Interesting take on the reality of the promised land (1 Viewer)

Major Tom · Apr 23, 2024

For Sheffield United and co the Premier League brings a unique brew of misery | Jonathan Liew

For the teams at the bottom of the food chain, England’s top flight has come to resemble an abusive relationship

www.theguardian.com

Quote: 'Ipswich fans and quite a lot of my time right now is being spent trying to convince them that this – right here – is the good bit. With a team they adore and a league they are tearing apart and a coach who is theirs and theirs alone.
Not the grim struggle that comes after: desperately begging big clubs for loan players, the sheer cliff face to 35 points, hours spent waiting for VAR decisions, 21% possession against Manchester City, elite tactical fouling. Getting bossed 2-0 at home and feeling weirdly grateful. Chris Sutton suddenly deciding to have an opinion about you. Getting rinsed by agents. Getting beaten by literal nation states. For the teams at the bottom of the food chain, the Premier League has come to resemble an abusive relationship'

Maybe I should add I'm split.. there is half of me that likes being able to sit around people who you've been with on a cold Tuesday night and still had a laugh, being able to afford a couple of season tickets, coming out off the other end of the journey we have been on and the fans spirit that brings, being the under dog, over achieving on a small budget, winning games and the affiliation with the players that in real terms cost nothing and bring us joy every week..well most.
`The other half.. wants to show the football world that we are good enough to be in the top league, see elite players at the CBS even if were being beat, being on match of the days again even if we're the last game, the extra fans we will attract, investment and the players that will bring in and finally for Mark Robins who deserves the opportunity to do with us.

shmmeee · Apr 23, 2024

I want us back cos it makes the club sustainable and cos frankly we deserve it.

But I’m not looking forward to the circus at all. The weekend gave me a taste and it’s almost universally shit outside the bits directly to do with the club (40k fans)

SBT · Apr 23, 2024

Major Tom said:
I know a few Ipswich fans and quite a lot of my time right now is being spent trying to convince them that this – right here – is the good bit. With a team they adore and a league they are tearing apart and a coach who is theirs and theirs alone.
Not the grim struggle that comes after

This is exactly how I feel about it. I want us to get promoted for the celebrations, the sense of accomplishment, and for Robins and the team. The stuff that comes afterwards would just be a circus. Objectively speaking I think it’s much more fun being a Championship fan than a Premier League one at the moment.

CBS16 · Apr 23, 2024

I agree in some ways. However this team in a year or 2 could be some force. Add to that our sustainable and intelligent way of signing players and I just refuse to believe there's a ceiling we can't punch through. It's not beyond the realms of possibility that in 5 years we're mid table up there. Huge huge ask but if Sunday taught us anything, it's that we can mix it with anyone!

messiahrobins · Apr 23, 2024

It will be just our luck that when we are promoted next season, the place to be is the Championship as some massive TV deal is struck as it becomes apparent fans prefer the blood and thunder and competitiveness of the Championship to the boring PL.

Yorkshire SB · Apr 23, 2024

Is interesting, and I do think there's a good chance it ends in misery.

However, loads of PL sides now have been where we are; Palace, Brentford, Wolves, Bournemouth, Brighton, Forest, Fulham - and they've all done brilliant things (bar Forest, actually).

eastwoodsdustman · Apr 23, 2024

I hate it, what it's become and what it stands for and really don't fancy us getting there.
Being in the premier league is like a drug habit, you need more and more money to feed the habit and as soon as you stop it comes crashing down and you're fucked.
I've had more that enough of surviving and there's no glory in it after doing it for a year or two, especially as the stakes get higher and higher the longer you're there. Its like playing Russian roulette with the club in the end.

Offhegoes · Apr 23, 2024

When we go up..
At best we'll be a comfortable lower mid table team (like a Palace) for at least 6-10 years, with the odd flirtation with Europe, and a cup run or 2.
At worst we'll do a Sheff Utd and be relegated by Christmas.
Or we become a yo-yo club like Norwich, West Brom & Fulham.

clint van damme · Apr 23, 2024

messiahrobins said:
It will be just our luck that when we are promoted next season, the place to be is the Championship as some massive TV deal is struck as it becomes apparent fans prefer the blood and thunder and competitiveness of the Championship to the boring PL.

Wonder if they'll be bungee jump payments for those who get promoted?

Darth Robins · Apr 23, 2024

shmmeee said:
I want us back cos it makes the club sustainable and cos frankly we deserve it.

But I’m not looking forward to the circus at all. The weekend gave me a taste and it’s almost universally shit outside the bits directly to do with the club (40k fans)

The more time I spend thinking about it the more I actually just want an EFL breakaway league, I'm sure about 10 of the current Prem teams would rather play without the oil and corporation owned clubs too.

I have no idea how that sort of thing will start, but the gap is already too big, and it's only going to widen unless something drastic happens.

rob9872 · Apr 23, 2024

In an ideal world (where we're free to choose), I'd take winning the Championship take the PL money but stay in the Championship and let someone else have our place. Unrealistic and the players / manager deserve a shot to compete at PL level, but a nice Eutopia for me.

messiahrobins · Apr 23, 2024

Darth Robins said:
The more time I spend thinking about it the more I actually just want an EFL breakaway league, I'm sure about 10 of the current Prem teams would rather play without the oil and corporation owned clubs too.

I have no idea how that sort of thing will start, but the gap is already too big, and it's only going to widen unless something drastic happens.

Think that is inevitable to be honest. There is going to be a Super League of 10 which will be like the NFL and a closed shop and eventually the same with the Champions League which will end up having European Super League of about 8 clubs.

robbiethemole · Apr 23, 2024

Offhegoes said:
When we go up..
At best we'll be a comfortable lower mid table team (like a Palace) for at least 6-10 years, with the odd flirtation with Europe, and a cup run or 2.
At worst we'll do a Sheff Utd and be relegated by Christmas.
Or we become a yo-yo club like Norwich, West Brom & Fulham.

Sheff Utd stand to get £112.6m this year for coming bottom!!!!!!! and then parachute payments for 3 years, that would be nice forstart

TomRad85 · Apr 23, 2024

I want us back as I want to see my club be successful and win games. Do that enough and you reach the Prem. I hate pretty much everything that league stands for but I'll be delighted when we're in it.

Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk

shmmeee · Apr 23, 2024

I would like a European campaign though. Feel we’re owed one after 87, just one fluke season then we can get relegated back to the Championship and proper football.

bigfatronssba · Apr 23, 2024

messiahrobins said:
Think that is inevitable to be honest. There is going to be a Super League of 10 which will be like the NFL and a closed shop and eventually the same with the Champions League which will end up having European Super League of about 8 clubs.

I’m happy with that.

The so called “big 6” stopped bringing anything meaningful to English football years ago.
Nowadays they are just a hindrance to other 86 clubs.

Take them out and imagine how great the Premier League would be? Last season you’d have had an exciting title race between Newcastle, Brighton, Villa, and Brentford.

shmmeee · Apr 23, 2024

I genuinely think the entire pyramid below the PL should disavow the FA and form a breakaway pyramid with clear egalitarian rules to stop the same thing happening again. Offer places to PL clubs that sign up to the fairness charter. Those that don’t can play with themselves in whatever is left.

djr8369 · Apr 23, 2024

messiahrobins said:
Think that is inevitable to be honest. There is going to be a Super League of 10 which will be like the NFL and a closed shop and eventually the same with the Champions League which will end up having European Super League of about 8 clubs.

A closed shop would kill off so much of the spirit of the game. Not saying it won’t happen but would be truly depressing.

Brighton Sky Blue · Apr 23, 2024

The missing part of the article is the likes of Bournemouth who then come down and treat the league like dirt on a shoe that should be grateful for its presence. If we go up and come back down, hopefully the fan base can be more humble than that.

bigfatronssba · Apr 23, 2024

djr8369 said:
A closed shop would kill off so much of the spirit of the game. Not saying it won’t happen but would be truly depressing.

On the contrary, I think people would soon lose interest in a super league, as it would be incredibly boring.

With those teams gone, the Premier League would become more like the championship, just slightly more skilful

torchomatic · Apr 23, 2024

shmmeee said:
I want us back cos it makes the club sustainable and cos frankly we deserve it.

But I’m not looking forward to the circus at all. The weekend gave me a taste and it’s almost universally shit outside the bits directly to do with the club (40k fans)

And, on the whole, the players we sign are nice people. You can see in the Unseen videos that they enjoy being here, enjoy playing football for Coventry City. In the PL we'd no doubt end up signing money grabbing bastards who are a waste of space, with little or no interest in the club outside of getting paid a lot of money.

I'm ambivalent about the PL. Yes, I'd like us to get there purely for the sense of achievement for the Club (players, staff) and, of course, the fans. However, I don't miss the days of getting hammered (or even just beaten) week after week and celebrating a draw against Newcastle or Villa as being a great achievement.

We all want it, but at what cost?

Darth Robins · Apr 23, 2024

shmmeee said:
I genuinely think the entire pyramid below the PL should disavow the FA and form a breakaway pyramid with clear egalitarian rules to stop the same thing happening again. Offer places to PL clubs that sign up to the fairness charter. Those that don’t can play with themselves in whatever is left.

It's probably the only chance we'd be able to get some sort of 50+1 requirement. There's definitely a schism coming, a proper pyramid re-forming would definitely be better than just the Super League teams fucking off.

torchomatic · Apr 23, 2024

Brighton Sky Blue said:
The missing part of the article is the likes of Bournemouth who then come down and treat the league like dirt on a shoe that should be grateful for its presence. If we go up and come back down, hopefully the fan base can be more humble than that.

Totally agree with this. The sense of entitlement from the relegated clubs on the whole is pretty unsavoury.

Yorkshire SB · Apr 23, 2024

messiahrobins said:
Think that is inevitable to be honest. There is going to be a Super League of 10 which will be like the NFL and a closed shop and eventually the same with the Champions League which will end up having European Super League of about 8 clubs.

There are no doubt some owners who would want that, but it would be madness for the PL to consider that. Moreover the PL hold all the cards, so why they would deviate from the status quo I don't know.

Skyblueweeman · Apr 23, 2024

torchomatic said:
And, on the whole, the players we sign are nice people. You can see in the Unseen videos that they enjoy being here, enjoy playing football for Coventry City. In the PL we'd no doubt end up signing money grabbing bastards who are a waste of space, with little or no interest in the club outside of getting paid a lot of money.

I'm ambivalent about the PL. Yes, I'd like us to get there purely for the sense of achievement for the Club (players, staff) and, of course, the fans. However, I don't miss the days of getting hammered (or even just beaten) week after week and celebrating a draw against Newcastle or Villa as being a great achievement.

We all want it, but at what cost?

If we went up next season (or even this!), I'd like to think that MR, his team and the scouting dept would stick to the same principles on signing players who are not only technically decent but are also like you say, nice people.

I'd be pretty certain that we've probably not considered players previously based on how they'd 'not fit in'.

It's so important to keep a happy, inclusive squad.

torchomatic · Apr 23, 2024

Skyblueweeman said:
If we went up next season (or even this!), I'd like to think that MR, his team and the scouting dept would stick to the same principles on signing players who are not only technically decent but are also like you say, nice people.

I'd be pretty certain that we've probably not considered players previously based on how they'd 'not fit in'.

It's so important to keep a happy, inclusive squad.

I'm sure every fan (apart from a Utd one!) will say their players are great, fit in and love the club with great team spirit and all that. I may be naïve, but I genuinely do think that about our squad. I really love watching the Unseen videos.

djr8369 · Apr 23, 2024

bigfatronssba said:
On the contrary, I think people would soon lose interest in a super league, as it would be incredibly boring.

With those teams gone, the Premier League would become more like the championship, just slightly more skilful

I hope you’re right but would they? We might but I’m sure they get enough viewed and money to continue with it.

Yorkshire SB · Apr 23, 2024

torchomatic said:
And, on the whole, the players we sign are nice people. You can see in the Unseen videos that they enjoy being here, enjoy playing football for Coventry City. In the PL we'd no doubt end up signing money grabbing bastards who are a waste of space, with little or no interest in the club outside of getting paid a lot of money.

I'm ambivalent about the PL. Yes, I'd like us to get there purely for the sense of achievement for the Club (players, staff) and, of course, the fans. However, I don't miss the days of getting hammered (or even just beaten) week after week and celebrating a draw against Newcastle or Villa as being a great achievement.

We all want it, but at what cost?

Sums up my fear.

However you hope for the unlikely, and we could create something special. Robins remains a very unique factor in our football club.

messiahrobins · Apr 23, 2024

Yorkshire SB said:
There are no doubt some owners who would want that, but it would be madness for the PL to consider that. Moreover the PL hold all the cards, so why they would deviate from the status quo I don't know.

The US owners would prefer a guaranteed 4 matches per season between for example Liverpool v Man City and lose say Man City v Bournemouth. No doubt the Asian owners would as well, as to them sport is about building franchises and a cartel.
Club fanbases in the PL are very different now. Even at Wolves i was shocked how quiet they were with many fans of theirs seeming foreign tourists. At Wembley we saw how disconnected from their club Man Utd fans are, i had friends in the Man Utd end (they actually are from manchester) and they said loads around them didnt even know who half the Man utd players were!!
The point is what we would have thought unthinkable say 25 years ago is actually not that far fetched as the PL has successfully attracted a whole new type of supporter who wouldnt object to a closed shop.

Alan Dugdales Moustache · Apr 23, 2024

Major Tom said:
For Sheffield United and co the Premier League brings a unique brew of misery | Jonathan Liew

For the teams at the bottom of the food chain, England’s top flight has come to resemble an abusive relationship

www.theguardian.com

Quote: 'Ipswich fans and quite a lot of my time right now is being spent trying to convince them that this – right here – is the good bit. With a team they adore and a league they are tearing apart and a coach who is theirs and theirs alone.
Not the grim struggle that comes after: desperately begging big clubs for loan players, the sheer cliff face to 35 points, hours spent waiting for VAR decisions, 21% possession against Manchester City, elite tactical fouling. Getting bossed 2-0 at home and feeling weirdly grateful. Chris Sutton suddenly deciding to have an opinion about you. Getting rinsed by agents. Getting beaten by literal nation states. For the teams at the bottom of the food chain, the Premier League has come to resemble an abusive relationship'

Maybe I should add I'm split.. there is half of me that likes being able to sit around people who you've been with on a cold Tuesday night and still had a laugh, being able to afford a couple of season tickets, coming out off the other end of the journey we have been on and the fans spirit that brings, being the under dog, over achieving on a small budget, winning games and the affiliation with the players that in real terms cost nothing and bring us joy every week..well most.
`The other half.. wants to show the football world that we are good enough to be in the top league, see elite players at the CBS even if were being beat, being on match of the days again even if we're the last game, the extra fans we will attract, investment and the players that will bring in and finally for Mark Robins who deserves the opportunity to do with us.

Absolutely totally agree with this Ipswich sentiment.
Take out the two Manchester clubs , Liverpool , Arsenal and Chelsea and the world will be a better place .

Garlana86 · Apr 23, 2024

In the last couple of days I've seen some absolutely laughable and cringe worthy comments in our feeds from Manchester united fan accounts, which I can presume from looking briefly at their pages as being located anywhere else in the world but Manchester.

It shows that united as a fanbase has far less shame than any other club in the championship, and I'm sure this extends to other teams in the top 6 with their glory supporters. At least you know when you get bantered in the champ it's likely from a proper fan of their club.

It's annoying at times getting beaten and then getting pelters from other champ teams, especially rivals, but I'd take that any day over these guys in India, Nigeria, China, London or wherever else they decided to start glory supporting united.

nunchuckas · Apr 23, 2024

I think I would take us getting promoted (for the money to sort the club out, essentially), staying up after having a good first season (no one wants to come straight back down) and then get relegated the following season after the novelty of the Prem has well worn off and we're all sick to death of VAR and vapid atmospheres, and get back to the Championship and proper football.

I do genuinely believe though that if we kept Robins and co, he would have the foresight to continue the incremental improvement, and eventually have us in the Brighton territory after a few years of the current model, but with prem money (wouldn't even need to spend THAT much). Would just be able to build a 24 man squad of promising, hungry players, an effective, intense style of football, and eventually selling the cream of the crop for 100m after being developed to their full potential by Adi and Robins at prem level. We'd maybe even get a season in Europe or a trophy before Robins is eventually snapped up by a top club or even England. I think that is about our ceiling unless we got taken over big time. I don't even think it's that unrealistic on the current trajectory and the project we have, just would happen over a few years and need to keep Robins and Adi.

messiahrobins · Apr 23, 2024

Garlana86 said:
In the last couple of days I've seen some absolutely laughable and cringe worthy comments in our feeds from Manchester united fan accounts, which I can presume from looking briefly at their pages as being located anywhere else in the world but Manchester.

It shows that united as a fanbase has far less shame than any other club in the championship, and I'm sure this extends to other teams in the top 6 with their glory supporters. At least you know when you get bantered in the champ it's likely from a proper fan of their club.

It's annoying at times getting beaten and then getting pelters from other champ teams, especially rivals, but I'd take that any day over these guys in India, Nigeria, China, London or wherever else they decided to start glory supporting united.

Do you mean on X? or here?

martincov · Apr 23, 2024

robbiethemole said:
Sheff Utd stand to get £112.6m this year for coming bottom!!!!!!! and then parachute payments for 3 years, that would be nice forstart

I think if you only stay up for one season then parachute payments are for two years not three, could be wrong.

messiahrobins · Apr 23, 2024

nunchuckas said:
I think I would take us getting promoted (for the money to sort the club out, essentially), staying up after having a good first season (no one wants to come straight back down) and then get relegated the following season after the novelty of the Prem has well worn off and we're all sick to death of VAR and vapid atmospheres, and get back to the Championship and proper football.

I do genuinely believe though that if we kept Robins and co, he would have the foresight to continue the incremental improvement, and eventually have us in the Brighton territory after a few years of the current model, but with prem money (wouldn't even need to spend THAT much). Would just be able to build a 24 man squad of promising, hungry players, an effective, intense style of football, and eventually selling the cream of the crop for 100m after being developed to their full potential by Adi and Robins at prem level. We'd maybe even get a season in Europe or a trophy before Robins is eventually snapped up by a top club or even England. I think that is about our ceiling unless we got taken over big time. I don't even think it's that unrealistic on the current trajectory and the project we have, just would happen over a few years.

I think Robins will make us like Aston V@lla. While we have him the sky is the limit, the problem is going be keeping him i think as i am certain many PL clubs will have him on their radars.

Interesting take on the reality of the promised land (1 Viewer)

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