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How many points do we need? (5 Viewers)

  • Thread starter skybluebristol
  • Start date Yesterday at 11:52 AM
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skybluebristol

Active Member
  • Yesterday at 11:52 AM
  • #1
Inspired by something @CovRes posted on another thread. Bear with me on this, it's fairly long, apologies.

I went back and looked at the Championship since 2004 to try and get an idea of how many points we'll need to come first or second this season. First off, I looked at the total number of points required to reach each position, shown below. This isn't how many points that team got, it's how many a team would have needed to reach that position, so, the team finishing below +1. As you can see, the average number to win the league is rounded to 90 points, and for second place, 85 points.



That seems about right based on where we're at currently after 28 games. If you remove the top and bottom 3 totals from each column to account for outliers, the average barely moves.

I then went back to this point in each of the last 21 seasons, to see, on average, how many points are won by 1st & 2nd over the remaining 18 games.

On average, 1st place wins a total of 36.4 points over the remaining 18 games. 2nd place wins on average a total of 35.0 points over the remaining 18 games.

This, then, would give Cov a total of 94 points (round down). Boro, in second, would likely see a total of 87 points. Ipswich are tricky to predict. They're currently on 50 points, with a game in hand. If you allow them 3 points for their game in hand, they'd be on 53. Adding 35 (2nd place average) to their 53 would be 88 points, meaning that 89 would be enough to win the league.



Before we get too excited though, we need to remember that this is on average. In 9 of the last 21 seasons, the team finishing in second place has won more than 35 points, including in 20/21, where they hit 45!

So Ipswich...

Over their last 8, they're currently hitting 2.125 PPG. I picked their last 8, because that gives a fairly good idea of their form and where they are at as a team. I think it's tricky with Ipswich to base their predicted total on full season PPG as they are a much different side now than they were in October. Multiply (2.125 * 19 remaining games) + current points = 90 points. 91 points would therefore be enough to win the league.



For what it's worth, I think we'll win the league, and I think Ipswich will finish slightly lower than 90 points, perhaps closer to 88 or 89 (based on the averages in the first section above).

For us to have to hit 91, Ipswich would have to get almost 13 points (12.75) per every 6 games (18 available) which is a lot. If they do, then fair play, because that's 4 wins and a draw in every 6. They'd need to win 12 of their last 19 games, draw 4, and lose only 3 more to hit 90. It's the Championship, so...

We're on 58 points right now. That means we only need 33 points (probably).

9 wins, 6 draws (3 losses) should be all we need.
 
Reactions: Briles, Fergusons_Beard, covcity4life and 12 others

Sky Blue Harry H

Well-Known Member
  • Yesterday at 12:01 PM
  • #2
One more than the 3rd placed team will be just fine.
 
Reactions: fernandopartridge, Sky Blue Pete, Gynnsthetonic and 3 others
S

skybluebristol

Active Member
  • Yesterday at 12:06 PM
  • #3
Sky Blue Harry H said:
One more than the 3rd placed team will be just fine.
Click to expand...
100% agree, that will likely be Boro, maybe with 87 points.
 

Robinshio

Well-Known Member
  • Yesterday at 3:54 PM
  • #4
if we beat Boro, and assume they lose at ipswich 85 points will be enough
Lose to Boro and we will need 88

so excluding the Boro game
beat them we need 7 wins, 3 draws and 7 defeats
Lose to them we need 9 wins 3 draws and 5 defeats

for boro to get to 86 if lose those 2 they need from the other 16
Win 10 Draw 4 Lose 2 - which is a very big ask, so

Boro game is key, Mid table form excluding that game should get us there
Also shows , another Lampard winning run, up to and including the Boro game, and we are nearly there
 

MusicDating

Euro 2016 Prediction League Champion!!
  • Yesterday at 4:04 PM
  • #5
WBA winning the league with 81 points is mental btw

2007–08 Football League Championship - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org
 

Johhny Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Yesterday at 4:07 PM
  • #6
I just want to go into the last game with a 3 point lead and +25 goal difference. Then we can sweat out the game.
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete
P

play_in_skyblue_stripes

Well-Known Member
  • Yesterday at 5:35 PM
  • #7
skybluebristol said:
Inspired by something @CovRes posted on another thread. Bear with me on this, it's fairly long, apologies.

I went back and looked at the Championship since 2004 to try and get an idea of how many points we'll need to come first or second this season. First off, I looked at the total number of points required to reach each position, shown below. This isn't how many points that team got, it's how many a team would have needed to reach that position, so, the team finishing below +1. As you can see, the average number to win the league is rounded to 90 points, and for second place, 85 points.

View attachment 48587

That seems about right based on where we're at currently after 28 games. If you remove the top and bottom 3 totals from each column to account for outliers, the average barely moves.

I then went back to this point in each of the last 21 seasons, to see, on average, how many points are won by 1st & 2nd over the remaining 18 games.

On average, 1st place wins a total of 36.4 points over the remaining 18 games. 2nd place wins on average a total of 35.0 points over the remaining 18 games.

This, then, would give Cov a total of 94 points (round down). Boro, in second, would likely see a total of 87 points. Ipswich are tricky to predict. They're currently on 50 points, with a game in hand. If you allow them 3 points for their game in hand, they'd be on 53. Adding 35 (2nd place average) to their 53 would be 88 points, meaning that 89 would be enough to win the league.

View attachment 48588


Before we get too excited though, we need to remember that this is on average. In 9 of the last 21 seasons, the team finishing in second place has won more than 35 points, including in 20/21, where they hit 45!

So Ipswich...

Over their last 8, they're currently hitting 2.125 PPG. I picked their last 8, because that gives a fairly good idea of their form and where they are at as a team. I think it's tricky with Ipswich to base their predicted total on full season PPG as they are a much different side now than they were in October. Multiply (2.125 * 19 remaining games) + current points = 90 points. 91 points would therefore be enough to win the league.

View attachment 48589

For what it's worth, I think we'll win the league, and I think Ipswich will finish slightly lower than 90 points, perhaps closer to 88 or 89 (based on the averages in the first section above).

For us to have to hit 91, Ipswich would have to get almost 13 points (12.75) per every 6 games (18 available) which is a lot. If they do, then fair play, because that's 4 wins and a draw in every 6. They'd need to win 12 of their last 19 games, draw 4, and lose only 3 more to hit 90. It's the Championship, so...

We're on 58 points right now. That means we only need 33 points (probably).

9 wins, 6 draws (3 losses) should be all we need.
Click to expand...
Great data analysis.
 
Reactions: djr8369, Skybluedownunder, skybluebristol and 1 other person

Hobo

Well-Known Member
  • Yesterday at 6:22 PM
  • #8
The only target you need is to keep trying to win the next game and see where that gets you.
 
Reactions: stupot07, Gynnsthetonic, CovRes and 1 other person

BackRoomRummermill

Well-Known Member
  • Yesterday at 6:32 PM
  • #9
skybluebristol said:
Inspired by something @CovRes posted on another thread. Bear with me on this, it's fairly long, apologies.

I went back and looked at the Championship since 2004 to try and get an idea of how many points we'll need to come first or second this season. First off, I looked at the total number of points required to reach each position, shown below. This isn't how many points that team got, it's how many a team would have needed to reach that position, so, the team finishing below +1. As you can see, the average number to win the league is rounded to 90 points, and for second place, 85 points.

View attachment 48587

That seems about right based on where we're at currently after 28 games. If you remove the top and bottom 3 totals from each column to account for outliers, the average barely moves.

I then went back to this point in each of the last 21 seasons, to see, on average, how many points are won by 1st & 2nd over the remaining 18 games.

On average, 1st place wins a total of 36.4 points over the remaining 18 games. 2nd place wins on average a total of 35.0 points over the remaining 18 games.

This, then, would give Cov a total of 94 points (round down). Boro, in second, would likely see a total of 87 points. Ipswich are tricky to predict. They're currently on 50 points, with a game in hand. If you allow them 3 points for their game in hand, they'd be on 53. Adding 35 (2nd place average) to their 53 would be 88 points, meaning that 89 would be enough to win the league.

View attachment 48588


Before we get too excited though, we need to remember that this is on average. In 9 of the last 21 seasons, the team finishing in second place has won more than 35 points, including in 20/21, where they hit 45!

So Ipswich...

Over their last 8, they're currently hitting 2.125 PPG. I picked their last 8, because that gives a fairly good idea of their form and where they are at as a team. I think it's tricky with Ipswich to base their predicted total on full season PPG as they are a much different side now than they were in October. Multiply (2.125 * 19 remaining games) + current points = 90 points. 91 points would therefore be enough to win the league.

View attachment 48589

For what it's worth, I think we'll win the league, and I think Ipswich will finish slightly lower than 90 points, perhaps closer to 88 or 89 (based on the averages in the first section above).

For us to have to hit 91, Ipswich would have to get almost 13 points (12.75) per every 6 games (18 available) which is a lot. If they do, then fair play, because that's 4 wins and a draw in every 6. They'd need to win 12 of their last 19 games, draw 4, and lose only 3 more to hit 90. It's the Championship, so...

We're on 58 points right now. That means we only need 33 points (probably).

9 wins, 6 draws (3 losses) should be all we need.
Click to expand...
i said 85 before christmas - I just asked co pilot and it gave the number
 

Lamps

Well-Known Member
  • Yesterday at 6:33 PM
  • #10
It's easier to predict the teams that will finish in the top 2 than to predict how many points they will need.

Us and Ipswich for me.
 
D

Dougin

Well-Known Member
  • Yesterday at 7:27 PM
  • #11
We need 1 more than Boro.
 
Reactions: CovRes

Hobo

Well-Known Member
  • Yesterday at 8:28 PM
  • #12
Dougin said:
We need 1 more than Boro.
Click to expand...

No, we need 1 point more than anyone. Always aim as high as possible.
 
Reactions: Captain Dart, Flying Fokker, MaltaSkyBlue and 2 others

skybluedan87

Active Member
  • Yesterday at 8:55 PM
  • #13
We get 94pts bookmark it, I had a dream a champagne soaked open top bus dream, woke up drenched!
 
Reactions: Briles, wingy and Sky Blue Pete

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Yesterday at 8:57 PM
  • #14
Lamps said:
It's easier to predict the teams that will finish in the top 2 than to predict how many points they will need.

Us and Ipswich for me.
Click to expand...
I feel pretty confident in it being 2 from the current top 3, and somewhat confident that Ipswich will be one of them. As for who joins them, I don't think we'll have a good idea till the end of February.
 
S

skybluebristol

Active Member
  • Yesterday at 9:16 PM
  • #15
I’m convinced it will be us and Ipswich, but the key game is Boro at home I think. If we get turned over at the CBS like we did against Ipswich it could be trouble but I don’t think we will.

If you offered me 89 points now I’d take it mind you!
 

Gynnsthetonic

Well-Known Member
  • Yesterday at 9:17 PM
  • #16
Hobo said:
The only target you need is to keep trying to win the next game and see where that gets you.
Click to expand...
Yes definitely, it will send you mad looking at all the permutations
 
Reactions: Lamps

Covcraig@bury

Well-Known Member
  • Yesterday at 10:21 PM
  • #17
It’s a Batch
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Yesterday at 10:23 PM
  • #18
MusicDating said:
WBA winning the league with 81 points is mental btw

2007–08 Football League Championship - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org
Click to expand...
We beat them away from home that season
 
Q

quinn1971

Well-Known Member
  • Yesterday at 10:27 PM
  • #19
10 more wins does it, 9 after Monday,
 

PUSB-We_are_going_up

Well-Known Member
  • Yesterday at 11:20 PM
  • #20
Based on games left the countdown to guaranteed title and ability to relax is 48pts (which will reduce every game as possible points will also reduce)
 

baldy

Well-Known Member
  • Yesterday at 11:26 PM
  • #21
If we're confirmed as promoted by the time the last home game comes around I think that last home line-up should be an absolutely mental team - Wilson up front,Allen in goal,Lati 'bombing' down the wing
 

Lamps

Well-Known Member
  • Today at 3:23 AM
  • #22
Brighton Sky Blue said:
I feel pretty confident in it being 2 from the current top 3, and somewhat confident that Ipswich will be one of them. As for who joins them, I don't think we'll have a good idea till the end of February.
Click to expand...
It could all change very quickly but we're in a great position. If we lose a couple now the worst that can happen is the others in the top 4 catch us up. If they lose a couple and we win, the table would look very different.
 
C

CovValleyBoy

Well-Known Member
  • Today at 7:23 AM
  • #23
quinn1971 said:
10 more wins does it, 9 after Monday,
Click to expand...
Hang on , it was 10 wins last week before the 2 wins. So I make it 8 wins & a few draws.
That will do it.
 
Reactions: wingy

Saddlebrains

Well-Known Member
  • Today at 7:36 AM
  • #24
CovValleyBoy said:
Hang on , it was 10 wins last week before the 2 wins. So I make it 8 wins & a few draws.
That will do it.
Click to expand...
This

No way 85 doesn't get us up this season
 

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • Today at 7:50 AM
  • #25
skybluedan87 said:
We get 94pts bookmark it, I had a dream a champagne soaked open top bus dream, woke up drenched!
Click to expand...

Not on the bus I hope
 

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • Today at 7:51 AM
  • #26
Lamps said:
It could all change very quickly but we're in a great position. If we lose a couple now the worst that can happen is the others in the top 4 catch us up. If they lose a couple and we win, the table would look very different.
Click to expand...

I think the big advantage we've got over Ipswich with regard to our more favourable split of home to away games is going to be crucial.
 

AFCCOVENTRY

Well-Known Member
  • Today at 7:52 AM
  • #27
The crux of it is Boro having to play Ipswich and us in the run in. If we both beat them then it will be over for them.
 

Otis

Well-Known Member
  • Today at 7:58 AM
  • #28
Saddlebrains said:
This

No way 85 doesn't get us up this season
Click to expand...
I hope you're right.

If I truly believed it was 85, I would so much more confident.

It is worrying me a little that Boro and Ipswich have been strengthening.

It's great we brought the two in, but I do think we need more. A CM and a left back for sure.

Just worry about injury/tiredness/suspensions as the season wears on.

If Grimes got injured, I think it would really hurt us. And at left back, the back up to JDS is lacking.
 
Reactions: Saddlebrains

Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
  • Today at 7:59 AM
  • #29
Terribly nervous going into every game
Can see the gap down to 3 after these games and I know it’s just past experience leading the future
Pusb
 
Reactions: Gynnsthetonic and Otis

Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
  • Today at 8:00 AM
  • #30
Otis said:
I hope you're right.

If I truly believed it was 85, I would so much more confident.

It is worrying me a little that Boro and Ipswich have been strengthening.

It's great we brought the two in, but I do think we need more. A CM and a left back for sure.

Just worry about injury/tiredness/suspensions as the season wears on.

If Grimes got injured, I think it would really hurt us. And at left back, the back up to JDS is lacking.
Click to expand...
I’ve been thinking we’d have to play a completely different game if grimes was injured and it might mean we are less open
An injury to Rushworth now that would be hard to manage
 
Reactions: Otis

Otis

Well-Known Member
  • Today at 8:00 AM
  • #31
AFCCOVENTRY said:
The crux of it is Boro having to play Ipswich and us in the run in. If we both beat them then it will be over for them.
Click to expand...
Yeah true. Boro at home for us could be massive and pretty much kill off their chance to overtake us, but Boro don't play Ipswich until the middle of April, so it could be some wait yet
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete

Otis

Well-Known Member
  • Today at 8:01 AM
  • #32
Sky Blue Pete said:
Terribly nervous going into every game
Can see the gap down to 3 after these games and I know it’s just past experience leading the future
Pusb
Click to expand...
Results in our favour today would be a tremendous boost going into Monday.
 

AFCCOVENTRY

Well-Known Member
  • Today at 8:05 AM
  • #33
Sky Blue Pete said:
Terribly nervous going into every game
Can see the gap down to 3 after these games and I know it’s just past experience leading the future
Pusb
Click to expand...

Yeah it might be but then we have a run of games which will take us away and increase the gap again. There’s 18 games left and we need to win a minimum of another 8. That’s shy of a 50% win rate for the rest of the season. We just need to win our home games as a minimum….
 

MacReady

Well-Known Member
  • Today at 8:06 AM
  • #34
You’d like to think Middlesborough or Ipswich simply have to dip at some point, can’t see them keeping it up permanently.
 

Torquay Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Today at 8:13 AM
  • #35
AFCCOVENTRY said:
Yeah it might be but then we have a run of games which will take us away and increase the gap again. There’s 18 games left and we need to win a minimum of another 8. That’s shy of a 50% win rate for the rest of the season. We just need to win our home games as a minimum….
Click to expand...
Our home form is excellent. If we grind out home wins and scrape a few away points we should be okay. Sounds a bit desperate but that's how teams go up... I think
 
Reactions: Hobo and Sky Blue Pete
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