Hoffman - Telegraph Back Page (4 Viewers)

Ccfc1979 · Apr 24, 2012

Investors still there, despite being told to go away several times, they want more info about League One now club relegated - does change things significantly, investors see Ricoh and club as 'joined at the hip', he has not said anything as it annoys people and doesn't want to go into history of things but will say if it all collapses or if anything is ever agreed, fears for future of club and will never stop looking to help with investment parties. All sounds quite grim and not close at all!

Astute · Apr 24, 2012

Or ready to pounce if things go tits up.

What I don't understand is the rumours of SISU wanting to finish us off, but not wanting to sell. Our biggest assets are our name, history, fanbase and position as a league club.

Otis · Apr 24, 2012

Sounds like as thought, they want out but only with being able to recoup some of their money and any new owner paying them a lump sum for getting out. This is why they keep talking in terms of co-investment. They don't just wish to walk away with nothing.

Thing is, in the business world, usually, you make a bad investment you lose your money, you don't get a pay-off for making the bad investment.

Hoffman quite rightly just wants the club and his team of backers are not prepared to pay off Sisu for their mistakes.

TommyAtkins · Apr 24, 2012

Astute said:
Or ready to pounce if things go tits up.

What I don't understand is the rumours of SISU wanting to finish us off, but not wanting to sell. Our biggest assets are our name, history, fanbase and position as a league club.

We are hardly an attractive option like that. Our history is irrelevant, our name is nothing more than a label and we are now a League One club.

We owe money, we are running at a loss, there is a declining fanbase and we don't own our own stadium.

This is why there has never been a queue of potential investors.

Sad, devastating but true.

We look at CCFC in a different way to those who have no connections with the club. Once you look at the club in an objective manner, the reality is less than appealing

Otis · Apr 24, 2012

Well all I can say is, they may be the owners, but the club belongs to us!!

Fans have the ultimate power to dictate what happens to this club.

steveo1987 · Apr 24, 2012

But also an opportunity for someone.

Billy Blofeld · Apr 24, 2012

The Sun today quoting Tim Fisher "If SISU do step out, I can categorically state there is no one coming in"

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar · Apr 24, 2012

Gary Hoffman investors bide their time after Coventry City relegation

http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/co...fter-coventry-city-relegation-92746-30825922/

LeamingtonBootBoy · Apr 24, 2012

Otis said:
Fans have the ultimate power to dictate what happens to this club.

Nice sentiment, Otis, but in reality once SISU took the shares for nothing (urged by the likes of Joseph Elliott), we have little/no power.

LeamingtonBootBoy · Apr 24, 2012

Billy Blofeld said:
The Sun today quoting...

I stopped reading after this point....:facepalm:

OyJimmy · Apr 24, 2012

I like to deal with facts, which is something Sisu don't do. The truth of the situation is this. If Sisu put us into administration then the administrator will calculate the total debt of the club and then ask possible investors how much of that debt they will agree to shoulder. If an investor offers more than the club is worth in a liquidated state and that offer is the only one on the table then he will take that. Ok that's maybe a bit too simple but it's basically what would happen.

Sisu could liquidate but then the press will hound them and questions will be asked about how much their investors lost. The only credible option for Sisu is admin.

LeamingtonBootBoy · Apr 24, 2012

Whose to say that SISU have lost anything.

Have they simply taking money out from transfer fees/mortgaging Ryton/borrowing off season ticket sales etc....and simply added to the debt of a Limited (and therefore ring-fenced) company, which enables them to protect other assets should we go tits up?

Wankers they are, but my experience of business people is that they rarely lose out.....:thinking about:

dongonzalos · Apr 24, 2012

Bloody hell, how nice is it to be told the truth even if it is not what we want to hear.

Why the bloody hell can SISU not be honest with us like this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Just hope the council could trust The Hof's investors. and they make an agreement like take over the club after 2 years a review will be done. If you are sensibly running the club 50% will be available to purchase.

thorninmyside · Apr 24, 2012

Firstly the hoff hasn't actually said anything here at all has he. Its simply more of the same old same old.

The key phrase I think fans need to consider is 'told to go away a few times'. Sisu will not sell to anyone unless they make a realistic offer.

The offer of 1 pound is disgraceful. The club isn't in administration or losing money hand over fist in a manner sisu investors can't handle with ease. These 1 pound buy out usually occur when a club is at deaths door or in administration.

Hoff is taking the p with his paltry offer.
Face it sisu would rather take the club down destroying it in flames rather than get completely ripped off in a rip hoff! !

Anyone wanting to buy the club has to cover the debt first of all of 30 million. I bet the 1 pound doesn't cover the debt/loan for starters.
Then there are the investments into the club to consider. Time. Payoffs to managers executives and other staff etc. ..
Then there is the price due for a going concern. .. every business has its price. Even when it doesn't make a profit.

And keep in mind most businesses don't profit in the first 3 to 6 years.

Offering 1 pound is simply a joke. I don't blame sisu due joking this guy around. If a serious billionaire wanted the club they would be paying around 45 million ... even then the investors would not make a profit.

Add to that the new owners will need another 60 million to buy the ricoh realistically.
That's a total of 105 million pounds .. hoffer of 1 pound is way off.

Now if you want to consider the reality of the state we are in. .. we are in the 3rd division. .. no home and no money. We need a buyer or sisu to pay 100 million.

Or a buyer could buy the likes of swansea for 50 million and have 50 million left for players and stand extentions.

The choice is yours. .. a ready made premier club with a bright future or coventry city in the 3rd division and you would still have to find extra money to buy players to make the investment worthwile.

Which option would you take.

That why the investors would rather we liquidate rather than accept 1 pounds for their millions in losses.

I'm with sisu on this one. .. if hoff was serioushe would have got the club a year ago. He is simply trying to get a lot for very little. .. he is a banker after all.

coundonskyblue · Apr 24, 2012

thorninmyside said:
Firstly the hoff hasn't actually said anything here at all has he. Its simply more of the same old same old. 
 
The key phrase I think fans need to consider is 'told to go away a few times'. Sisu will not sell to anyone unless they make a realistic offer. 
 
The offer of 1 pound is disgraceful. The club isn't in administration or losing money hand over fist in a manner sisu investors can't handle with ease. These 1 pound buy out usually occur when a club is at deaths door or in administration. 
 
Hoff is taking the p with his paltry offer. 
Face it sisu would rather take the club down destroying it in flames rather than get completely ripped off in a rip hoff! !
 
Anyone wanting to buy the club has to cover the debt first of all of 30 million. I bet the 1 pound doesn't cover the debt/loan for starters. 
Then there are the investments into the club to consider. Time. Payoffs to managers executives and other staff etc. ..
Then there is the price due for a going concern. .. every business has its price. Even when it doesn't make a profit. 
 
And keep in mind most businesses don't profit in the first 3 to 6 years. 
 
Offering 1 pound is simply a joke. I don't blame sisu due joking this guy around. If a serious billionaire wanted the club they would be paying around 45 million ... even then the investors would not make a profit. 
 
Add to that the new owners will need another 60 million to buy the ricoh realistically. 
That's a total of 105 million pounds .. hoffer of 1 pound is way off. 
 
Now if you want to consider the reality of the state we are in. .. we are in the 3rd division. .. no home and no money. We need a buyer or sisu to pay 100 million. 
 
Or a buyer could buy the likes of swansea for 50 million and have 50 million left for players and stand extentions. 
 
The choice is yours. .. a ready made premier club with a bright future or coventry city in the 3rd division and you would still have to find extra money to buy players to make the investment worthwile. 
 
Which option would you take. 
 
That why the investors would rather we liquidate rather than accept 1 pounds for their millions in losses. 
 
I'm with sisu on this one. .. if hoff was serioushe would have got the club a year ago. He is simply trying to get a lot for very little. .. he is a banker after all.

What is your valuation of the club then?

thorninmyside · Apr 24, 2012

OyJimmy said:
I like to deal with facts, which is something Sisu don't do. The truth of the situation is this. If Sisu put us into administration then the administrator will calculate the total debt of the club and then ask possible investors how much of that debt they will agree to shoulder. If an investor offers more than the club is worth in a liquidated state and that offer is the only one on the table then he will take that. Ok that's maybe a bit too simple but it's basically what would happen.

Sisu could liquidate but then the press will hound them and questions will be asked about how much their investors lost. The only credible option for Sisu is admin.

Administration. . That's not how hedge funds work. They simply take the hit and liquidate. I think a lot of people don't realise there is a 3rd option. Simply put the club can stop trading. .. sisu do not have to sell. They can simply wind up the club legally. Coventry city football club would the cease to exist.

Hedge funds do that all the time. This way they avoid the questions of the media. .. and it is simply business after all.

This situation is going to get much much worse yet.

dongonzalos · Apr 24, 2012

thorninmyside said:
Administration. . That's not how hedge funds work. They simply take the hit and liquidate. I think a lot of people don't realise there is a 3rd option. Simply put the club can stop trading. .. sisu do not have to sell. They can simply wind up the club legally. Coventry city football club would the cease to exist.

Hedge funds do that all the time. This way they avoid the questions of the media. .. and it is simply business after all.

This situation is going to get much much worse yet.

The Hoffman can make an agreement with the council to run a new club for 2 years responsibility, before then buying a share of the ground. We could be called Singers FC 2012.

SISU will destroy us eventually so the sooner the better whilst their is still a chance of the Hoff and his investors. The longer they get to do damage the less attractive the club looks

thorninmyside · Apr 24, 2012

My valuation of the club is 45 million without the ricoh. 100 with the ownership of the ricoh.

Do I think we are worth it. No

Do I think anyone will pay it. .. No

Our only way forward is this

1 sisu continue and refuse to invest unless they get the ricoh which is fair enough.

2 the council or acl take the club on. The thought of coventry council owning our club sends shivers through the spine.

coundonskyblue · Apr 24, 2012

thorninmyside said:
My valuation of the club is 45 million without the ricoh. 100 with the ownership of the ricoh.

Do I think we are worth it. No

Do I think anyone will pay it. .. No

Our only way forward is this

1 sisu continue and refuse to invest unless they get the ricoh which is fair enough.

2 the council or acl take the club on. The thought of coventry council owning our club sends shivers through the spine.

£45 Million? Are you Ken Deluded in disguise?

The club has assets of about £1m, liabilities of about £40m.

In any other industry CCFC would have gone out of existance ages ago.

TheBoss · Apr 24, 2012

Hoffman Investors still in the game?

http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/co...ter-coventry-city-relegation-92746-30825922/?

Its time for Hoffman to tell us what he knows, its obvious to me that Fisher is scaremongering to sway fans to support SISU and saying there is no on-going talks or interested parties when there clearly is.

:blue:

SkyBlue_Bear83 · Apr 24, 2012

This bullshit has been going on for a year now, the investors obviously don't want to commit to Coventry City or they would have. We don't need any more half arsed owners who don't give a monkeys like we have now.

Sounds to me as if the investors are not interested but Hoffman keeps begging them to stick with it and continue, I don't think a takeover will happen. Sounds as if the investors are as reluctant to make an offer as SISU are to accept.

TheBoss · Apr 24, 2012

or SISU are just playing hard-ball, taking over a club isnt easy at the best of times, but when you have owners who are as stubborn as a mule, it makes the whole task a bigger challenge.

The goal-posts have changed now we are in League One, that is self-explanatory, and I imagine the club is worth less now. Hoffman should sell the Southampton or Norwich way to these investors to show what is possible.

skybluesam66 · Apr 24, 2012

its all hard ball

Hoffman is hardly going to say its now easier now we are in League one - He is trying to drive down the price, SISU are trying to drive up the price

I think there will be a deal at some point, but Orange Joe may have his watch out as a deadline approaches

SkyBlue_Bear83 · Apr 24, 2012

TheBoss said:
The goal-posts have changed now we are in League One, that is self-explanatory, and I imagine the club is worth less now.

So anything less than £0 is negative, so that means SISU will actually have to pay the investors to take the club off their hands.

I agree SISU are stubborn but it still seems to me the investors aren't really interested in the club and Hoffman is having a battle just to keep them interested. If they were they could have forced the issue more than they have.

TheParsonsHose · Apr 24, 2012

Every day that goes buy without anything happening could and has resulted in us missing out on decent players from transfer embargos to just not having funds. I really dont know what to think anymore about this takeover to -be / not to-be situation.

SISU have just carried debt for us and nobody is going to let it go for a £1 or even £100k. I don't know what the price is but it would be great if SISU would just say right the club's for sale at £x which will include £x debt, who's interested?

Then we can all move on an accept no club or SISU in charge if nobody wants to deal.

Otis · Apr 24, 2012

CCFC said:
So anything less than £0 is negative, so that means SISU will actually have to pay the investors to take the club off their hands.

I agree SISU are stubborn but it still seems to me the investors aren't really interested in the club and Hoffman is having a battle just to keep them interested. If they were they could have forced the issue more than they have.

Why do you say that? You think Hoffman is lying then when he says that the investors are interested but are kept being told to 'go away' by Sisu?

Sisu has said they want co-investment. Hoffman's backers want to buy the club. There is the impasse.

Senior Vick from Alicante · Apr 24, 2012

I have heard from a source who is in the know and is very close to an ex owner of the club. That person has intimated that their is a lot of smoke and mirrors going on around the potential takeover at the moment, he has also said the liquidation threat is a hurry up to get it done and he was expecting an anouncement immediately after the Southampton game. It may be a lot of bluster as politicians are famous for it but who knows their may be some truth in it!

SkyBlue_Bear83 · Apr 24, 2012

Otis said:
Why do you say that? You think Hoffman is lying then when he says that the investors are interested but are kept being told to 'go away' by Sisu?

Sisu has said they want co-investment. Hoffman's backers want to buy the club. There is the impasse.

How many times have we heard that though, once about 9 months ago and nothing concrete since then, not the act of eager potential owners. This has been going on for to long, if the investors were serious about buying the club they would have forced the issue. It just seems as if both parties are waiting for the other to approach and neither are trying to force a deal through. Not the acts of people who seem keen to takeover the club.

Hoffman seems to me seems to be busting his balls trying to get a deal done whilst neither of the two parties seem that keen to do business.

Everyone blames SISU for a deal not happening but I don't think Hoffmans party is willing to seriously commit to the club at the moment.

thorninmyside · Apr 24, 2012

Business is like this. ... you offer enough for ANYTHING ........ you get it. Nature of the beast.

Hofman is full of it. .. he wants them to simply hand it over. Why would they. Would you? ?

If you had a ferarri that simply was not working properly would you politely sell it for a pound to give another person a go at it. I don't thinkso. . It still has a price doesn't it.

Look. Hofman in my opinion being a banker means we should not trust him at all. Should we trust sisu. No.

Should we trust anyone. .. yes . . Ourselves

We the fans can and should take the club from sisu investors. Start by not giving them your money.

Then club together and buy the club then if you all trust hofman you can partner him and his investors.

Paxman II · Apr 24, 2012

So Hoffman speaks....

....and says pretty much what i alluded to in a previous post.

There is no deal on the table so SISU are correct among all these accusations of lies? Hoffman's so called investors have backed off from their previous position....just makes me wonder why did they not push earlier?
Fact remains as I've said before the real prize is a stake in the Ricoh arena.
The football club is almost secondary.

What the hell Keys is on about is anybodies guess.

We should just forget about Hoffman's open ended rhetoric...it comes across as ever increasing bull shit. As suspected no negotiations take so long and it turns out there are no negotiations going on.

They have ideas for investment but those 'investors' are clearly way too skeptical and without the Ricoh on the table it's also clear there will be no Hoffman investors.

I propose Hoffman gets a clear mandate from his 'investors' first establishing that they will invest certain amounts provided the Ricoh is a part of that investment and then get negotiating with the council/Higgs as soon as possible.

He wants to try he says but frankly Hoffman your best effort to date has been poor to say the least. You should just quietly withdraw your interest like a responsible person and come back when you have some concrete investors on board. How the Hell does this man hold down his current job?

TheBoss · Apr 24, 2012

be careful, this thread will be removed by the powers to be.

Nonleagueherewecome · Apr 24, 2012

Well I think "here's a quid, you won't be losing more money any more, now go away" was an incredibly reasonable offer, actually. Show me a better one?

Ah well, we is gonna be liquidised!!!!

Nonleagueherewecome · Apr 24, 2012

TheBoss said:
be careful, this thread will be removed by the powers to be.

What, SISU? Or the Mods? We wouldn't remove that, he's not a dickhead Sunderland fan saying brain dead things..

We'll_live_and_die · Apr 24, 2012

Have you got a link to this?

TheBoss · Apr 24, 2012

I trust Hoffman because he supports the club, if people don't than thats their prerogative, if this was any other club they'd be supporting Hoffman, but synical Coventry fans just amuse me as always.

Hoffman - Telegraph Back Page (4 Viewers)

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