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Fisher on new stadium (6 Viewers)

  • Thread starter SkyBlue_Bear83
  • Start date Mar 8, 2015
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S

steveecov

New Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #246
Stubbornness Is Sinking Us .....SISU


Hoisted by their own petard....never more apt..
 
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #247
duffer said:
It's very hard to make a case, financially, for the new stadium.
Click to expand...

For that matter, the very fact the case comes down to finances shows that SISU have, in a way, won.

And that football is dead.
 
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #248
Kingokings204 said:
But the fact is the facts and figures don't add up with ccfc involved in a scrap for league 1 status.
Click to expand...

Seems to for Scunthorpe.
 
J

Jack Griffin

Guest
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #249
Deleted member 5849 said:
For that matter, the very fact the case comes down to finances shows that SISU have, in a way, won.

And that football is dead.
Click to expand...

Leaving it for someone else to breath life into an almost cold body?
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #250
dongonzalos said:
Nah they would just be sensible and do a deal with Wasps. Hopefully not having all that luggage would allow them to be trusted
Click to expand...

Grow up - you are embarrassing yourself. There is no deal and never will be a deal.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #251
Deleted member 5849 said:
Seems to for Scunthorpe.
Click to expand...

Also Bristol rovers who have now received plannimg permission for a 21,000 seater stadium also York
 

Ian1779

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #252
shmmeee said:
That plan has more holes than Oscar Pitourius' bathroom door.

I'll keep asking the same question from the start of this: what actual figures do you expect? It's easy to go "revenues" and hope for the best, but seriously how much cash do you think we'll make? How much more would we have to spend on players after rent?

Personally until I see even fag packet figures its pie in the sky.

If it was that easy to increase revenue every club in the league would be doing it. There must be a reason they're not. And if they are it won't give us a competitive advantage as claimed.
Click to expand...

Maybe my rough plan has lots of holes in it... but it's rough and does show an idea of what could be done.

What it does show is that a new owner would have those kind of decisions to take.... unless they were happy chucking millions and millions at the club with no intention of getting it back. We are very very unlikely to get one of those owners.
 
K

Kingokings204

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #253
Deleted member 5849 said:
Seems to for Scunthorpe.
Click to expand...

Go on? I will listen
 

Mary_Mungo_Midge

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #254
torchomatic said:
Ah, it's easy to just "do a deal with Wasps" then, is it? They'll be quite happy to give away their revenues will they? They're loss making (yes, they are MMM), their crowds are falling and they have a big loan to pay back. I wouldn't hold my breath over a deal with Wasps.
Click to expand...

What evidence do you have that Wasps are currently still loss making?
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #255
Mary_Mungo_Midge said:
What evidence do you have that Wasps are currently still loss making?
Click to expand...

Given they have made a purchase of a management company, were £14 million in debt before the take over, used to charge an average of £25 per head to watch a game and own a management company that had 10% profit margin you'd be pretty dumb to think otherwise.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #256
Grendel said:
Given they have made a purchase of a management company, were £14 million in debt before the take over, used to charge an average of £25 per head to watch a game and own a management company that had 10% profit margin you'd be pretty dumb to think otherwise.
Click to expand...

What was the JLR sponsorship deal worth to them that they attracted after taking over at the Ricoh?
 
B

Broken Hearted Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #257
Hey Tim I've got a great idea just came to me how about we try to engage with the fans give them something to cheer about, you know and try and get another 10000 in the ground sorry Tim forgot 4 pies a bovril and two weddings are worth a lot more,what was I thinking:facepalm:

OK.OK got another one how about a shop where we could sell all sorts of stuff the fans would like to buy,we could do what other football clubs do,yes I'm sure I've seen it at away grounds revolutionary you know a shop at the ground sorry Tim forgot thats so yesterday,I know I'll try to come back with something more realistic.

I've got it now Tim how about we phone Rhodri,there must be somebody we haven't taken to court,sorry it took so long Tim bit slow on the uptake.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #258
skybluetony176 said:
What was the JLR sponsorship deal worth to them that they attracted after taking over at the Ricoh?
Click to expand...

It's not jlr is it and it's hardly going to be £14 million either is it?
 

Mary_Mungo_Midge

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #259
Grendel said:
Given they have made a purchase of a management company, were £14 million in debt before the take over, used to charge an average of £25 per head to watch a game and own a management company that had 10% profit margin you'd be pretty dumb to think otherwise.
Click to expand...

So you have no evidence whatsoever that it's currently loss making? It's guess work, eh?
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #260
Mary_Mungo_Midge said:
So you have no evidence whatsoever that it's currently loss making? It's guess work, eh?
Click to expand...

It's more common sense than guess work.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #261
Mary_Mungo_Midge said:
So you have no evidence whatsoever that it's currently loss making? It's guess work, eh?
Click to expand...

Well only in the sense I will not be landing on Mars tomorrow or that CCFC are now making £100 million profit

Still - it's if interest you only now post in defence of your new friends.

Seems the peasants are revolting as well looking at the forums expressing disgust at the freebies being handed out.
 

Mary_Mungo_Midge

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #262
CCFC said:
It's more common sense than guess work.
Click to expand...

No its not. You don't know. I don't know. Grendel has got so many things wrong over the years, I'm not taking his word for it.

The Wasps people I speak to are very, very pleased with the way things are looking
 
B

Broken Hearted Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #263
Deleted member 5849 said:
Seems to for Scunthorpe.
Click to expand...

It did for Darlington as well didn't it? Mind you they are moving back to another new ground.
 

Mary_Mungo_Midge

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #264
Grendel said:
Well only in the sense I will not be landing on Mars tomorrow or that CCFC are now making £100 million profit

Still - it's if interest you only now post in defence of your new friends.

Seems the peasants are revolting as well looking at the forums expressing disgust at the freebies being handed out.
Click to expand...

I'm not defending anyone. Just pulling people up when they state 'facts' that are simply opinion. Caveat some of these statements with 'I think' and I have no issue with them
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #265
Mary_Mungo_Midge said:
No its not. You don't know. I don't know. Grendel has got so many things wrong over the years, I'm not taking his word for it.

The Wasps people I speak to are very, very pleased with the way things are looking
Click to expand...

Right and ready to leave Coventry when a more lucrative venue becomes available no doubt.
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #266
Mary_Mungo_Midge said:
No its not. You don't know. I don't know. Grendel has got so many things wrong over the years, I'm not taking his word for it.

The Wasps people I speak to are very, very pleased with the way things are looking
Click to expand...
Are they very pleased with it in the same way that the council said ACL was very profitable after the football club left?
 

Mary_Mungo_Midge

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #267
CCFC said:
Are they very pleased with it in the same way that the council said ACL was very profitable after the football club left?
Click to expand...

That's irrelevant. What an idiotic statement
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #268
Mary_Mungo_Midge said:
That's irrelevant. What an idiotic statement
Click to expand...

It's not, people have been wrong (I would say lied but you will probably take issue with that) about the profitability of ACL in the past so the fact that you've been told its going very well holds little credibility.
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #269
Mary_Mungo_Midge said:
I'm not defending anyone. Just pulling people up when they state 'facts' that are simply opinion. Caveat some of these statements with 'I think' and I have no issue with them
Click to expand...

So do you go around pulling people up on stating there opinions as facts all the time? Its funny how you only seem to do it when it's something negative about ACL or Wasps is posted, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you missed the other 99% of posts whilst you were doing your patrol.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #270
Grendel said:
It's not jlr is it and it's hardly going to be £14 million either is it?
Click to expand...

Isn't it? Who is it then?

I'm not suggesting it is going to pay off the debt but what it does show is that Wasps are clearly more marketable now they have a permanent home in a top class stadium and likewise it's probably fair to say that the same goes for the Ricoh by having a top class Rugby team as a permanent resident raising it's profile all across Europe. Its easy to see how both businesses are going to and have benefited from each others presence.
 

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #271
Mary_Mungo_Midge said:
No its not. You don't know. I don't know.
Click to expand...

You make it sound like people are making wild claims. The available evidence such as previous Wasps accounts, previous ACL accounts, availability of free tickets etc makes it highly unlikely they are now making a profit. That's not anyone saying they won't make a profit in the future just that they aren't now.

If I was Wasps I'd be very concerned. No one in their right mind would suggest that they were intending to give out this many free tickets over such a large number of matches. In fact many 'experts' pointed to the Saracens game as an example of a huge game that wouldn't need freebies yet even with thousands of free tickets available it was less than half full.

They are devaluing their product and you only have to take a brief look at their own forum to see it is having an impact. Posts saying things like what is the point of buying a ticket. Next season will be vital for them. Without the free transport and F&B to existing ST holders, which isn't sustainable over the long term, they will have to convert locals to ST holders in big numbers, problem is pretty much every local person who is attending is getting used to being given a free ticket every game, will they go back when they have to pay? It's a big gamble and one that could yet backfire on Wasps.
 
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #272
skybluetony176 said:
Isn't it? Who is it then?
Click to expand...

Given it was a no comment thanks to commercial confidentiality as to when the Ricoh deal actually expired...
 
S

steveecov

New Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #273
Deleted member 5849 said:
For that matter, the very fact the case comes down to finances shows that SISU have, in a way, won.

And that football is dead.
Click to expand...

Just real football NW. You'll still have your prima donna loving, plastic, 2 dimensional type. SISU have done to us what SKY did to real football. R.I.P
 

stupot07

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #274
Mary_Mungo_Midge said:
No its not. You don't know. I don't know. Grendel has got so many things wrong over the years, I'm not taking his word for it.

The Wasps people I speak to are very, very pleased with the way things are looking
Click to expand...

Eastwood told the SBT it would take 3-4 years for them to break even. So yes, common sense tells us they are still making a loss.

Unless it's another one of his embellishments.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #275
steveecov said:
Just real football NW. You'll still have your prima donna loving, plastic, 2 dimensional type. SISU have done to us what SKY did to real football. R.I.P
Click to expand...

Real football still exists elsewhere, though Richard Scudamore doesn't want you to know about it. If Sky keep calling it the best league on the planet then it must be so.
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #276
stupot07 said:
Eastwood told the SBT it would take 3-4 years for them to break even. So yes, common sense tells us they are still making a loss.

Unless it's another one of his embellishments.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors
Click to expand...

He did also say that it wasn't franchising so a bucket of salt needed on what he says Stu.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #277
Deleted member 5849 said:
Seems to for Scunthorpe.
Click to expand...

Just the man. Give me some examples of clubs who have gone from renting to owning their own grounds. Preferably clubs that publish their accounts for free I know you've mentioned some before. Ideally ones in their new ground not ones planning to move in.

I'm having no luck from the Wiki page of ground developments, most seem to have been funded by someone else (Donny I think) or were redevelopments of existing grounds they owned.
 
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #278
shmmeee said:
Just the man. Give me some examples of clubs who have gone from renting to owning their own grounds. Preferably clubs that publish their accounts for free I know you've mentioned some before. Ideally ones in their new ground not ones planning to move in.

I'm having no luck from the Wiki page of ground developments, most seem to have been funded by someone else (Donny I think) or were redevelopments of existing grounds they owned.
Click to expand...

CCFC bought the freehold for HR back in the pre-war(?) days, of that counts

tbf it was usually a desire to own rather than actual ownership It's easier to give examples of clubs who no onger own their ground and decline, although whether the loss of the ground is the symptom or the cause is a moot point.

Not sure if Plymouth just got a lease on Home Park, or if they bought it cheap off their council back in the day. It worked out well for them under Stephenson, until they then sold out and went through exactly the same again!

Brighton are an obvious choice!

Rotherham too...

Bournemouth sold their ground in the mid 2000s, think they bought it back (they certainly intended to).

Leicester of course had their ground owned by a Pensin fund, and is now owned by a prop-co

Molyneux was all set to become an Asda in the mid 80s, and was bought back by the club (I think!)

Can't be arsed to check the ownership of Chesterfield and COlchester's stadiums, but you might like to... along with Oxford and whether they ever actually bought it back off Kassam.

Then there's Crystal Palace, who now do indeed own the Selhurts Park freehold (I think!)

All a bit rough and ready but hey, I'm ill and it's late-ish.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #279
Cheers, some late night research when the kid inevitably gets me up again.
 
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Mar 9, 2015
  • #280
If in doubt, grounds tend to move in and out of club ownership remarkably frequently!

Could also add Northampton, who got a massive lease off their council for Sixfields, allowing them to redevelop in a half-arsed manner.
 
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