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Do you want to discuss boring politics? (21 Viewers)

  • Thread starter mrtrench
  • Start date Jun 14, 2020
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PVA

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,931
It was inevitable more photos would come out after Johnson threw all the staff and civil servants under the bus.

He's totally incapable of thinking more than one step ahead.
 
Reactions: Sky_Blue_Dreamer and Terry Gibson's perm

rob9872

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,932
Just because there's a photo of him holding a drink doesn't mean it was a party .... or does that defence only apply to Starmer and Rayner?
 
Reactions: Sky_Blue_Dreamer, Sick Boy, PVA and 1 other person

Grendel

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,933
rob9872 said:
Just because there's a photo of him holding a drink doesn't mean it was a party .... or does that defence only apply to Starmer and Rayner?
Click to expand...

Well as Mr Starmer says if there is not a penalty notice the law says there is no crime committed
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete and rob9872

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,934
rob9872 said:
Just because there's a photo of him holding a drink doesn't mean it was a party .... or does that defence only apply to Starmer and Rayner?
Click to expand...
No. But the 8 opened bottles of champagne, wine and gin on the table…

Also according to the Met it was a party, hence people in attendance received FPN. The only real conundrum is how the Met could conclude that some of those present were at a party while others present apparently weren’t. Explain that one if you can.
 
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Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,935
skybluetony176 said:
No. But the 8 opened bottles of champagne, wine and gin on the table…

Also according to the Met it was a party, hence people in attendance received FPN. The only real conundrum is how the Met could conclude that some of those present were at a party while others present apparently weren’t. Explain that one if you can.
Click to expand...
Time spent potentially
 
Reactions: stupot07

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,936
rob9872 said:
Just because there's a photo of him holding a drink doesn't mean it was a party .... or does that defence only apply to Starmer and Rayner?
Click to expand...
Also the defence of Starmer is in your head. You’ll struggle to find anyone who says that if the police deem it a broke the lockdown laws at that time and issue Starmer with a FPN then that’s OK, nothing to see, trivialise the law etc etc. I’ve only seen people on here and other platforms say that he must resign in that scenario.
 
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P

PVA

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,937
skybluetony176 said:
Also according to the Met it was a party, hence people in attendance received FPN. The only real conundrum is how the Met could conclude that some of those present were at a party while others present apparently weren’t. Explain that one if you can.
Click to expand...

Either Johnson was questioned about it and lied, or he didn't lie but the Met were happy to cover it up.

Either way it stinks.
 
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skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,938
Sky Blue Pete said:
Time spent potentially
Click to expand...
Isn’t there a sliding scale of FPN’s for breaking lockdown laws? Ie the amount goes up each time whet a repeat fine?
 
Reactions: chohan

Ian1779

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,939
PVA said:
Either Johnson was questioned about it and lied, or he didn't lie but the Met were happy to cover it up.

Either way it stinks.
Click to expand...
The Met if necessary will try and pin the overall decision on Dick seeing as she’s recently been disposed off.
There will be zero responsibility taken by Downing St or the Met… and plenty of sycophants out there to defend it.
Also expect to see another Starmer gotcha from the Daily Mail, Sun or Express….
 
Reactions: Sky_Blue_Dreamer, djr8369, duffer and 1 other person

fatso

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,940
I'm holding my judgement back until V.A.R. has had a look!
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete
P

PVA

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,941
It's also clear evidence that he lied to parliament so it should be the end of him.

Well see...
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,942
Grendel said:
Well as Mr Starmer says if there is not a penalty notice the law says there is no crime committed
Click to expand...

How many briefcases of booze did Mr Starmer order to be collected?
 
Reactions: stupot07

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,943
fatso said:
I'm holding my judgement back until V.A.R. has had a look!
Click to expand...
Can’t see Gove so nothing probably went over the line
 
Reactions: duffer and Sky Blue Pete

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,944
PVA said:
It's also clear evidence that he lied to parliament so it should be the end of him.

Well see...
Click to expand...
I’m sure it’s just a coincidence that the Mail has started attacking Sue Grey on the day photos start coming out. Apparently she’s playing politics.
 
Reactions: duffer, Sky Blue Pete and chohan

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,945
skybluetony176 said:
Starting to think it suits the government to keep this story rolling on

Click to expand...
Maybe it was just a case of the meeting was less controversial than the photos and they were looking to draw our attention away from the photos. Leak the story of the meeting, deliberately create confusion about who requested the meeting and what was said at the meeting. Don’t look over there.
 

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,946
Brighton Sky Blue said:
How many briefcases of booze did Mr Starmer order to be collected?
Click to expand...
What do you think was in Boris’ red ministerial briefcase that was visible in the photos.
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,947
Grendel said:
I don’t think people who work from home are especially concerned about productivity but prefer the lifestyle
Click to expand...
Come on, it might be true for some people but not everybody. In the same way that working in offices / on client sights is made advantageous to some (by their own actions) but not others.

Personally, I've found WFH to be overly obtrusive into my home life, I've been working at 1am in the morning at times as all sense of a working day seems lost in relation to workload with absolutely fuck all moral support.
 

Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,948
Doesn't change anything for me. He should have gone by now already.

Hopefully this now pushes it all over the edge though. I don't see how he can defend the pictures themselves.

Additionally, if it comes around again and there are lockdowns imposed, I suspect they'll have a really hard time imposing them. Not because I believe most of the general public are bad people, but how on earth do they expect anyone is going to respect or listen to them?
 
Reactions: Sky_Blue_Dreamer, djr8369, Sky Blue Pete and 2 others

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,949
Find the whole partygate stuff pretty immaterial given everybody is taking an ongoing axe to their standard of living.
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete

stupot07

Well-Known Member
  • May 23, 2022
  • #13,950
rob9872 said:
Just because there's a photo of him holding a drink doesn't mean it was a party .... or does that defence only apply to Starmer and Rayner?
Click to expand...
I count 7 bottles of booze (orange circles) and also a green drink that looks distinctly like absinthe (green circle).

We also know it was the date of an advisors leaving do, and that at least one person attending it was issued a FPN for being st the party.

The whole "it was a works do" is nonsense, the rule at the time was "is this gathering reasonably necessary for work purposes?"

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk
 
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D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • May 24, 2022
  • #13,951
Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
Additionally, if it comes around again and there are lockdowns imposed, I suspect they'll have a really hard time imposing them. Not because I believe most of the general public are bad people, but how on earth do they expect anyone is going to respect or listen to them?
Click to expand...
This is a big problem isn't it and, tbf, not just lockdowns, but any civil group law is a gonner, isn't it.

(Waits for photos of Johnson invading pitches across the country)
 
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D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • May 24, 2022
  • #13,952
Currently just one person confirmed was fined from that party? How pissed off would that make you?
 
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clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • May 24, 2022
  • #13,953
stupot07 said:
I count 7 bottles of booze (orange circles) and also a green drink that looks distinctly like absinthe (green circle).

We also know it was the date of an advisors leaving do, and that at least one person attending it was issued a FPN for being st the party.

The whole "it was a works do" is nonsense, the rule at the time was "is this gathering reasonably necessary for work purposes?"

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Anyone comparing this to the starmer incident is either blinded by their devotion to Johnson and the tories or has lost their mind.
And I say that as someone who be quite happy if it got rid of the pair of them.
 
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C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
  • May 24, 2022
  • #13,954
Deleted member 5849 said:
Currently just one person confirmed was fined from that party? How pissed off would that make you?
Click to expand...

Not if I was the one who drank all that champagne, wine and gin …I’d take the £50 fine as I would’ve got my monies worth
 
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duffer

Well-Known Member
  • May 24, 2022
  • #13,955
fernandopartridge said:
Find the whole partygate stuff pretty immaterial given everybody is taking an ongoing axe to their standard of living.
Click to expand...

I'd disagree. If we want to get out of the current mess then we need trustworthy, competent, leadership. This goes to the heart of that.

These people were partying whilst other people couldn't see their dying relatives in hospital or go to their friends funerals.

They broke the very laws they were on telly every night telling us that it was vital we keep, no matter how painful.

It's not trivial.

If you're looking for a political solution to the cost of living crisis, or indeed anything else, then you'll need to find politicians who care more about the country and less about themselves.
 
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C

CCFCSteve

Well-Known Member
  • May 24, 2022
  • #13,956
Joking apart I wonder if the police have made their decisions based on timing and number the photos, as well as eye witness testimony. If there was just the photos around the toasting of Cain leaving, it might be tricky for the police to argue a party, if there were various at different times then it would be a lot easier. It might just come down to strength of evidence and this is the problem with retrospective fining, it’s going to be imperfect. If the one person fined had, for example, admitted to bringing the booze in, or were not due to be working in the building at the time, then again that would maybe make more sense.

Just guesswork obviously
 
Last edited: May 24, 2022
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B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
  • May 24, 2022
  • #13,957
He can be a knob sometimes but thought O’Brien’s views were spot on

 
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clint van damme

Well-Known Member
  • May 24, 2022
  • #13,958
He's been reading some of the cucked contributors on here!
 
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skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
  • May 24, 2022
  • #13,959
duffer said:
I'd disagree. If we want to get out of the current mess then we need trustworthy, competent, leadership. This goes to the heart of that.

These people were partying whilst other people couldn't see their dying relatives in hospital or go to their friends funerals.

They broke the very laws they were on telly every night telling us that it was vital we keep, no matter how painful.

It's not trivial.

If you're looking for a political solution to the cost of living crisis, or indeed anything else, then you'll need to find politicians who care more about the country and less about themselves.
Click to expand...
This. The notion that a government who are actively taking the decision to not tackle the cost of living is somehow distracted by their own behaviour rings hollow. Partygate or no partygate isn’t going to change how they govern, if anything it’s the perfect example of how they govern. Missed cobra meetings at the start of the biggest crisis the world has faced since WW2 but doesn’t miss an illegal lockdown party. Boris is not a man for a crisis.
 
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fatso

Well-Known Member
  • May 24, 2022
  • #13,960
skybluetony176 said:
Also the defence of Starmer is in your head. You’ll struggle to find anyone who says that if the police deem it a broke the lockdown laws at that time and issue Starmer with a FPN then that’s OK, nothing to see, trivialise the law etc etc. I’ve only seen people on here and other platforms say that he must resign in that scenario.
Click to expand...
I don't think he should resign!
If he broke the law he should face the consequences, the same as every one else, which is a fine as I understand it.
Are you going to force everyone in public office who attended these so called parties to resign? If so there wouldn't be many of the fuckers left. (possibly a good thing)
Meanwhile this sad debacle is now overshadowing every issue that now faces us, such as the increasing reliance on food banks, and the increasing numbers who can't heat their homes. Not to mention rapidly rising inflation, the imminent recession, and the ongoing war in Ukrain etc etc.
 
M

Macca1987

Well-Known Member
  • May 24, 2022
  • #13,961
fatso said:
I don't think he should resign!
If he broke the law he should face the consequences, the same as every one else, which is a fine as I understand it.
Are you going to force everyone in public office who attended these so called parties to resign? If so there wouldn't be many of the fuckers left. (possibly a good thing)
The while sad debacle is now overshadowing every issue that now faces us, such as the increasing reliance on food banks, and the increasing numbers who can't heat their homes. Not to mention rapidly rising inflation, the imminent recession, and the ongoing war in Ukrain etc etc.
Click to expand...
It's not a case of breaking the law and getting a fine, it's lying to parliament which in most cases is a resigning matter, but bunty boy has no shame and will just deny deny deny an d then move on, and the public will just get bored with it and move on too
 
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D

Deleted member 5849

Guest
  • May 24, 2022
  • #13,962
One easy way to stop it being a distraction...

And it's only a distraction because the PM has kicked the can in the hope people blithely defend him with such shit.
 
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fatso

Well-Known Member
  • May 24, 2022
  • #13,963
Macca1987 said:
It's not a case of breaking the law and getting a fine, it's lying to parliament which in most cases is a resigning matter, but bunty boy has no shame and will just deny deny deny an d then move on, and the public will just get bored with it and move on too
Click to expand...
I'm bored of it already, and I'd suggest every fucker in Westminster is a lier, in fact politics IS the art of telling lies!

I'd also add, that while we are being distracted by party gate, there's very little focus on applying a windfall tax on the excessive profits made by the energy corporations.
 

duffer

Well-Known Member
  • May 24, 2022
  • #13,964
CCFCSteve said:
Joking apart I wonder if the police have made their decisions based on timing and number the photos, as well as eye witness testimony. If there was just the photos around the toasting of Cain leaving, it might be tricky for the police to argue a party, if there were various at different times then it would be a lot easier. It might just come down to strength of evidence and this is the problem with retrospective fining, it’s going to be imperfect. If the one person fined had, for example, admitted to bringing the booze in, or were not due to be working in the building at the time, then again that would maybe make more sense.

Just guesswork obviously
Click to expand...

Steve mate, it feels like you're working pretty hard here to try to excuse this!

It seems that other (more junior) people who attended the event were fined, ergo, it's an event that broke the rules that were in place at the time, as set by the Prime Minister.

The photographs clearly show that the Prime Minister was present.

There is no condition that I'm aware of in the law that sets a minimum time of attendance at a forbidden event, below which one can claim to have followed the rules.

Here are the rules that were in force at the time, as set and outlined quite clearly by the Prime Minister literally eight days prior to the event.

Prime Minister announces new national restrictions

From Thursday, everyone must stay at home, with a limited set of exemptions.
www.gov.uk

I'd welcome an honest explanation of how one person at the event is fined, and another who is clearly present, is not. It certainly doesn't look like the Met are going to be able to provide one!

Regardless, he has already accepted that he has broken the law at another point in time, is it a three strikes and you're out rule for Government ministers now?
 
Reactions: Sky Blue Pete and stupot07

duffer

Well-Known Member
  • May 24, 2022
  • #13,965
fatso said:
I'm bored of it already, and I'd suggest every fucker in Westminster is a lier, in fact politics IS the art of telling lies!

I'd also add, that while we are being distracted by party gate, there's very little focus on applying a windfall tax on the excessive profits made by the energy corporations.
Click to expand...

Then why bother fucking voting? What's the point if you're just going to accept that politicians can do whatever they want once elected?

This isn't a distraction, it's key - and it's bollocks to say that's it was ok because everyone was at it.

How many stories do you have to hear about people who weren't allowed in hospitals to visit dying relatives before it hits home.

If you don't care about it then you get the politicians you deserve and there's no point whining about their decisions or lack thereof.
 
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