Fighting discrimination through discrimination

Discussion in 'Off Topic Chat' started by Evo1883, Jul 7, 2019.

  1. Evo1883

    Evo1883 Well-Known Member

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  2. shmmeee

    shmmeee Well-Known Member

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    How would they even police that?

    “Is that a tan mate? Half off”

    Madness.

    Social justice people have gone mental, we had this sorted twenty years ago “treat everyone the same” and everyone agreed. Now we’re adding up oppression points like some kind of board game and it turns people off the whole idea.

    I’m with Stephen Fry on this one, forget whether it’s right, it’s just not effective.
     
  3. Evo1883

    Evo1883 Well-Known Member

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    Problem is, there are actually people on social media who agree with this, it's fucking frightening how thick people are
     
  4. shmmeee

    shmmeee Well-Known Member

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    Not that many TBF. It’s mostly amplified student politics and teenagers being edgy. The number of actual real life people I’ve met in left wing spaces who think this stuff is a good idea is absolutely tiny.
     
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  5. Evo1883

    Evo1883 Well-Known Member

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    Good to hear
     
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  6. Gazolba

    Gazolba Well-Known Member

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  7. djr8369

    djr8369 Well-Known Member

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    Exactly. What I think is more worrying is how this is amplified and blown up by those on the right to flair up a culture war, “the world gone mad”, “the left is taking over” etc. I think there must be more right wing governments than almost any time in history.

    The only time I ever hear about this kind of thing is when conservatives are moaning about it. Otherwise it would be a fringe thing that’s forgotten about in no time.


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  8. Gazolba

    Gazolba Well-Known Member

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    There are no people of colour in the USA.
    There are only people of color.
    And someone should educate these people that neither black nor white is a colour/color.
    What they are doing is clearly illegal.
     
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  9. Evo1883

    Evo1883 Well-Known Member

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    It's actually against the law in America, be Interesting to see where this goes
     
  10. Evo1883

    Evo1883 Well-Known Member

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    I hadn't heard about it until I saw it on sky news tbh
     
  11. SkyblueBazza

    SkyblueBazza Well-Known Member

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    Interesting concept...explain; black shoes & the polish we make them shine with; those boards teachers use white chalk to write on blackboards with; white paint for ceilings & skirting boards.
    I agree that the terms applied to skin colour are quite sweeping & inaccurate. Don't see why they are needed or matter apart from '...police are looking for...' or other harmless descriptive purposes to identify people we are specifically referring to...like - ' the guy in the red shirt'
    "There are 2 guys in red shirts"
    'The white guy in the red shirt'

    Perhaps it's just me. Same with LGBT all that. I (& I suspect the vast majority of people) really don't care about anybody elses sexuality, or gender, or colour, or age. It's become more of a reflection on those that do care imo. But I recognise that is maybe much easier for someone with a thick white hetero male skin to say.


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  12. OffenhamSkyBlue

    OffenhamSkyBlue Well-Known Member

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    I totally agree with this sentiment, Bazza.
    Moreover, the workplace is NOT the place to talk about your sexuality, no matter what that might be. It is IRRELEVANT as far as your work goes, and it is just a waste of time!

    As far as the colour debate goes, i saw the [black] comedian Reginald D Hunter do a gig a few years back (in Cambridge, so was very white and middle-class). At the start, and i quote verbatim, so make no apologies for not editing certain words, he said that "the word "nigger" was just street vernacular when he was growing up in Georgia, and was still in common usage", but apologised in case anyone in the audience was offended by his frequent use of the term. He then said "anyway, i'm trying to figure out when the word nigger became offensive to white folks". Got the biggest laugh of the night!

    It all comes down to being offended on other people's behalf, which was the problem with "loony-Left" councils back in the 80s (e.g. Leicester City Council not allowing people to call it Christmas in case it upset the Hindus, Sikhs and Muslims in the city - until the realisation came that none of them were offended by it, and enjoyed it as much as the Christian population).
     
  13. shmmeee

    shmmeee Well-Known Member

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    Have you got a source for that last bit? Doesn’t seem right to me.

    This article states it was the late 90s that people started getting triggered about “banning Christmas” (also that it’s always been nonsense). HuffPost is now part of Oath

    Best I can find is this rather looney website cataloguing the “looney left” that talks about an ox roast being banned but them never actually going through with it. Garbagegate - Three Decades of the Loony Left
     
  14. OffenhamSkyBlue

    OffenhamSkyBlue Well-Known Member

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    It was pre-internet days, Shmmeeee, so i'm not sure it would be in the archives much, but i lived there from 86 to 00, and the City Council's "PC gone mad" stance was legendary. They famously put up a "Midwinter arboreal decoration" in Town Hall Square. Known to the rest of us as a Christmas tree! The Diwali lights along Belgrave Road were fantastic, but it was only in the late 90s that they started labelling the same decorations (which stayed up between Diwali and Christmas) with messages including the word Christmas, because the Hindu community around there said it was ludicrous not to. The society in Leicester was brilliantly multi-cultural and integrated, and most of the immigrant population (for want of a better term) went there to integrate into British society, not to be offended by it.
    It is odd that subsequent generations (whose links to the country of heritage are more distant) have decided that they want to be in conflict with these principles.
     
  15. Astute

    Astute Well-Known Member

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    The problem these days is that whichever "correct" term is used there are people waiting in hope of being able to say they have been offended.
     
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  16. rob9872

    rob9872 Well-Known Member

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    Whatever the rights and wrongs of the situation, fair play to the marketing guy who must be on a huge bonus! The best free PR that they'll ever get.
     
  17. rob9872

    rob9872 Well-Known Member

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    Reported :)
     
  18. rob9872

    rob9872 Well-Known Member

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    What I find most disappointing about this is not the polar opposite pricing of $10 PoC, $20 PoNC, but no $15 for mixed race or even $12.50/$17.50, depending on grandparents. I'd be spitting feathers if that was me and I wasn't charged the correct price!
     
  19. Gazolba

    Gazolba Well-Known Member

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  20. Sky_Blue_Dreamer

    Sky_Blue_Dreamer Well-Known Member

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    The LGBTQI+D.I.S.C.O brigade are really good at that. Changed the name about four times in a year because it discriminated against someone or other and accused people of being ignorant cause they used the wrong term on social media two minutes after some unknown person had decided to change it. Didn't do them any favours and just managed to piss a lot of people who fundamentally supported their cause by accusing them of discrimination.
     
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  21. fellatio_Martinez

    fellatio_Martinez Well-Known Member

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    What about black albinos? I'm dying to hear their take on this.
     
  22. Gazolba

    Gazolba Well-Known Member

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  23. Cov City Daytrader 87

    Cov City Daytrader 87 Active Member

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    Oh dear.

    'Hello 911? I need to be rescued as I fell into a personhole!' :banghead:
     
  24. fellatio_Martinez

    fellatio_Martinez Well-Known Member

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    LETS CHANGE MANCHESTER TO TO PERSONCHESTER!!!


    [​IMG]
     
  25. Sick Boy

    Sick Boy Well-Known Member

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    Sadly there are those that are still bothered by it.

    While the country is certainly more tolerant than it was some decades ago, I’d say that we still have a long way to go before members of the LGBT are full accepted within society.

    Can you imagine 2 men being able to openly hold hands in all UK cities without some form of abuse. The only place I’ve ever seen it is Brighton and even then it was rare and homophobic attacks were not rare.
     
  26. SkyblueBazza

    SkyblueBazza Well-Known Member

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    Interesting...so now a police officer of either gender will be assigned to search suspects? There will be no toilet separation? Clothes will all be the same sizing & shaping? And how will paramedics be able to explain to hospitals what they are dealing with without giving the game away?
    The world has not gone mad, just some of the people on it have!

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
     
  27. rd45

    rd45 Active Member

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    Yes. Exactly this.

    Most of what most white people have to say about racism is bullshit. Most of what most straight people have to say about homophobia is bullshit. Most of what most men have to say about sexism is bullshit.

    They haven’t experienced it, so they should shut the fuck up & hear from the people who have.
     
  28. Sky_Blue_Dreamer

    Sky_Blue_Dreamer Well-Known Member

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    While on the whole I agree with you does this also mean it should apply to women about male privilege, black people about white privilege and LGBT about straight privilege?

    They haven’t experienced it, so they should shut the fuck up & hear from the people who have.

    There was this piece I saw from the US a few years ago with a black woman lecturing people on slavery and reparations. A white woman came up and started having a go at her about not having a clue. Cue accusations of racism etc. Turned out the white woman had actually been forced into prostitution earlier in her life by a pimp. The black woman had never been a slave, neither had her parents, grandparents or anyone else in her family in living memory.
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2019
  29. rd45

    rd45 Active Member

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    On one level, we’d like to say that any human being can offer their understanding & their solidarity to any other human being, and if it’s given in good faith then it can be received in good faith too.

    But realistically, you’re going to take it much better from someone who’s got a sufficiently similar experience of life as your own, because they know where you’re coming from.

    To make a football analogy - Bury fans & Bolton fans are in a fairly similar spot right now, and can meaningfully offer a lot of solidarity to each other. Our fans aren’t in quite such a bad place as them, but we know well enough what it’s like - so we can offer our well wishes to Bury & Bolton fans & have that taken seriously. On the other side, fans of - I don’t know, let’s pick an example - Man City? On the whole they should probably stay out of it, given that they have very little idea what it’s like to fear for the very existence of your club.

    So - if I as a straight white guy want to talk about discrimination, I need to stay aware that I’m analogous to the Man City fan in this situation, and check what I’m saying, or I’ll risk offending someone else who knows this stuff from first hand. They should get to speak first.
     
  30. fellatio_Martinez

    fellatio_Martinez Well-Known Member

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    Good point.

    Saying that white people, men or heterosexuals should just "shut the fuck up" is rabid leftism and doesn't take into account anything other than skin colour, gender and sexual preference which is a form of discrimination in itself.
     
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  31. Evo1883

    Evo1883 Well-Known Member

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    Absolutely
     
  32. rd45

    rd45 Active Member

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    We all hear plenty from straight white men. More than enough. There are other voices that deserve to heard. Not only on these subjects, but it’s a good place to start.
     
  33. fellatio_Martinez

    fellatio_Martinez Well-Known Member

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    I don't see where white men are overwhelming minority voices. Can you give me some examples?

    I'm not talking about Twitter or web forums but in actual places where it matters.

    It's not like that as a society we're not moving into a far more progressive landscape than before.

    "This election has created one of the most diverse House of Commons ever. It’s made up of more female, more black, Asian and minority ethnic (BAME), and more lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender (LGBT) MPs than ever before"

    How Parliament is becoming more diverse
     
  34. rd45

    rd45 Active Member

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    Yes, thank you, that’s a perfect example. More of this please. More women, more BAME, more LGBT+ MPs is good for all of us. Move out some straight white men to make room. When both houses of parliament reflect the diversity of the whole country, we’ll really have got somewhere.
     
  35. shmmeee

    shmmeee Well-Known Member

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    No. This isn’t a healthy way to run a society at all. It’s what leads to some of the crap like young authors getting cancelled because they aren’t black enough to write a story with a black character.

    People have empathy and sympathy and a working brain. And just because you’re in a minority doesn’t mean your subjective view is always 100% correct.

    Rights are always balanced in a liberal democracy. Whether that’s religious peoples rights to avoid being made to make statements they don’t agree with, scientists rights to describe the truth as they see it, atheists rights to call out religious intolerance where they see it or women’s rights to privacy and safety from men.

    As a society you talk together for a compromise or you set yourself up for failure. Everyone should have a seat at the table, no one should take priority over another by default. For a start, which gay people do you pick to represent “the gays”? Owen Jones and Milo Yiannopoulos would give you very different answers as would Diane Abbott and Candice Owens on race or a liberal and radical feminist on sex.
     

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