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Do you want to discuss boring politics? (24 Viewers)

  • Thread starter mrtrench
  • Start date Jun 14, 2020
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Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 10, 2023
  • #31,431
CCFCSteve said:
This is a sensible approach. As we saw with Truss, anything ‘unfunded’ for day to day stuff will, rightly or wrongly, be slaughtered by the markets.

The alternative is to start suggesting theyll spend more but that it will require higher taxes…unlikely to an election winner especially in the middle of a cost of living crisis

Their first job is to get into power and whether people like the approach or not, Starmer and Reeves have rebuilt labours credibility when it comes to the economy/public finances so the strategy does appear to be working. The problems will be if shadow ministers start suggesting they can deliver more than perceived to be affordable as Clint mentioned about streeting

Still waiting for the long term vision/plan from any party.
Click to expand...
Does it not depend on who is having to pay taxes as to whether the rises will be unpopular? I wouldn’t see many objecting to a hike on the likes of Centrica.
 
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Oct 11, 2023
  • #31,432
CCFCSteve said:
Still waiting for the long term vision/plan from any party.
Click to expand...
Five yearly elections don't help that
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete and shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2023
  • #31,433
CCFCSteve said:
This is a sensible approach. As we saw with Truss, anything ‘unfunded’ for day to day stuff will, rightly or wrongly, be slaughtered by the markets.

The alternative is to start suggesting theyll spend more but that it will require higher taxes…unlikely to an election winner especially in the middle of a cost of living crisis

Their first job is to get into power and whether people like the approach or not, Starmer and Reeves have rebuilt labours credibility when it comes to the economy/public finances so the strategy does appear to be working. The problems will be if shadow ministers start suggesting they can deliver more than perceived to be affordable as Clint mentioned about streeting

Still waiting for the long term vision/plan from any party.
Click to expand...

It’s a tough one because equally they need to show improvements reasonably quickly. They don’t have the luxury of a couple of years spending nothing because of the state of the country and how febrile politics is.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2023
  • #31,434
Brighton Sky Blue said:
Does it not depend on who is having to pay taxes as to whether the rises will be unpopular? I wouldn’t see many objecting to a hike on the likes of Centrica.
Click to expand...

I don’t think there’s as much disdain for tax rises as there used to be TBH. The media will still play it, but the polling suggests most people are happy to fund public services a bit better. And as you say I’d expect it not to be low earners paying more. Personally I’d be happy to pay a little more tax if it meant schools and hospitals actually worked.
 
Reactions: duffer, Sky Blue Pete and PVA

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2023
  • #31,435
One of the Labour right's go to stenographers


Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2023
  • #31,436
Interesting that she decided to retract - surely it’s perfectly possible for him to denounce the attacks, and then subsequently equivocate and deflect when talking about them. Corbyn’s lawyers must have been on the phone!
 
Reactions: shmmeee

Ian1779

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2023
  • #31,437
SBT said:
Interesting that she decided to retract - surely it’s perfectly possible for him to denounce the attacks, and then subsequently equivocate and deflect when talking about them. Corbyn’s lawyers must have been on the phone!
Click to expand...
Probably because he didn’t do what she claimed he did. And she would have been sued into the middle of next week otherwise.

It’s about time people were actually held to account when they spout shit online, even more so when they are a journalist and expected to be truthful.
 
Reactions: AOM, fernandopartridge, Sky Blue Pete and 1 other person

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2023
  • #31,438
Grendel said:
Byng was a weirdo who drank coffee in a hotel bar and his mate Labowitch I think had tomato juice - who has tomato juice?
Click to expand...
I believe it's good for people with some forms of intestinal trouble.
 

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2023
  • #31,439
CCFCSteve said:
This is a sensible approach. As we saw with Truss, anything ‘unfunded’ for day to day stuff will, rightly or wrongly, be slaughtered by the markets.

The alternative is to start suggesting theyll spend more but that it will require higher taxes…unlikely to an election winner especially in the middle of a cost of living crisis

Their first job is to get into power and whether people like the approach or not, Starmer and Reeves have rebuilt labours credibility when it comes to the economy/public finances so the strategy does appear to be working. The problems will be if shadow ministers start suggesting they can deliver more than perceived to be affordable as Clint mentioned about streeting

Still waiting for the long term vision/plan from any party.
Click to expand...
I disagree. It's just the Tories have been so utterly incompetent at it for 13 years people think they can't be any worse.

And if that credibility has come from aping conservative blueprints, I again refer the honourable gentleman to the past 13 years...
 
Reactions: dutchman

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2023
  • #31,440
I’ve put the guy who started the Israel thread on ignore simply to stop seeing it

It’s an embarrassment
 
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2023
  • #31,441
Ian1779 said:
It’s about time people were actually held to account when they spout shit online, even more so when they are a journalist and expected to be truthful.
Click to expand...
Seems like the journalist in question was very much held to account!
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2023
  • #31,442
SBT said:
Seems like the journalist in question was very much held to account!
Click to expand...
On this occasion. The episode just exposes a complete lack of journalistic rigour if something appears to agree with her own worldview.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 11, 2023
  • #31,443
fernandopartridge said:
On this occasion. The episode just exposes a complete lack of journalistic rigour if something appears to agree with her own worldview.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Well without knowing specifically what comments she was referring to in her original tweet, the notion that a public figure (especially one like Corbyn) was deflecting and equivocating on a sensitive issue like this one hardly sounds like unusual behaviour for a politician, and accusing someone of doing so sounds to me like it’s in the realm of fair comment. Personally I think journalists (and all of us!) should have some degree of freedom to make such comment without having to worry about lawyers ringing them up a few days later to get it all retracted. Maybe you disagree, or maybe you think the accusation was just completely offbase/untrue, but browbeating journalists into apologies is not always the sign of a healthy society.
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 12, 2023
  • #31,444
SBT said:
Well without knowing specifically what comments she was referring to in her original tweet, the notion that a public figure (especially one like Corbyn) was deflecting and equivocating on a sensitive issue like this one hardly sounds like unusual behaviour for a politician, and accusing someone of doing so sounds to me like it’s in the realm of fair comment. Personally I think journalists (and all of us!) should have some degree of freedom to make such comment without having to worry about lawyers ringing them up a few days later to get it all retracted. Maybe you disagree, or maybe you think the accusation was just completely offbase/untrue, but browbeating journalists into apologies is not always the sign of a healthy society.
Click to expand...

Journalists failing to do the most basic fact checking isn't either, especially one who is purportedly 'Associate Political Editor' for erm The New Statesman.

I have a journalist in my close family and I know how important they see fact checking. I'm sure you agree, given that it is a fairly fundamental ethical standard in your chosen profession.

People like her do YOU no favours at all, so I'm not really sure why you feel the need to defend her.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 
S

SBT

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 12, 2023
  • #31,445
fernandopartridge said:
Journalists failing to do the most basic fact checking isn't either, especially one who is purportedly 'Associate Political Editor' for erm The New Statesman.

I have a journalist in my close family and I know how important they see fact checking. I'm sure you agree, given that it is a fairly fundamental ethical standard in your chosen profession.

People like her do YOU no favours at all, so I'm not really sure why you feel the need to defend her.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
I’m not defending her specifically. I just think that terms like “deflecting” and “equivocating” are so nebulous and subjective that it seems like overkill to threaten legal action against someone for accusing a public figure of doing either. Unless she completely fabricated something that Corbyn said (did she?), then it appears fact checking isn’t the issue here, it’s just not being very good at her job. Disappointing, yes. Worthy of legal action, probably not.
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 12, 2023
  • #31,446
SBT said:
I’m not defending her specifically. I just think that terms like “deflecting” and “equivocating” are so nebulous and subjective that it seems like overkill to threaten legal action against someone for accusing a public figure of doing either. Unless she completely fabricated something that Corbyn said (did she?), then it appears fact checking isn’t the issue here, it’s just not being very good at her job. Disappointing, yes. Worthy of legal action, probably not.
Click to expand...
To be fair they are her description of what she'd said, not the verbatim words. I'm not sure what the words actually were but I wouldn't be surprised if she has understated them.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 12, 2023
  • #31,447
 

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 12, 2023
  • #31,448
clint van damme said:
Click to expand...
And in other news the sun is hot.
 
Reactions: duffer and clint van damme

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 12, 2023
  • #31,449
Defecting from the SNP to the Tories. Kin’ell.
 
Reactions: ovduk78 and dutchman
M

Macca1987

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 12, 2023
  • #31,450
skybluetony176 said:
Defecting from the SNP to the Tories. Kin’ell.
Click to expand...
And for bullying of all things, out of the frying pan and into the fire springs to mind
 
Reactions: duffer and skybluetony176
D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • Oct 12, 2023
  • #31,451
Here's a policy decision that I just know will go down well on here:

 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 12, 2023
  • #31,452
Deleted member 5849 said:
Here's a policy decision that I just know will go down well on here:

Click to expand...

Need to make sure there's room for anyone waving a Palestinian flag, good old Cruella and the party of law and order.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 12, 2023
  • #31,453
Ridiculous policy. Feels like Sunak stole their clothes with the smoking ban so now this? Are we banning strawberry and lime Koppaburg (sp?) as well?

 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 12, 2023
  • #31,454
Deleted member 5849 said:
Here's a policy decision that I just know will go down well on here:

Click to expand...
The Times really is just the Sun with a different font isn't it

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 
Reactions: duffer and shmmeee

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 12, 2023
  • #31,455
fernandopartridge said:
The Times really is just the Sun with a different font isn't it

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Seem so many people on Twitter who genuinely think it’s just rapists and burglars and everyone else is still going to jail
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 15, 2023
  • #31,456
How can you be simultaneously convinced of your unassailable poll lead yet terrified of the opposition

Labour to omit funding of social care reform from manifesto and scale back Lords plans

Dismay as key proposals are downsized in order to make election offer to voters ‘bombproof’
www.theguardian.com

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 
Reactions: duffer

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 15, 2023
  • #31,457
fernandopartridge said:
How can you be simultaneously convinced of your unassailable poll lead yet terrified of the opposition

Labour to omit funding of social care reform from manifesto and scale back Lords plans

Dismay as key proposals are downsized in order to make election offer to voters ‘bombproof’
www.theguardian.com

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Because you’ve seen Labour fuck it up from here before.
 
D

Deleted member 9744

Guest
  • Oct 15, 2023
  • #31,458
shmmeee said:
Because you’ve seen Labour fuck it up from here before.
Click to expand...
And you know the media is so biased in favour of the Tories and unfortunately is prepared to do anything to see them in power.
 
Reactions: Grendel

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 15, 2023
  • #31,459
shmmeee said:
Because you’ve seen Labour fuck it up from here before.
Click to expand...
But they're miles ahead having already talked about social care and house of lords

Now they just look like anything they've said has no credibility

The cast iron fiscal rule nonsense will strangle them

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 15, 2023
  • #31,460
fernandopartridge said:
But they're miles ahead having already talked about social care and house of lords

Now they just look like anything they've said has no credibility

The cast iron fiscal rule nonsense will strangle them

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

They’re absolutely terrified.
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 15, 2023
  • #31,461
shmmeee said:
They’re absolutely terrified.
Click to expand...
Also seem to be quite inconsistent in what lost them previous elections, I thought it was all down the leader at the time

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 15, 2023
  • #31,462
shmmeee said:
They’re absolutely terrified.
Click to expand...

It’s a bizarre argument - why wasn’t Blair terrified?
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 15, 2023
  • #31,463
Grendel said:
It’s a bizarre argument - why wasn’t Blair terrified?
Click to expand...

Better politician? Maybe he was.
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 15, 2023
  • #31,464
Also job was a lot easier in the 90s compared to todays media landscape.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • Oct 15, 2023
  • #31,465
shmmeee said:
Also job was a lot easier in the 90s compared to todays media landscape.
Click to expand...

Oh come on. The media landscape if it’s that biased will oppose Starmer anyway

He’s really just Cameron mK2 - someone will really no interest in politics and just there to get the job and make money afterwards

Whatever you think of Blair and brown they were politicians to be admired for some conviction and drive

Every indicator is that the tories will digger a huge defeat - yet Starmer seems to just align to Tory type politics. He’s a very poor leader.
 
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