True although during the war Bulgaria was a Nazi ally/stooge until the tide turned.
We need to look at ourselves too. Can't be taking the moral high ground on this then going and singing '10 German bombers' when pissed up in Germany.
My disappointment was that England didn't walk off. They've said they were going to and that they heard plenty of racist abuse after the second warning, so they should have followed through with their threat. Especially in a game you're winning very very comfortably and then run the risk of forfeiting by walking off. Makes a statement and gets a lot more publicity not just here but elsewhere too. Plus it then forces the authorities to actually do something about it. IMO the players bottled it.
My disappointment was that England didn't walk off. They've said they were going to and that they heard plenty of racist abuse after the second warning, so they should have followed through with their threat. Especially in a game you're winning very very comfortably and then run the risk of forfeiting by walking off. Makes a statement and gets a lot more publicity not just here but elsewhere too. Plus it then forces the authorities to actually do something about it. IMO the players bottled it.
I know what you mean but I actually think it sends a stronger message to stay on the field and give the oppo a good twatting. If we go off the pitch, the players get jeered off and racism wins.
On the one hand I agree, staying on & ignoring it whilst destroying them on the pitch is right. On the other, having said we are going to walk-off...then saying we heard much more racist chanting in the 2nd half but we were playing so well the players decided to stay on (quoting GS on R5Live earlier) it kind of cheapens the stance & lessens racism as an issue for the players being targeted imo.I know what you mean but I actually think it sends a stronger message to stay on the field and give the oppo a good twatting. If we go off the pitch, the players get jeered off and racism wins.
Kicking a ball in a net does fuck all to counter racism.I know what you mean but I actually think it sends a stronger message to stay on the field and give the oppo a good twatting. If we go off the pitch, the players get jeered off and racism wins.
Depends whose ball it is. If it belongs to a racist, then great.Kicking a ball in a net does fuck all to counter racism.
Bulgaria is the most racist, backwards country I’ve ever been to. I was considering a holiday here but I definitely won’t be doing that now. The racism is not a football problem. It’s institutionalised within their society. I’ve seen, heard and experienced so much this trip that has concerned and disappointed me that it’d take me too long to write it all so I’ve linked in some tweets (the last one is unbelievable) below to sum it all up. Mainly about the Bulgarian part of the trip but also the attitudes of some towards England fans and the problems that need stamping out within those that travel. In that respect above everything else it needs to be remembered that we’re here to support England. Too many are now turning up thinking it’s acceptable to bring their club or someone else’s into proceedings. Leave your club shirt and chanting at home. Both are not wanted or needed either at home or away games. It gives the opportunity for problems to arise.
Cj Joiner on Twitter
Cj Joiner on Twitter
Cj Joiner on Twitter
Cj Joiner on Twitter
Cj Joiner on Twitter
Cj Joiner on Twitter
Cj Joiner on Twitter
Cj Joiner on Twitter
Cj Joiner on Twitter
Cj Joiner on Twitter
Henry Winter on Twitter
Cj Joiner on Twitter
Most concerning of all. We genuinely couldn’t believe what we were seeing:
Cj Joiner on Twitter
It is shameful they behaved like that toward this guy. Wondering what support you could have shown for him other than opening the door on his way out?
At the moment it reads as though you allowed yourself to be treated as a superior form of life by getting served before him, watched others do likewise, ate your food in front of him while he still waited, opened the door for him & then simply walked away. Maybe you were in fear of others in there or whatever? A stand has to be made at some point though. Like even adding his order to yours at least wpuld have shown some solidarity for the cause.
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There is a basic racism throughout much of Eastern Europe based on old stereotypes - like racial biology, eugenics etc.It’s all a bit weird, some Ukrainians, Belarusians and Slavs saw the Germans as some kind of liberators from the Soviet’s. communism really fucked up Eastern Europe (as it does anywhere). Spent time working in the former east Germany during the 90’s, when the wall came down, East Germans went back across and found loads of Turks and other immigrants integrated within west Germany and were like what the fuck.
Loads of racists appeared from behind the iron curtain.
Couple of years ago I’d have argued with you, very rarely heard outright racism, possibly because as a white guy that’s not where my attention is tuned.
Since 2016 though it’s becoming rife. Heard one person say “yeah I’m racist so what?” The other day was having a conversation about Brexit and someone actually said “I just voted Leave to get rid of the blacks”. I’m ashamed to admit I was too stunned to say anything and the conversation moved on, I won’t make that mistake again.
What the fuck is happening? I thought we agreed on this decades ago and it all seems to be going backwards. From what you say maybe it’s just people are bolder now.
Really sorry you have to go through that mate.
Kicking a ball in a net does fuck all to counter racism.
If that’s what it takes to change then surely a small price to pay?If you want to ban nations for their fans behaviour, England will never qualify for a tournament again.
Agree but it also has the huge advantage of bringing ‘like’ minds together very very easily whereas they had to all meet to arrange this type of shit now via SM it’s on a plateI'll have my "old fogey" rant on this and blame internet & social media.
People sat behind their keyboards have become emboldened to spout all sorts of nasty rubbish including racism. When no-one is stopping them from spouting this rubbish they begin to believe its acceptable and start expressing it more openly in public areas.
Likes of Twitter, FAcebook, google etc. more interested in making money than controlling content and then hide behind arguments of freedom of expression etc.
The rights or wrongs of whether the internet should have unlimited freedom of speech is another argument in itself.
I’m glad we stayed on, the UEFA process was followed and we stuffed them by 6. I think what this showed was that group was arranged to do this then walk at that stage prior to stage 3. Apparently these guys (or some of them) are employees of the stadium !Disagree - if we can show that the players being booed are superior footballers and are capable of beating the booing team's fans, then it shows the colour of someone's skin is irrelevant.
I do not see how it helps to combat racism if the players respond to racism by walking off - in that case, the racists are winning. If that happen, they'd go home laughing "we booed them off the pitch haha". Don't want that to happen.
If you want to ban nations for their fans behaviour, England will never qualify for a tournament again.
Disagree - if we can show that the players being booed are superior footballers and are capable of beating the booing team's fans, then it shows the colour of someone's skin is irrelevant.
I do not see how it helps to combat racism if the players respond to racism by walking off - in that case, the racists are winning. If that happen, they'd go home laughing "we booed them off the pitch haha". Don't want that to happen.
I personally think the game should be stopped, then the home fans should be told to leave the stadium. I am not sure walking off the pitch and abandoning the game would matter to these racist cretins, they do not care about the football match.
But if we walked off wouldn’t we have defaulted on the game and lost? The irony is that outcome would have had a straight forward outcome and England would have been punished more than Bulgaria. It’s shit but it’s the likely outcome.But if we're beating them by four/five and THEN choose to walk off we prove that they're both superior footballers and makes FIFA/UEFA actually act.
We stayed on the pitch so who out of those organisations is today having to scrabble around trying frantically to work out what to do and having the world press on the phone demanding answers as to what happened and what happens now? No-one. The authorities don't have to deal with the fallout so they'll not care. Had we walked off UEFA and FIFA would be being hit by an absolute shitstorm today, and it'd also have set the precedent to open the floodgates for other teams to follow suit. It'd do far too much harm to their product to let that happen so they'd have to act.
No I haven't - if you read it properly mateThink you've jumped to some conclusions there mate.
But if we walked off wouldn’t we have defaulted on the game and lost? The irony is that outcome would have had a straight forward outcome and England would have been punished more than Bulgaria. It’s shit but it’s the likely outcome.
I think if people just ignored the racist chanting from the crowd and showed no reaction to it, it would eventually cease.
Jesus christ you post some shite, but this takes the cake.I think if people just ignored the racist chanting from the crowd and showed no reaction to it, it would eventually cease.
The whole point of their behaviour is to provoke a reaction and they are succeeding in that beyond their wildest dreams.
The media and everyone else has been whipped into a frenzy over it (and so has this forum).
People expressing such outrage every time it happens just encourages them to keep doing it since they know it's working.
But, that said, if they want to continue in the current direction, they should abandon the game and award the three points to the abused team.
That, of course will lead to appeals and maybe even lawsuits.
And how will the people who paid a lot of money and travelled huge distances to watch the game react?
I think if people just ignored the racist chanting from the crowd and showed no reaction to it, it would eventually cease.
The whole point of their behaviour is to provoke a reaction and they are succeeding in that beyond their wildest dreams.
The media and everyone else has been whipped into a frenzy over it (and so has this forum).
People expressing such outrage every time it happens just encourages them to keep doing it since they know it's working.
But, that said, if they want to continue in the current direction, they should abandon the game and award the three points to the abused team.
That, of course will lead to appeals and maybe even lawsuits.
And how will the people who paid a lot of money and travelled huge distances to watch the game react?
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