonnell was whipping a frenzy up by calling on a million to march on the capital and topple the government. People are looking for any chance to jump on board and sadly people dying in a fire has been used as a vehicle for this.

Philosoraptor · Jun 23, 2017

We are living in strange times. Newspapers losing their clout in being the conscious of the nation and people now turning to social media to voice their views.

This can only be good for Democracy.

clint van damme · Jun 23, 2017

eastwoodsdustman said:
Nice. I take it that's not your wallpaper at home!
Mcdonnell was whipping a frenzy up by calling on a million to march on the capital and topple the government. People are looking for any chance to jump on board and sadly people dying in a fire has been used as a vehicle for this.

they need fucking toppling! You've either been living in a cave or a stately home for the last 5 years if you can't see what's going on.

clint van damme · Jun 23, 2017

"People are looking for any chance to jump on board and sadly people dying in a fire has been used as a vehicle for this."

The government used a global fuck up by the banks to impose austerity on working and middle class people, not heard you and your ilk moaning about that.

eastwoodsdustman · Jun 23, 2017

I don't think nationalising everything will help get us out of the financial mess that we were left with. If we are struggling at the moment where is the money going to come from to buy everything back? and who would be paying for it?

SkyBlueScottie · Jun 23, 2017

eastwoodsdustman said:
I don't think nationalising everything will help get us out of the financial mess that we were left with. If we are struggling at the moment where is the money going to come from to buy everything back? and who would be paying for it?

How do other nations who control energy companies, railways etc afford it?

SkyBlueScottie · Jun 23, 2017

Philosorapter said:
We are living in strange times. Newspapers losing their clout in being the conscious of the nation and people now turning to social media to voice their views.

This can only be good for Democracy.

That there is spot on... the world is changing, it started with the Gen Xer's and is being carried on by the millenials. As communication links have improved around the world we are quickly realising that we are not as different as the press / politicians would have continued to have us believe, within minutes somebody on the street can show you whats really happening rather than having to take your skew from the written press with a potential political bias, we are seeing via social media that people are marching on Downing Street because they believe our nations social values are being trampled on yet hardly any of the "established" press report on it, politics have been used to divide and conquer much like religion has done through the ages, and now the world is hopefully waking up to it.

Deleted member 5849 · Jun 23, 2017

SkyBlueScottie said:
How do other nations who control energy companies, railways etc afford it?

Through the profits made owning ours?

SkyBlueScottie · Jun 23, 2017

Deleted member 5849 said:
Through the profits made owning ours?

That cant be right. They dont make profits, hence them being sold off...

Grendel · Jun 23, 2017

clint van damme said:
they need fucking toppling! You've either been living in a cave or a stately home for the last 5 years if you can't see what's going on.

Dear old Len McClusky is on about mobilising the workforce in a series of strikes to bring down the Government. Dear old Len - lets ignore the ballot box and try to weaken the economy for political ideology no one wants.

Grendel · Jun 23, 2017

eastwoodsdustman said:
I don't think nationalising everything will help get us out of the financial mess that we were left with. If we are struggling at the moment where is the money going to come from to buy everything back? and who would be paying for it?

Given the debt as a percentage of GDP we have is already at 100% clearly it will do nothing other than increase debt through state ownership for no purpose whatsoever than a political ideology. Look at us we are nationalising the commanding heights as we are left wing.
The notion any more tax would be paid by the proposed Labour changes is a joke. I would just put any earnings over £80k in a pension fund so they get nothing. In the end the whole country would have huge hikes in tax under the spend, spend mantra

Philosoraptor · Jun 23, 2017

Grendel said:
Dear old Len McClusky is on about mobilising the workforce in a series of strikes to bring down the Government. Dear old Len - lets ignore the ballot box and try to weaken the economy for political ideology no one wants.

People do have the right to protest. You may not agree with what they're protesting about but the right is there.

Grendel · Jun 23, 2017

Philosorapter said:
People do have the right to protest. You may not agree with what they're protesting about but the right is there.

It depends what they are protesting about - if it is usurp the will of the people through a targeted action of withdrawal of labour for political gain - they do not

clint van damme · Jun 23, 2017

Grendel said:
Given the debt as a percentage of GDP we have is already at 100% clearly it will do nothing other than increase debt through state ownership for no purpose whatsoever than a political ideology. Look at us we are nationalising the commanding heights as we are left wing.
The notion any more tax would be paid by the proposed Labour changes is a joke. I would just put any earnings over £80k in a pension fund so they get nothing. In the end the whole country would have huge hikes in tax under the spend, spend mantra

given the current goverment have massively increased the debt you mention, why do you maintain they are doing a good job?
There are lots of examples of state ownership working,ironically, the tories have made sure that TFL remains state owned so they must trust it to get then and their banker mates to work.

eastwoodsdustman · Jun 23, 2017

Philosorapter said:
People do have the right to protest. You may not agree with what they're protesting about but the right is there.

Right to protest except if your name is Gerard Coyne.

clint van damme · Jun 23, 2017

eastwoodsdustman said:
Right to protest except if your name is Gerard Coyne.

what couldn't he protest about?

Grendel · Jun 23, 2017

clint van damme said:
given the current goverment have massively increased the debt you mention, why do you maintain they are doing a good job?
There are lots of examples of state ownership working,ironically, the tories have made sure that TFL remains state owned so they must trust it to get then and their banker mates to work.

So what do you think is the benefit of nationalising the energy companies?

eastwoodsdustman · Jun 23, 2017

clint van damme said:
what couldn't he protest about?

He's plenty of time on his hands to protest about whatever he likes now hasn't he.
Standing in opposition to Mclusky was a protest in itself and he's been removed from his position because of it.

left wing agitation and John Mcdonnell (13 Viewers)

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