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Gyokeres (3 Viewers)

  • Thread starter Evo1883
  • Start date Nov 5, 2022
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Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,046
shmmeee said:
“the deal” being “this fee in return for that player” so in effect it is. King clearly values it at a couple of million because he’s willing to take a lower cash fee for it. Without the 35% Sporting wouldn’t have been able to afford him.
Click to expand...
shmmeee said:
If the fee had been from Burnley and was £18m + McNally would that have counted? We’d have had to agree on a value for McNally to decide, sell ons are no different.
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Imagine a scenario Sporting sell up for £30-40m and we got an extra £10-14 million… does it not count? Of course it does.

35% sell-on fee would be a seriously good deal given the circumstances.

It’s a manipulation of terms that I don’t like. Suppose Sporting packaged the £18m over 2 years, does that mean we class it as £9m for this window.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,047
Mucca Mad Boys said:
Imagine a scenario Sporting sell up for £30-40m and we got an extra £10-14 million… does it not count? Of course it does.

35% sell-on fee would be a seriously good deal given the circumstances.
Click to expand...

It’s got a value in and of itself. You could imagine a scenario where Sporting buy it out or drop it as part of a future deal between the clubs. Yes it’s a gamble, like buying stock in a player and the value isn’t realised until it’s sold. That doesn’t mean stocks don’t have value.
 
Reactions: CCFCSteve

AFCCOVENTRY

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,048
Mucca Mad Boys said:
Imagine a scenario Sporting sell up for £30-40m and we got an extra £10-14 million… does it not count? Of course it does.

35% sell-on fee would be a seriously good deal given the circumstances.
Click to expand...

Sporting also won’t let him go on a free at the end of his contract. He’s got 18-24 months tops. They’re a bit like us but obviously higher up in terms of bringing on talent and selling on for a profit to Euro club big boys.
 
D

Deity

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,049
I don’t much care who wins the charity bet but you can’t exclude a sell on clause from the calculation. That’s obvious.
 
Reactions: Grendel

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,050
shmmeee said:
It’s got a value in and of itself. You could imagine a scenario where Sporting buy it out or drop it as part of a future deal between the clubs. Yes it’s a gamble, like buying stock in a player and the value isn’t realised until it’s sold. That doesn’t mean stocks don’t have value.
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AFCCOVENTRY said:
Sporting also won’t let him go on a free at the end of his contract. He’s got 18-24 months tops. They’re a bit like us but obviously higher up in terms of bringing on talent and selling on for a profit to Euro club big boys.
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Agreed. At 24, you’d think Gyokeres has still got development to do and in the Portuguese league, a good opportunity to use it as a stepping stone. Going to the Prem is the ceiling for him in a sense because the next step is either a top-end Prem/European team. As much as I like Gyokeres, I doubt his ceiling is that high.
 
Reactions: bulko

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,051
Deity said:
I don’t much care who wins the charity bet but you can’t exclude a sell on clause from the calculation. That’s obvious.
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So if the bet was when we sold Maddison it wouldn’t pay out for 7 years?
 

Marty

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,052
I think you need to include the sell on fee as it's part of the deal between the 2 clubs. If he goes and flops over there, you'd expect a newly relegated championship side would try and pick him up for 10mill or so. From what I've read the few covers the whole future fee and not just the profit side of things, so think it's fair to value the sell on clause at 3.5mill in addition to the original 18m.
 
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,053
Mucca Mad Boys said:
I weighed in on the point that the transfer package could total more than £20 million down the line.

‘Sold for more than £20m by end of the current transfer window’ - that’s not so unambiguous as to what that actually means. Again, the sell-on clause was negotiated before the end of the window. Therefore, we won’t know what if we get over £20m for Gyokeres until he leaves Sporting, one way or the other.

Then again, I’m not a gambler and silly bets like this show me why.
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The “end of the transfer window” wording is indeed important. If he is “sold for more than £20m by end of the transfer window” then I’m happy to pay up. I’m even willing to take into account the value of future fees that have been agreed at the time of the player’s sale, before the end of the transfer window. But I somehow doubt that the value of any sell-on clauses will have been agreed on and collected by the end of the transfer window, so they shouldn’t count imo.

Again, if @Earlsdon_Skyblue1 and I cannot agree on the value of the fee, I have said I am happy to void the bet. It’s up to him whether he wants to go ahead with the bet he suggested.
 

Gynnsthetonic

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,054

West Ham must urgently offer recent signing in exchange for Gyokeres to save deal

Deal makes complete sense for all parties but Hammers must act fast...
www.hammers.news
 
Reactions: Sick Boy

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,055
Gynnsthetonic said:

West Ham must urgently offer recent signing in exchange for Gyokeres to save deal

Deal makes complete sense for all parties but Hammers must act fast...
www.hammers.news
Click to expand...
Thanks for posting that again.
 
Reactions: skybluepm2, MacReady and Deleted member 5849

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,056
The sell on % has no guaranteed value to be fair, Gyokeres could leave Sporting on a free

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 
Reactions: GaryMabbuttsLeftKnee, Hobo and Ccfcisparks
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,057
Marty said:
I think you need to include the sell on fee as it's part of the deal between the 2 clubs. If he goes and flops over there, you'd expect a newly relegated championship side would try and pick him up for 10mill or so. From what I've read the few covers the whole future fee and not just the profit side of things, so think it's fair to value the sell on clause at 3.5mill in addition to the original 18m.
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You think it’s fair to just make up a £3.5m value for a sell-on fee which you’ve said in the previous sentence could well be worth zero?
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,058
Arguing over the value of a sell on % for an internet bet, this is peak skybluestalk
 
Reactions: Tomh111, mmttww, CCFCSteve and 6 others
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,059
This is going to end with me trying to throw a kettle over a pub isn’t it
 
Reactions: ajsccfc, djr8369 and Deleted member 5849

hill83

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,060
SBT said:
This is going to end with me trying to throw a kettle over a pub isn’t it
Click to expand...

The real quiz
 
Reactions: Deleted member 9744

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,061
I think we should settle all SBT arguments gladiator style at half time.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,062
SkyBlue_Bear83 said:
Arguing over the value of a sell on % for an internet bet, this is peak skybluestalk
Click to expand...
Just went you thought there was nothing left to argue about...
 

CDK

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,063
Surprised he's not gone yet ,cause he will can't see him playing for us again get rid city
 
D

djr8369

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,064
hill83 said:
The real quiz
Click to expand...
Fuck Blockbusters
 

Ccfcisparks

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,065
djr8369 said:
Fuck Blockbusters
Click to expand...
Half Vulcan, half Human.
 
Reactions: Deleted member 9744 and Briles
C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,066
CDK said:
Surprised he's not gone yet ,cause he will can't see him playing for us again get rid city
Click to expand...

Apparently waiting for the terms of the SBT bet to be agreed before speaking to clubs
 
Reactions: RegTheDonk, Sky Blue Pete, SBT and 1 other person

Nuskyblue

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,067
SBT said:
This is going to end with me trying to throw a kettle over a pub isn’t it
Click to expand...
Rekon you could?
 

Bertola

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,068
Fray Bentos!
 
Reactions: hill83

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,069
SBT said:
The “end of the transfer window” wording is indeed important. If he is “sold for more than £20m by end of the transfer window” then I’m happy to pay up. I’m even willing to take into account the value of future fees that have been agreed at the time of the player’s sale, before the end of the transfer window. But I somehow doubt that the value of any sell-on clauses will have been agreed on and collected by the end of the transfer window, so they shouldn’t count imo.

Again, if @Earlsdon_Skyblue1 and I cannot agree on the value of the fee, I have said I am happy to void the bet. It’s up to him whether he wants to go ahead with the bet he suggested.
Click to expand...

Your wording isn’t as unambiguous as you think.

Simply put, you’re wagering in the ‘up front’ amount being below £20m. If reports of a deal with Sporting being ‘close’ you aren’t making a big bold claim. From @Earlsdon_Skyblue1’s POV, it’s a stupid bet to take on for a £5a let alone £250.

From a CCFC POV, I’d rather accept less money upfront for a sell-on % given that Gyokeres can leave next year for free. At 24, he is yet to peak.

If Gyokeres performs well in the Portuguese league and in Europe - which I back him to do - he could easily command a £30-40m fee in a year or two.
 

hill83

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,070
shmmeee said:
I think we should settle all SBT arguments gladiator style at half time.
Click to expand...

Awooga
 
Reactions: RegiswasGod and mmttww

Skybluedownunder

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,071
shmmeee said:
Yeah but it’s clear that the 35% was added because we wanted £20m and they couldn’t afford it.
Click to expand...

How can they not afford it with the sales of Pedro Poro and Ugarte? That’s rubbish… they just don’t want to

Portugal clubs always buy low and sell high


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete

Briles

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,072
This thread it making my eyes go deaf. You cannot include a "what if" into a transfer fee total. If its 18 million "rising to xyz based on xyz" its 18 million. If its 18 million with a 35% sell on clause, its 18 million. A fee is an amount paid, not an amount that could be
 
Reactions: Sick Boy
D

Deity

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,073
Briles said:
This thread it making my eyes go deaf. You cannot include a "what if" into a transfer fee total. If its 18 million "rising to xyz based on xyz" its 18 million. If its 18 million with a 35% sell on clause, its 18 million.
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No it isn’t. Simply factually and legally not true.
 
D

Deity

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,074
£18m is the minimum liability but not the maximum liability, therefore the transfer value is not simply £18m.
 
Reactions: Mucca Mad Boys

Briles

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,075
Deity said:
£18m is the minimum liability but not the maximum liability, therefore the transfer value is not simply £18m.
Click to expand...

So what was neymars transfer fee?
 

Briles

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,076
Deity said:
£18m is the minimum liability but not the maximum liability, therefore the transfer value is not simply £18m.
Click to expand...

My point is when a player goes for 60 million, that's the agreed amount. What ifs are irrelevant. Otherwise transfer fees would be published as with or without VAT
 

baldy

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,077
CDK said:
Surprised he's not gone yet ,cause he will can't see him playing for us again get rid city
Click to expand...

Great input
 
Reactions: skybluepm2

BackRoomRummermill

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,078
Wonder what Gustavo thinks of all this … arguably the better player and no playoffs without him .
 

BackRoomRummermill

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,079
When was the last Victor goal in open play ?
 
Reactions: Greggs
H

HuckerbyDublinWhelan

Well-Known Member
  • Jul 1, 2023
  • #3,080
BackRoomRummermill said:
When was the last Victor goal in open play ?
Click to expand...
QPR in April
 
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