Fans Forum (2 Viewers)

dongonzalos · May 22, 2014

With no fans forum in sight. As I have always said, I am going to see if I can ask the club a few questions.

Mainly I want to ask.......

How can the council hurt us if we agree a temporary agreement to play at the Ricoh whilst negotiating or building a new stadium?

Why did we not accept the offer made to the FL. (even if it was made to the FL)

How can we can get money back to SISU's investors if we build a new stadium (70 odd million debt)

What are the costs to the club of our tenure at Sixfields. Why do the club not propose a 5 year rent deal at the Ricoh at less than these costs?

Why did we not buy ACL for the agreed 4 million pounds?

Why do we not offer to buy ACL for 4 million and buy the council loan for 10 million. ( has to be cheaper than a new stadium)

Have we spoken to compass about their share?

What do the club intend to do post JR depending on each outcome?

How can we push for promotion if we pay 1.8 million interest on our current debts and our plan is to nearly double the debts to build the new stadium.

Thank the club for investing in the academy.

What progress do we need to make on the new stadium to satisfy the FL and what timescales?

If I am successful and you want anything else asking and it is reasonable and I understand it then let me know on here thanks.

shmmeee · May 22, 2014

dongonzalos said:
With no fans forum in sight. As I have always said, I am going to see if I can ask the club a few questions.

Mainly I want to ask.......

How can the council hurt us if we agree a temporary agreement to play at the Ricoh whilst negotiating or building a new stadium? The trust is broken, we cannot go back to a tenancy agreement. We will not prop up a failed company in ACL.

Why did we not accept the offer made to the FL. (even if it was made to the FL) No such offer was ever recieved by the club. This was simply a PR stunt from ACL to fool the fans. The offer that was proposed to the FL did not include matchday costs, which would have made it more expensive than Sixfields.

How can we can get money back to SISU's investors if we build a new stadium (70 odd million debt) We are in it for the long term. We do not sell at the bottom of a business cycle. Sisu's investors realise this and are committed to the long haul.

What are the costs to the club of our tenure at Sixfields. Why do the club not propose a 5 year rent deal at the Ricoh at less than these costs? We cannot go back to a tenancy agreement like the one that nearly killed the club. Northampton are kind enough to offer us a deal that allows us to reduce costs significantly from the extoritionate £1.3m/year at the Ricoh.

Why did we not buy ACL for the agreed 4 million pounds? Sisu's professional appraisal of the company determined that it was worth nothing. Because a local charity was involved, Joy decided out of the good of her heart to offer them £2m, however the greedy council who have sucked the life out of this club for years, do not deserve a penny.

Why do we not offer to buy ACL for 4 million and buy the council loan for 10 million. ( has to be cheaper than a new stadium) The council are not willing to negotiate with us.

Have we spoken to compass about their share? We cannot speak to a third party without ACL's permission, we expect the council to resolve all contractual issues should the club return as owners.

What do the club intend to do post JR depending on each outcome? The JR has no effect on the club's plans to build their own stadium and have access to all revenues, enabling a brighter future for all. Should the council be found to have breached State Aid legislation, we will of course be proud to have worked for the good of the taxpayer.

How can we push for promotion if we pay 1.8 million interest on our current debts and our plan is to nearly double the debts to build the new stadium. Many clubs gain promotion on little or no resources, however this excellent question highlights the importance of the club having control of it's own destiny through stadium ownership and the related revenues that come with that.

Thank the club for investing in the academy. You are welcome, I am glad you recognise that Sisu are committed to Coventry in the long term and we are as excited as you about the upcoming homegrown talent on display under Pressley's watchful eye.

What progress do we need to make on the new stadium to satisfy the FL and what timescales? We have an agreement with the FL and we are keeping to it.

If I am successful and you want anything else asking and it is reasonable and I understand it then let me know on here thanks.

Saved you the bother

Good questions in all seriousness. I'd also like further clarification on the liquidation process, the movement of assets before admin (if you've done nothing wrong!) and the plans to rebuild trust in the fanbase whatever the outcome over the next few years.

RegTheDonk · May 22, 2014

shmmeee said:
Saved you the bother

Good questions in all seriousness. I'd also like further clarification on the liquidation process, the movement of assets before admin (if you've done nothing wrong!) and the plans to rebuild trust in the fanbase whatever the outcome over the next few years.

Good answers in fairness Shmmeee. You've done it tongue in cheek, but I believe had you researched all that you'd probably actually find those quotes from ML and TF. I would imagine most of those questions have been put to ML during his various smaller meetings with the fans anyway.

dongonzalos · May 22, 2014

shmmeee said:
Saved you the bother

Good questions in all seriousness. I'd also like further clarification on the liquidation process, the movement of assets before admin (if you've done nothing wrong!) and the plans to rebuild trust in the fanbase whatever the outcome over the next few years.

Best withdraw my request for a meet then

dongonzalos · May 22, 2014

RegTheDonk said:
Good answers in fairness Shmmeee. You've done it tongue in cheek, but I believe had you researched all that you'd probably actually find those quotes from ML and TF. I would imagine most of those questions have been put to ML during his various smaller meetings with the fans anyway.

I would hope they were, but I have not seen any of the answers on here, so it may be worth a try.

dongonzalos · May 24, 2014

Well I had my meet.

We still disagree on the ground concept. TF could not convince me on that one.
He still maintains its happening however when you discuss figures the Ricoh is still far more viable. IMO.

It seems they are still buying the land and the idea is to develop it to try and multiply the value.

The club are still open to negotiating with the council once the JR is over.
He states the JR is not going to bring an automatic solution.
Also the club are not adverse to negotiating a temporary tenure at the Ricoh as well.

(So all fans groups should push for that IMO)

He was a good chap. Says he will meet any fans anytime. FairPlay on this occasion he certainly did.

He talked a lot about the football side of things and surprisingly came across as very passionate.

Says JS is also meeting fans bit by bit.

( I forgot to ask if she will be at the fans forum)

Nothing ground breaking to report.

However he surprised me with his football knowledge.

I felt a bit more reassured that these talks in whatever format they take will have to happen at some point.

Sky Blues · May 24, 2014

Did he say why Neverneverland stadium was taking so long? (And I'll have to rename it if TF wasn't talking in Fisherisms at you.) I would have thought they'd need to do a heck of a lot of extra development to make back the costs of a new ground and get investor returns. I don't see much evidence of that in those drawings they released. Can you expand on what was said around the financial case for that Don?

skybluetony176 · May 24, 2014

You can't help but get the impression that they are back tracking on the JR. For all their filibuster they seem to have lost confidence in the procedure. I'm never going to state that they will lose but there is no denying that their tone is changing.

The time has come for all the supporter groups to unite and make a joint statement to all the parties that are involved that the fans are united in that we want to be playing back home next season and it must be with access to revenues raised by the club. If only on a temporary basis while never never land doesn't get built. The time has come to stop the bull shit.

dongonzalos · May 24, 2014

Sky Blues said:
Did he say why Neverneverland stadium was taking so long? (And I'll have to rename it if TF wasn't talking in Fisherisms at you.) I would have thought they'd need to do a heck of a lot of extra development to make back the costs of a new ground and get investor returns. I don't see much evidence of that in those drawings they released. Can you expand on what was said around the financial case for that Don?

He maintains the land deal was very close to been signed off.
He was maintaining it has taken so long because of the very few sites in the area of the size. Then tough negotiating once you have a site identified.
On the finance side I did not dwell on it too long as I was not convinced.
However the gist was the site comes with loads of extra land you develop that land as well as the stadium and automatically multiply the value of the site in comparison to the cost price of the build.

My gut feeling is they will go as far as purchasing land but I still think the Ricoh will be the real negotiation.

TF is still maintaining Plan A new stadium
Plan B Ricoh.

Sky Blues · May 24, 2014

dongonzalos said:
He maintains the land deal was very close to been signed off.
He was maintaining it has taken so long because of the very few sites in the area of the size. Then tough negotiating once you have a site identified.
On the finance side I did not dwell on it too long as I was not convinced.
However the gist was the site comes with loads of extra land you develop that land as well as the stadium and automatically multiply the value of the site in comparison to the cost price of the build.

My gut feeling is they will go as far as purchasing land but I still think the Ricoh will be the real negotiation.

TF is still maintaining Plan A new stadium
Plan B Ricoh.

Thanks Don. Playing along with for a minute... The more land they seek to develop, the less likely they are to gain planning permission I would have thought (and I wouldn't rate the chances highly to begin with).

Ian1779 · May 24, 2014

dongonzalos said:
Well I had my meet.

We still disagree on the ground concept. TF could not convince me on that one.
He still maintains its happening however when you discuss figures the Ricoh is still far more viable. IMO.

It seems they are still buying the land and the idea is to develop it to try and multiply the value.

The club are still open to negotiating with the council once the JR is over.
He states the JR is not going to bring an automatic solution.
Also the club are not adverse to negotiating a temporary tenure at the Ricoh as well.

(So all fans groups should push for that IMO)

He was a good chap. Says he will meet any fans anytime. FairPlay on this occasion he certainly did.

He talked a lot about the football side of things and surprisingly came across as very passionate.

Says JS is also meeting fans bit by bit.

( I forgot to ask if she will be at the fans forum)

Nothing ground breaking to report.

However he surprised me with his football knowledge.

I felt a bit more reassured that these talks in whatever format they take will have to happen at some point.

At least they are trying to engage with fans.. they should know they have an awful lot to do to build fans trust up again.

As Tony said, both sides need to swallow a bit of pride and find some way to return to Ricoh, even if on a temporary basis. This would have to include some deal on revenue access, and SISU ensuring they pay their bills in full and on time.

Buster · May 24, 2014

It all seems quite vague and nothing we haven't heard before . Did he give you the impression he was talking Tesco and Next or just KFC and Mcdoodles.

Jack Griffin · May 24, 2014

Sky Blues said:
Thanks Don. Playing along with for a minute... The more land they seek to develop, the less likely they are to gain planning permission I would have thought (and I wouldn't rate the chances highly to begin with).

Certainly the more land the more complex and delayed the planning process.

dongonzalos · May 24, 2014

Buster said:
It all seems quite vague and nothing we haven't heard before . Did he give you the impression he was talking Tesco and Next or just KFC and Mcdoodles.

No there was nothing groundbreaking that you haven't heard before the bits that came out of it for me were......

He is prepared to put himself out and meet anyone anytime, it seems.

I get the impression he is a bit more rational and less provocative than ML.

He is more knowledgeable and passionate about football than you would realise

The figures to me (no expert) don't make sense re new stadium over Ricoh.

The club seems open to negotiating either a temporary and more permanent deal for the Ricoh once the JR is out the way.

As I was not really overly convince by the overall concept of a new stadium I did notpush for the nitty gritty finer details tbh

dongonzalos · May 24, 2014

I agree with Tony
The SBT, Michael and Rob should unite and just focus on get us back temporarily.

For me you best time to campaign that is when all parties are in the same place......

The JR

Jack Griffin · May 24, 2014

Sounds to me like the land deal mentioned is another hedge, which doesn't have to include a stadium.

The only 2 possible 60 acre sites I can think of are ...
1) Near the NEC and proposed Birmingham HS2 interchange, this is a 10 year plan
2) Coventry and Warwickshire Gateway scheme (Cov Airport).

Godiva · May 24, 2014

dongonzalos said:
Well I had my meet.

We still disagree on the ground concept. TF could not convince me on that one.
He still maintains its happening however when you discuss figures the Ricoh is still far more viable. IMO.

It seems they are still buying the land and the idea is to develop it to try and multiply the value.

The club are still open to negotiating with the council once the JR is over.
He states the JR is not going to bring an automatic solution.
Also the club are not adverse to negotiating a temporary tenure at the Ricoh as well.

(So all fans groups should push for that IMO)

He was a good chap. Says he will meet any fans anytime. FairPlay on this occasion he certainly did.

He talked a lot about the football side of things and surprisingly came across as very passionate.

Says JS is also meeting fans bit by bit.

( I forgot to ask if she will be at the fans forum)

Nothing ground breaking to report.

However he surprised me with his football knowledge.

I felt a bit more reassured that these talks in whatever format they take will have to happen at some point.

Fair play for you actually going one-on-one with TF.

Did he say anything about team investment and ambitions next season?

Nick · May 24, 2014

dongonzalos said:
I agree with Tony
The SBT, Michael and Rob should unite and just focus on get us back temporarily.

For me you best time to campaign that is when all parties are in the same place......

The JR

Jesus I agree with you

dongonzalos · May 24, 2014

Godiva said:
Fair play for you actually going one-on-one with TF.

Did he say anything about team investment and ambitions next season?

It was brave because Hector the horse dog was there as well

He is desperate to keep Callum I believe him on that one. He had nothing but positive things to say about Callum's personality TBF.
However he was also honest that if a massive offer comes in you have to consider it. However if the worse happens some of that money would go back to SP.

Massively excited and genuinely believes in SP. He is a proper no nonsense type of manager.
Was very complimentary about Christies personality as well.

JS wants promotion.

SP wants more depth to the squad and they are going to back him and do that. I got the impression this was along the lines of two reasonable players in each position.

He was really excited about the upcoming kids

dongonzalos · May 24, 2014

Jack Griffin said:
Sounds to me like the land deal mentioned is another hedge, which doesn't have to include a stadium.

The only 2 possible 60 acre sites I can think of are ...
1) Near the NEC and proposed Birmingham HS2 interchange, this is a 10 year plan
2) Coventry and Warwickshire Gateway scheme (Cov Airport).

I said I still don't believe a new stadium will be built. He looked me straight in the eye and and said the land deal is so near completion.
So all I can take from that IMO is they are prepared to buy the land but it still does not financially add up for me over the Ricoh.

Jack Griffin · May 24, 2014

dongonzalos said:
I said I still don't believe a new stadium will be built. He looked me straight in the eye and and said the land deal is so near completion.
So all I can take from that IMO is they are prepared to buy the land but it still does not financially add up for me over the Ricoh.

No nor me, it may be a longer term contingency plan if they fail to get their mitts on the Arena.

A large property deal could just be a different investment, until planning consent for a stadium is given and a construction contract is awarded it may simply be empty rhetoric.

dongonzalos · May 24, 2014

Jack Griffin said:
Sounds to me like the land deal mentioned is another hedge, which doesn't have to include a stadium.

The only 2 possible 60 acre sites I can think of are ...
1) Near the NEC and proposed Birmingham HS2 interchange, this is a 10 year plan
2) Coventry and Warwickshire Gateway scheme (Cov Airport).

That first one is an area that is going to explode over the next 20 years.

Jack Griffin · May 24, 2014

dongonzalos said:
That first one is an area that is going to explode over the next 20 years.

Yup, but it is 8-9 miles from Coventry. The main reason I think it could be significant is because Byngs investors want to reopen a disused rail line that terminates there & connect Hs2 with Brum airport. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77-ajpG_ElA

dongonzalos · May 24, 2014

I know I can see why the Chinese fancy investing in that project

Buster · May 24, 2014

Theve got the balls, got the cash, but because they use power through court action and the law to get the desired outcome, they didnt have the sense to take the fans with them on the deal ! I think the strength of the council (to protect their asset) and the supporters sticking together boycotting Sixfields, has put them on the back foot . Their only out is to make peace with the fans and start talking to the council. No more unencumbered freehold.

rupert_bear · May 24, 2014

I have more chance of buying the Ricoh than Sepalla.

shmmeee · May 24, 2014

Good stuff, Don, shame there's no more details, but what did we expect?

In fairness, the only fans group who haven't been pushing for a temporary deal are Rob's crew, they swallowed the "never again" crap from Fisher/Seppala.

Seems like an easy win to me: tell the council to match the terms of Sixfields for the next 3 years, reassess then. Everything else is bollocks quite frankly, let's leave the fans out of this, we can get on with what we care about and the legals and wannabe Apprentice contestants that run our club can fuck about with obscure legal processes all they like.

dongonzalos · May 24, 2014

Buster said:
Theve got the balls, got the cash, but because they use power through court action and the law to get the desired outcome, they didnt have the sense to take the fans with them on the deal ! I think the strength of the council (to protect their asset) and the supporters sticking together boycotting Sixfields, has put them on the back foot . Their only out is to make peace with the fans and start talking to the council. No more unencumbered freehold.

Well they are starting to engage the fans now so that's part one fingers crossed on part 2

dongonzalos · May 24, 2014

My gut feeling is the land they are trying to buy is in the Nuneaton Bedworth patch.

dongonzalos · May 24, 2014

shmmeee said:
Good stuff, Don, shame there's no more details, but what did we expect?

In fairness, the only fans group who haven't been pushing for a temporary deal are Rob's crew, they swallowed the "never again" crap from Fisher/Seppala.

Seems like an easy win to me: tell the council to match the terms of Sixfields for the next 3 years, reassess then. Everything else is bollocks quite frankly, let's leave the fans out of this, we can get on with what we care about and the legals and wannabe Apprentice contestants that run our club can fuck about with obscure legal processes all they like.

I agree and after the meeting. I am convinced these talks between the two will happen. I just don't know how those talks will pan out.

shmmeee · May 24, 2014

dongonzalos said:
Well they are starting to engage the fans now so that's part one fingers crossed on part 2

Sorry Don, but one by one is not "Engaging the fans". At this rate they'll have "Engaged" the entire fanbase roughly the time my daughter retires.

The have a massive media campaign that is needed to touch those that come nowhere near sites like this.

dongonzalos · May 24, 2014

shmmeee said:
Sorry Don, but one by one is not "Engaging the fans". At this rate they'll have "Engaged" the entire fanbase roughly the time my daughter retires.

The have a massive media campaign that is needed to touch those that come nowhere near sites like this.

Ha ha they could do Sixfields in a couple of weeks.

No what I meant mate is they have realised they need to start to engage with the fans otherwise they have no chance.
They are saying they will meet anyone anytime.
They have finally arranged the fans forum. (bit in a slightly confrontational manner)

They are doing more of this sort of thing than they have done in the past.

martcov · May 24, 2014

dongonzalos said:
Ha ha they could do Sixfields in a couple of weeks.

No what I meant mate is they have realised they need to start to engage with the fans otherwise they have no chance.
They are saying they will meet anyone anytime.
They have finally arranged the fans forum. (bit in a slightly confrontational manner)

They are doing more of this sort of thing than they have done in the past.

It is good that they are talking - fair Play to them for that. If they are buying land as a plan A to fall back on, let's hope they get a good deal - one that works with or without a stadium. Joy majored in real estate and I would guess she therefore has some idea of property development. I would think that SISU could put a project together. If the soccer club got back to the Ricoh in the meantime, on a deal that at least enabled the 1,8 m interest to be paid to her investors for the time being, the pressure would be off. They could then concentrate on their exciting bew project in the Coventry area, hopefully creating some wealth from property development. If they can't get a permanent deal on the Ricoh - then back to plan A with a stadium.

James Smith · May 24, 2014

Ian1779 said:
At least they are trying to engage with fans.. they should know they have an awful lot to do to build fans trust up again.

As Tony said, both sides need to swallow a bit of pride and find some way to return to Ricoh, even if on a temporary basis. This would have to include some deal on revenue access, and SISU ensuring they pay their bills in full and on time.

I agree, but I think it unlikely until the JR is out of the way. They really ought to communicate clearly that they're not opposed to a return to the Ricoh and that it could be on a rental basis if they really are.

Or to put it in Fisher speak, [win lose or draw in the JR?] it's possible that the ship that had sailed has hit stormy waters and could be looking for a return to port even if that's just whilst they build us a port of our own.

shmmeee · May 24, 2014

dongonzalos said:
Ha ha they could do Sixfields in a couple of weeks.

No what I meant mate is they have realised they need to start to engage with the fans otherwise they have no chance.
They are saying they will meet anyone anytime.
They have finally arranged the fans forum. (bit in a slightly confrontational manner)

They are doing more of this sort of thing than they have done in the past.

They're like a cheating spouse mate, there's always a flurry of affection when they need you onside or you're just about to find out they've been naughty. The image of the club as a whole has to change. They need to be repentant to all fans, actively trying to get us back with advertising, promotions, events, etc. The fans forums and Labovitch's super secret squirrel meetings are just froth and PR in front of the JR IMO.

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