FAO: The Trust - Question about Q&A (1 Viewer)

shmmeee · Jan 7, 2014

I know I should use Twatter or something, but figure someone might be about to answer this.

In this thread: http://www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/39728-Questions-from-the-SBT

It says you asked CCC

- has the Council been approached by any SISU related entity or agent or neighbouring Council in respect of building a stadium or sports facilities within the City boundaries or within 5 miles of those boundaries?

But this isn't in the Q&A email today.

Was is missed off? Did they refuse to answer? Are we still waiting?

chiefdave · Jan 7, 2014

could someone that knows how to do these things do a freedom of information request to all the neighbouring councils?

shmmeee · Jan 7, 2014

chiefdave said:
could someone that knows how to do these things do a freedom of information request to all the neighbouring councils?

They have. For some reason they won't release the answers until all of them are in. I think they were still waiting for one.

Hobo · Jan 7, 2014

chiefdave said:
could someone that knows how to do these things do a freedom of information request to all the neighbouring councils?

Just write a letter asking the question. State you are requesting the information under the Freedom of Information Act.

chiefdave · Jan 7, 2014

shmmeee said:
They have. For some reason they won't release the answers until all of them are in. I think they were still waiting for one.

Odd to wait, whatever the answers from the others it would give some indication. If one's a yes then we'll have an idea where it could be, if they're all no then it only leaves one possible option - and might put a bit of pressure on them to hurry up and answer.

blueflint · Jan 7, 2014

shmmeee said:
I know I should use Twatter or something, but figure someone might be about to answer this.

In this thread: http://www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/39728-Questions-from-the-SBT

It says you asked CCC

But this isn't in the Q&A email today.

Was is missed off? Did they refuse to answer? Are we still waiting?

even if it was asked of OTIUM they refused to answer so we would be no further forward

WillieStanley · Jan 7, 2014

I'm not too sure, but I think that sort of information for a certain period of time is protected, even by the FOI act for commercial reasons.

Steve.B50 · Jan 7, 2014

chiefdave said:
could someone that knows how to do these things do a freedom of information request to all the neighbouring councils?

We are in the middle of doing so, just waiting for one council to reply, others have done replied.

Jack Griffin · Jan 7, 2014

Steve.B50 said:
We are in the middle of doing so, just waiting for one council to reply, others have done replied.

I hope you've written to Solihull council too?

Just out of interest which council has yet to reply..

bigfatronssba · Jan 7, 2014

Hope they asked Hinckley and Bosworth Borough as well.

shmmeee · Jan 7, 2014

Steve.B50 said:
We are in the middle of doing so, just waiting for one council to reply, others have done replied.

So can you answer OP?

Steve.B50 · Jan 7, 2014

shmmeee said:
So can you answer OP?

Not till every Council has replied, then we will know the full situation.

Godiva · Jan 7, 2014

Have sisu/otium/fisher/whoever even said they had applied for planning permission?
I would think that before sending a formal application you would have a series of meetings with the council.

bigfatronssba · Jan 7, 2014

Godiva said:
Have sisu/otium/fisher/whoever even said they had applied for planning permission?
I would think that before sending a formal application you would have a series of meetings with the council.

They have said that they have had discussions with various councils, that's what an FOI request would be to find out.

Had they applied for planning permission then it would already be public knowledge as that cannot be done in secret.

lordsummerisle · Jan 7, 2014

shmmeee said:
I know I should use Twatter or something, but figure someone might be about to answer this.

In this thread: http://www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/39728-Questions-from-the-SBT

It says you asked CCC

But this isn't in the Q&A email today.

Was is missed off? Did they refuse to answer? Are we still waiting?

Isn't your uncle on the Trust board or something?

Try asking him.

skybluetony176 · Jan 7, 2014

Godiva said:
Have sisu/otium/fisher/whoever even said they had applied for planning permission?
I would think that before sending a formal application you would have a series of meetings with the council.

they have to buy some land 1st before they can apply for any type of planning permission. i believe the "discussions" they or their agent are having is to identify said land.

just to clarify

need to find land (already taken months)

need to negotiate to buy land (will take months)

need to go through all 4stages of planning permission (including public consultation, redesigns, appeals etc. so will take months and months)

need to finalise designs (although this will be mostly be done during planning applications but still time consuming)

designs need to go out to tender (a big build like this will take weeks to finalise material cost estimate labour etc.)

contract to be awarded

contractor needs to start digging (remember they wont be waiting by the phone for Sisu's call with blokes sitting around for the good news, whoever the contractor is will have to plan this around existing contracts and commitments so it could be months after the winning bid is announced before the 1st sod is lifted)

that 3years is going fast and i would suggest even 5years is optimistic. another 4 seasons at sixfields will kill this club.

shmmeee · Jan 7, 2014

lordsummerisle said:
Isn't your uncle on the Trust board or something?

Try asking him.

My phone's dead, this was easier (and you know, I thought others might want to know the answer as it's been asked several times)

Cheer up grumpy.

shmmeee · Jan 7, 2014

Steve.B50 said:
Not till every Council has replied, then we will know the full situation.

Got ya. Still not entirely sure why, but it's your call.

When did the request go in? Have they asked for more time? If not I'd imagine the FOI deadline is coming up soon.

A more cynical man might say one council is stalling for time to allow Sisu a chance to get ahead of any released info.

Jack Griffin · Jan 7, 2014

skybluetony176 said:
they have to buy some land 1st before they can apply for any type of planning permission. i believe the "discussions" they or their agent are having is to identify said land.

just to clarify

need to find land (already taken months)

need to negotiate to buy land (will take months)

need to go through all 4stages of planning permission (including public consultation, redesigns, appeals etc. so will take months and months)

need to finalise designs (although this will be mostly be done during planning applications but still time consuming)

designs need to go out to tender (a big build like this will take weeks to finalise material cost estimate labour etc.)

contract to be awarded

contractor needs to start digging (remember they wont be waiting by the phone for Sisu's call with blokes sitting around for the good news, whoever the contractor is will have to plan this around existing contracts and commitments so it could be months after the winning bid is announced before the 1st sod is lifted)

that 3years is going fast and i would suggest even 5years is optimistic. another 4 seasons at sixfields will kill this club.

I'd say there is absolutely no chance of a new stadium being ready within 4 years .. at least 18 months planning, 24 months to build it and probably another 6 months to actually buy land..

There is also the issue of obtaining backers for the project, SISU have admitted that they want/need outside finance to support a build, so were is that coming from?
The favourite partners will be involved in a) retail b) housing c) industrial or e) transport infrastructure (e.g. Byng).. yet no partner has been announced & with the public profile SISU have it would surprise me if there is much of a queue.

Jack Griffin · Jan 7, 2014

shmmeee said:
Got ya. Still not entirely sure why, but it's your call.

When did the request go in? Have they asked for more time? If not I'd imagine the FOI deadline is coming up soon.

A more cynical man might say one council is stalling for time to allow Sisu a chance to get ahead of any released info.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_Information_Act_2000

In general, public authorities have 20 working days to respond to an information request, though this deadline can be extended in certain cases and/or with the agreement of the requester.

The requests seem to have been made at least 2 weeks ago http://www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threa...-shaft-another?p=608905&viewfull=1#post608905

Hobo · Jan 7, 2014

skybluetony176 said:
they have to buy some land 1st before they can apply for any type of planning permission. i believe the "discussions" they or their agent are having is to identify said land.

just to clarify

need to find land (already taken months)

need to negotiate to buy land (will take months)

need to go through all 4stages of planning permission (including public consultation, redesigns, appeals etc. so will take months and months)

need to finalise designs (although this will be mostly be done during planning applications but still time consuming)

designs need to go out to tender (a big build like this will take weeks to finalise material cost estimate labour etc.)

contract to be awarded

contractor needs to start digging (remember they wont be waiting by the phone for Sisu's call with blokes sitting around for the good news, whoever the contractor is will have to plan this around existing contracts and commitments so it could be months after the winning bid is announced before the 1st sod is lifted)

that 3years is going fast and i would suggest even 5years is optimistic. another 4 seasons at sixfields will kill this club.

That all seems to be reasonable predictions until the last sentence. Sixfields won't kill the club it will be SISU!

skybluetony176 · Jan 7, 2014

Hobo said:
That all seems to be reasonable predictions until the last sentence. Sixfields won't kill the club it will be SISU!

Good point.

sky blue john · Jan 7, 2014

Nobody buys land for development unless they are sure they will get planning permission on it first. A stadium build would be a complex build situation. So there is no way in this world that Sisu or anyone would buy land without discussions with whichever council planning offices

bigfatronssba · Jan 7, 2014

sky blue john said:
Nobody buys land for development unless they are sure they will get planning permission on it first. A stadium build would be a complex build situation. So there is no way in this world that Sisu or anyone would buy land without discussions with whichever council planning offices

Even then though they can never be 100% certain that they will get planning permission.

We still live in a democracy and just because a council would indicate to sisu that they would get planning permission, that doesn't mean it would happen.

There could be a big public outcry at the proposals.

The political make up of the council could change hands and the new leadership might be against it.

Rare fauna/flora could be found on the site.

Until planning permission has actually been granted nothing is for certain.

Also once sisu go down the new stadium route, they are into the area of public scrutiny. They really will not like this. There will be no hiding, they will have to be open and honest. This is not something they are used to doing.

James Smith · Jan 7, 2014

bigfatronssba said:
Even then though they can never be 100% certain that they will get planning permission.

We still live in a democracy and just because a council would indicate to sisu that they would get planning permission, that doesn't mean it would happen.

There could be a big public outcry at the proposals.

The political make up of the council could change hands and the new leadership might be against it.

Rare fauna/flora could be found on the site.

Until planning permission has actually been granted nothing is for certain.

Also once sisu go down the new stadium route, they are into the area of public scrutiny. They really will not like this. There will be no hiding, they will have to be open and honest. This is not something they are used to doing.

Thought that was why Tim was looking for Badger droppings - or is that just a hobby of his?

skybluetony176 · Jan 8, 2014

James Smith said:
Thought that was why Tim was looking for Badger droppings - or is that just a hobby of his?

I thought it was bull droppings he's more interested in.

letsallsingtogether · Jan 8, 2014

But Sisu aren't just nobody they have made a drawing to appease fans they will buy land to do the same then they can blame someone else or some other Council for not getting what they want so be prepared for a scaled down 8,000 seater stadium IT WON'T BE THEIR FAULT.
But some will still believe them and even defend them.

sky blue john said:
Nobody buys land for development unless they are sure they will get planning permission on it first. A stadium build would be a complex build situation. So there is no way in this world that Sisu or anyone would buy land without discussions with whichever council planning offices

oldskyblue58 · Jan 8, 2014

Suggest you all look at the Trust website

shmmeee · Jan 8, 2014

oldskyblue58 said:
Suggest you all look at the Trust website

Just posted a thread.

italiahorse · Jan 8, 2014

Good work from the Trust.

We now need a statement from Otium/Sisu/CCFC but obviously they are not subject to the freedom of information act.
Come on Tim, you are bull$hitting the fans if you say you are still in discussions with 2 councils.

chiefdave · Jan 8, 2014

italiahorse said:
Good work from the Trust.

We now need a statement from Otium/Sisu/CCFC but obviously they are not subject to the freedom of information act.
Come on Tim, you are bull$hitting the fans if you say you are still in discussions with 2 councils.

Shall we have a sweepstake on how long it will be untill a BS statement appears on ccfc.co.uk?

shmmeee · Jan 8, 2014

chiefdave said:
Shall we have a sweepstake on how long it will be untill a BS statement appears on ccfc.co.uk?

Or coventrytelegraph.net?

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