Is it sisus fault that we can't hold a lead? (1 Viewer)

skybluesteve76 · Feb 1, 2012

What does everyone think about the fact we keep losing by the odd goal, especially after leading in games.
Surely better tactics and timing of substitutions could and should stop this?
I can't believe what happened last night. But when it did, I wasn't at all suprised. To say I'm gutted this morning is an understatement.
Is a change of manager the answer?

All the best

EleanorRigby · Feb 1, 2012

Would we hold a lead better with Turner, Gunnersson, Jutkiewicz and Marlon King in the side ?

pusbccfc · Feb 1, 2012

I think if we had decent owners, we would have got KP at the start of the season and we wouldn't need to hold a lead as we would be 2+ up.

mark82 · Feb 1, 2012

EleanorRigby said:
Would we hold a lead better with Turner, Gunnersson, Jutkiewicz and Marlon King in the side ?

Yes. Simple.

mark82 · Feb 1, 2012

pusbccfc said:
I think if we had decent owners, we would have got KP at the start of the season and we wouldn't need to hold a lead as we would be 2+ up.

Sorry to be dumb, what/who is KP?

Astute · Feb 1, 2012

Or even players like Best. Celtic even tried signing him yesterday, and they are flying at the moment. We have lost players recently even the top teams want. We could make a team with the players we have recently lost and not replaced to be good enough to be challenging this season. How many got replaced? Then we constantly see comments that it is not the fault of SISU

OyJimmy · Feb 1, 2012

EleanorRigby said:
Would we hold a lead better with Turner, Gunnersson, Jutkiewicz and Marlon King in the side ?

Yep pretty obviously we could! You'd have to be blind not to notice the difference the loss of this lot has made, clearly some people are choosing what they want to see

mark82 · Feb 1, 2012

mark82 said:
Sorry to be dumb, what/who is KP?

Worked it out. Kevin Phillips.

Bertola · Feb 1, 2012

If SISU would pay for a fitness coach it may help too

torchomatic · Feb 1, 2012

That's nuts.

pusbccfc said:
we would have got KP at the start of the season and we wouldn't need to hold a lead as we would be 2+ up.

pusbccfc · Feb 1, 2012

torchomatic said:
That's nuts.

Its correct though, with a goal scorer like king or phillips we would be scoring goals to put the game to bed, what we didn't do again last night, we had chances...

torchomatic · Feb 1, 2012

No, you misunderstood me. That's NUTS.

pusbccfc said:
Its correct though, with a goal scorer like king or phillips we would be scoring goals to put the game to bed, what we didn't do again last night, we had chances...

skybluesteve76 · Feb 1, 2012

I wish people would stop harping on about old players!
We've got what we've got, and we didn't hold onto leads and finish in respectable league positions with players like turner,king and Gunnar.
But those managers got the boot didn't they?
We may have scored more goals if Robbie Keane was still with us, we may have conceded less with Scott Dann in the side or Trevor Peake at centre half but they don't play for us any more.
Why are we constantly losing games from winning positions? That's got sweet FA to do with Ben Turner going surely?

All the best

Covstu · Feb 1, 2012

Maybe the fact thatbwe have poor defenders is the answer however even last year we conceded so many late goals and this is down to tactics and attitude. You look at teams like Norwich who always play for 94 mins and generally always score that late in the game

blueflint · Feb 1, 2012

if the owners were any good our backbone would still be intact we would be fighting for top six i'm certain

CUS Wyken · Feb 1, 2012

The reason we didn't hold onto a lead was because certain players were knackered.

HH was fucked after 60 mins. He played really well but was at fault for the equaliser and certaintly his legs were gone by then.

skybluesteve76 · Feb 1, 2012

CUS Wyken said:
The reason we didn't hold onto a lead was because certain players were knackered.

HH was fucked after 60 mins. He played really well but was at fault for the equaliser and certaintly his legs were gone by then.

Could subs have been bought on earlier to at least get us a point do you think?

All the best

BurbageSkyBlues · Feb 1, 2012

So, tired, inexperienced and unfit players on the pitch A lack of options on the bench, therefore unable to correct the situation.

Who's fault?

Basically, it comes down to the quality and depth of players at the club; plus, possibly, the mentality and determination to see a game out-arguably, the manager's responsibility.

Bottom line- all a result of Sisu' approach to running a football club

covcity4life · Feb 1, 2012

poor management,poor mental strength from the players

not sisu fault really

BurbageSkyBlues · Feb 1, 2012

covcity4life said:
poor management,poor mental strength from the players

not sisu fault really

Irony, right?

Or do you actually mean that the lack of those qualities has nothing to do with:

A) better options being sold
B) better options not being brought to the club

Tankie · Feb 1, 2012

Morning Fellas.
One, nil up, away from home, is always going to be a position under siege, and pressure, last night was no exception, and against a team with a certain amount of Premiership quality, its going to be difficult to hang on, and so was the case.
There is a case for blaming AT for not reacting quicker to the pressure, and going 4/5/1 in an attempt to block the channels, but if he'd done that,and the result remained the same, he would have been blamed for changing a winning side.
But Blackpool, are still a formidable side, a glance at their bench, and then at ours, makes the point. We nearly pulled it off, but these last gasp defeats are getting hard to wear,after another game where we gave a good account of ourselves for long periods, only to be let down by basic errors on the pitch, and slow decisions from the dugout..
Respect.....Tankie..

CUS Wyken · Feb 1, 2012

skybluesteve76 said:
Could subs have been bought on earlier to at least get us a point do you think?

All the best

Of Course they should off. Anyone with a football brain could see subs needed to be made especially as Blackpool had 3 fresh pair of legs on the pitch.

I found it strange his first sub was on the 86th min mark after the equaliser.

Madness.

CUS Wyken · Feb 1, 2012

Tankie said:
Morning Fellas.
One, nil up, away from home, is always going to be a position under siege, and pressure, last night was no exception, and against a team with a certain amount of Premiership quality, its going to be difficult to hang on, and so was the case.
There is a case for blaming AT for not reacting quicker to the pressure, and going 4/5/1 in an attempt to block the channels, but if he'd done that,and the result remained the same, he would have been blamed for changing a winning side.
But Blackpool, are still a formidable side, a glance at their bench, and then at ours, makes the point. We nearly pulled it off, but these last gasp defeats are getting hard to wear,after another game where we gave a good account of ourselves for long periods, only to be let down by basic errors on the pitch, and slow decisions from the dugout..
Respect.....Tankie..

Look at Everton for example last night. They have lesser players than Man City but managed to hold onto a win.

You cannot hide from the fact that players tiring and Thorn Decided to keep them on despite Blackpool brining on 3 fresh pair of legs. Quality was irreverent last night, tiredness was the factor.

Astute · Feb 1, 2012

skybluesteve76 said:
I wish people would stop harping on about old players!
We've got what we've got, and we didn't hold onto leads and finish in respectable league positions with players like turner,king and Gunnar.
But those managers got the boot didn't they?
We may have scored more goals if Robbie Keane was still with us, we may have conceded less with Scott Dann in the side or Trevor Peake at centre half but they don't play for us any more.
Why are we constantly losing games from winning positions? That's got sweet FA to do with Ben Turner going surely?

All the best

You ask why AT has such a hard job or why is he so crap? Someone mentions nearly all the better players left or got sold and not replaced. Then you say stop harping on about our ex players and ask the same question again

Astute · Feb 1, 2012

skybluesteve76 said:
Could subs have been bought on earlier to at least get us a point do you think?

All the best

And brought on the same quality players as Blackpool did?

CUS Wyken · Feb 1, 2012

Astute said:
And brought on the same quality players as Blackpool did?

As i said on the other thread. It was clear to all the city fans certain players were tiring. That’s when substitutions should be used.

Holloway had a better bench granted but Thorn didn’t react to their changes and that cost us in the end.

Nick · Feb 1, 2012

Astute said:
And brought on the same quality players as Blackpool did?

You keep going on about quality players, what about Palace and Burnley?

When they have 4 players up front, we have 4 defenders and one who is blowing out of his arse, it is pretty obvious what is going to happen isn't it? Either put a fresh pair of legs on up front who will chase them from the front and keep it in their half / halfway or put on a fresh pair of defender legs to help keep it tight.

If they were hammering us down our left, I'd have tucked HH in and put Wood on left back.

Astute · Feb 1, 2012

So we now have a better squad than Palace and Burnley? Yes, it would be good to bring an extra striker on that can score goals. It would be even better if we could start games with a striker that can score goals. As we all know we have a lack of players. Were any of our players on the bench carrying knocks? We can only guess. AT is not perfect. AT has a lot of experience to gain. Not all of our problems are down to him though.

Nick · Feb 1, 2012

Astute said:
So we now have a better squad than Palace and Burnley? Yes, it would be good to bring an extra striker on that can score goals. It would be even better if we could start games with a striker that can score goals. As we all know we have a lack of players. Were any of our players on the bench carrying knocks? We can only guess. AT is not perfect. AT has a lot of experience to gain. Not all of our problems are down to him though.

I agree it isn't ALL down to him, but mistakes like last night are.

CUS Wyken · Feb 1, 2012

Astute said:
So we now have a better squad than Palace and Burnley? Yes, it would be good to bring an extra striker on that can score goals. It would be even better if we could start games with a striker that can score goals. As we all know we have a lack of players. Were any of our players on the bench carrying knocks? We can only guess. AT is not perfect. AT has a lot of experience to gain. Not all of our problems are down to him though.

Andy’s gameplan was spot on and it was working but once Holloway made changes Thorn didn’t react to them.

On the way home last night i had Radio 5 on.

Everton reserves beat Man City 1-0. They held on to a lead despite having lesser players. The players were good enough to get us the lead so why can’t they hold onto it?

My issue last night was everyone round me were shouting for Thorn to make changes from the 75min. He only decided to once the equaliser went in by then the damage was done.

andyboy81 · Feb 1, 2012

I haven't really been one to bad-mouth Thorn. HOWEVER, I do think that he lacks tactical knowledge / Judgement. I know he only has what he is able to work with but there has been many times at home this season when we have been trailing and he tries to change things by a "like for like" substitution which does nothing for the team. Everybody knows these changes, its the one when you look about and everybody's got that "why did he do that?" look on their face.

I wasn't at the game last night but from what I have heard we were starting to get a bit of a pasting well before the equalizer and yet Thorn did nothing to try and secure the 3 points. Call it faith in the players in the pitch or whatever you like. The fact of the matter is that he hasn't really got the skills to look at a situation, analyse it and make decisions that can secure / change the outcome of the game.

The way I see it, ANYONE can pick a starting 11. The real skill in management is knowing when to change things when things aren't going your way. THAT is a manager should be judged on and THAT is what Andy Thorn struggles with.

CUS Wyken · Feb 1, 2012

Spot on... Thorn gameplan worked a treat but once Holloway made his changes we didn’t respond ourselves and that proved to be our downfall.

Nick · Feb 1, 2012

andyboy81 said:
The way I see it, ANYONE can pick a starting 11. The real skill in management is knowing when to change things when things aren't going your way. THAT is a manager should be judged on and THAT is what Andy Thorn struggles with.

Spot On!

skybluesteve76 · Feb 1, 2012

Astute said:
You ask why AT has such a hard job or why is he so crap? Someone mentions nearly all the better players left or got sold and not replaced. Then you say stop harping on about our ex players and ask the same question again

I'm not with ya pal. All I'm saying is, that banging on about old players is not the answer to why we keep losing leads at the end of games. Like I stated, the same thing happened with those players in the team! There is more to it than who is or isn't in the team IMHO!

All the best

Astute · Feb 1, 2012

skybluesteve76 said:
I'm not with ya pal. All I'm saying is, that banging on about old players is not the answer to why we keep losing leads at the end of games. Like I stated, the same thing happened with those players in the team! There is more to it than who is or isn't in the team IMHO!

All the best

We lost most of them before this season started.

Yes, he didn't respond to the Blackpool subs in time. Who did we have on the bench though. Yes, he makes mistakes. Which manager does not though? The better managers make less. There is a big difference between an experienced manager and a good manager. I would love us to have a good manager who is experienced. Not just an experienced manager though.

Is it sisus fault that we can't hold a lead? (1 Viewer)

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