Joy seppala has steadied the ship!! (2 Viewers)

Interesting piece and discussion. Everything about Sisu's involvement has, until now, been an utter shambles but, as I see it, its fortunes are becoming inextricably linked to those of CCFC. If the club and the arena are to be united, as appears to be happening, and there is big development potential, surely it doesn't matter who owns the club. Sisu/CCFC will either fail and get out, or they will succeed and everyone's happy. CCFC on its own is a basket case but CCFC+Arena is investable. Someone would want it - maybe Hoffman steps in then.

The council must sure that CCFC and the arena are bound together with hoops of iron before they sell the half share. Although I think the Arena needs CCFC, what must not happen is that Sisu somehow end up with the arena and are able to just dump the club.

I can see why Ian Palmer is feeling mildly optimistic.

As a side issue does anyone know how SISU are doing in any of their other ventures? I expect obviously some of their investments to have come off but there must be other notable failures along the way - that's how venture capital works - would be interesting to see how long they kept hold of some investments that ultimately failed - not a criticism of SISU as it happens with any investment fund - just thought it might give an insight into their investment mentality and ability to make tough decisions when they had to

skyblueman said:

They are here for now because they do not have the balls to admit it is a total cock-up and continue in the hope that they will get lucky and be able to minimise the losses or even make a profit - SISU should know when to give up and that was a good while ago - but we have egos here the size of the stadium and they do not want to admit they got it wrong - only unsustainable losses going forward or a major problem for the fund itself will change any of this I'm afraid

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In fact, they are staying because they have the 'balls' to carry on to minimise losses/profit, in a corporate world, you take risks.

If you we're a businessman I am sure you would take that risk, as you want to cut losses, I wouldn't be happy throwing away the amount of money they have spent (whatever sum, as it been disputed, point being, it's a LOT!

Even if SISU leave, who would want to take is over anyway? Hoffman hasn't got the 'balls' to come in with a realistic bid, probably because he has hardly any investment behind him? The fans taking us over? We have fuck all and be in a worse place as let face it, in the loyal 8k, how many can afford to help piece the money to run a football club.

Wake up, smell the coffee, if you look at it, SISU aren't THAT bad. Of course you will deny that as you seem (based on the fact of your SISU should leave now comment) that there is a saviour waiting in the wings? No, if SISU leave, admin or liquidation would be the most likely thing to happen.

Administration would be a dream if thats what it takes to get rid of these parasites. There is only one way this club is heading with these idiots at the helm,and thats down.

SkyBlue_Taylor said:

In fact, they are staying because they have the 'balls' to carry on to minimise losses/profit, in a corporate world, you take risks.

If you we're a businessman I am sure you would take that risk, as you want to cut losses, I wouldn't be happy throwing away the amount of money they have spent (whatever sum, as it been disputed, point being, it's a LOT!

Even if SISU leave, who would want to take is over anyway? Hoffman hasn't got the 'balls' to come in with a realistic bid, probably because he has hardly any investment behind him? The fans taking us over? We have fuck all and be in a worse place as let face it, in the loyal 8k, how many can afford to help piece the money to run a football club.

Wake up, smell the coffee, if you look at it, SISU aren't THAT bad. Of course you will deny that as you seem (based on the fact of your SISU should leave now comment) that there is a saviour waiting in the wings? No, if SISU leave, admin or liquidation would be the most likely thing to happen.

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Sorry but I disagree - SISU are not it would seem a shrewd outfit in their management of this investment and I do not think they have some fantastic grand master-plan hidden from the world - they bought into a plan that has failed in spectacular fashion and they have NO EXIT at the moment - this is a bad investment for them no question.

My SISU should leave comment wasn't one I am wished for by the way - I think it is difficult for any of them to write-off an investment this size but there comes a point where it becomes a dead loss - not their yet as there is still hope but on the other hand there are still massive losses mounting up.

FYI I am actually a businessman and I have worked with some big Venture Capitalists and believe me the egos on these guys can be huge - they always like to win big and hate losing - SISU will hate to lose on this and lose big they have so far- it is IMO this massive loss and a lack of any viable EXIT that keeps them bankrolling the club

I agree if SISU leave then administration is likely - not what I wish for at all - however unless SISU can turn it around completely they will over price the club and no one else will buy it - only likely change of ownership IMO is following an administration - the vultures are always around then ... just like SISU were before

Your'e wasting your time with some people,some people are too brainwashed.

valiant15 said:

Your'e wasting your time with some people,some people are too brainwashed.

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You are right.
Just look at me ... always say and believe the same. Never change my stance or oppinion. Doesn't matter what facts or evidence I am presented with ... I won't hear it.
I can't hear it.
So I just say the same ... over and over again.

skyblueman said:

Sorry but I disagree - SISU are not it would seem a shrewd outfit in their management of this investment and I do not think they have some fantastic grand master-plan hidden from the world - they bought into a plan that has failed in spectacular fashion and they have NO EXIT at the moment - this is a bad investment for them no question.

My SISU should leave comment wasn't one I am wished for by the way - I think it is difficult for any of them to write-off an investment this size but there comes a point where it becomes a dead loss - not their yet as there is still hope but on the other hand there are still massive losses mounting up.

FYI I am actually a businessman and I have worked with some big Venture Capitalists and believe me the egos on these guys can be huge - they always like to win big and hate losing - SISU will hate to lose on this and lose big they have so far- it is IMO this massive loss and a lack of any viable EXIT that keeps them bankrolling the club

I agree if SISU leave then administration is likely - not what I wish for at all - however unless SISU can turn it around completely they will over price the club and no one else will buy it - only likely change of ownership IMO is following an administration - the vultures are always around then ... just like SISU were before

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We have different opinions fair enough, but if I was SISU now, I wouldn't pack up or leave, nor try to sell, I'd roll the dice on trying to get promoted, which they have to some extent (signing 13 odd players) and buying the RICOH, cutting losses and making us a more sellable 'business' (I hate calling football clubs businesses, especially Cov) to cut loses.

Their egos are incredibly huge, but they obviously see potential of what could happen, hence why they haven't sold/left.

Football as a whole, is a risky investment, it either pays of or it don't, for SISU, it hasn't worked out but, if we get promoted, it could be the start of something.

Lets face it, if SISU sold us now, the next people who come in, will only find themselves in the same situation as SISU are now.

Also, too many posters are way too short-sighted, BEFORE SISU TOOK OVER, there were fundamental issues that were out of their hands! E.g. Ricoh.

McGinity and co. are the REAL villians here.

SkyBlue_Taylor said:

We have different opinions fair enough, but if I was SISU now, I wouldn't pack up or leave, nor try to sell, I'd roll the dice on trying to get promoted, which they have to some extent (signing 13 odd players) and buying the RICOH, cutting losses and making us a more sellable 'business' (I hate calling football clubs businesses, especially Cov) to cut loses.

Their egos are incredibly huge, but they obviously see potential of what could happen, hence why they haven't sold/left.

Football as a whole, is a risky investment, it either pays of or it don't, for SISU, it hasn't worked out but, if we get promoted, it could be the start of something.

Lets face it, if SISU sold us now, the next people who come in, will only find themselves in the same situation as SISU are now.

Also, too many posters are way too short-sighted, BEFORE SISU TOOK OVER, there were fundamental issues that were out of their hands! E.g. Ricoh.

McGinity and co. are the REAL villians here.

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Totally agree it was a basket case before they came in - however it is still a bit of a basket case you have to concede that- they have been at it for FIVE years and we are a worse position now then we have ever been - that's not my opinion it's reality

Losses run into millions a year still - all the players and the management are all from SISU's tenure - the club doesn't own half the stadium as of yet - our position now is of their making - ALL the money they put in and taken out has gone and we are worse off than we were

My point is simply that SISU are only here because they have no choice - the club does not have any value yet and the only win they can make now is to get us back up to the top table - no one will buy us now for what they would want so they are stuck with us

Bottom line with all this is that it easy to please most fans ............ win a few games

The mood of optimism is based on the recent record of 7 out of 9 points and a cup win and good night out in London where we were not disgraced. Optimism stems from the pitch .......... most fans have no real interest in the shenanigans going on behind the scenes financial and otherwise.

People dress it up with reasons about finances steadier, buying the Ricoh, etc. It doesnt matter if those perceptions are actually wide of the mark and the reality is we are still loss making debt ridden etc. So long as the team is winning then the cracks will be papered over ........... and in a way it is what we need, optimism, because it will bring bigger crowds and money to the club. If it works for fans to ignore the actual facts and realities then i can see that just dont complain if reality bites at some point.

So dont dress up the growing optimism on the pitch as solving those problems or hiding the causes and remaining huge problems. A lot of this debt and mess is directly attributable to decisions made in the last 5 years.... only been one owner in that time..... and they and the problems have not gone away

It is however good to be optimistic about the team and be in with a good chance of winning ......... no matter what lurks in the back ground

If we get promoted it could be the start of something? So why hasn't it been the start of something for the last 5 years?

skyblueman said:

Totally agree it was a basket case before they came in - however it is still a bit of a basket case you have to concede that- they have been at it for FIVE years and we are a worse position now then we have ever been - that's not my opinion it's reality

Losses run into millions a year still - all the players and the management are all from SISU's tenure - the club doesn't own half the stadium as of yet - our position now is of their making - ALL the money they put in and taken out has gone and we are worse off than we were

My point is simply that SISU are only here because they have no choice - the club does not have any value yet and the only win they can make now is to get us back up to the top table - no one will buy us now for what they would want so they are stuck with us

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I'm not pro SISU, I like to think I'm telling it as it is.

SISU, have been hindered MASSIVELY due to ownership of the Ricoh, that is the core of all our problems, we must've missed out on at least 10m+, SISU should've brought a share, but it was unlikely we could get a share unless we got promoted.

Manager mise, they haven't been great, Coleman being the worse, massively overspent, massively underachieved.

It's perceived as being 1 sided in that it's all SISU, when actually, their predecessors were worse. IMO.

The Telegraph article is all spin.
We are very poorly served by those particular gentlemen of the press.
This forum (with a few notable exceptions) is a far more useful medium.
Naming no names but quite a few on here beat the professional journos hands down.
Keep up the good work