Joey Barton comments on Twitter (1 Viewer)

CJparker · Feb 7, 2012

All the papers are talking about whether Barton will avoid contempt of court charges over Twitter comments about the John Terry / Anton Ferdinand case - but what did he actually say? Can't find his actual comments anywhere!

Si80 · Feb 7, 2012

In short, he basically said that he wasn't anywhere near the incident so didn't hear what Terry said for himself. But, it's plain to see via video evidence what was said and that the FA shouldn't be allowing the case to continue in the manor that they have.

His casepoint being, that if it were anyone else (eg: Evra / Suarez case) then it would have been resolved within days, not being dragged through court and costing the taxpayers money.

stupot07 · Feb 7, 2012

He hasn't said anything that hasn't already been said in the media.

Otis · Feb 7, 2012

Si80 said:
In short, he basically said that he wasn't anywhere near the incident so didn't hear what Terry said for himself. But, it's plain to see via video evidence what was said and that the FA shouldn't be allowing the case to continue in the manor that they have.

His casepoint being, that if it were anyone else (eg: Evra / Suarez case) then it would have been resolved within days, not being dragged through court and costing the taxpayers money.

But it's not plain to see is it? Part of the conversation is blocked out by players going past. Can't see where the concrete proof is of exactly what he said word for word, and therein lies the problem. If Terry did say what he's supposed to have said I think it is going to be hard to prove in a court of law. If you only have part of a conversation then the rest is open to conjecture.

Even if Terry is guilty of saying what he's reported to have said I can still see him being found not guilty in court. Seems like Ferdinand didn't hear what was said, Barton didn't hear what was said and Ashley Cole was the closest to Terry, so as his teammate you would expect him to back his fellow player in this wouldn't you.

stupot07 · Feb 7, 2012

But can he be found guilty by the FA if proved innocent in court? The FA only need the same level of proof to the Saurez case don't need to prove guilt 'beyond reasonable doubt' like a court of law.

rob9872 · Feb 7, 2012

The biggest farce of all is that the maximum penalty for such an offence is £2,500. How much will it cost for the courts and all of the lawyers etc not to mention the ridiculous amount of space in the papers day after day which is afforded until some real news comes along. Surely it would be better for everyone concerned if he said look I didn't do it but I'll accept a 3 game ban and make a £25k (10 x max fine) donation to a charity for helping black kids on the streets of London. Then we could have all moved on months ago.

We'll_live_and_die · Feb 7, 2012

rob9872 said:
for helping black kids on the streets of London.

Why Black kids and why London? Why not kids in general?

hughescov · Feb 7, 2012

Haha singling out black kids would not do him any justice. He may as well say he will donate the money for the white kids of london!

Otis · Feb 7, 2012

stupot07 said:
But can he be found guilty by the FA if proved innocent in court? The FA only need the same level of proof to the Saurez case don't need to prove guilt 'beyond reasonable doubt' like a court of law.

But with the Suarez case weren't the FA saying his version of events didn't tie in with all the evidence that had been given by everyone else? Seems with the Terry case that hardly anyone, if anyone at all, heard what he said and of course the tv evidence suffers from the partial blind spot of what Terry words he actually uttered.

I think Terry will get off whether he is guilty or not.

Nick · Feb 7, 2012

What I don't get is if Ferdinand heard him why did he not say anything at the time? Surely he would be going mad if it deeply hurt him and offended him? I am not saying he would have started caving Terry's face in but was there a fracas or anything after he said it or did he just walk off?

Otis · Feb 7, 2012

Apparently he didn't hear him though, Nick.

The initial report by the media is that Terry heard about what he was reported to have said after he came off the pitch after the game and went straight into the QPR dresssing room to speak to Ferdinand to expain what he actually said and Ferdinand apparently said he hadn't got a clue what Terry was talking about.

The fact is he didn't hear anything at all.

Nick · Feb 7, 2012

So who did hear it? Are they just going off what it did look like on TV?

How can he press charges and go into court and say "I didn't hear it"?

stupot07 · Feb 7, 2012

I thought Ferdinand did here him but has not said anything publicly in case it jeopardises the investigation?

rob9872 · Feb 7, 2012

La_Lucha said:
Why Black kids and why London? Why not kids in general?

If you accept there is a problem with gang culture especially in London and especially within the black community, then instead of people hiding behind what they should or shouldn't say for fear of upsetting people, it would be better if we tried to address that. One way to help is by investing to ensure there are enough opportunities available to offer an alternative way of life.

There are lots of projects that need investment and therefore I thought it would be a good way of giving something back simply because its a race related slur and he is from London. Nothing more to read into it than that.

Otis · Feb 7, 2012

Yep, think it was just the cameras that identified it. According to this Ferdinand didn't hear him.

From The Guardian at the time .....

The incident

What we know The next image of the footage is the key clip of a smiling Terry shouting something back towards the QPR goal, with the defender briefly obscured as Cole walks across the camera shot. It is hard to judge how close Cole is in reality to Terry at this exact moment. Once the left-back is out of shot, Terry appears to mouth the alleged offensive comments before the camera cuts to jubilant looking QPR supporters.

John Terry's view Terry's camp have suggested that the centre-half only became aware that Ferdinand believed he had been the subject of racial abuse when Cole shouted to the England captain as he retreated towards the halfway line following the concession of the free‑kick. His response was to shout back towards Ferdinand that he had never said the offensive comments.

Anton Ferdinand's view Ferdinand has not spoken publicly on the matter, but figures close to the centre-half have suggested he may have had no idea Terry had used racist language in the incident.

The dressing room

What we know Terry sought out Ferdinand after the game had concluded, with the QPR player visiting the away dressing room where the England captain sought confirmation that Ferdinand accepted his version of events.

John Terry's view "Anton and I spoke for 10 minutes in the dressing room after the game and there is no issue between us," Terry said. Cole was among the players also in attendance and the conversation was witnessed in part by the Chelsea manager, André Villas-Boas, as he headed out to conduct his post-match media duties. The pair ended their chat by "high-fiving and embracing" with the situation apparently resolved.

Anton Ferdinand's view He claims that Terry approached him after the game, asking: "Are we cool?" Ferdinand said they were, which may have been because the QPR defender had had no idea there had been an issue between them in the first place.

rob9872 · Feb 7, 2012

Nick said:
So who did hear it? Are they just going off what it did look like on TV?

How can he press charges and go into court and say "I didn't hear it"?

He didn't hear it and he isn't pressing charges. The police and CPS brought this case based on the video evidence. There was no problem between the players who were chatting for 10 minutes after the game. It was only later after seeing the video when Ferdinand became involved. Initaially he had assumed all was ok between them.

Nick · Feb 7, 2012

I haven't really seen it as on the news they blur it out

rob9872 · Feb 7, 2012

Ah - as Otis said!

Otis · Feb 7, 2012

So there you have 5 witnesses saying that Terry and Ferdinand ended up sharing a hug and high fives.

Think everything may well have got blown up out of all proportion by the media to be honest.

Nick · Feb 7, 2012

[video=youtube;OfoaoQImtaI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=OfoaoQImtaI[/video]

Was it meant to be fucking black c-unit?

What did Terry say he said?

stupot07 · Feb 7, 2012

It was a member of the public that complained that's why the police started investigating it.

Regardless of whether anton was or wasn't bothered at the time, presumably because he didn't properly hear it, it doesn't make it ok to use that language on the pitch or in the stands.

Otis · Feb 7, 2012

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2011/oct/26/john-terry-anton-ferdinand

Here is the article with the clip. I can't make out whether he's saying 'blind c..t' or black c..t'

Terry's stance has always been though that he was saying before this 'Do you think I called you a .......'

It's all very grey and not at all clear cut for me. Think Ashley Cole could be key in all this, as he was the closest.

rob9872 · Feb 7, 2012

Terry's version is "Do you think I called you a f***ing black c***, f*** off"

Nick · Feb 7, 2012

Would he shout Black C-unit when Ashley Cole was stood next to him?

Otis · Feb 7, 2012

Nick said:
[video=youtube;OfoaoQImtaI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=OfoaoQImtaI[/video]

Was it meant to be fucking black c-unit?

What did Terry say he said?

Terry says that his comment was "Do you think I just called you a black c..t?'

Nick · Feb 7, 2012

Hmm, very hard to tell. It does look like he was laughing so could have been saying what he said.

stupot07 · Feb 7, 2012

Nick said:
Would he shout Black C-unit when Ashley Cole was stood next to him?

Would it shag is best mates bird behind his and his wifes back?

Would he sell a tour of the training ground for £10k?

I wouldn't try to use normal logic with Terry.

Otis · Feb 7, 2012

As I say, think it has all been blown up out of all proportion and it is not at all clear cut.

Whether he is guilty or not, with a good lawyer he will be cleared. Evidence is ropey at best. Ferdinand didn't hear it, Barton didn't hear it and part of the dialgoue is blanked out.

Nick · Feb 7, 2012

stupot07 said:
Would it shag is best mates bird behind his and his wifes back?

Would he sell a tour of the training ground for £10k?

I wouldn't try to use normal logic with Terry.

What I mean is that surely Ashley Cole would have had a word with him?

rob9872 · Feb 7, 2012

Be interesting to see if they have any other angles of the footage. 16 cameras in every EPL game so there will be some not obscured by Cole, just whether they picked it up or not.

Otis · Feb 7, 2012

I do think a lot of people just don't like Terry. Whether he is a twat or not has no bearing whatsoever on this case. Think people assume that because he is a twat he must have done it and that is plain wrong.

Nick · Feb 7, 2012

Otis said:
I do think a lot of people just don't like Terry. Whether he is a twat or not has no bearing whatsoever on this case. Think people assume that because he is a twat he must have done it and that is plain wrong.

Yep, it is the same as when Marlon King left us everybody said it was his fault based on before but when it was Jay Tabb it was the club's fault...

stupot07 · Feb 7, 2012

Some interesting points in post 5 - he really sounds like he understands the law.

http://www.courtoffside.com/forum/showthread.php?t=110039

stupot07 · Feb 7, 2012

I would feel the same regardless who had been accused of this.

Mary_Mungo_Midge · Feb 7, 2012

stupot07 said:
Some interesting points in post 5 - he really sounds like he understands the law.

http://www.courtoffside.com/forum/showthread.php?t=110039

Look again at post 16. I think I subscribe to this guy's train of thought (especially as it s along the same tracks as I posted yesterday!!)

Joey Barton comments on Twitter (1 Viewer)

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