It's all in your head ... (1 Viewer)

Godiva

Well-Known Member
Thorn got three league games, then he was sacked. Was that the wrong timing? Should he have had 10 more games to show what great squad he had assembled?
Or should he have gone at the end of the season and let another manager assemble his own team?

Nothing is ever 100% right or 100% wrong. So there's no definete answer to those questions. Except for those who live in a black and white world. In their head there's always a 100% right answer.

The main reason Thorn was sacked after three games was that there was no real evidence this season would be any different from last season. We couldn't buy three points for our life.
That's a habbit. It's in the head of the players and the management team. They knew there was no way they would ever win a match. Because it has been like that forever.
They knew they would concede a soft goal due to an individual error - and when it happened, their expectations were met.

So Shaw/Carsley got to recitify this. But in their heads they had the same expectations, so they didn't really change anything. The same players, the same linup ... more or less, the same play style, the same training sessions, the same pre match pep talk.

And players low on confidence make mistakes. Passes to an opponent. Overhits his shot. Concede a penalty because he just won't lose his man again. Do the complicated thing to show he's not a bad player but gives the ball away.
They try, but in their heads they know it wont be good enough, and so it's not good enough.

Should they have just a tiny little bit of confidence from the prematch pep talk, it evaporate as soon as the crowd starts booing.

You see, it's also in your head. And in my head.
We just know we can't win. We are used to losing. So we help the players to meet our expectation. Boo them, intimidate them, abuse them, scare them.

And we do it everywhere. At the game, on twitter, on facebook and on this forum. Most players read what we think about them, and that's not easy reading.
We justify our abuse by pointing to their pay check. They're much richer that most of us.
So they should deliver nothing less than a spotless performance everytime they show up.
Which nobody can. But first time they mess up, we're all over them telling them exactly what we think of them.
And we think they're a bunch of loses. It's in our heads.

But we can't really lay all the blame on the players, so we turn against Fischer & Waggot. Afterall they are appointed by Sisu, so they can't be any good. And as Waggot himself has admitted he signed the new players - from a list drafted by Thorn, Shaw, Carsley and Oggy - he must surely be the master crook.
And Fischer who refuses to pay £1.2m rent out of a <£5m income, he really is Don Corleone reincarnated using mafia methods to balance the finances. A few appreciate the need for balancing the books, but does it have to be today?
It's in our head. We are used to hear the club is bleeding money every year. So surely we can bleed a few years more.

Sisu, who have been our owners for so many years, are surely responsible for the decline of our once proud club. They were following in the footsteps of Richardson, Robinson and other failed owners. In our heads we expected them to just keep pouring money in. Spend milions on new exciting players and more milions on the paychecks. Forget about balancing the books - that's not something we're used to. It's not in our heads, so we can't understand it.

Anyway.
In comes Robins. Immidiately we are excited. Well, some are. Actually most would have preferred Thorn or Wise or Ince or Black or Nielsson or Wenger or Money. But a handful were excited Robins got the job.

He holds one training session looking at the players. Let them do what they are used to and in training they perform well and with confidence. They want to impress the new manager.
Then he picks the team, do some pre match peptalk and off to the pitch they go.
Expecting to win. To finally show that they actually are good players.

One stray pass later and some heavy swearing from the stands, the confindence starts to evaporate. A questionable pen to the opponents and it's all back to business as usual.
We were always going to lose.
It's in the players heads.
It's in our heads.

But it's not in Robins head.
Now it will show if he really is the manager we need. If he's someone who can address the clubs losing mentality.
If he is to succeed his first and most important task is to brainwash the players and the fans into believing we can win.

Afterall, the players really are good enough for this level (and most even for the next). Unfortunately they don't know it. Don't believe it.

A year ago many fans put in much effort in creating a sisu-out-campaign.
Could those people put in just a tiny fraction of that energy and start a 'yes, we can' campaign?
I have a feeling Robins will need some help erasing the losing mentality.
A lot of help!
 

Last edited:

ccfcway

Well-Known Member
Thorn Drew with Burnley away 2-2
Boothroyd beat Portsmouth 2-0
Coleman beat Leicester 2-0
Dowie beat Southampton 2-1
 

Marty

Well-Known Member
Thorn Drew with Burnley away 2-2
Boothroyd beat Portsmouth 2-0
Coleman beat Leicester 2-0
Dowie beat Southampton 2-1

Black beat Walsall 6-1. :claping hands::claping hands::claping hands:
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Adams certainly did win a game until about the 5th attempt.
 

Big Mo

New Member
A losing mentality is ingrained in the club from top to bottom and has been for so long its not going to be easily changed. whilst i hoped and partly believed we would bounce straight back i don't think any of us should be shocked by the position we are in.
 

covross

New Member
SISU acquiring half the stadium and Robins' clean slate statement should give the players a boost. It feels for the first time in ages that we have a boardroom and management staff that actually give a fuck about CCFC now, I think installing a bit of self belief in this squad and we'll soon start shoot up the table. PUSB
 

ccfcway

Well-Known Member
A losing mentality is ingrained in the club from top to bottom and has been for so long its not going to be easily changed. whilst i hoped and partly believed we would bounce straight back i don't think any of us should be shocked by the position we are in.

im not .
 

wingy

Well-Known Member
Has Godiva been on the pop?

ITs possible Godivas had a good Sunday ,Most of his post I Agree with ,apart from the Idea that the 2-300 who protested last year are the type that boo and Demotivate the team.Could'nt be further from the truth ,some of the best ,more vocal Home and away fans I've met.
 

Big_Ben

Active Member
Thorn got three league games, then he was sacked. Was that the wrong timing? Should he have had 10 more games to show what great squad he had assembled?
Or should he have gone at the end of the season and let another manager assemble his own team?

Nothing is ever 100% right or 100% wrong. So there's no definete answer to those questions. Except for those who live in a black and white world. In their head there's always a 100% right answer.

The main reason Thorn was sacked after three games was that there was no real evidence this season would be any different from last season. We couldn't buy three points for our life.
That's a habbit. It's in the head of the players and the management team. They knew there was no way they would ever win a match. Because it has been like that forever.
They knew they would concede a soft goal due to an individual error - and when it happened, their expectations were met.

So Shaw/Carsley got to recitify this. But in their heads they had the same expectations, so they didn't really change anything. The same players, the same linup ... more or less, the same play style, the same training sessions, the same pre match pep talk.

And players low on confidence make mistakes. Passes to an opponent. Overhits his shot. Concede a penalty because he just won't lose his man again. Do the complicated thing to show he's not a bad player but gives the ball away.
They try, but in their heads they know it wont be good enough, and so it's not good enough.

Should they have just a tiny little bit of confidence from the prematch pep talk, it evaporate as soon as the crowd starts booing.

You see, it's also in your head. And in my head.
We just know we can't win. We are used to losing. So we help the players to meet our expectation. Boo them, intimidate them, abuse them, scare them.

And we do it everywhere. At the game, on twitter, on facebook and on this forum. Most players read what we think about them, and that's not easy reading.
We justify our abuse by pointing to their pay check. They're much richer that most of us.
So they should deliver nothing less than a spotless performance everytime they show up.
Which nobody can. But first time they mess up, we're all over them telling them exactly what we think of them.
And we think they're a bunch of loses. It's in our heads.

But we can't really lay all the blame on the players, so we turn against Fischer & Waggot. Afterall they are appointed by Sisu, so they can't be any good. And as Waggot himself has admitted he signed the new players - from a list drafted by Thorn, Shaw, Carsley and Oggy - he must surely be the master crook.
And Fischer who refuses to pay £1.2m rent out of a <£5m income, he really is Don Corleone reincarnated using mafia methods to balance the finances. A few appreciate the need for balancing the books, but does it have to be today?
It's in our head. We are used to hear the club is bleeding money every year. So surely we can bleed a few years more.

Sisu, who have been our owners for so many years, are surely responsible for the decline of our once proud club. They were following in the footsteps of Richardson, Robinson and other failed owners. In our heads we expected them to just keep pouring money in. Spend milions on new exciting players and more milions on the paychecks. Forget about balancing the books - that's not something we're used to. It's not in our heads, so we can't understand it.

Anyway.
In comes Robins. Immidiately we are excited. Well, some are. Actually most would have preferred Thorn or Wise or Ince or Black or Nielsson or Wenger or Money. But a handful were excited Robins got the job.

He holds one training session looking at the players. Let them do what they are used to and in training they perform well and with confidence. They want to impress the new manager.
Then he picks the team, do some pre match peptalk and off to the pitch they go.
Expecting to win. To finally show that they actually are good players.

One stray pass later and some heavy swearing from the stands, the confindence starts to evaporate. A questionable pen to the opponents and it's all back to business as usual.
We were always going to lose.
It's in the players heads.
It's in our heads.

But it's not in Robins head.
Now it will show if he really is the manager we need. If he's someone who can address the clubs losing mentality.
If he is to succeed his first and most important task is to brainwash the players and the fans into believing we can win.

Afterall, the players really are good enough for this level (and most even for the next). Unfortunately they don't know it. Don't believe it.

A year ago many fans put in much effort in creating a sisu-out-campaign.
Could those people put in just a tiny fraction of that energy and start a 'yes, we can' campaign?
I have a feeling Robins will need some help erasing the losing mentality.
A lot of help!

A lot of thought and insight went into that post by someone who appears to have the ability to take a step back and look at the bigger picture. There are quite a few out here who can relate to the points you make, and who realise that the problems facing our club are going to take a lot more to turn round than many regular posters on here realise.
Take the whole SISU situation and imagine it as your own workplace. You are a bit pissed off with your wages and the conditions in general, so you decide that the best solution is if the directors (shareholders, bosses, call them what you will) have to go in order that you are happier in your work. So you mount a big protest action to make them sell out to another company who will look after you better - Oh yeah !!!!
Then there's the bit which goes: I pay my hard earned money to go to games and I expect value, and if I think they're a bunch of shite I'll boo as much as I like and I'll slag them off as much as I like (then there's always the get-out clause which says ' I know they are rubbish but I'm willing to be proved wrong if they improve'. Sort of an each-way bet really, but the point has been made so many times - If you slag them off and boo them whenever they put a foot wrong - you've achieved what you've set out to do and you will get exactly the sort of team you deserve!
My three penn'orth, for what it's worth before the usual horde of myopic keyboard warriors chip back in, is that SISU well underestimated the task when they came in, relying too much on 'experts' like RR who couldn't deliver. They have stuck with it (although I'm sure there have been many times that they have wished they could have got out) and have been learning as they've gone along and now at last seem to be making progress in the right direction, business-wise at least. At least recognise that fact. There's been a commitment to playing staff and a recognised young manager. Yes I can understand the frustration, having seen the gradual decay from my first match in 1972, but anything in the past was then - this is now, and now's the time we have to get behind the team and roar them on.
If all you can do is slag and boo you'd be better off saving your cash and staying away, for everybody's sake.
 

Godiva

Well-Known Member
ITs possible Godivas had a good Sunday ,Most of his post I Agree with ,apart from the Idea that the 2-300 who protested last year are the type that boo and Demotivate the team.Could'nt be further from the truth ,some of the best ,more vocal Home and away fans I've met.

I don't think I said anywhere that the SOC people are those who boo the players. Sorry if I have mislead you.
What I suggest is that the SOC people who have previously shown much desire to force changes could now use some of their energy and creativity to help stop the negativity.

I read the Robins interview that was published here a few minutes after my original post, and it's quite clear to me that he has identified the losing mentality and that it need to be changed.
We, the fans, could help with this.
 
Last edited:

dongonzalos

Well-Known Member
Robins seems very impressive, this squad will achieve.
As they would have achieved without the recent dustuption and set back.

In every grey area scenario there is always a decisive factor that tips it one direction or the other.

Good post even if I don't agree with some of it.
 

Sky Blues

Active Member
Some good points there Godiva. I'm not going to tell another fan not to boo, because that goes against individual freedom, but I do think there is a shortage of positive messages around the club and maybe us fans could do more to help Robins turn this club around. Can we come up with some ideas? Obviously singing more songs for the players can't hurt. Maybe we can help on here too. Like, maybe, i don't know, after a match we can have a poll on who was man of the match as far as SBT member were concerned. Just put the positive reasons why you think X or Y deserves it. If you don't think a player played well, just leave it off that thread and put it elsewhere. Then, if any players do happen to look on here, there would be at least one thread where there was some positivity.
 
Last edited:

LilleSkyBlue

Well-Known Member
Good post, Godiva. It's much harder to put thought and effort into a sustained piece of argument than it is to come on here saying 'they're all shit, I'm never going to the Ricoh again'.

The one thing I want to add is a reminder of the sheer mind-wrenching disappointment, let-down and anger that comes when conceding at home to (say) Carlisle or Stevenage. I live abroad and can't get to games, but when I see these teams score the winner on Sky Sports Score Centre or whatever I'm overcome with despair and fury. AGAIN! IS THERE NO HOPE? etc.

Those feelings have to go somewhere. Kick the cat?
 

Godiva

Well-Known Member
Some good points there Godiva. I'm not going to tell another fan not to boo, because that goes against individual freedom, but I do think there is a shortage of positive messages around the club and maybe us fans could do more to help Robins turn this club around. Can we come up with some ideas? Obviously singing more songs for the players can't hurt. Maybe we can help on here too. Like, maybe, i don't know, after a match we can have a poll on who was man of the match as far as SBT member were concerned. Just put the positive reasons why you think X or Y deserves it. If you don't think a player played well, just leave it off that thread and put it elsewhere. Then, if any players do happen to look on here, there would be at least one thread where there was some positivity.

I like your idea about a MOM poll.
But as you saw in another thread asking for people to point to staff they're happy with, there will always be a handful who cannot resist to spoil the show.

It's sad, but some people have little success in their own life and their 'survival strategy' is to focus on others failures and shortcommings.

I have suggested that those who last year had the energy to organise demonstrations could maybe use some of their creativity to start a positivity change among the fans.

But the club should do something too.
Maybe they could take off from your idea and bring it to the match.
If they opened a sms service (at normal sms charge! It can't be seen as a money maker!) where fans throughout the match could vote who they think are the best player so far, then the results could be shown at the scoreboard throughout the game as a current overall top 5 plus a top 5 for the past 15 minutes. That might add some intensive to the players.
 

Macca

Well-Known Member
Some good points for sure, but the blame coming down to the fans is something I can't accept anymore. Every club has a mixture of happy clappers there for the singalong, quiet supporters and those who would moan if we won 7-1 because we didn't keep a clean sheet. ALL other clubs have these types but have been successful at some point.

The continuous berating of loyal, long suffering fans, completetly alienates me. More likely to put me off than the on the pitch results.
 

Godiva

Well-Known Member
The continuous berating of loyal, long suffering fans, completetly alienates me. More likely to put me off than the on the pitch results.

I am not really sure what you find berating, when it started and when you last felt it.
What should the club do to make you feel a valued customer?
 

Macca

Well-Known Member
nothing to do with the club. Its the attitude that I feel runs through a lot of fans particularly on here that its all the fans fault. Our fault for not getting behind them, our fault for being negative, our fault for not turning up in greater numbers etc etc.
 

skyblueinBaku

Well-Known Member
Maybe they could take off from your idea and bring it to the match.
If they opened a sms service (at normal sms charge! It can't be seen as a money maker!) where fans throughout the match could vote who they think are the best player so far, then the results could be shown at the scoreboard throughout the game as a current overall top 5 plus a top 5 for the past 15 minutes. That might add some intensive to the players.

The MOM poll on this forum is a good idea. But at the Ricoh, I'd rather the players watched what was happening on the pitch, not the scoreboard!
 

wingy

Well-Known Member
Yeah the only reason they should be looking at the scoreboard is a) When they've scored and b) at the end of the match collectively for a positive result ,job done.:p
 

ccfcway

Well-Known Member
I'd stick the league table on the scoreboard, if they aint motivated by that alone, they can jog on !
 

ccfcway

Well-Known Member
I'd also introduce them as

"they are 2nd from bottom, not won all season, currently in the drop zone, ladies and gentleman, YOUR SKY BLUES"
 

Nonleagueherewecome

Well-Known Member
And I also completely disagree with he view that the protests against SISU had a negative effect upon on-the-pitch affairs. If anything it was the only time we had any atmosphere, and we actually played better!

The only negativity I show is by not grinning and cheering like a fool when the soul-crushingly inevitable opposition winner settles into the net..a pretentious rant about fan negativity would also be more platable if we weren't bottom and winless, you know? I think that's about as far away from being our fault as fans as it's possible.
 
B

Bobby Firenze

Guest
And I also completely disagree with he view that the protests against SISU had a negative effect upon on-the-pitch affairs. If anything it was the only time we had any atmosphere, and we actually played better!

Where does Godiva say that the protests had a negative effect on the pitch?

I read through it again and can't see it.
 

Nonleagueherewecome

Well-Known Member
Maybe not in that post, but I know he thinks it unless he's changed his mind!
 

Astute

Well-Known Member
And I also completely disagree with he view that the protests against SISU had a negative effect upon on-the-pitch affairs. If anything it was the only time we had any atmosphere, and we actually played better!

So are you saying negativity breeds positivity?
 

Godiva

Well-Known Member
3 months later ...
We are winning. Setting records. Scoring goals for fun.
Robins really has turned the players around.
We can't lose. It's in their heads now.
The opposition knows it too - they can't beat us. It's in their heads as well.

Fans are exited. At first we were suspecious, now we believe!
It's in our heads now ... we will win the league!

And it won't be long now before we race through the championship brushing everything aside.
We can't lose.
It's in our heads now.
We can't lose!
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Top