Is the noose finally starting to tighten around the neck of SISU/OTIUM (1 Viewer)

mrbluesky87 · Aug 6, 2013

Given the comments from the Judge in the case of the 14m bailout, is the noose finally tightening and is time running out for Fisher and Co. The judge was quite open and damning in his comments and it would suggest that in such a short space of time he got to grips with SISU and what kind of business they really were and what they stand for.

Given the many posts of a new team to be created etc etc which I admit am/was in favour of, do we now stand firm in the knowledge that very soon we hope to see CCFC back at the Ricoh with new owners and by this I mean anybody thinking of caving in, in regards to attending Northampton, DONT, we could be back at the Ricoh sooner than we think and if we can just wait a little longer we will all get our just rewards.

Maybe im being a little optimistic but it would appear SISU/OTIUM are getting regular hammer blows now and a few more could finally see them disappear in to the Northampton sun set.

This is just a post to get everyones opinion of where we stand and what point we are at in this sorry saga.

PUSB

Bill Glazier · Aug 6, 2013

Yes cc1883 can wait for now but Sisu need to know that plan is 100% on if they hang around. Timing is good with new season a long way off.

longjohnskyblue · Aug 6, 2013

While sisu can play the blame game with sisu, are they going to try and suggest the judge is biased? I would certainly like to see them try that on a judge! That is at least twice (to my knowledge at least) that a judge has not only found against sisu, but indeed has in effect called into question their entire business practices. Whilst it was indeed painful to receivce the 10 point penalty, if it means that sisu can no longer hide behind threats and "favourable" administrators and weak willed FL officials and they have to face the hard glare of a proper investigation so much the better.

Surely there is no way sisu can spin forming otium a few years ago leaving it dormant, failing to file accounts then low and behold they buy a football club! It stinks.

Well done judge - sanity is starting to prevail

covcity4life · Aug 6, 2013

mrbluesky87 said:
Given the comments from the Judge in the case of the 14m bailout, is the noose finally tightening and is time running out for Fisher and Co. The judge was quite open and damning in his comments and it would suggest that in such a short space of time he got to grips with SISU and what kind of business they really were and what they stand for.

Given the many posts of a new team to be created etc etc which I admit am/was in favour of, do we now stand firm in the knowledge that very soon we hope to see CCFC back at the Ricoh with new owners and by this I mean anybody thinking of caving in, in regards to attending Northampton, DONT, we could be back at the Ricoh sooner than we think and if we can just wait a little longer we will all get our just rewards.

Maybe im being a little optimistic but it would appear SISU/OTIUM are getting regular hammer blows now and a few more could finally see them disappear in to the Northampton sun set.

This is just a post to get everyones opinion of where we stand and what point we are at in this sorry saga.

PUSB

i hope sisu are on way out but what are these regular hammer blows? this is first victory i can remember council getting

CVA lost them money remember

mrbluesky87 · Aug 6, 2013

covcity4life said:
i hope sisu are on way out but what are these regular hammer blows? this is first victory i can remember council getting

CVA lost them money remember

The first was not signing the CVA, Sisu were convinced that ACL would have to sign this. Yes, ACL lost money but at the same time SISU lost all hope of getting their hands on the Ricoh. I would say that was a hammerblow for SISU not ACL.

mrbluesky87 · Aug 6, 2013

Also this is not about my support for ACL this is about getting CCFC back and unfortunately this now only looks likely if SISU/OTUM sell up.

covcity4life · Aug 6, 2013

id rather a sisuless city no doubt, love to get rid of council too tho

just want ccfc free

ccfcmustang · Aug 6, 2013

The usually grey area between the Football League and the Law seems to be becoming ever so slightly transparent. it seems we have the support of the law, i wonder what influence that will have going forward. I dont think that SISU will be in charge by the end of the season, no im sure of that. Holding firm and standing on a united front will prevail. PUSB

Sky Blue Sheepy · Aug 6, 2013

I must admit I read the verdict today and thought maybe this is the start of the end. From SISUs point of view the Ricoh seems more and more out of reach and I don't see what else would keep them here besides spite - and I doubt these business men/women would stay to spite us if it cost them to do so.
Also note that Haskell and the Chinese have still not backed out.
It's a glimmer of hope, if nothing else.

oldskyblue58 · Aug 6, 2013

depends if SISU have plan B or not and whether it can be proven that the FL have acted wrongly in giving the share to Otium

If Plan A was to get the Ricoh then right now SISU have to be looking seriously at getting Plan B up and running. I do not think that the stakeholders are of a mind to sell the Ricoh or ACL either whole or in part to SISU and SISU needed the legal levers to try force it to happen. So they are left with a football club and to either sell or build.

If it can be proven that the administration process was flawed in that assets belonging to CCFC Ltd were not in CCFC Ltd and should have been then it might help prove the FL decision is wrong. However I think we have to bear in mind that the administrator sold the rights to any assets that might exist in CCFC Ltd to Otium he did not itemise those assets. So if it turns out that other assets should have been there but were not disclosed I would guess Otium still own them for the price they paid of £1.5m. The next legal stuff etc is not so clear cut because it may well involve trying to prove conspiracy and collusion and that wont be easy. It will involve getting the various authorities to look thoroughly in to what has gone on and those kind of wheels never turn quickly

All in all although the JR decision and the leaked minutes are all big positives for ACL etc we are still left with the situation of SISU owning the club, playing at Sixfields with the FL recognising at their discretion Otium as the owners of CCFC.

mrbluesky87 · Aug 6, 2013

covcity4life said:
id rather a sisuless city no doubt, love to get rid of council too tho

just want ccfc free

IMHO i have no doubt ACL will sell at least 50% of the Ricoh to the right buyer but they know and we know Otium are not the right people. I only use this as an example but if PHIV was to get the club I have no doubt he gets the Ricoh at the same time, maybe the Ricoh first therefore this will only stem from SISU finally selling up.

sky blue john · Aug 6, 2013

Be prepared though for Sisu to keep this charade going for a good bit longer yet !!!

skyblueirish · Aug 6, 2013

My worry is the endgame in all this is that sisu will sell or liquidate when we are so laden with debt that no-one else can buy so we cease 2 exist

mrbluesky87 · Aug 6, 2013

skyblueirish said:
My worry is the endgame in all this is that sisu will sell or liquidate when we are so laden with debt that no-one else can buy so we cease 2 exist

The only up-side to that (if there is one) is that there will be a space in the FL free, thus we begin again but not as far down as if we were starting a new side to compete against the Cov Cobblers

Sterling Archer · Aug 6, 2013

mrbluesky87 said:
The only up-side to that (if there is one) is that there will be a space in the FL free, thus we begin again but not as far down as if we were starting a new side to compete against the Cov Cobblers

Think what you've just said through here carefully.
a) There is no such team as Cov Cobblers. It is Coventry City Football Club, but they are playing Northampton (which is obviously very very effing shit at this moment in time).
b) A new side created out of nowhere would have to start at the bottom and wouldn't take any "free space" that the club ceasing to exist would create in League One.

I'm not having a go but very very careful what you wish for.

Seeing the club die, as in ACTUALLY die and cease to exist/wiped off the football league fixtures list would be a disaster. Any other club created in anger after this hypothetical death would NOT be Coventry City FC, it would be a brand new club and different team.

We have to concentrate on keeping the current club alive and getting it back playing in Coventry. To me, and I would hope most people, that is the priority over changing the owners.

saltaire bantam · Aug 6, 2013

Good luck! Maybe the refusal to go to Sixfields and talk of a new club has addled their (SISU's) brains. I'd love to know what their financial reserves are and when the next shareholder meeting is, somebody is going to get it in the neck!

Sterling Archer said:
b) A new side created out of nowhere would have to start at the bottom and wouldn't take any "free space" that the club ceasing to exist would create in League One.

It would not, the FL made a precedent in 2008. Halifax ceased to exist, a new club was formed (new name). It was put in the pyramid 4 promotions away from the FL.

Spionkop · Aug 6, 2013

Have just written a letter, walked to post box with it, to Greg Clarke at the FL.
I'm no financial whizzkid, but I gave him TEN POINTS on which he might have intervened.
Among them Seppala's 'shadow' director role. & mentioned his fine words to Henry Winter at the FL celebrations last week. Just that, fine words.
& enclosed Adrian Durham's Daily Mail article just drive it home. It about sums up everything that we feel and I have to say, well done Adrian Durham. (can't stand the Daily Mail however).
Addressed to him personally. Thought a letter is better than email. For what is worth.
Very polite but basically saying he should hang his head in shame.
Just keep at it everyone. Don't give in. DON'T go to Northampton.
Like people have said, we'll be back.

mrbluesky87 · Aug 6, 2013

Sterling Archer said:
Think what you've just said through here carefully.
a) There is no such team as Cov Cobblers. It is Coventry City Football Club, but they are playing Northampton (which is obviously very very effing shit at this moment in time).
b) A new side created out of nowhere would have to start at the bottom and wouldn't take any "free space" that the club ceasing to exist would create in League One.

I'm not having a go but very very careful what you wish for.

Seeing the club die, as in ACTUALLY die and cease to exist/wiped off the football league fixtures list would be a disaster. Any other club created in anger after this hypothetical death would NOT be Coventry City FC, it would be a brand new club and different team.

We have to concentrate on keeping the current club alive and getting it back playing in Coventry. To me, and I would hope most people, that is the priority over changing the owners.

This was my response to skyblueirish, not what I hope to happen. My point was if this was the very last option whereby SISU say thats it and kill us of course we would have to start again, why wouldnt we and I would expect that we would probably start again the the Conference North/South (maybe one below) thus there would be an extra promotion from the leagues that season. I dont WISH for this to happen though.

Sterling Archer · Aug 6, 2013

saltaire bantam said:
Good luck! Maybe the refusal to go to Sixfields and talk of a new club has addled their (SISU's) brains. I'd love to know what their financial reserves are and when the next shareholder meeting is, somebody is going to get it in the neck!

It would not, the FL made a precedent in 2008. Halifax ceased to exist, a new club was formed (new name). It was put in the pyramid 4 promotions away from the FL.

... and wheres the precedent of that actually happening in the professional leagues? Not a chance.

saltaire bantam · Aug 6, 2013

Sterling Archer said:
... and wheres the precedent of that actually happening in the professional leagues? Not a chance.

Same one, Halifax were a full time pro club in the Conference Premier when they were liquidated and ceased to exist in any form.

SkyBlueBlood · Aug 6, 2013

SISU will be expecting a token stay away from the first game but expect to sell out Northampton for the rest of the season. It may take a few weeks for them to see they are in serious shit.

ajsccfc · Aug 6, 2013

As much as I'd like this to be a positive sign, they'll wriggle through somehow. They have a knack of doing so.

skybluealan · Aug 6, 2013

saltaire bantam said:
Same one, Halifax were a full time pro club in the Conference Premier when they were liquidated and ceased to exist in any form.

It also happened to Darlington 2011/2012 season. They were liquidated, new club called Darlington 1883 started 4 leagues lower.

DazzleTommyDazzle · Aug 6, 2013

skybluealan said:
It also happened to Darlington 2011/2012 season. They were liquidated, new club called Darlington 1883 started 4 leagues lower.

And to my local team, Telford United.

As I recall, AFC Telford started three divisions lower.

Skybluerevolution (Pt2) · Aug 6, 2013

I was going to Northampton - however after today's ruling, and the amount of ST tickets sold I have decided to abstain for a while until I see how this is all panning out, It will hurt my son more than me as he has just started to enjoy the match-day experience, he 5 but has been going since he was 3, last season was the one were he started to really take an interest in the football and now understands who Coventry are, and even joins in on the the songs (although not always the right words) I believe if SISU are still here come January, and they are still not getting the supports at NTFC, they probably will be here for good, so .fingers crossed those fookers fail, and we win. PUSB

covhead1 · Aug 6, 2013

Skybluerevolution (Pt2) said:
I was going to Northampton - however after today's ruling, and the amount of ST tickets sold I have decided to abstain for a while until I see how this is all panning out, It will hurt my son more than me as he has just started to enjoy the match-day experience, he 5 but has been going since he was 3, last season was the one were he started to really take an interest in the football and now understands who Coventry are, and even joins in on the the songs (although not always the right words) I believe if SISU are still here come January, and they are still not getting the supports at NTFC, they probably will be here for good, so .fingers crossed those fookers fail, and we win. PUSB

Buy yourself and your son tickets for the Ricoh on sunday instead

Jack Griffin · Aug 6, 2013

I found this on the Cov Telegraph website, which spells out how much trouble SISU are in as a business, or failing hedge fund should I say.

Andrew Maniban

4:57 PM on 6/8/2013

A sound judgement, registering the vexatious and vindictive nature of the action. But for Seppala and Coleman getting hold of the Ricoh Stadium is the last big play of a failing business. They're cornered rats more than predators. The SISU financial numbers speak for themselves.

Year.............Turnover...........Profit/Loss
2006.............26,837,000.......18,821,000
2007.............25,445,000.......16,019,000
2008.............19,508,000.......10,621000
2009...............6,069,000............692,981
2010...............3,397,000............-124,274
2011...............3,075,000............-120,663
2012...............2,136,000..............-18,956

The shift from Hanover St to Red Square to save on rent and the shedding of staff have cut the losses, but they need a big win or the investors will pull the plug. The return on capital has gone from 171.9% in 2006 to -0.6% in 2012. Starve them out!

Skybluerevolution (Pt2) · Aug 6, 2013

covhead1 said:
Buy yourself and your son tickets for the Ricoh on sunday instead

My niece is getting married on Sunday in Liverpool - otherwise I would be there absolutely, I hope that you guys get the pleasure of seeing Mr T Hutchinson play again, I remember him playing in Gynny's he was fantastic - I hope he plays.

CarpyCov84 · Aug 6, 2013

Skybluerevolution (Pt2) said:
My niece is getting married on Sunday in Liverpool - otherwise I would be there absolutely, I hope that you guys get the pleasure of seeing Mr T Hutchinson play again, I remember him playing in Gynny's he was fantastic - I hope he plays.

I'm in the same position my son is also 5 and it's not nice for them I've been brought up supporting the club and my family always has going back generations people will be turning in their graves we just have to stick together starve them out just keep momentum keep focused stay as one...

SISU GET GONE...Your time is done admit defeat !!!

Nonleagueherewecome · Aug 6, 2013

Sterling Archer said:
Think what you've just said through here carefully.
a) There is no such team as Cov Cobblers. It is Coventry City Football Club, but they are playing Northampton (which is obviously very very effing shit at this moment in time).
b) A new side created out of nowhere would have to start at the bottom and wouldn't take any "free space" that the club ceasing to exist would create in League One.

I'm not having a go but very very careful what you wish for.

Seeing the club die, as in ACTUALLY die and cease to exist/wiped off the football league fixtures list would be a disaster. Any other club created in anger after this hypothetical death would NOT be Coventry City FC, it would be a brand new club and different team.

We have to concentrate on keeping the current club alive and getting it back playing in Coventry. To me, and I would hope most people, that is the priority over changing the owners.

Getting sick of making this point but it has to be done: AFC Wimbledon ARE the same club that won the F.A. Cup: they hold the honour, as well as all of Wimbledon's other honours. If the present CCFC ceases to exist, the new Phoenix Club formed WOULD BE CCFC. That's how it works. AFC Newport ARE Newport County, the new Chester ARE Chester City, the new Aldershot ARE Aldershot Town, the new Telford ARE Telford Utd. You will not find a single solitary fan of those clubs who thinks that their club is in any way whatsoever disconnected from the club that was liquidated.

As for the "spare place"-you misunderstand: it means that a gap can be created for us much higher up than if we started with that place occupied-possibly as high as BSN.

Nonleagueherewecome · Aug 6, 2013

Skybluerevolution (Pt2) said:
I was going to Northampton - however after today's ruling, and the amount of ST tickets sold I have decided to abstain for a while until I see how this is all panning out, It will hurt my son more than me as he has just started to enjoy the match-day experience, he 5 but has been going since he was 3, last season was the one were he started to really take an interest in the football and now understands who Coventry are, and even joins in on the the songs (although not always the right words) I believe if SISU are still here come January, and they are still not getting the supports at NTFC, they probably will be here for good, so .fingers crossed those fookers fail, and we win. PUSB

Good man. Get your lad up The Ricoh, show him some proper City legends, from when we were actually good! He'll love it-I remember my little brother seeing Hutch at a testimonial when he was 7 and he utterly fell in love with him as much as my dad who watched him in his heyday is

stupot07 · Aug 6, 2013

Nonleagueherewecome said:
Getting sick of making this point but it has to be done: AFC Wimbledon ARE the same club that won the F.A. Cup: they hold the honour, as well as all of Wimbledon's other honours. If the present CCFC ceases to exist, the new Phoenix Club formed WOULD BE CCFC. That's how it works. AFC Newport ARE Newport County, the new Chester ARE Chester City, the new Aldershot ARE Aldershot Town, the new Telford ARE Telford Utd. You will not find a single solitary fan of those clubs who thinks that their club is in any way whatsoever disconnected from the club that was liquidated.

As for the "spare place"-you misunderstand: it means that a gap can be created for us much higher up than if we started with that place occupied-possibly as high as BSN.

Only if the Phoenix club is created on the back of ccfc ceasing to exist. I can't see how a breakaway '1883' can claim to be ccfc, it isn't, like FC united, FC liverpool it is a breakaway club for disillusioned fans.

Nonleagueherewecome · Aug 6, 2013

stupot07 said:
Only if the Phoenix club is created on the back of ccfc ceasing to exist. I can't see how a breakaway '1883' can claim to be ccfc, it isn't, like FC united, FC liverpool it is a breakaway club for disillusioned fans.

I think I probably agree, but it was posted in response to someone saying that a Phoenix club would not be CCFC: it would, as every precedent I quoted prove. Add Nuneaton and Leamington to that list!

stupot07 · Aug 6, 2013

Nonleagueherewecome said:
I think I probably agree, but it was posted in response to someone saying that a Phoenix club would not be CCFC: it would, as every precedent I quoted prove. Add Nuneaton and Leamington to that list!

Yep, that's why I am so anti the 1883 idea.

blend · Aug 6, 2013

stupot07 said:
Only if the Phoenix club is created on the back of ccfc ceasing to exist. I can't see how a breakaway '1883' can claim to be ccfc, it isn't, like FC united, FC liverpool it is a breakaway club for disillusioned fans.

Again tell that to AFC Wimbledon fans. They started in 2002, 2 years later in 2004 Wimbledon FC changed their name to Milton Keynes Dons.
AFC Wimbledon own the club's history and were given all trophies and memorabilia back in 2007.

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