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Germany *again* (1 Viewer)

  • Thread starter ccfc922
  • Start date Dec 20, 2024
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duffer

Well-Known Member
  • Jan 23, 2025
  • #246
With apologies for the lengthy rant, I get a bit pissed off with the whole "hang-em-and-flog em" knee jerk suggestions to stop kids carrying knives. On its own, it simply doesn't work.

I'll let you do your own research, but when you think about it calmly you'll realise that a lot of kids are carrying knives because they're scared of becoming victims of violence. That's children scared of other children, and children scared of adults.

Whatever solution you want to come up with has to acknowledge that fact first, because just locking a few of them up for longer won't change anything.

In Scotland, they've had good results with a far more rounded approach, treating it as a public health issue. That, of course, costs money and time, and doesn't provide red meat for the Daily Mail.

In the meantime, here's a thought. In the cities (and county lines in particular), knife crime is driven by gangs, with adults exploiting children into becoming expendable couriers and soldiers in petty but deadly turf wars or respect 'beefs'.

If you're buying drugs from these scum-sucking fuckers (I can think of no other words for an adult who exploits a child), and plenty of people are, then to me, you're part of the problem.

Sorry again for going on - as a parent with a soon to be teenage son, there's not much that worries me more than this.

How Scotland reduced knife deaths among young people

Treating knife crime as a health issue has led to a dramatic drop in stabbings: of the 35 deaths of young people in Britain this year, none were in Scotland
www.theguardian.com
 
Reactions: Sky_Blue_Dreamer, Sky Blue Pete and chiefdave
C

CovValleyBoy

Well-Known Member
  • Jan 23, 2025
  • #247
If we had a Southport riots police & judiciary response to those carrying knives.
Immediate prison it would be a start.
Send 50 the first week & so on.
It can be done if the government wishes it.
 

Captain Dart

Well-Known Member
  • Jan 23, 2025
  • #248
Meanwhile yesterday there was a knife attack in Plymouth and today 4 stabbed near an Asda in Croydon.
 
C

CovValleyBoy

Well-Known Member
  • Jan 23, 2025
  • #249
Captain Dart said:
Meanwhile yesterday there was a knife attack in Plymouth and today 4 stabbed near an Asda in Croydon.
Click to expand...
It's a daily occurrence isn't it...
 

Nick

Administrator
  • Jan 23, 2025
  • #250
It's just becoming the norm now.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Jan 23, 2025
  • #251
duffer said:
With apologies for the lengthy rant, I get a bit pissed off with the whole "hang-em-and-flog em" knee jerk suggestions to stop kids carrying knives. On its own, it simply doesn't work.

I'll let you do your own research, but when you think about it calmly you'll realise that a lot of kids are carrying knives because they're scared of becoming victims of violence. That's children scared of other children, and children scared of adults.

Whatever solution you want to come up with has to acknowledge that fact first, because just locking a few of them up for longer won't change anything.

In Scotland, they've had good results with a far more rounded approach, treating it as a public health issue. That, of course, costs money and time, and doesn't provide red meat for the Daily Mail.

In the meantime, here's a thought. In the cities (and county lines in particular), knife crime is driven by gangs, with adults exploiting children into becoming expendable couriers and soldiers in petty but deadly turf wars or respect 'beefs'.

If you're buying drugs from these scum-sucking fuckers (I can think of no other words for an adult who exploits a child), and plenty of people are, then to me, you're part of the problem.

Sorry again for going on - as a parent with a soon to be teenage son, there's not much that worries me more than this.

How Scotland reduced knife deaths among young people

Treating knife crime as a health issue has led to a dramatic drop in stabbings: of the 35 deaths of young people in Britain this year, none were in Scotland
www.theguardian.com
Click to expand...

I get what you’re saying but the first step according to that article was tripling sentences for carrying a knife and carrying out a lot of stop and search which seems to be what a lot of people are asking for.

The next step was identifying them and letting them know they had been identified. The “public health” angle gets a lot but much of this was just solid visible police work.

Admittedly this is followed up by housing, education and employment support and getting them to realise the consequences of their actions.

Carrot and stick seems a fair way of describing it.
 
Reactions: CCFCSteve, duffer and Sky Blue Pete
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 13, 2025
  • #252
And now a car runs into a crowd of trade unionists in Munich - supposedly an attack from an Afghan asylum seeker. Police say the suspect was known to them for theft and drug offences - if that’s all true, I can only ask what the hell was he still doing in the country?
 
Reactions: Otis

Harry Krishner

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 13, 2025
  • #253

At least 28 injured in suspected deliberate attack as car hits crowd in Munich – Europe live

Local authorities say suspected attacker is 24-year-old Afghan man
www.theguardian.com
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 13, 2025
  • #254
SBT said:
And now a car runs into a crowd of trade unionists in Munich - supposedly an attack from an Afghan asylum seeker. Police say the suspect was known to them for theft and drug offences - if that’s all true, I can only ask what the hell was he still doing in the country?
Click to expand...

Seeking asylum?
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 13, 2025
  • #255
shmmeee said:
Seeking asylum?
Click to expand...
One would hope that anyone guilty of drug and theft offences would be swiftly rejected and removed. Shouldn’t be complicated.
 
Reactions: CCFCSteve, hill83 and mmttww

Nick

Administrator
  • Feb 13, 2025
  • #256
SBT said:
One would hope that anyone guilty of drug and theft offences would be swiftly rejected and removed. Shouldn’t be complicated.
Click to expand...

Probably against the poor lamb's human rights.
 

Marty

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 13, 2025
  • #257
SBT said:
And now a car runs into a crowd of trade unionists in Munich - supposedly an attack from an Afghan asylum seeker. Police say the suspect was known to them for theft and drug offences - if that’s all true, I can only ask what the hell was he still doing in the country?
Click to expand...

Probably liked the local nuggets.
 

Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 13, 2025
  • #258
What a total shit show. This is literally happening all the time now.

Elections there are imminent as well.
 
Reactions: Otis

SBAndy

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 13, 2025
  • #259
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
What a total shit show. This is literally happening all the time now.

Elections there are imminent as well.
Click to expand...

Far be it from me to suggest conspiracy, but a quick flurry of these types of incidents probably does the AfD no harm does it.
 
Reactions: shmmeee
P

PVA

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 13, 2025
  • #260
There's a photo that shows a mangled pram on the floor, horrible to see.

Seems to be no deaths so far, let's hope it stays that way.
 
Reactions: Otis

Otis

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 13, 2025
  • #261
It's just a whole new can of worms using a vehicle isn't it. So little can be done about it too.

Major events can have barricades, but smaller group gatherings and just cars driving down streets in a town centre, but then mounting the pavement in order to just drive at people? What can you do about that?

It's awful isn't it.
 
Reactions: hill83, Sick Boy, Harry Krishner and 1 other person

rob9872

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 13, 2025
  • #262
Otis said:
It's just a whole new can of worms using a vehicle isn't it. So little can be done about it too.

Major events can have barricades, but smaller group gatherings and just cars driving down streets in a town centre, but then mounting the pavement in order to just drive at people? What can you do about that?

It's awful isn't it.
Click to expand...
Not sure what the answer is. You could argue for bollards etc, but they'll likely move onto sporting events or something else with crowds and less protection. Almost impossible to police. I guess we should be thankful at being cars and not HGV's which are less accessible, but applications to learn should now perhaps be monitored closely.
 
Reactions: hill83, Otis and Sky Blue Pete

Nick

Administrator
  • Feb 13, 2025
  • #263
rob9872 said:
Not sure what the answer is. You could argue for bollards etc, but they'll likely move onto sporting events or something else with crowds and less protection. Almost impossible to police. I guess we should be thankful at being cars and not HGV's which are less accessible, but applications to learn should now perhaps be monitored closely.
Click to expand...

I think if somebody is going to use a car to drive into a crowd of people, they aren't going to be that arsed if they have a license or not.
 

rob9872

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 13, 2025
  • #264
Nick said:
I think if somebody is going to use a car to drive into a crowd of people, they aren't going to be that arsed if they have a license or not.
Click to expand...
Oh of course totally agree, but I meant in terms of them being less accessible and I'd like to think if someone is interested in buying who isnt from a business it would raise a few flags.
 
Reactions: ccfc922, Otis and Sky Blue Pete
M

Macca

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 13, 2025
  • #265
Got to live with it sadly, horse well and truly bolted
 
Reactions: Otis

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 14, 2025
  • #266
So not an asylum seeker and no criminal record. Feel like there’s an opposing phrase needed for “if it sounds too good to be true it probably is” here. Seems crazy an asylum seeker with a criminal record was allowed to wander about and it turns out it was.
 
Reactions: Otis and Sky Blue Pete

rob9872

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 14, 2025
  • #267
I'm sure that's comforting to the families of the victims.

I feel the same way about those desperate to prove that it's just an ordinary Joe as I do to the racists and Islamophobes who try to always look for blame where it isn't.

The focus every single time should be on the victims and their families.

Absolutely ok to hate on the perpetrator, but hate them for being that and nothing more or less.
 
Reactions: AOM and Sky Blue Pete

Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 14, 2025
  • #268
shmmeee said:
So not an asylum seeker and no criminal record. Feel like there’s an opposing phrase needed for “if it sounds too good to be true it probably is” here. Seems crazy an asylum seeker with a criminal record was allowed to wander about and it turns out it was.
Click to expand...

Where are you seeing this?

From BBC:

The suspect - named locally as 24-year-old Farhad N - came to Germany in 2016, according to reports. He had his asylum application rejected, but his deportation was suspended.

Munich car attack: Suspected attacker named locally as counter-terrorism police take over investigation
 

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 14, 2025
  • #269
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
Where are you seeing this?

From BBC:

The suspect - named locally as 24-year-old Farhad N - came to Germany in 2016, according to reports. He had his asylum application rejected, but his deportation was suspended.

Munich car attack: Suspected attacker named locally as counter-terrorism police take over investigation
Click to expand...
He arrived in Germany in 2016 and although his application for asylum was turned down he was allowed to stay in Germany and had a valid residence and work permit.

The Munich prosecutor confirmed to reporters that Farhad N had been living in Germany legally.

Jihadist motivation in Munich attack, prosecutors say

The Afghan suspect admits driving into a crowd, injuring 36 people including a two-year-old, police say.
www.bbc.co.uk
And when they initially said known to police it seems that may be because he worked security
Herrmann said initially that the suspect had been known to police but later explained that he had previously worked as a store detective and had been a witness in several cases of shoplifting.
Click to expand...
 

Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 14, 2025
  • #270
chiefdave said:
He arrived in Germany in 2016 and although his application for asylum was turned down he was allowed to stay in Germany and had a valid residence and work permit.

The Munich prosecutor confirmed to reporters that Farhad N had been living in Germany legally.

Jihadist motivation in Munich attack, prosecutors say

The Afghan suspect admits driving into a crowd, injuring 36 people including a two-year-old, police say.
www.bbc.co.uk
And when they initially said known to police it seems that may be because he worked security
Click to expand...

What a shambles, if anything that makes it worse. Looks like there is a key bit of information missing:

The man's asylum application was rejected, but he had not been forced to leave due to security concerns in Afghanistan and he was in Germany legally with a work permit.


All that confirms really is that the system is a joke. (We already knew that).
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 14, 2025
  • #271
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
What a shambles, if anything that makes it worse. Looks like there is a key bit of information missing:

The man's asylum application was rejected, but he had not been forced to leave due to security concerns in Afghanistan and he was in Germany legally with a work permit.

All that confirms really is that the system is a joke. (We already knew that).
Click to expand...

Just going off the (BBC ironically) news on the radio that said he didn’t have previous convictions and was working with a permit.
 

Captain Dart

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 15, 2025
  • #272
A 23-year-old Syrian man went on a stabbing spree near the Drau Bridge in Villach, Austria, injuring four and killing a 14-year-old boy. A food delivery driver intervened by hitting the attacker with his car, stopping the assault. One suspect is in custody, others may be on the run.
Click to expand...
 
W

wingy

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 15, 2025
  • #273
Shoot to kill philosophy or keep taking the hit on society, keep asking questions, keep killing or put them out of their misery, which may instigate more, but it would be a deterrent of sorts!
 
Reactions: Harry Krishner

ccfc922

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 16, 2025
  • #274
Nick said:
I think if somebody is going to use a car to drive into a crowd of people, they aren't going to be that arsed if they have a license or not.
Click to expand...

Assume they mean an HGV isn't as easy to get hold of as a car?
 

ccfc922

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 16, 2025
  • #275
Macca said:
Got to live with it sadly, horse well and truly bolted
Click to expand...

Exactly what all the politicians wanted, for whatever bizarre reason.
 

ccfc922

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 16, 2025
  • #276
I am very surprised that German people put up with all of this (mass immigration and terror attacks) Historically, they're a strong nation and I'm amazed they've let Merkel do the whole open arms shite.
 
Reactions: Harry Krishner

rob9872

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 16, 2025
  • #277
ccfc922 said:
I am very surprised that German people put up with all of this (mass immigration and terror attacks) Historically, they're a strong nation and I'm amazed they've let Merkel do the whole open arms shite.
Click to expand...
How though? They have many land borders. We can't stop it with water in between so they've got no chance.
 

ccfc922

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 16, 2025
  • #278
rob9872 said:
How though? They have many land borders. We can't stop it with water in between so they've got no chance.
Click to expand...

Their politicians not doing an impressive of Steve McClaren beckoning would be a start?

Poland seem to manage it, and they're similar geographically.
 

rob9872

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 16, 2025
  • #279
That's true about Poland, but also not as affluent so less desire to go there. In fact lots of poles have headed to Germany too as they have here for better opportunities.
 

ccfc922

Well-Known Member
  • Feb 16, 2025
  • #280
rob9872 said:
That's true about Poland, but also not as affluent so less desire to go there. In fact lots of poles have headed to Germany too as they have here for better opportunities.
Click to expand...

I might be wrong, but I think alot of Poles are going back?

I think there's less desire for "asylum seekers" to go to Poland, because they're not inviting them and offering hotels, money and clothes for them to come like ourselves and Germany etc.
 
Reactions: brizzle and Harry Krishner
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