General Election (2 Viewers)

Brylowes · Jun 6, 2017

Kingokings204 said:
Tories will win this election. To even suggest otherwise is a tad deluded. Tories got a majority with ukip getting 4m votes so now about half of ukip are going back to Tory this just further strengthens their seats and majority. Snp will take the lions share in Scotland meaning labour can't win this election. I know this post won't be popular but it is the reality. Tory majority of 30-50 seats is my best guess.

Sadly I agree, to many obstacles in Labours way 'what with the popular press acting as an Unsalable wall
to Downing Street, though I do think labour will have a better showing than I thought 'even two weeks ago.
Even though Farage and his merry band harbour right wing views that would make an old school Tory blush,
They probably took more votes off labour than they did the torys. Again the power of the press, how to
Conjure up a "man of the people" image, for a man who was reviled as to extreme by many in the Tory
Party. ......You couldn't make it up.:banghead:
I'm going for Tory 20 - 35 seats and May resigns inside 6 months, woefully out of her depth.

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Jun 6, 2017

Heard Abbott's interview on Sky News last night was a corker. Anyone got a link?

chiefdave · Jun 6, 2017

Whoever at Conservative HQ thought wheeling Boris out for the last couple of days of campaigning was going to help is probably looking for a new job after his performance on Radio 4 this morning.

Liquid Gold · Jun 6, 2017

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
Heard Abbott's interview on Sky News last night was a corker. Anyone got a link?

chiefdave said:
Whoever at Conservative HQ thought wheeling Boris out for the last couple of days of campaigning was going to help is probably looking for a new job after his performance on Radio 4 this morning.

What a shit election.

SkyblueBazza · Jun 6, 2017

oakey said:
I have noticed but he lacks credibility as he is perceived as a friend of terrorists and an opponent of anti-terror legislation. Cooper has no such baggage.

Not perceived...portrayed by the mostly Tory press

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

SkyblueBazza · Jun 6, 2017

mrtrench said:
What would happen if it were made illegal to shoot to kill and policemen were faced with murder charges if they did so?

That is virtually the case now - every time a bullet is discharged it is referred to the Police Complaints body who would probably be better employed further investigating some of the suspected Jihadists like the one that slipped through Saturday night

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

rob9872 · Jun 6, 2017

Surely even the most staunch Labour supporters among you must be concerned at the level of office Abbott could potentially hold after that car crash of an interview? Even if anyone can make a mistake with the numbers a few weeks back, this one is completely embarrassing and actually a bit scary.

My granddad voted Labour blindly his entire life as the party of the working man, in fact I'm sure he still would if he was alive today, regardless of what they said or did. Today they are not the party of the working man imo, but represent scroungers and wasters. The Conservatives may be deemed nasty, but there really is no credible alternative that I resonate with on policy or even on an individual likable basis. Blair apart, then New Labour (Tory light) was probably the best choice for me, but as a tax paying middle earning worker with a family, I feel compelled to vote Conservative again this time around.

RegTheDonk · Jun 6, 2017

Brylowes said:
You maybe haven't noticed, but Jeremy Corybin is running rings around May in this
Current climate, it's just not reported that way.

Perhaps but the people around him are doing a good job fucking it up. Latest gaff from Abott she looked like a rabbit in headlights. Cooper should have put party before personal thought and got with the programme would have been a much better senior shadow minister than Abott. May doesnt need to win this Jezzas team are going all her hard work.

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Jun 6, 2017

Anyone know anything about Sandra Findlay who is standing independently in Coventry South? Can't find anything.

Yes, really. I am thinking about it.

clint van damme · Jun 6, 2017

rob9872 said:
Surely even the most staunch Labour supporters among you must be concerned at the level of office Abbott could potentially hold after that car crash of an interview? Even if anyone can make a mistake with the numbers a few weeks back, this one is completely embarrassing and actually a bit scary.

My granddad voted Labour blindly his entire life as the party of the working man, in fact I'm sure he still would if he was alive today, regardless of what they said or did. Today they are not the party of the working man imo, but represent scroungers and wasters. The Conservatives may be deemed nasty, but there really is no credible alternative that I resonate with on policy or even on an individual likable basis. Blair apart, then New Labour (Tory light) was probably the best choice for me, but as a tax paying middle earning worker with a family, I feel compelled to vote Conservative again this time around.

why anyone who falls into that demographic, (as I do), would vote tory is an absolute mystery to me. Especially if you have kids who go to a state school or haven't got private health care for your family.

chiefdave · Jun 6, 2017

rob9872 said:
Surely even the most staunch Labour supporters among you must be concerned at the level of office Abbott could potentially hold after that car crash of an interview? Even if anyone can make a mistake with the numbers a few weeks back, this one is completely embarrassing and actually a bit scary.

I would be concerned but I also thing she would be shuffled out pretty quickly. In the highly unlikely event Labour get in there will have to be some sort of coalition so people like Caroline Lucas and Angus Robertson would be in fairly prominent positions.

You could ask similar questions of staunch Conservative supporters. Are they not concerned that May is refusing to debate anyone, has been shown to ignore police advice that her actions would increase the risk of terrorists attacks, trust Boris to negociate brexit after his own car crash interview this morning and his claim the other day that the £350m plastered on the side of the brexit bus was in the manifesto and a chancellor who got his figures wrong by tens of billions.

rob9872 · Jun 6, 2017

I've not heard of Sandra Findlay and couldn't find anything with a Google search either. If she is representing your constituency and hasn't got her message out to all of the local area then with two days to go it's not a great advert for her campaign team. I assume as an independent she is standing on local issues rather than national as I've heard nothing about any protest to the main parties particularly linked locally.

I'd love to see the SISU out campaigner win in Coventry North and literally stand up every week in Parliament with a SISU out t-shirt on and ask a question about them. Picking up £50k pa for that too would be nice

rob9872 · Jun 6, 2017

chiefdave said:
I would be concerned but I also thing she would be shuffled out pretty quickly. In the highly unlikely event Labour get in there will have to be some sort of coalition so people like Caroline Lucas and Angus Robertson would be in fairly prominent positions.

You could ask similar questions of staunch Conservative supporters. Are they not concerned that May is refusing to debate anyone, has been shown to ignore police advice that her actions would increase the risk of terrorists attacks, trust Boris to negociate brexit after his own car crash interview this morning and his claim the other day that the £350m plastered on the side of the brexit bus was in the manifesto and a chancellor who got his figures wrong by tens of billions.

Absolutely Boris is a liability, but whilst I also supported Brexit, many seem to be unable to separate Brexit from being a Conservative policy. The PM himself and his main team you'll recall campaigned to stay in and it was supported by TM. The £350m really needs to be let go too - it was discredited at the campaign and anyone who says they voted on the basis of that clearly wasn't listening to debate or is a liar (my opinion of course is that they only said what it could fund and not what it would fund, but accept it was misleading as were many lies from both sides. I'd also say that whether it's 350 or 200 which is the corrected and agreed amount - that's still £10bn p/a going to Europe that could be better spent at home).

chiefdave · Jun 6, 2017

clint van damme said:
why anyone who falls into that demographic, (as I do), would vote tory is an absolute mystery to me. Especially if you have kids who go to a state school or haven't got private health care for your family.

Same here. Maybe in the past it was understandable but we've reached a point where they've taken everything they can from the lower classes and are targeting the middle class. Its turkeys voting for Xmas because The Sun / Mail / Times etc tell them to.

The current government has overseen the biggest transfer of wealth to the richest in the country in history, have privatised more than any other government in history (even Thatcher and Lawson) and show no signs of slowing down. The NHS will be gone for certain, implementing Naylor makes sure of that. Land Registry as well with planning being moved under their control so you'll have a private company deciding who can build what and where they can build it. Our infrastructure increasingly being owned by either other countries governments or the Chinese. I struggle to see a single reason to vote for them.

rob9872 · Jun 6, 2017

clint van damme said:
why anyone who falls into that demographic, (as I do), would vote tory is an absolute mystery to me. Especially if you have kids who go to a state school or haven't got private health care for your family.

We do have private health care, but the NHS will always say they are under funded by a Troy govt. We cant keep on overspending, cuts in the right area (and not to direct care) are right - so much waste it needs redirecting. Schools I don't see as a problem and again support more grammar schools albeit too late for my daughter - I also believe that would have benefitted from them if they were around more in my time.

rob9872 · Jun 6, 2017

chiefdave said:
Same here. Maybe in the past it was understandable but we've reached a point where they've taken everything they can from the lower classes and are targeting the middle class. Its turkeys voting for Xmas because The Sun / Mail / Times etc tell them to.

The current government has overseen the biggest transfer of wealth to the richest in the country in history, have privatised more than any other government in history (even Thatcher and Lawson) and show no signs of slowing down. The NHS will be gone for certain, implementing Naylor makes sure of that. Land Registry as well with planning being moved under their control so you'll have a private company deciding who can build what and where they can build it. Our infrastructure increasingly being owned by either other countries governments or the Chinese. I struggle to see a single reason to vote for them.

I find it insulting that it's so often quoted that people voting Tory or last year the same threw at brexiteers was because they read it in the press. It's far from true and if you believe all Labour voters are somehow more intelligent, then I could point to many examples both known and reported that contradict that theory.

I think the pledge of raising the middle band of taxable income to £50k in addition to increasing the 20p threshold is a decent incentive if you're looking for one and I feel safer and more secure with their policies on defence and their ability to deliver a strong brexit are other factors to consider.

chiefdave · Jun 6, 2017

rob9872 said:
I've not heard of Sandra Findlay and couldn't find anything with a Google search either.

Wasn't easy to find anything but came up with this
None
Looks like shes a single issue candidate who doesn't want Baginton Fields developed.

chiefdave · Jun 6, 2017

rob9872 said:
It's far from true and if you believe all Labour voters are somehow more intelligent, then I could point to many examples both known and reported that contradict that theory.

Nowhere have I said Labour voters are more intelligent. Studies have shown a huge bias in the media and there are also studies that have shown when people are polled on issues and policies without a party label the Conservative vote collapses.

rob9872 said:
I think the pledge of raising the middle band of taxable income to £50k in addition to increasing the 20p threshold is a decent incentive if you're looking for one and I feel safer and more secure with their policies on defence and their ability to deliver a strong brexit are other factors to consider.

The 20p threshold increase pledge is meaningless, its only in line with annual increases and rising inflation negates some of the increase. As for safer and more secure obviously your own opinion but I'm not sure how you come to that conclusion when May is happily selling arms to our enemies and ignoring experts telling her that her plans will leave us more exposed to terrorist attacks.

Ian1779 · Jun 6, 2017

rob9872 said:
Surely even the most staunch Labour supporters among you must be concerned at the level of office Abbott could potentially hold after that car crash of an interview? Even if anyone can make a mistake with the numbers a few weeks back, this one is completely embarrassing and actually a bit scary.

I agree it was a car crash - but I also think that should Labour be in power either directly or in a coalition that she would not be holding that position going forward.

Although Dermot was right in questioning her the way he did - it would be nice to see this level of forensic questioning applied to a Tory minister.

Also send out a search party for the Health Secretary as he appears to be missing,...

clint van damme · Jun 6, 2017

rob9872 said:
I find it insulting that it's so often quoted that people voting Tory or last year the same threw at brexiteers was because they read it in the press. It's far from true and if you believe all Labour voters are somehow more intelligent, then I could point to many examples both known and reported that contradict that theory.

I think the pledge of raising the middle band of taxable income to £50k in addition to increasing the 20p threshold is a decent incentive if you're looking for one and I feel safer and more secure with their policies on defence and their ability to deliver a strong brexit are other factors to consider.

But we don't overspend, it's a myth, we just take money from the bottom/middle strata of society and propel it up towards the top percentile.
The wealth gap isn't widening like it is by chance.

RegTheDonk · Jun 6, 2017

Ian1779 said:
I agree it was a car crash - but I also think that should Labour be in power either directly or in a coalition that she would not be holding that position going forward.

Although Dermot was right in questioning her the way he did - it would be nice to see this level of forensic questioning applied to a Tory minister.

Also send out a search party for the Health Secretary as he appears to be missing,...

I'm sure she will be replaced but the damage is done now in the public eyes, just like Corbyn being soft on nukes and having a shoot-to-kill U turn.

I'm seeing more and more of this labour bashing and you are right Ian. Boris has had a couple of gaffs but this seems to be glossed over. Mud is now sticking and making Labour look completely clueless which is a shame because - again - ignore the people, read the policies.

Abott's heart is in the right place but she clearly either hadn't read the report or (more likely) couldn't remember the recommendations/bullet points. Why the hell she couldn't just come out and say this, rather than blag her way through it and look an idiot, is beyond me. I wouldn't expect the head of any company to know everything about their firm, but I'm just really suprised she isn't more adept at batting away questions - which is surely on the CV of every politician?

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Jun 6, 2017

chiefdave said:
Same here. Maybe in the past it was understandable but we've reached a point where they've taken everything they can from the lower classes and are targeting the middle class. Its turkeys voting for Xmas because The Sun / Mail / Times etc tell them to.

The current government has overseen the biggest transfer of wealth to the richest in the country in history, have privatised more than any other government in history (even Thatcher and Lawson) and show no signs of slowing down. The NHS will be gone for certain, implementing Naylor makes sure of that. Land Registry as well with planning being moved under their control so you'll have a private company deciding who can build what and where they can build it. Our infrastructure increasingly being owned by either other countries governments or the Chinese. I struggle to see a single reason to vote for them.

It's the same the other way round though. Most of my generation are balls deep in The Independent and think Corbyn and his crew are the best thing since sliced bread.

To be honest, I think most people that do vote Tory will know that the NHS is more at risk, as with education and the police force etc. It's a question of where your priority is. I think a lot of people have their minds on Brexit and Terrorism, both aspects of which are weak for the main two parties. It might be favourable to some that a soft brexit is better, but Labour will absolutely get rings run around them by the bullying and spiteful EU and although I know many on here will disagree, the population may decide that Madam May has a better shot at getting us out.

As with terrorism, people rightly know we should cut ties with Saudi, but shutting down M15, a debatable link to terrorist organisations (not opening that can of worms again), an equally if not worse border policy, and an uncertain stance on shoot to kill (which no doubt saved countless more lives at the weekend) are completely reasonable reasons not to vote for Labour.

That's what it will go down to ultimately. Not which party is the best, but which isn't the worst. On those two topics it is not clear however you want to argue it.

Thursday will be interesting.

Ian1779 · Jun 6, 2017

RegTheDonk said:
I'm sure she will be replaced but the damage is done now in the public eyes, just like Corbyn being soft on nukes and having a shoot-to-kill U turn.

I'm seeing more and more of this labour bashing and you are right Ian. Boris has had a couple of gaffs but this seems to be glossed over. Mud is now sticking and making Labour look completely clueless which is a shame because - again - ignore the people, read the policies.

I wonder how much mud is really sticking though - we've had weeks of the Tories having their pants pulled down on just about everything - they have exhausted every atom of credibility that they had (which wasn't much to begin with IMO).

clint van damme · Jun 6, 2017

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
It's the same the other way round though. Most of my generation are balls deep in The Independent and think Corbyn and his crew are the best thing since sliced bread.

To be honest, I think most people that do vote Tory will know that the NHS is more at risk, as with education and the police force etc. It's a question of where your priority is. I think a lot of people have their minds on Brexit and Terrorism, both aspects of which are weak for the main two parties. It might be favourable to some that a soft brexit is better, but Labour will absolutely get rings run around them by the bullying and spiteful EU and although I know many on here will disagree, the population may decide that Madam May has a better shot at getting us out.

As with terrorism, people rightly know we should cut ties with Saudi, but shutting down M15, a debatable link to terrorist organisations (not opening that can of worms again), an equally if not worse border policy, and an uncertain stance on shoot to kill (which no doubt saved countless more lives at the weekend) are completely reasonable reasons not to vote for Labour.

That's what it will go down to ultimately. Not which party is the best, but which isn't the worst. On those two topics it is not clear however you want to argue it.

Thursday will be interesting.

You think May won't get torn to shreds in brexit negotiations? I'm not sure what you base that on.
I've never known a party leader to engage so little with their opposition or the public as she has in the run up to an election, she is hopeless. The way she sneaked under the radar to grab the tory leadership while all around her were tearing each other to shreds was a great bit of political manoeuvring. Unfortunately all it proved is she's a sly cow.

Her performances since the events in Manchester and London have been appalling, her and boris will get rinsed during brexit negotiations.

chiefdave · Jun 6, 2017

Brylowes · Jun 6, 2017

rob9872 said:
Surely even the most staunch Labour supporters among you must be concerned at the level of office Abbott could potentially hold after that car crash of an interview? Even if anyone can make a mistake with the numbers a few weeks back, this one is completely embarrassing and actually a bit scary.

My granddad voted Labour blindly his entire life as the party of the working man, in fact I'm sure he still would if he was alive today, regardless of what they said or did. Today they are not the party of the working man imo, but represent scroungers and wasters. The Conservatives may be deemed nasty, but there really is no credible alternative that I resonate with on policy or even on an individual likable basis. Blair apart, then New Labour (Tory light) was probably the best choice for me, but as a tax paying middle earning worker with a family, I feel compelled to vote Conservative again this time around.

The scroungers and wasters as you put it are predominantly a product of Thatcherism, the Inner Cities
and suburban sink estates, mining communities, and smallish satellite towns built for proximity to large
Industrial cities. All these places only 30-35 years ago were thriving communities full of hard working
Proud families, they wouldn't earn a fortune but they would earn enough to keep their families and
Would socialise together in pubs, clubs and restaurants which in turn would fuel the economy.

These communities were betrayed and crushed, this resulted in the breakdown of the family unit and
Values, schools in such areas were chronicley under funded leading to hundreds of thousands of
Children leaving school without a basic education. For a community to truly work its people need to
Feel apart of something, what is a life if your life serves no purpose.

In truth the real Conservatives don't really believe that the likes of you and me should have a vote,
They tolerate it because they have to, but they control the media and press.

I know it could and would never happen, BUT if all media and press outlets were compelled to only
Report facts and truth, I genuinely believe the Tory party would struggle to finish 2nd in the GE.

chiefdave · Jun 6, 2017

4

Terry Gibson's perm · Jun 6, 2017

rob9872 said:
I've not heard of Sandra Findlay and couldn't find anything with a Google search either. If she is representing your constituency and hasn't got her message out to all of the local area then with two days to go it's not a great advert for her campaign team. I assume as an independent she is standing on local issues rather than national as I've heard nothing about any protest to the main parties particularly linked locally.

I'd love to see the SISU out campaigner win in Coventry North and literally stand up every week in Parliament with a SISU out t-shirt on and ask a question about them. Picking up £50k pa for that too would be nice

Robinson has got away with the same level of effort for years at least this bloke must live in the city and not Surrey

Captain Dart · Jun 6, 2017

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
Heard Abbott's interview on Sky News last night was a corker. Anyone got a link?

She's pulled out of a Radio 4 a spot on woman’s hour today claiming illness, Thornberry was the sub.

Terry Gibson's perm · Jun 6, 2017

Captain Dart said:
She's pulled out of a Radio 4 a spot on woman’s hour today claiming illness, Thornberry was the sub.

If it could keep her out of politics fir the next ten to twenty years or so that will be good news

chiefdave · Jun 6, 2017

Brylowes · Jun 6, 2017

Terry Gibson's perm said:
Robinson has got away with the same level of effort for years at least this bloke must live in the city and not Surrey

This Bloke.......Its not Nikki Sinclaire again is it.:emoji_thinking:

Brylowes · Jun 6, 2017

chiefdave said:

The outrage over politicians getting some numbers muddled up really puzzles me, you would
Have to have the brain capacity of a space rockets computer coupled with a photographic
Memory, to have the answer to every possible question.
They should know and be able to explain their policies and beliefs, but to know the exact
numbers involved off the top of their head. Nah.

Otis · Jun 6, 2017

Brylowes said:
The outrage over politicians getting some numbers muddled up really puzzles me, you would
Have to have the brain capacity of a space rockets computer coupled with a photographic
Memory, to have the answer to every possible question.
They should know and be able to explain their policies and beliefs, but to know the exact
numbers involved off the top of their head. Nah.

They should do it like Dragons' Den and let you call for your financial expert to come up in the lift and clarify things.

rob9872 · Jun 6, 2017

Brylowes said:
The outrage over politicians getting some numbers muddled up really puzzles me, you would
Have to have the brain capacity of a space rockets computer coupled with a photographic
Memory, to have the answer to every possible question.
They should know and be able to explain their policies and beliefs, but to know the exact
numbers involved off the top of their head. Nah.

But they should (on all sides) also have the balls to say "I don't know" rather than guessing or allowing themselves to be made to look ridiculous. A bit of honesty in not knowing everything would actually make them appear more human, honest and trustworthy to most folk.

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